[Tactile-Talk] List

Wed Apr 16 18:20:45 UTC 2025

Actually I think you might be surprised but it depends on what you see as quickly.  I see two years as pretty quick as development goes.

From: Tactile-Talk <tactile-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Seeing Hands via Tactile-Talk
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2025 1:49 PM
To: Tactile Talk for the discussion of the display and use of graphics on refreshable Braille platforms <tactile-talk at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Seeing Hands <community at seeinghands.org>
Subject: Re: [Tactile-Talk] List

>From my reading of the article, the call was not for a specific technology, but rather an expression of hope that some other type of display technology would enable prices to decrease. As much as I would like this to happen, I do not think it is likely at the moment. Existing systems that provide tactile output without moving parts have a problem with resolution, especially as fine finger position detection becomes a requirement rather than a convenience. While you could theorize a grid of very small electromagnetic haptic generators serving as pixels, I'm not sure they would be very good at conveying the same information as pins do, and trying to build that would likely prove quite expensive too. I do not have much hope for building a Braille display without moving parts.
Unfortunately, I also don't have much hope for a miraculous cheaper cell technology to come along quickly. We have seen several new implementations which show a lot of promise, and I am confident there will be more, but these took many years of painstaking research and development. The good news is that, with increased production, these will probably become cheaper. The bad news is that that's probably not going to happen quickly.

The relevant paragraph reads:
"Braille had a strong presence at CSUN 2025, with four different companies showcasing multi-line braille displays — a long-awaited innovation that could revolutionize literacy and information access for blind users. But one persistent issue remained: cost. The technology still relies on mechanical pins moving up and down, which makes it expensive and difficult to scale. Until we move beyond this outdated, costly mechanism, braille displays will remain financially out of reach for many who need them most. We need a breakthrough — a new refreshable braille technology that eliminates the reliance on mechanical pins, allowing for a truly affordable, scalable solution."
--
On 4/16/2025 10:30, carcione--- via Tactile-Talk wrote:
Dan, do you know how that works?  What does a person feel, with no moving parts?  I suppose they could use haptics or something, but, at least for me, vibrations are not as clear as dots for understanding a pattern.
Tracy

From: Tactile-Talk  <mailto:tactile-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> <tactile-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of dan.tevelde--- via Tactile-Talk
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2025 1:20 PM
To: 'Tactile Talk for the discussion of the display and use of graphics on refreshable Braille platforms'  <mailto:tactile-talk at nfbnet.org> <tactile-talk at nfbnet.org>
Cc: dan.tevelde at comcast.net <mailto:dan.tevelde at comcast.net> 
Subject: Re: [Tactile-Talk] List

I had the impression that he meant any moving parts. I remember reading at one time about technology which created virtual buttons. It was described using the acronym MEMS. A tech support person from my cell phone provider said it was a technology used to replace physical buttons which can break.

Dan

From: Tactile-Talk <tactile-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org <mailto:tactile-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> > On Behalf Of Jenine Stanley via Tactile-Talk
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2025 11:54 AM
To: Tactile Talk for the discussion of the display and use of graphics on refreshable Braille platforms <tactile-talk at nfbnet.org <mailto:tactile-talk at nfbnet.org> >
Cc: Jenine Stanley <jeninems at icloud.com <mailto:jeninems at icloud.com> >
Subject: Re: [Tactile-Talk] List

I’d be curious to know if he meant the piezoelectric pins or the little magnetic balls/pins used by the less expensive displays like the Orbit Reader. 

On Apr 16, 2025, at 12:14 PM, dan.tevelde--- via Tactile-Talk <tactile-talk at nfbnet.org <mailto:tactile-talk at nfbnet.org> > wrote:

Is this list still active? I haven’t seen any traffic lately. I’m interested in continuing the discussion of tactile displays. It was interesting reading a blog post by Kirk Adams describing his impressions of the CSUN conference. He noted that multi-line displays capable of displaying text and graphics are too expensive for the average consumer. I think we already knew that. It’s like any new technology. I remember the first Kurzweil reading machine was $50,000 and you only saw them at universities. Now we have reading machines in our pockets. I can use my phone or Meta glasses to read text. Could graphics displays become cheaper? I don’t know considering the situation with reduced public funding.

One comment Kirk made puzzled me. He said graphics displays should stop using pins. What would replace the pins? He should have explained what he meant which would have helped him make a case for his ideas.

Dan
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