[Sportsandrec] echo location was blind skateboarder

Tue Feb 19 08:07:04 UTC 2013

Echo location also works in boogy/body surfing but only to a certain extent. 
The sound off of approaching water is very tricky.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "justin williams" <justin.williams2 at gmail.com>
To: "'Sports and Recreation for the Blind Discussion List'" 
<sportsandrec at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2013 6:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Sportsandrec] echo location was blind skateboarder


> He's right.  The  cane tap is not as good especially if you are using a 
> cane
> that folds.  The cloth further distorts the sound.  Also, you can't 
> mountain
> bike and do some of the other techniques.  It is rather useful, especially
> if you know what it can and can't do, but not as powerful as the
> echolocation techniques.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sportsandrec [mailto:sportsandrec-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
> JUSTIN LOUCHART
> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 8:39 AM
> To: Sports and Recreation for the Blind Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [Sportsandrec] echo location was blind skateboarder
>
> Hello, Everyone,
>
> I'm going to point out that there are two Justins involved with this
> conversation. There's Justin Williams, who wants to hide his potential
> echolocation abilities, and there's me, Justin Louchart, who is an
> echolocation teacher and strives to make my skills and the skills of 
> others
> public information available to all interested  parties.
>
> Julie, in response to your question about cane taps being used for
> echolocation, there are two parts to my answer as an educator and as a
> scientist in the field.
>
> First, yes, your cane tap can be used as a relatively bad echolocation
> signal.
>
> Second, emphasis on the relatively bad.
>
> The cane tap comes from the ground, hits the target, and reaches the ears.
> Meaning that all of your images are going to be bent, blurry, and
> inconsistent. Not only that, but furthermore there is no real aim or
> directionality in using a cane tap. Next, the cane tap doesn't work on all
> or even most surfaces. You cannot modulate the volume or the frequency of
> the cane tap in anywhere near the same way you can a tongue click. 
> Finally,
> your acuity simply isn't as good with a cane tap, no matter what you do. 
> You
> won't be able to see the front versus the back of a car with your cane tap
> from fifteen feet away.
>
> It might be worth mentioning that if you're using your cane tap for
> echolocation, riding a bicycle independently in unknown environments, 
> riding
> a mountain bike on advanced trails, hiking on your own, doing independent
> mountain climbing, doing advanced tree climbing, and accomplishing a
> thousand other independent recreational activities is much less convenient
> or likely to happen.
>
> I have no fear when I travel, no matter what I'm asked to do. Flash sonar
> and other perceptual mobility techniques give me the options to do 
> anything
> from walk to the grocery store without running into anything to go 
> bicycling
> on an unknown street with my students. Flash sonar opened doors for me and
> for countless others that most blind folks don't even realize are closed 
> to
> them. If you ask most blind people why they don't go mountain biking,
> hiking, or why they don't play soccer with sighted peers, they're going to
> tell you that they don't even want to. Well, how much of their not wanting
> to is a result of their not thinking it's easy or fun? How much of it is
> because blindness and people around blindness indicated to them that it's
> either impossible, or not worth the effort?
>
>
> I don't have to worry about any of that. I see my environment quite
> similarly to any sighted person, mine just doesn't have color or extremely
> fine details. I can choose how to navigate an environment usually a block 
> or
> half a block away, depending on clutter. If you have that preparation, a
> million things are easier.
>
> Justin
>
> On 2/15/13, Julie J. <julielj at neb.rr.com> wrote:
>> I'm confused as to why you want to hide your abilities?     I don't get
>> the sense that you are embarrased or that you think it would truly be
>> a bother to other people.
>>
>> Also, doesn't the tap of the cane tip provide a sound from which to
>> use for echolocation?  Maybe you've discussed this, I don't know.
>> Again the subject was about skateboarding so I wasn't reading.
>>
>> Very curiously,
>> Julie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Hi, Justin,
>>>
>>> Well, do ya think most sighted people will be none the wiser about
>>> what you are doing, unless they know what to be listening for?
>>> Perhaps, amongst other blind folk, such an ability might be hard to
>>> conceal, but relax about your treasure. What's the point of hiding it
>>> when, I'm sure you don't see sighted people concealing the fact that,
>>> they might be able to ocularly see. For me, seeing without eyes even
>>> is a tremendous asset to my travel, in fact to most fasits of
>>> mobility, and my life in general.
>>> Please don't see this as an attack. I'm just befuddled.
>>> Car 09:24 AM 2/11/2013, justin williams wrote:
>>>> I can't figure out a good work around as of yet.  I really don't
>>>> want everyone to hear the clicking.  I believe in keeping your
>>>> abilities hidden.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Sportsandrec [mailto:sportsandrec-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>> Behalf Of Carly Mihalakis
>>>> Sent: Monday, February 11, 2013 4:57 PM
>>>> To: Sports and Recreation for the Blind Discussion List; 'Sports and
>>>> Recreation for the Blind Discussion List'
>>>> Subject: Re: [Sportsandrec] Blind skateboarder
>>>>
>>>> Hi, Jody,
>>>>
>>>> In an event that no one has yet answered, you sort of slide your
>>>> tongue against the roof of your mouth, in the way that some people
>>>> make a little noise while they are absent mindedly, pondering
>>>> something. I  have successfully made any type of similar sound,
>>>> functioning as a sort of tongue click, but a little less obvious,
>>>> something that I can only perceive.
>>>> Play
>>>> with it, you can use anything to offer the same feedback about which
>>>> you are looking device to offer similar  effects of a tongue click,
>>>> such as drawing in some breath between your top teeth. That also
>>>> works very well in situations where one must be quiet, as they try
>>>> to navigate.
>>>> Car
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> >JUSTIN LOUCHART
>>>> >Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2013 7:59 PM
>>>> >To: Sports and Recreation for the Blind Discussion List
>>>> >Subject: Re: [Sportsandrec] Blind skateboarder
>>>> >
>>>> >Hi, Jody,
>>>> >
>>>> >Ben's echolocation ability was quite good, but by no means unique.
>>>> >Virtually anyone can learn flash sonar to that degree. It simply
>>>> >takes diligence. It's easier than you might think; just most people
>>>> >don't ever have training in it.
>>>> >
>>>> >Justin Louchart
>>>> >
>>>> >On 2/10/13, Jody Ianuzzi <jody at thewhitehats.com> wrote:
>>>> > > Hello all,
>>>> > >
>>>> > > I have been offline for a week so this may be old news.  Ben
>>>> > > Underwood had a remarkable echolocation ability.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > I am sad to say he died a few years ago at only 16 years old.
>>>> > > His blindness was caused by cancer of the retina and his eyes
>>>> > > were removed when he was 2.
>>>> > > Unfortunately the cancer returned and he died of brain cancer.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > JODY
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > > _______________________________________________
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>>>> > >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >--
>>>> >Justin Louchart
>>>> >JALOUCHART at GMAIL.COM
>>>> >
>>>> >Inveniam Viam Aut Faciam
>>>> >
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
>
> --
> Justin Louchart
> JALOUCHART at GMAIL.COM
>
> Inveniam Viam Aut Faciam
>
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