[Quietcars] Are hybrids anti-driver safety and anti-environment?

[Robert Wilson]

Hi Michael,

A couple of technical corrections:

----------------------------------------
> . . .  I heard a
> claim that the huge batteries carried in the front of
> hybrids, seriously reduce "the crunch zone". 

The Prius, Camry and Honda Civic hybrid traction batteries are carried behind the rear passenger seat. In the case of the Honda Civic, the rear seat does not fold down because of the batteries. In the case of the current Prius, it is located above the fuel tank above the rear axle. This is one of the safest places in the car.

I am not aware of any hybrid that has the traction battery in the engine compartment because the battery is too large. I did look at a Saturn VUE green, an auto-stop, "mild" hybrid and the battery, a realtively tiny unit in a retangular housing about 4 inches by 4 inches was located at the rear of the second seat and just in front of the spare tire well. 

> . . . That is
> the area in the front of a conventional auto which
> compresses during a front-end crash, thus absorbing
> much of the impact and is therefore safer for the
> driver.

This is inaccurate as the Prius has a 5 star rating for the front passengers in the USA and Europe. For the facts and data I would recommend:
http://www.safercar.gov/

> . . . I have also read concerns expressed by
> environmentalists that when these batteries lose their
> effectiveness (Claimed to be only five years),

My 2003 Prius is on its original battery and this is January 2009. In fact, the bulk of the first generation, 2001-03 Prius still have their original batteries and many of the few that have failed are getting replacements from the ones that crash. Remember, the traction batteries are in the strongest part of the car, just above the solid rear axle between the rear wheels.

In 2004, the Prius battery module was changed to strengthen the battery case and the terminals. As a result, the 2004-current models, nearly 500,000, have had less than 400 batteries replaced and mostly under warranty. In fact, Toyota told us January 12 that the same modules used in today's Prius will be in the next model, the 2010.

> . . . they
> will be a serious negative addition to our trash
> heaps. 

I will pay $250 to anyone who has a work-out traction battery they want to put in the trash. There is enough nickel in the battery that I still make a profit even if I do not refurbish the modules. It turns out that only one or two modules are permanently failed in the 38 modules of a Prius traction battery. The other 36-37 can be easily refurbished and retuned to service like new. I've done it already at home by simply replacing the water that was lost and resealing.

The other thing to realize is the traction battery is huge, weighting about 110 pounds. Now there are many things one can do with 110 pounds of traction battery but throwing one away is not one of them. Toyota also buys them back when people replace their traction batteries.

> . . . The negative environmental impact of the
> mining of one of the chemical components of the
> vbatteries, has been the subject of worry also.

Actually that article in the "Sunday Mail" was withdrawn when Sudbury Canada contacted them with the facts and data. Unlike the USA, the English libel laws have teeth and the "Sunday Mail" was not willing to face a law suit that they would have lost. The only worry has come from hybrid skeptics who would rather believe sweet nonsense than face the facts and data.

Bob Wilson

ps. Please pass anyone who claims to have a Prius traction battery to contact me. Depending upon shipping or pickup arrangements, I am paying $250, hard Yankee dollars for worn-out traction batteries. To understand what I've been doing, here is a URL showing my work:

http://hiwaay.net/~bzwilson/prius/pri_batt.html


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