[Trainer-Talk] Is NVDA enough for the blind?

Fri Jun 5 19:24:55 UTC 2026

Hi all –

Coming from a trainer-adjacent perspective, this is a great thread. My
takeaway to the answer to Showe’s original question is that it depends on
the individual and the situation.

Let me state first that I’ve been using NVDA almost exclusively for the
past 15 years or so. The only consistent use I’ve made of JAWS in that time
is to work with Duxbury, and I don’t do any Duxbury work these days. I’ve
used a number of screen readers since the early 90s, and for much of that
time JAWS was the pinnacle. But I don’t believe that is the case now.

1.      Curtis is right on the mark when he says that it is deplorable for
VR to opt for the “good enough” option simply to save money. They need to
provide the tools that are most appropriate to that individual’s situation
– including the work tools they will need to use and the level of support
that will be available to them. Trainers need to cite these factors in tech
recommendations, but I think that what Showe alludes to is that, once
you’ve recommended no-cost NVDA for one client, VR counselors turn into
sharks (no pun intended) and when they smell blood, they move in on one
free solution for all. Brian suggests that this might one day become true
for Narrator, should it cross some effectiveness/acceptance threshold.

2.      Matthew makes great points about teaching skills and
problem-solving rather than one screen reader. And no, NVDA isn’t always
enough. Sometimes I need to turn on Narrator. (grin). In the College
Readiness I’ve taught for the past dozen years, I’ve emphasized to those
students that they can’t rely on one browser or one screen reader, because
we will always run into something that doesn’t work in Chrome that works in
Edge or Firefox, or that NVDA or JAWS doesn’t get, but the other does.

Or that works better in the phone app, for that matter. If something
doesn’t work right when I’m using JAWS, can I complain it isn’t accessible
and stop? No, as Matthew suggests, in my job, I need to get things done, so
I need to try a couple of alternatives before I throw u my hands.

3.      I’ve been using NVDA for everything so long that, if I have turned
JAWS on for some other purpose and move to Outlook or Excel, I get
frustrated because it doesn’t respond in the ways that I’m accustomed to
with NVDA. I mention this to underscore that familiarity factor mentioned
in the thread.

4.      Sometimes, screen readers lock up. My experience of old with JAWS
was that it often froze the computer, and I would have to restart the
computer if it froze, but with NVDA I rarely do that, just do Control-alt N
and I’m good again. Don’t know if this is still a thing with JAWS.

5.      Brett didn’t mention this, but every time we need to renew our JAWS
license – or now consider subscriptions – our discussions as to whether the
time is upon us to drop JAWS and switch to NVDA as the screen reader of
choice for CCB become more serious. Once, I was the only one who brought
this up, but this idea keeps gaining traction. Licensing has always been a
huge headache  for JAWS, not just at CCB, but in my previous years tracking
that at the university level with libraries and labs, etc., where we
deployed JAWS in the old days. But that was back when nobody could touch
JAWS. Now, things are roughly even and we have to ask, “Are the hassles and
costs for JAWS really worth it?” For some, the answer will be yes, but not
for all of us. JAWS just doesn’t own this space like it did in the late 90s
or 00s.

6.      Does the word “bloat” resonate with anyone?

7.      I am impressed with all that Quinton has shared, but maybe more
impressed with the number of professionals on this list saying that they
use JAWS to do their very professional jobs as tech trainers. That is a
real testimonial for NVDA.

Thanks for indulging me!

Dan

On Fri, Jun 5, 2026 at 9:54 AM Christopher Murphy via Trainer-Talk <
trainer-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Good morning,
>         Everything stated here is so true. There are so many actors to
> consider when accommodations are requested and what may be more affordable.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Christopher Murphy
> Email:
> cjohnmurph at gmail.com
>
> this is a CONFIDENTIAL communication and is not to be duplicated or
> forwarded to other individuals or organizations unless the email says
> otherwise. This electronic message, including all attachments, is intended
> only for the use of the addressee(s) named above and may contain legally
> privileged and confidential information. The authorized recipient of this
> information is prohibited from disclosing this information to any other
> party unless required to do so by law or regulation and is required to
> destroy the information after its stated need has been fulfilled.  If you
> received this message in error, please do not use, disclose, copy, or
> disseminate any of the information in this message. Please notify the
> sender by reply e-mail and delete the original message
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Trainer-Talk <trainer-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Brian
> Vogel via Trainer-Talk
> Sent: Friday, June 5, 2026 10:43 AM
> To: List for teachers and trainers of adaptive technology <
> trainer-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Brian Vogel <britechguy at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Trainer-Talk] Is NVDA enough for the blind?
>
> Leo Bado wrote:  ". . . if the goal is to secure a real-world job, users
> should train with the same authentic, situational tools the role actually
> demands. Practice should mirror the workplace—not some sanitized sandbox
> with training wheels."
>
> Showe Trela wrote, in part: "For those of you actively teaching, placing
> consumers into employment, or working within VR systems, what do you see as
> the long-term implications of moving away from JAWS as the primary screen
> reader taught to blind individuals?"
>
> These two things are not mutually exclusive.  That being said, most VR
> systems and employers (if the employers know anything at all) know about
> one, and only one, screen reader:  JAWS.  That's an accident of history as
> JAWS is the granddaddy of them all that still survives on the Windows
> platform.
>
> But the reality is that money does matter, as do the attitudes of many IT
> departments, a number of which are only familiar with JAWS.  But none of
> this makes JAWS inherently superior.
>
> I am recently retired (as of April 1st) after a decade and a half of
> working as a tutor for the Virginia Department for the Blind and Vision
> Impaired Technology Tutor Network.  We were (and are still) effectively a
> JAWS only shop, which I had been trying to get them away from for quite
> some time.  Many clients, particularly those who will be seeking remote
> employment, and where such employment is sometimes tenuous, at best, simply
> cannot afford the current JAWS subscription costs if they are not actively
> employed.  You can't use JAWS Personal for employment (or at least you
> can't legally, and no state agency would ever do so).  Keeping a
> professional subscription is expensive.
>
> I have used NVDA as a functional stand-in for JAWS since almost 2010,
> because when I first started tutoring the only option for JAWS was a full
> license and the number of referrals and their irregularity made it
> financially unreasonable to buy a JAWS license that I used only
> intermittently.  JAWS and NVDA have much more in common from the
> perspective of "typical daily driver tasks" (regardless of setting) than
> they do differences.
>
> One also cannot ignore Narrator in all of this, either, as Microsoft has
> been focusing more resources on Narrator in the Windows 10/11 era than it
> ever did before.
>
> It's also important to remember that choice of screen reader as a
> reasonable accommodation by an employer does not necessarily mean you will
> get the screen reader you prefer.  They are not obligated to supply JAWS
> (though this is what most do) but to supply a screen reader that allows the
> work tasks to be performed.  And when it comes to money, and how business
> works, I can definitely see the time coming in the not wildly distant
> future where Narrator is going to be pushed a lot harder because it comes
> with Windows at no cost and is a Microsoft made and supported product.
>
> It's all about feature matching, and that can and does mean that if most
> of the employers in your area of service are almost certain to be supplying
> JAWS, then the focus should be on JAWS.  But if they are not already set in
> their ways about what they supply, that gives you the latitude to teach the
> screen reader you choose and help them get it set up.
>
> There is no one right answer here.  The number of variables on the end of
> the potential employers and on the end of the clients, and the nature of
> the likely employment scenario itself all can push more in the JAWS or NVDA
> direction.
>
> But in the end I've yet to meet a long-term JAWS user who can't make the
> jump to NVDA, or vice versa, with relative ease.  These two screen readers
> are not "worlds apart."
>
> Brian Vogel
> _______________________________________________
> Trainer-Talk mailing list
> Trainer-Talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/trainer-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Trainer-Talk:
>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/trainer-talk_nfbnet.org/cjohnmurph%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Trainer-Talk mailing list
> Trainer-Talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/trainer-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Trainer-Talk:
>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/trainer-talk_nfbnet.org/burke.dall%40gmail.com
>

-- 
Dan Burke

National Federation of the Blind of Colorado Legislative Co-chair

"Blindness is not what holds you back.  You can live the life you want!"

My Cell:  406.546.8546