[stylist] seeing with your tongue

Fri Aug 27 19:40:50 UTC 2010

Dear list,

I am not against research such as this product or any other products.  I
don't think it is wrong for a blind person, whether from birth or later
in life, to want to experience sight.  Sometimes we ostracize people who
make such comments and believe they are "bad" blind people who have a
bad philosophy, but just because some one wishes to "see" does not mean
they are a bad example of a blind person.  I too agree that the world is
not established for any disabilities, and, though much progress has been
made, accommodations and modifications can take time and funds not
always readily available.  So if a disability of any kind can be
eliminated, then I say continue the research.

Having said all this, I now make this point.  I know far too many blind
people who hear about such technology and sit and wait for the
technology to catch up and become a product ready for the market.
Instead of learning the tools and methods currently available to allow
independence for the blind, they choose to wait for technology and
science to "cure" them.

I firmly believe that we must understand that we, as blind people,
currently have every chance to be successful and independent.  We talk
about norms and acceptance, but the real issue is perception.  We all
know the struggle for society to accept us and embrace our abilities
with open, trusting arms, but far to often this is not the case.  Many
of us have had people doubt our abilities even though we present an
independent, confident image.  Would it be easier to assimilate into the
world without a disability, most likely, but again, this is because the
established norm is based on not having a disability.  So are we any
closer to having technology or science that eliminates blindness, then
we are to changing perceptions about blindness?

Personally, and I myself am not sure why I feel this way, do not care a
whole lot if a "cure" is ever found, and I truly do not know if I would
take it.  Hmmm... To be the only blind person in the world!  Think of
all the attention I would get!  *smile*

Seriously though, we need to accept our own capabilities and success
whether or not other means eventual will exist allowing for sight.  I
also don't think it matters what point a person loses their vision, we
all can learn and utilize tools and methods like Braille and cane travel
and be just as efficient, quick and safe as those with sight.

So, I'm not against any research, but I also believe we need to
understand that sight will not necessarily make life easier, but just
different.

Bridgit

-----Original Message-----
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Behalf Of stylist-request at nfbnet.org
Sent: Friday, August 27, 2010 12:00 PM
To: stylist at nfbnet.org
Subject: stylist Digest, Vol 76, Issue 47

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Today's Topics:

   1. seeing with your tongue (Allison Nastoff)
   2. Re: seeing with your tongue (Joe Orozco)
   3. Writers' division- August Monthly Telephone Gathering
      (Robert Leslie Newman)
   4. Re: seeing with your tongue (Donna Hill)
   5. Re: Word Processing question (slery)
   6. Re: seeing with your tongue (cheryl echevarria)
   7. Re: seeing with your tongue (Robert Leslie Newman)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 20:47:45 -0500
From: Allison Nastoff <anastoff at wi.rr.com>
To: stylist at nfbnet.org
Subject: [stylist] seeing with your tongue
Message-ID: <79.27.18983.A59177C4 at hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed

Hi Everyone,
Since this list has been talking about technology that would 
allow the blind to drive, I thought it would be interesting to 
start a discussion on a story I saw on yesterday's episode of 
Good Morning America.  The story was about technology being 
developed that projects images on to the tongue using electrical 
signals that the blind can feel, which in a sense allows them to 
"see with their tongue".  I hope you don't mind me cross posting 
this since it was discussed on another NFB list, but since it was 
off topic for that list, I thought it would be interesting to 
continue the discussion on this list.
I also wanted to get your opinions because when I was in sixth 
grade, I participated in a research study for this technology at 
a local college when it was very early in its development.  I 
dropped out of the study after the first year, and maybe in the 
years since, the technology has improved.  But I remember that 
when I was in the study, the strip that I put on to my tongue 
extended from a large machine which sent the electrical 
stimulation to my tongue.  This machine was connected to a camera 
which sent the images to a computer, and a board covered with 
cloth to create a white background also had to be set up behind 
the camera.  So the point I am trying to make is that this was 
way too much gear to walk around my kitchen or go rock climbing 
with the way the blind participants did in this segment.  But it 
also seemed kind of impractical because it was hard to tell what 
the shapes were, even when it came to braille dots which I read 
expertly with my fingers, and I know I can locate objects around 
the kitchen much faster with my fingers.  Don't get me wrong.  
The concept of seeing with your tongue is pretty cool, and I 
understand how it could be useful for people like the man 
featured in this video since he went blind as an adult, but since 
I have been blind all of my life, I wonder if investing in this 
kind of technology makes sense, or if it would be more beneficial 
to invest the resources in teaching people to adapt to their 
blindness with the traditional, and I think more efficient way, 
using your fingers, ears and nose, or at least invest in 
technology that restores sight for real, rather than just coming 
up with some weird inefficient contraption to see with their 
tongue.  What do you all think? Is there anyone else on this list 
who has participated in research for this kind of technology? If 
so, what were your feelings about it? I am always interested in 
getting other people's perspectives about innovations like this.  
Here is the link to the story.
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/helping-blind-people-tongues-1147
7360
Allison Nastoff

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:59:04 -0400
From: "Joe Orozco" <jsorozco at gmail.com>
To: "'Writer's Division Mailing List'" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [stylist] seeing with your tongue
Message-ID: <FFEA8EAB85C54B1F9190B18DE776DFDA at Rufus>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="US-ASCII"

Dude, this for some reason makes me think of Harry Potter.  Didn't he
speak
snake? (grin)  No, in all seriousness though, I think people are
generally
well-intentioned in their desire to introduce technology that could help
blind people lead more enjoyable lives, but it's up to us to educate
them on
striking a balance between what would be useful and what would be useful
and
draw unneeded attention.  I can't comment on the concept of seeing
through
tasting, but I do believe that no matter where a blind person is in her
independence skills, ultimately she would want to be socially accepted.
That is, after all, the philosophy of the NFB, to adjust to the
challenges
of our environment.  While I am vehemently opposed to the cars for the
blind, I would rather we take the initiative than someone else dictate
what
these cars should look like.  In my personal opinion, this is also true
of
echolocation.  It might work for some folks, but even in my socially
drunken
days you would have never caught me cruising around clucking like a
chicken.

Best,

Joe

"Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up their
sleeves,
some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam Ewing 

-----Original Message-----
From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Allison Nastoff
Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2010 9:48 PM
To: stylist at nfbnet.org
Subject: [stylist] seeing with your tongue

Hi Everyone,
Since this list has been talking about technology that would 
allow the blind to drive, I thought it would be interesting to 
start a discussion on a story I saw on yesterday's episode of 
Good Morning America.  The story was about technology being 
developed that projects images on to the tongue using electrical 
signals that the blind can feel, which in a sense allows them to 
"see with their tongue".  I hope you don't mind me cross posting 
this since it was discussed on another NFB list, but since it was 
off topic for that list, I thought it would be interesting to 
continue the discussion on this list.
I also wanted to get your opinions because when I was in sixth 
grade, I participated in a research study for this technology at 
a local college when it was very early in its development.  I 
dropped out of the study after the first year, and maybe in the 
years since, the technology has improved.  But I remember that 
when I was in the study, the strip that I put on to my tongue 
extended from a large machine which sent the electrical 
stimulation to my tongue.  This machine was connected to a camera 
which sent the images to a computer, and a board covered with 
cloth to create a white background also had to be set up behind 
the camera.  So the point I am trying to make is that this was 
way too much gear to walk around my kitchen or go rock climbing 
with the way the blind participants did in this segment.  But it 
also seemed kind of impractical because it was hard to tell what 
the shapes were, even when it came to braille dots which I read 
expertly with my fingers, and I know I can locate objects around 
the kitchen much faster with my fingers.  Don't get me wrong.  
The concept of seeing with your tongue is pretty cool, and I 
understand how it could be useful for people like the man 
featured in this video since he went blind as an adult, but since 
I have been blind all of my life, I wonder if investing in this 
kind of technology makes sense, or if it would be more beneficial 
to invest the resources in teaching people to adapt to their 
blindness with the traditional, and I think more efficient way, 
using your fingers, ears and nose, or at least invest in 
technology that restores sight for real, rather than just coming 
up with some weird inefficient contraption to see with their 
tongue.  What do you all think? Is there anyone else on this list 
who has participated in research for this kind of technology? If 
so, what were your feelings about it? I am always interested in 
getting other people's perspectives about innovations like this.  
Here is the link to the story.
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/helping-blind-people-tongues-1147
7360
Allison Nastoff

_______________________________________________
Writers Division web site:
http://www.nfb-writers-division.org 
<http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>

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------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:28:13 -0500
From: "Robert Leslie Newman" <newmanrl at cox.net>
To: "Robert Leslie Newman" <newmanrl at cox.net>
Subject: [stylist] Writers' division- August Monthly Telephone
	Gathering
Message-ID: <E5A80E5C7AC343D1942E3E07E2F2C010 at Newmans>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"

RE: August Writers' Division's Telephone Gathering- Sunday August 29th 

this is a reminder- Join in on our monthly telephone gathering and
interact
with our guest speaker, Dennis H. R. Sumlin, President of the Performing
Arts Division (PAD).(this guy is also a writer and song writer) Let us
learn
about the Performing Arts Division; let us ask about what they have to
offer; who joins and what performing arts are represented in the
Division;
how does what we do fit into what PAD's members do; Dennis will answer
any
of our questions; he will give us information on how PAD is able to be
one
of the only Divisions to offer a college scholarship; and more. 

The time is- 8:30 PM Eastern; 7:30 PM Central; 6:30 PM Mountain; 5:30 PM
Pacific.

The phone number to call is- 218-339-4300 

The code is: 568839# (last character is a number sign)

(It will be recorded and posted to our website) 

Robert Leslie Newman

President NFB Writers' division 

Writers' Division Website-

http://www.nfb-writers-division.org

Personal Website- 

http://www.thoughtprovoker.info

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:49:54 -0400
From: Donna Hill <penatwork at epix.net>
To: Writer's Division Mailing List <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [stylist] seeing with your tongue
Message-ID: <4C7727D2.4070406 at epix.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Hi Allison,
I think this sort of thing is a double-edged sword. As science, it is 
fascinating, but I personally have a viseral reaction against it. Even 
with no heavy equipment, the idea that we would use such a technique, 
which would seem to have its own social stigma, instead of developing 
other senses like hearing and touch just seems like a re enforcement of 
the social stereotype that blindness must be so aweful that people would

jump at something this weird.
Just my two cents,
Donna

Read Donna's articles on
Suite 101:
www.suite101.com/profile.cfm/donna_hill
Ezine Articles:
http://ezinearticles.com/?expert=D._W._Hill
American Chronicle:
www.americanchronicle.com/authors/view/3885

Connect with Donna on
Twitter:
www.twitter.com/dewhill
LinkedIn:
www.linkedin.com/in/dwh99
FaceBook:
www.facebook.com/donna.w.hill.

Hear clips from "The Last Straw" at:
cdbaby.com/cd/donnahill
Apple I-Tunes
phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playListId=25924437
4

Check out the "Sound in Sight" CD project
Donna is Head of Media Relations for the nonprofit
Performing Arts Division of the National Federation of the Blind:
www.padnfb.org

On 8/26/2010 9:47 PM, Allison Nastoff wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
> Since this list has been talking about technology that would allow the

> blind to drive, I thought it would be interesting to start a 
> discussion on a story I saw on yesterday's episode of Good Morning 
> America.  The story was about technology being developed that projects

> images on to the tongue using electrical signals that the blind can 
> feel, which in a sense allows them to "see with their tongue".  I hope

> you don't mind me cross posting this since it was discussed on another

> NFB list, but since it was off topic for that list, I thought it would

> be interesting to continue the discussion on this list.
> I also wanted to get your opinions because when I was in sixth grade, 
> I participated in a research study for this technology at a local 
> college when it was very early in its development.  I dropped out of 
> the study after the first year, and maybe in the years since, the 
> technology has improved.  But I remember that when I was in the study,

> the strip that I put on to my tongue extended from a large machine 
> which sent the electrical stimulation to my tongue.  This machine was 
> connected to a camera which sent the images to a computer, and a board

> covered with cloth to create a white background also had to be set up 
> behind the camera.  So the point I am trying to make is that this was 
> way too much gear to walk around my kitchen or go rock climbing with 
> the way the blind participants did in this segment.  But it also 
> seemed kind of impractical because it was hard to tell what the shapes

> were, even when it came to braille dots which I read expertly with my 
> fingers, and I know I can locate objects around the kitchen much 
> faster with my fingers.  Don't get me wrong.  The concept of seeing 
> with your tongue is pretty cool, and I understand how it could be 
> useful for people like the man featured in this video since he went 
> blind as an adult, but since I have been blind all of my life, I 
> wonder if investing in this kind of technology makes sense, or if it 
> would be more beneficial to invest the resources in teaching people to

> adapt to their blindness with the traditional, and I think more 
> efficient way, using your fingers, ears and nose, or at least invest 
> in technology that restores sight for real, rather than just coming up

> with some weird inefficient contraption to see with their tongue.  
> What do you all think? Is there anyone else on this list who has 
> participated in research for this kind of technology? If so, what were

> your feelings about it? I am always interested in getting other 
> people's perspectives about innovations like this.  Here is the link 
> to the story.
> http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/helping-blind-people-tongues-1147
> 7360
> Allison Nastoff
>
> _______________________________________________
> Writers Division web site:
> http://www.nfb-writers-division.org 
> <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
>
> stylist mailing list
> stylist at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/stylist_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> stylist:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/stylist_nfbnet.org/penatwork%40epi
x.net 
>
>
>
>
>
> E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.514)
> Database version: 6.15740
> http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/
>

E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.514)
Database version: 6.15740
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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 02:01:57 -0400
From: "slery" <slerythema at insightbb.com>
To: "'Writer's Division Mailing List'" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [stylist] Word Processing question
Message-ID: <566ED2B1843D48B394BD8276A5710AD3 at DesktopCindyPC>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"

Yes, Joe, that is exactly what I am talking about.

Cindy

> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org 
> [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Joe Orozco
> Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 9:56 AM
> To: 'Writer's Division Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [stylist] Word Processing question
> 
> 
> I'm not Cindy, but I think she may be talking about the 
> formatting styles you can access through Word using Shift + 
> Control + S.  There you can pick from a list of formatting 
> styles and modify their appearance so that they affect the 
> document across the board where ever that style is used.  For 
> example, I have a title style and a subtitle style.  With a 
> couple keystrokes I can make a part of my text fall into that 
> style, and later, if I should change my mind about the size, 
> font, alignment, bold, etc. I can just adjust the style and 
> have it reflect throughout the document without manual 
> adjustments.  Hope that helps.
> 
> Joe
> 
> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up 
> their sleeves, some turn up their noses, and some don't turn 
> up at all."--Sam Ewing 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org 
> [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of slery
> Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 1:47 AM
> To: 'Writer's Division Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [stylist] Word Processing question
> 
> 
> Judith, et al,
> 
> I am a little under the weather at the moment and this 
> requires a length response to do it. Therefore, I will get 
> back to the list with 
> this answer
> but not at this moment.
> 
> Cindy
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org
> > [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Judith Bron
> > Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2010 11:12 AM
> > To: Writer's Division Mailing List
> > Subject: Re: [stylist] Word Processing question
> > 
> > 
> >   Cindy, How do you set the style?  In my manuscript I typed
> > the words 
> > formatting it to indent the first word of the paragraph by 
> > 0.5 inches.  I 
> > sentered the chapter title like Chapter one.  I never heard 
> > of what you are 
> > talking about.  Can you enlighten us further?  Thanks, Judith
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "slery" <slerythema at insightbb.com>
> > To: "'Writer's Division Mailing List'" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2010 1:21 AM
> > Subject: Re: [stylist] Word Processing question
> > 
> > 
> > > The best way, and the way that copyeditors and publishers
> > use, are to
> > > use styles.
> > >
> > > Don't format each heading and chapter. Set it to a style, 
> then when
> > > you define the style (or your publisher changes it), it will be 
> > > applied to all items listed as that style and you don't 
> > have to change
> > > each and every occurrence.
> > >
> > > Cindy
> > >
> > >> -----Original Message-----
> > >> From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org
> > [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org]
> > >> On Behalf Of Judith Bron
> > >> Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2010 10:33 PM
> > >> To: Writer's Division Mailing List
> > >> Subject: Re: [stylist] Word Processing question
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Donna, I'm also using word 2003 but Jaws 7.1.  I don't have those
> > >> problems. I combine chapters into one document all the 
> time and the
> > >> font, point size
> > >> and formatting stay the same.  Here's one suggestion.  Put
> > >> all your chapters
> > >> into one document.  When you have the last one in the
> > >> document select the
> > >> document, hit control D for font, select the font you want
> > >> and go through
> > >> and do to each heading whatever you want.  Not an optimum
> > >> solution, but the
> > >> only one I can come up with.  HTH, Judith
> > >> ----- Original Message ----- 
> > >> From: "Donna Hill" <penatwork at epix.net>
> > >> To: <stylist at nfbnet.org>
> > >> Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2010 9:58 PM
> > >> Subject: [stylist] Word Processing question
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> > Hi Guys,
> > >> > Here's the thing. I'm trying to make one document of all of my
> > >> > chapters. I've done this many times with the same 
> > frustrations. If
> > >> > I
> > >> start with
> > >> > Chapter 1, put Chapter 2 on the clipboard and paste it into
> > >> Chapter 1
> > >> > after inserting a page break, one of 2 things happens.
> > >> Either the font
> > >> > changes from 12 pt. Times New Roman to 10 pt. TMNS (or
> > >> something like
> > >> > those initials anyway), or the font stays Times New Roman,
> > >> but the Chapter
> > >> > title, which I had painstakingly bolded, centered and
> > >> changed to 14 pt.,
> > >> > goes back to 12 pt. regular type and aligned left. It
> > >> always involves a
> > >> > lot of re formatting.
> > >> >
> > >> > Is there some easier way to combine documents? I'm using
> > Word 2003
> > >> > with Jaws 11.
> > >> > Thanks,
> > >> > Donna
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > Read Donna's articles on
> > >> > Suite 101:
> > >> > www.suite101.com/profile.cfm/donna_hill
> > >> > American Chronicle: www.americanchronicle.com/authors/view/3885
> > >> >
> > >> > Connect with Donna on
> > >> > Twitter:
> > >> > www.twitter.com/dewhill
> > >> > LinkedIn:
> > >> > www.linkedin.com/in/dwh99
> > >> > FaceBook:
> > >> > www.facebook.com/donna.w.hill.
> > >> >
> > >> > Hear clips from "The Last Straw" at: cdbaby.com/cd/donnahill 
> > >> > Apple I-Tunes
> > >> >
> > >> 
> > 
> phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playListId=25924
> > >> 4
> > >> > 374
> > >> >
> > >> > Check out the "Sound in Sight" CD project Donna is 
> Head of Media
> > >> > Relations for the nonprofit Performing Arts Division of the 
> > >> > National
> > >> Federation of
> > >> > the Blind:
> > >> > www.padnfb.org
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > =======
> > >> > Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
> > >> (Email Guard:
> > >> > 7.0.0.18, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15430)
> > http://www.pctools.com/
> > >> > =======
> > >> >
> > >> > _______________________________________________
> > >> > Writers Division web site: http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
> > >> > <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
> > >> >
> > >> > stylist mailing list
> > >> > stylist at nfbnet.org
> > >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/stylist_nfbnet.org
> > >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your
> > >> account info for
> > >> > stylist:
> > >> >
> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/stylist_nfbnet.org/jbron
> > > %40optonline.net
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Writers Division web site: http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
> > > <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
> > >
> > > stylist mailing list
> > > stylist at nfbnet.org 
> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/stylist_nfbnet.org
> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your
> > account info for
> > > stylist:
> > > 
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/stylist_nfbnet.org/slery
> thema%40insigh
> > tbb.com
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Writers Division web site: http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
> > <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
> >
> > stylist mailing list
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> account info for
> > stylist:
> >
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> 0optonline.n
> et
> > 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
> 
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> stylist: 
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> ema%40insigh
> tbb.com
> 
> 
> 
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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 06:20:59 -0400
From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
To: "Writer's Division Mailing List" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [stylist] seeing with your tongue
Message-ID: <BAY110-DS22AD5B495CC953DBB08303A1860 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

my friend and NAGDU member albert rizzi was the one on the program.

The biggest compliment you can pay me is to recommend my services!

Cheryl Echevarria
Independent Travel Consultant
C10-10646

http://Echevarriatravel.com
1-866-580-5574
skype: angeldn3

Reservations at echevarriatravel.com
Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
CST-1018299-10
Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise and Travel
Inc.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Donna Hill" <penatwork at epix.net>
To: "Writer's Division Mailing List" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2010 10:49 PM
Subject: Re: [stylist] seeing with your tongue

> Hi Allison,
> I think this sort of thing is a double-edged sword. As science, it is
> fascinating, but I personally have a viseral reaction against it. Even
> with no heavy equipment, the idea that we would use such a technique,
> which would seem to have its own social stigma, instead of developing
> other senses like hearing and touch just seems like a re enforcement
of
> the social stereotype that blindness must be so aweful that people
would
> jump at something this weird.
> Just my two cents,
> Donna
>
> Read Donna's articles on
> Suite 101:
> www.suite101.com/profile.cfm/donna_hill
> Ezine Articles:
> http://ezinearticles.com/?expert=D._W._Hill
> American Chronicle:
> www.americanchronicle.com/authors/view/3885
>
> Connect with Donna on
> Twitter:
> www.twitter.com/dewhill
> LinkedIn:
> www.linkedin.com/in/dwh99
> FaceBook:
> www.facebook.com/donna.w.hill.
>
> Hear clips from "The Last Straw" at:
> cdbaby.com/cd/donnahill
> Apple I-Tunes
>
phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playListId=25924437
4
>
> Check out the "Sound in Sight" CD project
> Donna is Head of Media Relations for the nonprofit
> Performing Arts Division of the National Federation of the Blind:
> www.padnfb.org
>
>
> On 8/26/2010 9:47 PM, Allison Nastoff wrote:
> > Hi Everyone,
> > Since this list has been talking about technology that would allow
the
> > blind to drive, I thought it would be interesting to start a
> > discussion on a story I saw on yesterday's episode of Good Morning
> > America.  The story was about technology being developed that
projects
> > images on to the tongue using electrical signals that the blind can
> > feel, which in a sense allows them to "see with their tongue".  I
hope
> > you don't mind me cross posting this since it was discussed on
another
> > NFB list, but since it was off topic for that list, I thought it
would
> > be interesting to continue the discussion on this list.
> > I also wanted to get your opinions because when I was in sixth
grade,
> > I participated in a research study for this technology at a local
> > college when it was very early in its development.  I dropped out of
> > the study after the first year, and maybe in the years since, the
> > technology has improved.  But I remember that when I was in the
study,
> > the strip that I put on to my tongue extended from a large machine
> > which sent the electrical stimulation to my tongue.  This machine
was
> > connected to a camera which sent the images to a computer, and a
board
> > covered with cloth to create a white background also had to be set
up
> > behind the camera.  So the point I am trying to make is that this
was
> > way too much gear to walk around my kitchen or go rock climbing with
> > the way the blind participants did in this segment.  But it also
> > seemed kind of impractical because it was hard to tell what the
shapes
> > were, even when it came to braille dots which I read expertly with
my
> > fingers, and I know I can locate objects around the kitchen much
> > faster with my fingers.  Don't get me wrong.  The concept of seeing
> > with your tongue is pretty cool, and I understand how it could be
> > useful for people like the man featured in this video since he went
> > blind as an adult, but since I have been blind all of my life, I
> > wonder if investing in this kind of technology makes sense, or if it
> > would be more beneficial to invest the resources in teaching people
to
> > adapt to their blindness with the traditional, and I think more
> > efficient way, using your fingers, ears and nose, or at least invest
> > in technology that restores sight for real, rather than just coming
up
> > with some weird inefficient contraption to see with their tongue.
> > What do you all think? Is there anyone else on this list who has
> > participated in research for this kind of technology? If so, what
were
> > your feelings about it? I am always interested in getting other
> > people's perspectives about innovations like this.  Here is the link
> > to the story.
> > http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/helping-blind-people-tongues-1147
> > 7360
> > Allison Nastoff
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Writers Division web site:
> > http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
> > <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
> >
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> > stylist at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/stylist_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
for
> > stylist:
> >
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/stylist_nfbnet.org/penatwork%40epi
x.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.514)
> > Database version: 6.15740
> > http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/
> >
>
>
>
>
> E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (7.0.0.514)
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>
> _______________________________________________
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<http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>
>
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0hotmail.com
> 

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 05:56:41 -0500
From: "Robert Leslie Newman" <newmanrl at cox.net>
To: "'Writer's Division Mailing List'" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [stylist] seeing with your tongue
Message-ID: <33F7BE1A3D274A40ABD1DCCB94BAE33C at Newmans>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"

On this seeing with your tongue thing. Guess I am of the opinion that if
there is money out there for research and development of alternative
sight,
then go for it. And I say this, tongue in cheek, sight is better than
being
blind. --- Hold on with the storm of thoughts words and recriminations
---
I'll just explain my last statement by this super generalizing
definition-
This world is setup for the sighted and there are fewer hassles if you
are
sighted. And so in saying that "having sight is better than being
blind,"
and getting back to the general topic of this thread, I support things
like
these experimentation "seeing" projects, though many of them will be too
weird and not functional or practical or acceptable for one or more
reasons.
Yet, there probably is one or more eventual outcomes that will be equal
and
acceptable to "normal" vision and/or even superior to what we were born
with. And I also support any research that could prevent the human
embryo
from developing with a medical and/or physical condition that would upon
birth be there or develop blindness later in that persons life. And in
saying all  this, in general I'm saying that I am for eliminating all
human
abnormalities, be they hereditary or congenital or even cause later in
life
by accidents (repairing the broken part or replacing it).

And so, can we successfully live with blindness? I don't feel I need to
tell
you this answer --- you know it and I know it and most of us believe and
live it. Again, I am for improving the human experience; which includes
the
personal choice of being blind, if you so choose to be. 

Robert Leslie Newman
President- NFB Writers' Division
Division Website
http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
Personal Website-
http://www.thoughtprovoker.info

-----Original Message-----
From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Allison Nastoff
Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2010 8:48 PM
To: stylist at nfbnet.org
Subject: [stylist] seeing with your tongue

Hi Everyone,
Since this list has been talking about technology that would 
allow the blind to drive, I thought it would be interesting to 
start a discussion on a story I saw on yesterday's episode of 
Good Morning America.  The story was about technology being 
developed that projects images on to the tongue using electrical 
signals that the blind can feel, which in a sense allows them to 
"see with their tongue".  I hope you don't mind me cross posting 
this since it was discussed on another NFB list, but since it was 
off topic for that list, I thought it would be interesting to 
continue the discussion on this list.
I also wanted to get your opinions because when I was in sixth 
grade, I participated in a research study for this technology at 
a local college when it was very early in its development.  I 
dropped out of the study after the first year, and maybe in the 
years since, the technology has improved.  But I remember that 
when I was in the study, the strip that I put on to my tongue 
extended from a large machine which sent the electrical 
stimulation to my tongue.  This machine was connected to a camera 
which sent the images to a computer, and a board covered with 
cloth to create a white background also had to be set up behind 
the camera.  So the point I am trying to make is that this was 
way too much gear to walk around my kitchen or go rock climbing 
with the way the blind participants did in this segment.  But it 
also seemed kind of impractical because it was hard to tell what 
the shapes were, even when it came to braille dots which I read 
expertly with my fingers, and I know I can locate objects around 
the kitchen much faster with my fingers.  Don't get me wrong.  
The concept of seeing with your tongue is pretty cool, and I 
understand how it could be useful for people like the man 
featured in this video since he went blind as an adult, but since 
I have been blind all of my life, I wonder if investing in this 
kind of technology makes sense, or if it would be more beneficial 
to invest the resources in teaching people to adapt to their 
blindness with the traditional, and I think more efficient way, 
using your fingers, ears and nose, or at least invest in 
technology that restores sight for real, rather than just coming 
up with some weird inefficient contraption to see with their 
tongue.  What do you all think? Is there anyone else on this list 
who has participated in research for this kind of technology? If 
so, what were your feelings about it? I am always interested in 
getting other people's perspectives about innovations like this.  
Here is the link to the story.
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/helping-blind-people-tongues-1147
7360
Allison Nastoff

_______________________________________________
Writers Division web site:
http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
<http://www.nfb-writers-division.org/>

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net

------------------------------

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End of stylist Digest, Vol 76, Issue 47
***************************************