[Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of silence?information Article

Fri Jul 16 23:38:55 UTC 2010

yep
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "michael townsend" <mrtownsend at optonline.net>
To: "'Discussion of new quiet cars and pedestrian safety'" 
<quietcars at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 4:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of 
silence?information Article


> As the motor cycle guys say, "loud pipes save lives", and if you have loud
> pipes on anything, be it a bus, truck, car or whatever, you ain't going to
> hear no hybrid, even with a chirp or beep.  But, stay safe and keep that
> shiny side up there, Mr. Dewey.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org] 
> On
> Behalf Of Dewey Bradley
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 2:55 PM
> To: Discussion of new quiet cars and pedestrian safety
> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of
> silence?information Article
>
> You can be as safe as you can be, they do need to make some sound.
> I don't hate them, but they have to be heard along with the big trucks and
> busses and trains.
> I'm just glad that we don't have allot of yuppies here that have them.
> Where I live, we are hilbillies, we like our pickups nice and loud.
> I was almost hit by one of the things 2 years ago, and I'm a very good
> traveler.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "michael townsend" <mrtownsend at optonline.net>
> To: "'Discussion of new quiet cars and pedestrian safety'"
> <quietcars at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 1:32 PM
> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of silence?
> information Article
>
>
>> Bob, my theories on this blind and other pedestrian interface with autos
>> and
>> vehicular accidents is that, first off, good orientation skills play a
>> major
>> part in how people interact on the street, in parking lots and around 
>> cars
>> in general.  Be you blind or sighted, you have to be responsible for your
>> actions and make assumptions about vehicles around you and the people who
>> drive them.  Sometimes, it is not correct to assume, nor can you always
>> guess correctly.  And, adding to the mix, if you use a guide dog, you are
>> safer, in some instances, than if you use a cane, as the guide dog will
>> alert you to circumstances and keep you from being laced in harm's way v.
>> using a cane, during which time and usage, you must play a very critical
>> role in accident avoidance.  You have NO safety net but your knowledge,
>> skills and circumstance.
>>
>> Add to this, that the schools training guides, at least for the past few
>> years, have had a hybrid car on staff, and that has allowed many of the
>> schools who could afford to do so, to purchase a hybrid and get the dogs
>> and
>> handlers familiar with the vehicle on campus and in the cities in which
>> the
>> guides were trained.
>>
>> I have stressed n list that those persons who are not as familiar with 
>> the
>> hybrids as they should be, should contact their state agencies who teach
>> mobility, contact friends who have a hybrid and familiarize themselves
>> with
>> the ins and outs of the vehicle, so that they can work, around a hybrid 
>> in
>> as safe a manner as possible and not just jump on the "we hate hybrids
>> bandwagon" as a lot of people do without credible foundation.
>>
>> I was surprised to hear of how low the stats were which reflected with
>> direct contact with a hybrid, causing death of a blind person.  There are
>> probably more scares around a quieter car, but, I am concerned that 
>> sinc3e
>> we can't see whether a particular car that has come close to us is a
>> hybrid
>> or not that we make general assumptions that it is and mischaracterize 
>> the
>> car or vehicle incorrectly.
>>
>> MOST cars are quieter today than they were even five years ago because of
>> noise abatement issues that are imposed upon the auto industry by
>> communities, so we must truly be careful in assessing this whole scenario
>> of
>> quieter vehicle "assaults" in this country.
>>
>> Interesting reading, Deb and bob.  thanks for the thoughts.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>> On
>> Behalf Of Robert Wilson
>> Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2010 4:16 PM
>> To: quietcars at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of 
>> silence?
>> Information Article
>>
>>
>> Hi Debra,
>>
>> In this we will just have to agree to disagree. Noisy cars already kill
>> the
>> blind every year and a noisy Prius will be just as deadly as the rest.
>> Adding noise all the time repeats the same auto experience of the past 
>> 100
>> years without improving the current rate of fatal accidents.
>>
>> In contrast, accident avoidance systems addresses the 37,000 total auto
>> deaths in 2008 including 4,300 pedestrians and about five blind each 
>> year.
>> Accident systems are a universal solution but like you said, they remain
>> an
>> independent, disconnected effort. Sad to say, delayed by costs and
>> availability.
>>
>> Bob Wilson
>>
>> ----------------------------------------
>>> From: dkent5817 at att.net
>>> To: quietcars at nfbnet.org
>>> Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2010 23:21:02 -0500
>>> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds
>>> of silence? Information Article
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear Bob,
>>>
>>> Thanks for the info about the new Volvo. The Stearns Amendment is not
>>> walking away from technology such as this, which sounds like a clear
>>> benefit to pedestrians and drivers. It is not an either/or
>>> proposition. However, the Volvo system goes into effect when a
>>> pedestrian has stepped into the road in front of a car and is clearly
>>> in danger; a warning sound, such as that called for in the Stearns
>>> Amendment, may prevent pedestrians from stepping into a car's path in
>>> the first place. As the old adage says, an ounce of prevention is worth 
>>> a
>> pound of cure.
>>>
>>> Debbie
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Robert Wilson"
>>> To:
>>> Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 8:23 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of
>>> silence?
>>> Information Article
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> I was just reading this article about the new Volvo:
>>>> http://www.thecarconnection.com/marty-blog/1046844_2011-volvo-v60-wag
>>>> on-makes-debut
>>>>
>>>> ". . .
>>>> There's also an advanced Pedestrian Detection safety system that can
>>>> detect pedestrians who walk into the road in front of the car, warn
>>>> the driver--and automatically apply full braking power if the driver
>>>> does not respond in time. In an emergency situation the driver first
>>>> receives an audible warning combined with a flashing light in the
>>>> windscreen's head-up display. At the same time, the car's brakes are
>>>> pre-charged. If the driver does not react to the warning and an
>>>> accident is imminent, full braking power is automatically applied.
>>>> . . ."
>>>>
>>>> This is the technology that the Sterns Amendment is walking away from.
>>>>
>>>> Bob Wilson
>>>>
>>>>> Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 11:32:09 -0400
>>>>> From: mrtownsend at optonline.net
>>>>> To: quietcars at nfbnet.org
>>>>> Subject: [Quietcars] Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of silence?
>>>>> Information Article
>>>>>
>>>>> A really well written article that doesn't play the blame game as
>>>>> many articles on this and other lists do.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike T in NJ
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Quiet hybrids: An end to their sounds of silence?
>>>>>
>>>>> By KEN THOMAS
>>>>> July 4, 2010 - 9:18am
>>>>>
>>>>> WASHINGTON (AP) - The age of the silent hybrid may be coming to an 
>>>>> end.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gas-electric hybrids, propelled by electric motors at low speeds,
>>>>> are well-known for their quiet ride and great mileage. But their
>>>>> silence isn't always golden.
>>>>>
>>>>> Some researchers and safety groups say that quiet operation _
>>>>> "hybrid creep"
>>>>> _ can pose risks for unsuspecting pedestrians and the blind, who use
>>>>> sound cues.
>>>>>
>>>>> Advocates for the blind have sought the addition of artificial
>>>>> noises in hybrids for several years, concerned that the expected
>>>>> sales growth of hybrids could lead to more pedestrian fatalities and
>>>>> injuries. Hybrids account for about 2 percent of new car sales each
>>>>> year but auto companies are expected to boost production in advance
>>>>> of tougher fuel efficiency standards this decade.
>>>>>
>>>>> "This is an example of too much of a good thing," said John Pare,
>>>>> executive director for strategic initiatives with the National
>>>>> Federation of the Blind. "Cars got quieter, that was good. Suddenly
>>>>> they got to be so quiet that it added an element of danger."
>>>>>
>>>>> The government's auto safety agency said in a research report last
>>>>> year that hybrid vehicles are twice as likely to be involved in
>>>>> pedestrian crashes at low speeds compared with cars with
>>>>> conventional engines. The study by the National Highway Traffic
>>>>> Safety Administration examined circumstances in which the vehicles
>>>>> were slowing down or coming to a stop, backing up or entering or
>>>>> departing a parking space.
>>>>>
>>>>> More than 4,300 pedestrians were killed in 2008, according to the
>>>>> most recent data available. The government has been researching the
>>>>> safety risks that hybrids and electrics could pose for pedestrians,
>>>>> particularly the blind, along with the elderly and children, for
>>>>> vehicles traveling at 20 mph or less. When a car is going faster,
>>>>> the friction between the tire and the road's surface makes the
>>>>> vehicle louder.
>>>>>
>>>>> The quiet hybrid phenomenon already has its place in pop culture. In
>>>>> an episode of NBC's "The Office," paper salesman Andy Bernard uses
>>>>> his stealthy blue Toyota Prius to sneak up on Dwight Schrute and pin
>>>>> his bitter rival against a hedge. One concerned co-worker, watching
>>>>> the unfolding drama, says "the Prius is silent if he keeps it under
>>>>> 5 miles per hour."
>>>>>
>>>>> Congress is heeding the warnings, adding sound performance
>>>>> requirements for hybrids and electric cars to an auto safety bill
>>>>> being considered after the massive Toyota recalls. Lawmakers could
>>>>> consider the changes this summer and car companies most likely would
>>>>> have to have the sounds ready to go three years after the release of
>>>>> new government rules.
>>>>>
>>>>> Automakers helped develop the proposal in Congress and are moving
>>>>> forward with new artificial sounds that will be emitted from
>>>>> electric cars and future hybrid models.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nissan Motor Corp. has produced distinct sounds for the Leaf, the
>>>>> electric car expected to go on sale this year, when the vehicle
>>>>> accelerates or moves in reverse. When the Leaf speeds up to 20 mph,
>>>>> it automatically will use a soft whirring sound that changes pitch
>>>>> as the car accelerates. When the Leaf backs up, an intermittent bell
>>>>> will ring to warn those nearby.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Japanese automaker consulted with acoustic psychologists and
>>>>> Hollywood sound designers to find a tone that addresses drivers,
>>>>> pedestrians and the community.
>>>>>
>>>>> "It was kind of like peeling back an onion. The more we worked on
>>>>> it, the more issues came up, the more of a balancing act it became,"
>>>>> said Andy Christensen, a manager with Nissan's North American
>>>>> Technical Center near Detroit. Nissan plans to use the sounds on the
>>>>> Infiniti M35 hybrid to be released in 2012.
>>>>>
>>>>> General Motors Co. wanted a more subtle chirp on its Chevrolet Volt,
>>>>> so it chose an alert horn that lets the driver warn an unknowing
>>>>> bystander.
>>>>>
>>>>> "We didn't want to blast the horn at them and figuratively smack the
>>>>> people in the nose," said Doug Moore, a vehicle performance engineer
>>>>> for the Volt project. "We just wanted to tap them on the shoulder
>>>>> and say, 'Hey I'm here.'"
>>>>>
>>>>> Other automakers are hard at work, too.
>>>>>
>>>>> Toyota Motor Corp., which makes the top-selling Prius hybrid, is
>>>>> studying artificial sounds for hybrids when the vehicle is propelled
>>>>> by its electric motor at low speeds. Ford Motor Co. is working to
>>>>> bring external sounds to future hybrids and electrics, including its
>>>>> Focus electric car, expected in 2011, and a next-generation hybrid
>>>>> and plug-in hybrid vehicle planned for 2012.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nancy Gioia, Ford's director of global electrification, said car
>>>>> companies should consider standardizing tones from future hybrids
>>>>> and electrics to avoid a cacophony of confusion on the streets.
>>>>>
>>>>> "It can't be like cell phones where we all select our own sound and
>>>>> we tune out everybody else's but our own," Gioia said.
>>>>>
>>>>> Some green car advocates have questioned the need for the extra
>>>>> tones and noted that the requirement could add more noise to
>>>>> neighborhoods. Paul Scott, vice president of Plug In America, said
>>>>> the sounds could help under certain circumstances, but drivers
>>>>> should have the right to activate the tones.
>>>>>
>>>>> "After hearing how innocuous the Nissan Leaf sound is, maybe it'll
>>>>> be a minor irritant for us, but I suspect people will tire of it
>>>>> eventually and seek ways to disable the noise," Scott said in an
>>>>> e-mail from Japan, where he was test-driving the car.
>>>>>
>>>>> Les Blomberg, who is the founder of the Noise Pollution
>>>>> Clearinghouse, said reducing noise from the loudest vehicles, such
>>>>> as trucks, buses and motorcycles, would increase the ability of
>>>>> pedestrians to detect sound.
>>>>> Adding sounds to hybrids, however, would simply enhance noise
>>>>> pollution and make it more difficult to hear an individual vehicle
>>>>> in traffic.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>
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