[Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 6

[Patricia C. Estes]

Congrats on the Power Point! Good luck with that...and you go, Girl! You are 
inspiring us and we will love to hear your reports back about projects.
There must be some other people on the list doing projects or with 
questions...someone asked a while back to "know how you do what you 
do."...or to be shown how.
Patty
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
<artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 1:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 6


>I have always believed we do not have to be "educated" in art to enjoy it, 
>do it, or teach it.  The education part is necessary if we are formally, 
>professionally teaching art through an academic setting - but otherwise I 
>think that art is a universal language that everyone can enjoy or make at 
>some level. Your mother's influence on the people she taught is priceless. 
>You were so fortunate to be raised in a home that did not set boundaries on 
>your abilities and aspirations.
>
> My daughter-in-law and I were speaking the morning about reading. I my 
> children's experience, they encountered Shakespeare, Dickens, Tennyson, 
> and lots more great thinkers while they were babies.  I would put my 
> babies in their little "chairs" from the time they were born, and place 
> them right onto the kitchen table, and read to them. They are all great 
> readers today, and I think it is because they encountered reading from 
> their very beginnings. My youngest daughter would go and sit in a bedroom, 
> when she was pregnant, with one of her boys. She would sit in a rocking 
> chair and rock, while reading a book to her unborn babies. Today, that 
> daughter is a librarian, reading stories to hundreds of little students at 
> her school. Like art, reading is universal and nobody has to understand 
> every word that they hear in order to gain something from the experience.
>
> OH, I am kind of EXCITED. I decided I was going to relearn how to do a 
> power point presentation. Well, I asked my daughter and she told me where 
> to find that program on my computer. I found it, and I have started to 
> create my first power point presentation since my sight loss.  I only did 
> the first slide, and it took me awhile, but it will all come back to me as 
> I continue to figure it out now.  woooHoooo, for learning and relearning 
> every day, right?  Lynda
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 12:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 
> 6
>
>
>> Linda,
>> I am sharing this about my mother as an art instructor in case it is 
>> useful to anyone.
>> Yes, My mother was a great, self taught, instructor of the arts: 
>> sketching, oils, water and art appreciation. We did have great books 
>> around the house: Betty Edwards, History of Art, Metropolitan Museum of 
>> Art home study course, etc.
>> But to Mom's great frustration, she was a much better teacher than an 
>> artist!She had private students and also taught at the very large Adult 
>> Ed program for many years. And she would have a "real exhibit" of her 
>> students' first paintings. It was amazing to hear about the variety of 
>> styles, subjects and reasons for turning to painting. It did not at all 
>> look like the pieces were an assembly line type of art that could be 
>> traced to a particular teacher.
>> Now, my personal opinion about her instruction is that she had great 
>> powers of observation...right down to details and nuanced intentions that 
>> a student hoped to convey. This is sort of what we have been talking 
>> about: being almost hyper aware of one's world, observing it and 
>> translating it into your own language.
>> So, to be our own best instructor we could ask ourselves some questions 
>> as we begin and develop our work (I mean, Play). And this is also 
>> granting that we will not know the end from the beginning, as Linda wrote 
>> about. There's the clarity about what we produce as well as the energetic 
>> clarity coming from our *intentions*...and to realize the importance of 
>> the detail of intention.
>> If we are clear, as my mother was able to pull out of her students, we 
>> will tease the viewers' attention to wander/move where we would like, in 
>> order that they might also realize our intention.
>> And sometimes a piece is intended for fun! and we can help someone 
>> smile...if we are clear.
>>
>> Oh my, time out! Now where's the red ink...???
>> Patty
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 9:14 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, 
>> Issue 6
>>
>>
>>> Patty, your mother was one fantastic teacher!
>>> OH, NO, what will you once you can no longer attend the private art 
>>> showings? Such a loss!  l o l
>>> Lynda
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2014 8:14 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, 
>>> Issue 6
>>>
>>>
>>>> Linda-this was a fun spin you put on my experience...and when you 
>>>> mentioned "weight", I heard Mom's words,"OK, you have shown me the 
>>>> shape...but objects take up space and have weight! I don't see that 
>>>> it-anchor it!"
>>>> Patty
>>>> PS A few weeks ago I was told that my dentist sold his practice. I've 
>>>> been seeing  him for twenty years and my reaction was relief!!
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 9:26 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, 
>>>> Issue 6
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Patty, this was so funny! There you are, a captive audience for a one 
>>>>> person art show - right there in your dentist's office!  This could be 
>>>>> a comic skit on SNL. But, I do understand what you are saying, 
>>>>> seriously. If the artist would just spend some time getting to know 
>>>>> those objects in a personal way, it would make a difference. She could 
>>>>> just sit and hold them, feel their weight, explore the surfaces and 
>>>>> how they move in space, and things like this.  The way you describe 
>>>>> them makes it seem to me as though they don't have a sense of "touch" 
>>>>> to them and as a viewer you cannot get that feeling from the 
>>>>> paintings, so something is amiss. The scary part is that this is 
>>>>> really how she sees them herself.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lynda
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 7:55 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, 
>>>>> Issue 6
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Linda, what you just expressed about understanding the object, 
>>>>>> whatever, one is painting totally explains something to me. We have a 
>>>>>> local artist who has many, many still life paintings and the subjects 
>>>>>> are interesting and the colors dramatic and she is truly hailed 
>>>>>> around these parts. But I have such trouble with her work-after the 
>>>>>> color, the subject and the presentation. (and here it is, my personal 
>>>>>> perspective presented as fact!) In my opinion, all of her objects 
>>>>>> seem to be floating-no sense of dimension. Which goes back to the 
>>>>>> time spent learning to draw (her shadowing is confusing and these are 
>>>>>> not abstracts) and, she may not "understand" her subjects and relies 
>>>>>> on vision alone to define it...just thinking out loud.
>>>>>> Evry time I go to my dentist's for cleanings, the paintings around 
>>>>>> the place are all different...oh, this artist is married to my 
>>>>>> dentist. So, I am confronted with these large canvases and I just 
>>>>>> stare at one painting at a time to try to "see" what she is doing and 
>>>>>> why it is that it bothers me-grapes and wine bottles just don't 
>>>>>> float! OK...back to the no rules thing, I love that, but...hmmm...I 
>>>>>> think I'll rethink this.Maybe these do float... Maybe I don't need a 
>>>>>> reason to be distracted by her lack of grounding things, in my view. 
>>>>>> Maybe I just don't like her work!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, the energy here is nice-the clearer we can be about what we are 
>>>>>> doing, want to do, etc...that clarity is quite fresh. But this 
>>>>>> applies in all endeavors, of course. That is until one comes to the 
>>>>>> point that there just aren't the words for what we think/feel.  the 
>>>>>> space and energy around creating from the self are nebulous-like 
>>>>>> trying to tack jello to a tree. But we just love trying, don't 
>>>>>> we? -loving the subjects here has been very energizing.
>>>>>> Patty
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons" 
>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 7:03 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, 
>>>>>> Issue 6
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As a drawing teacher, I understood that if my sighted students did 
>>>>>>> not understand the object they were drawing by using all their 
>>>>>>> senses, then they did not understand that thing at all. Because the 
>>>>>>> sense of sight is so powerful and takes over all the other senses, a 
>>>>>>> sighted person just takes a very quick glance at things and THINKS 
>>>>>>> she understands it and she does not at all.  The drawing will be 
>>>>>>> merely superficial and will not show the nuances of it, as it is in 
>>>>>>> space, it's weight, etc. When blindfolded, the student begins to 
>>>>>>> understand the object on deeper levels of understanding. What 
>>>>>>> happens is that by relying only on sight, the student cannot really 
>>>>>>> SEE a thing at all - but they think they can. So blindfolding the 
>>>>>>> student had nothing to do with how a blind person experiences the 
>>>>>>> thing, it had to do with really SEEING the thing. Seeing is 
>>>>>>> something that is experienced over a very long period of time - it 
>>>>>>> required that the person slow way down, and focus on the moment in 
>>>>>>> time as they touch the object - and they are at the same time, 
>>>>>>> learning how it really looks.  Sight alone cannot do this for us. 
>>>>>>> This is very intersting to me because I had never been around a 
>>>>>>> blind person in my life, with the exception of two different people 
>>>>>>> whom I had only very limited time with. I would not have made the 
>>>>>>> connection between sight loss and the drawing experience at that 
>>>>>>> time at all. Only in hind sight, after my own sight loss, can I 
>>>>>>> truly understand how important these lessons were.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>> From: "Laurie Porter" <free.spirit1 at live.com>
>>>>>>> To: <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 6:40 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, 
>>>>>>> Issue 6
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The idea that all children blind or sighted can draw pictures 
>>>>>>>> fascinates me. I was legally blind all my life until 2003 when I 
>>>>>>>> lost all my sight. both of my parents  were blind, and I recall 
>>>>>>>> them never knowing how to draw anything However, fundimentally  all 
>>>>>>>> children, blind or sighted learn basics like drawing a circle or 
>>>>>>>> square then later other shapes. I might have been a better drawer 
>>>>>>>> if I had access to tactual shapes. I was encouraged to use my 
>>>>>>>> vision to do everything but my parents lacked the ability to teach 
>>>>>>>> me how to process things visually which comes to all children at a 
>>>>>>>> very early age. this is a very interesting t,   -----Original 
>>>>>>>> Message----- 
>>>>>>>> From: artists-making-art-request at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 2:03 PM
>>>>>>>> To: artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 6
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Send Artists-making-art mailing list submissions to
>>>>>>>> artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>>>>>>> than "Re: Contents of Artists-making-art digest..."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>   1. Re: drawing the internal dialogue (Lynda Lambert)
>>>>>>>>   2. Re: drawing the internal dialogue (Sahar's Beaded Creations)
>>>>>>>>   3. Re: drawing the internal dialogue (Patricia C. Estes)
>>>>>>>>   4. Re: Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 5 (Laurie Porter)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 08:56:25 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] drawing the internal dialogue
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <2E945A7FA30F4110A726835349F4841D at Lambert>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Patricia, you bring up the most fascinating things. This is another 
>>>>>>>> one of those things that is so enjoyable to think about. Drawing! 
>>>>>>>> We do not need sight to draw, I am absolutely sure of that. In 
>>>>>>>> fact, in many of my drawing courses, I had students draw 
>>>>>>>> blindfolded. They had to feel the objects, then return to the easel 
>>>>>>>> to do their drawings. They could walk over to feel it as often as 
>>>>>>>> they liked during the process, but they were not permitted to have 
>>>>>>>> a physical "look" at it with the eyes. The drawings they made were 
>>>>>>>> astounding - so full of livingness and so magical. You are making 
>>>>>>>> me remember those things that I had not thought of for a very long 
>>>>>>>> time - and this is great for me because I am going to be a speaker 
>>>>>>>> at a conference on disabilities and inclusion in March, and this is 
>>>>>>>> exactly what I needed to be thinking about as I prep for that 
>>>>>>>> lecture.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If anyone else has some examples of experiences for me, that I 
>>>>>>>> could share with the audience, please let me know.  I want to 
>>>>>>>> really make my audience understand that blind people have the same 
>>>>>>>> passions for art and art making as anyone else. We just have to 
>>>>>>>> learn adaptive ways of working, but we can do it, and we love to do 
>>>>>>>> it and it brings us great joy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> yes, I used Drawing From the Right Side of the Brain as a textbook 
>>>>>>>> for Drawing courses at the college! I also used "The Natural Way to 
>>>>>>>> Draw" by Nicolaides.  I have worked my way through both of these 
>>>>>>>> books for years on end. Drawing is the core of everything we do as 
>>>>>>>> artists and without a good foundation in drawing, it's difficult to 
>>>>>>>> move on - it is the structure on which we build everything else no 
>>>>>>>> matter the medium we work with. Drawing puts us in touch with the 
>>>>>>>> internal dialogue and we become more aware and connected with the 
>>>>>>>> object we are drawing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The interesting thing about drawing, to me, has always been that 
>>>>>>>> all children seem to know how to draw by instinct. How does that 
>>>>>>>> "fit" in your experience, Patricia?  I have never encountered a 
>>>>>>>> child who did not know how to draw and make pictures - I have 
>>>>>>>> always thought we are born with these abilities.  I think a child 
>>>>>>>> born blind would have this same inclination, if provided with the 
>>>>>>>> tools and opportunities early on, but that is a guess on my part. I 
>>>>>>>> would love to know more about this by someone who has had the 
>>>>>>>> experience as a very small child without sight. Drawing is more, 
>>>>>>>> far more, than the thing that is left on the page after the person 
>>>>>>>> has made it. It is a whole body experience - physical and spiritual 
>>>>>>>> experience, in my experiences. So, it seems to me that no sight is 
>>>>>>>> needed to make drawings. I like to say, about my own work, that the 
>>>>>>>> "thing that is on display on the gallery wall is the residue left 
>>>>>>>> behind as I was making art."  It is not the art itself, it is the 
>>>>>>>> tracks that show I was there.  The art was what transpired within 
>>>>>>>> me as I worked on it and the piece in the gallery is the evidence 
>>>>>>>> that I was there.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have to say that without my extensive drawing background, I would 
>>>>>>>> not be who I am today as a blind person. I have a small amount of 
>>>>>>>> peripheral vision that is enough that I can detect movement. Those 
>>>>>>>> movements are "gestures" and it is through the gestures around me 
>>>>>>>> that I navigate the world and that I identify people and things. It 
>>>>>>>> is the essence of everything - gesture. When I am making my art 
>>>>>>>> these days, it is because I am accustomed to using gesture and can 
>>>>>>>> continue to do that without sight. Touch is gesture, and that is 
>>>>>>>> how I understand what I touch. I feel it's internal and external 
>>>>>>>> gesture.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OH, that is so funny about your 5 year old's comment about using 
>>>>>>>> his "girl brain."  This is what I found so fascinating when I was 
>>>>>>>> reading this book, that the entire structure of the brain is very 
>>>>>>>> different in males and females. Each individual part of the brain 
>>>>>>>> is different between the sexes - so it is a physical as well as 
>>>>>>>> psychological difference. She explored many different nuances that 
>>>>>>>> really helped me as a blind person as well, as I was reading. It 
>>>>>>>> gave me new insight into different aspects we encounter due to 
>>>>>>>> sight loss. I would highly recommend it to anyone who has interest 
>>>>>>>> in learning more about how the brain functions, and it is explored 
>>>>>>>> in a way that a non-science person like me coulnd understand and 
>>>>>>>> enjoy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is all certainly another aspect of  the discussion on 
>>>>>>>> difference between art and crafts thought process and ways of 
>>>>>>>> "seeing."  Lynda
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Patricia C. Estes
>>>>>>>>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 8:54 PM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Linda, the brain is so fascinating-or is it the mind?? My first 
>>>>>>>> real understanding of it (before I studied holistic psychology and 
>>>>>>>> energy medicine) was when our youngest was caught doing something 
>>>>>>>> or other that five year olds do, and he burst into tears and 
>>>>>>>> managed to blurt out emphatically, "My girl brain made me do it!"
>>>>>>>>  Yes, Luke, I know what you mean! But he didn't go to school, yet, 
>>>>>>>> and we didn't have a TV...I think he just *knew*.
>>>>>>>>  Dr. Christian Northrop teaches about the female brain, too. Her 
>>>>>>>> example is that she and her, then, husband were flying somewhere 
>>>>>>>> and she noticed that she was reading "Enriching the Mother/Daughter 
>>>>>>>> Relationship" and he was reading "How to get the most out of your 
>>>>>>>> Band Saw."
>>>>>>>>  To bring art into this, I am sure you are familiar with the 
>>>>>>>> book,"Drawing on the Right side of the Brain." Pretty fascinating, 
>>>>>>>> if one has time to complicate one's life by experimenting with 
>>>>>>>> drawing things upside down.
>>>>>>>>  Energetically, if you want to engage both hemispheres, Brain Gym 
>>>>>>>> says to "think of an X." And to relax the mind, think of two 
>>>>>>>> parallel lines.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  OK, I'm taking my parallel lines and heading to bed,
>>>>>>>>  Patty
>>>>>>>>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>    From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:48 PM
>>>>>>>>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" by 
>>>>>>>> Luann Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful 
>>>>>>>> information a long time ago. Raising my brood of children would 
>>>>>>>> have been so much easier if I had known these things about the 
>>>>>>>> differences between male and female brains. And, my goodness, I 
>>>>>>>> would have been a much better teacher, too. I would have a better 
>>>>>>>> understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least I do 
>>>>>>>> understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was 
>>>>>>>> so enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as 
>>>>>>>> we would ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess 
>>>>>>>> it is like this conversation we are having right now in this 
>>>>>>>> truck." This was his insight as I was rapidly sharing so much 
>>>>>>>> information as he sat quietly listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I 
>>>>>>>> understand this conversation here in this truck so much better." We 
>>>>>>>> laughed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into the 
>>>>>>>> other. We all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my 
>>>>>>>> mother taking an afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery 
>>>>>>>> stitches and to creat a picture on a linen tea towel - I was 
>>>>>>>> probably 8 years old. Then, it continues on with my precious 
>>>>>>>> neighbor taking an hour each morning, one summer, to teach me how 
>>>>>>>> to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, skirt, and then an 
>>>>>>>> entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those around us, and 
>>>>>>>> how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is an 
>>>>>>>> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with 
>>>>>>>> every stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" 
>>>>>>>> to them for giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I 
>>>>>>>> am becoming with each new day and each new idea I work with.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1
>>>>>>>>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>      From: Patricia C. Estes
>>>>>>>>      To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>      Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>>>>>>>>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time 
>>>>>>>> to articulate these distinctions.
>>>>>>>>      I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter 
>>>>>>>> simultaneously. I am back to my art and love the discovery of 
>>>>>>>> it-but I will admit, my left brain does like rules and 
>>>>>>>> instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no put down to Boy 
>>>>>>>> Brains, just a family joke).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Right on! Right on, Linda!
>>>>>>>>      pece out
>>>>>>>>        ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>        From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>        To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>        Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>>>>>>>>        Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I 
>>>>>>>> better get back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this 
>>>>>>>> should be a good place for a discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line 
>>>>>>>> between the two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a 
>>>>>>>> crafter can take the exact same materials, but the mind that works 
>>>>>>>> with them is quite different and the results are quite different. 
>>>>>>>> It's really about "ideas" and "concepts" and what we are thinking 
>>>>>>>> about as we work, and where we go with the materials in our process 
>>>>>>>> of working. In Pittsburgh, PA there is a very fine museum/gallery 
>>>>>>>> called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - now, what is done 
>>>>>>>> there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and there is 
>>>>>>>> CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
>>>>>>>> very distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you 
>>>>>>>> would be very aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college 
>>>>>>>> (Geneva College, in western PA)  where I was free to teach across 
>>>>>>>> disciplines, as I have my MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in 
>>>>>>>> English Literature. Because of this background, I was very 
>>>>>>>> marketable for a good position.  I was able to create 
>>>>>>>> multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
>>>>>>>> art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, 
>>>>>>>> printmaking, drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary studies and doing so many projects with profs in 
>>>>>>>> other disciplines. I was very active in conferences on 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European experience for 
>>>>>>>> art and literature students and we lived in Austria every summer 
>>>>>>>> and then traveled to other countries. I even had an art exhibition 
>>>>>>>> in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so hard in 
>>>>>>>> the studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the 
>>>>>>>> month they had a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto 
>>>>>>>> Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring as part of their 
>>>>>>>> course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to visit 
>>>>>>>> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent 
>>>>>>>> our spring time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get 
>>>>>>>> a piece done today!
>>>>>>>>        Lynda
>>>>>>>>          ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>          From: Ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>          To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>          Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>          Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is 
>>>>>>>> reading this is still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since 
>>>>>>>> there are all sorts of shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went 
>>>>>>>> off on a tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather 
>>>>>>>> randomly. They started laughing and saying something akin to how do 
>>>>>>>> you make it from day to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for 
>>>>>>>> you to be a good pilot you know and follow rules. That is what they 
>>>>>>>> pay you for. I am an artist and I am paid to break the rules. No 
>>>>>>>> one wants to hear from me if it has already been done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>          Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>          303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>          ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>          http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>          http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>            Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>            From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>            Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>            To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>            <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            ?
>>>>>>>>            Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>            So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group 
>>>>>>>> though, I am like you, I just came on to ask a question about 
>>>>>>>> something I needed to know and was so glad to meet Ann who helped 
>>>>>>>> me with my question.  I am furiously working right now (oops, split 
>>>>>>>> that infinitive!) getting work done for the opening of a two-person 
>>>>>>>> exhibition at a museum - the show is called _Vision and Revision: 
>>>>>>>> Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ It is my 
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what 
>>>>>>>> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but 
>>>>>>>> just will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at 
>>>>>>>> two locations this year and will have a video that plays in the 
>>>>>>>> gallery with the art works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I 
>>>>>>>> will even be teaching in the gallery one afternoon, for the Women 
>>>>>>>> in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I taught when I 
>>>>>>>> was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. I'll 
>>>>>>>> be lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the 
>>>>>>>> ideas have come from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to 
>>>>>>>> speak at a conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two 
>>>>>>>> sessions, the day before we hang our show. So, I have those 
>>>>>>>> presentations to be working on every day now, too.  I officially 
>>>>>>>> retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, but I am still very much 
>>>>>>>> involved in everything but being in the classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Here is my response to the question you have asked. The 
>>>>>>>> gap between an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it 
>>>>>>>> is that wide. Some basic things may be similar between the two, but 
>>>>>>>> most things are very far apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Both work with the hands, and both love working with the 
>>>>>>>> hands and most have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>            Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and 
>>>>>>>> the satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            While the crafter will usually be satisfied with 
>>>>>>>> beginning something and knowing where the end will be, the artist 
>>>>>>>> begins with no notion of where the end will be or even if it will 
>>>>>>>> be.  the crafter has a clearly defined path to the finished 
>>>>>>>> product. The artist has only some inklings of possible outcomes, 
>>>>>>>> but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            The other very big thing I see as a difference between 
>>>>>>>> them is that the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever 
>>>>>>>> deviate from those rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On 
>>>>>>>> the other hand, the mature artist has learned that there are no 
>>>>>>>> rules at all. They may begin in the early stages by learning 
>>>>>>>> techniques, but eventually with the years of working, the light 
>>>>>>>> comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she is free of 
>>>>>>>> all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, everything 
>>>>>>>> can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
>>>>>>>> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? 
>>>>>>>> It's the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are 
>>>>>>>> absolutely no rules whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep 
>>>>>>>> breath just to say it. Free, free, free, at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft 
>>>>>>>> is where the person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but 
>>>>>>>> is usually content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, 
>>>>>>>> then moves on to learn something else and does that again with it. 
>>>>>>>> The artist can take crafts materials (which is what you and I both 
>>>>>>>> do) and techniques, and then take them far beyond because they will 
>>>>>>>> combine their techniques and materials with the imagination.  If 
>>>>>>>> you can teach it, it is usually a craft. If you cannot teach it, it 
>>>>>>>> is normally art. Art can begin by learning some techniques, or 
>>>>>>>> using craft materials, but then the person begins to ask the "what 
>>>>>>>> if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends in the 
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, 
>>>>>>>> but one that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows 
>>>>>>>> where the "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will 
>>>>>>>> never understand what I have just said and will most likely be 
>>>>>>>> huffing and puffing and angry with it.  An "artist" is standing and 
>>>>>>>> applauding what I have said. It is that simple, and that complex. 
>>>>>>>> The artist thrives on change and making new discoveries and each 
>>>>>>>> work leads to other querstions and more change and more new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            One can see the difference when you look at work in 
>>>>>>>> types of environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a 
>>>>>>>> table full of things that are basically all the same while the 
>>>>>>>> other will have work on display in a gallery or museum.  Each has 
>>>>>>>> decided where they "fit" and each is very happy with where they 
>>>>>>>> are. They are different animals, with different ideas, and 
>>>>>>>> different end results and outcomes. Each one has decided their own 
>>>>>>>> path and each one is comfortable with the decision she has made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>              From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>              To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>              Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>              Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from 
>>>>>>>> wisconsin who is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium 
>>>>>>>> is beadwork. I make pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed 
>>>>>>>> beads sewn together with thread. but most of my work is in making 
>>>>>>>> jewlry, but I have always looked upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              so, I have a basic question. What is the difference 
>>>>>>>> between an art and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms 
>>>>>>>> of art  but are all arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of 
>>>>>>>> you for getting this list going as it is something I?ve always 
>>>>>>>> dreamed of seeing in our efforts to bring blind people together who 
>>>>>>>> love to both create and appreciate the visual arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>              Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>              Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>              To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>            _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>            Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>            Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>            To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>          To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>        To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 2
>>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 09:41:10 -0600
>>>>>>>> From: "Sahar's Beaded Creations" <sahar at inebraska.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "'An exploration of art by and for blind persons'"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] drawing the internal dialogue
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <024c01cf24e4$31086190$931924b0$@inebraska.com>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello, Lynda,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I remember drawing as a small child, and I really think I would 
>>>>>>>> have been able to develop the skill had that skill been cultivated. 
>>>>>>>> I think that the teachers figured blind people couldn?t draw, so I 
>>>>>>>> don?t remember them involving us in that after Kindergarten. 
>>>>>>>> However, that?s not why I wrote. I wrote because I wondered if 
>>>>>>>> you?d ever heard of the totally blind Turkish painter, Asraf. 
>>>>>>>> Apparently, who can paint in vivid detail. I find that truly 
>>>>>>>> fascinating.  He might be someone you might want to look up.  Take 
>>>>>>>> care.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Warm regards,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sahar Husseini
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For hand-crafted, one-of-a-kind jewelry, please visit my Website at 
>>>>>>>> <http://www.saharscreations.com> www.saharscreations.com Find me on 
>>>>>>>> Facebook at  <http://www.facebook.com/saharscreations> 
>>>>>>>> www.facebook.com/saharscreations And remember, "Obstacles don't 
>>>>>>>> have to stop you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you run into a wall, don't turn around and give up.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Figure out how to climb it, go through it, or work around it."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Michael Jordan
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Artists-making-art 
>>>>>>>> [mailto:artists-making-art-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lynda 
>>>>>>>> Lambert
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 8, 2014 7:56 AM
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] drawing the internal dialogue
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Patricia, you bring up the most fascinating things. This is another 
>>>>>>>> one of those things that is so enjoyable to think about. Drawing! 
>>>>>>>> We do not need sight to draw, I am absolutely sure of that. In 
>>>>>>>> fact, in many of my drawing courses, I had students draw 
>>>>>>>> blindfolded. They had to feel the objects, then return to the easel 
>>>>>>>> to do their drawings. They could walk over to feel it as often as 
>>>>>>>> they liked during the process, but they were not permitted to have 
>>>>>>>> a physical "look" at it with the eyes. The drawings they made were 
>>>>>>>> astounding - so full of livingness and so magical. You are making 
>>>>>>>> me remember those things that I had not thought of for a very long 
>>>>>>>> time - and this is great for me because I am going to be a speaker 
>>>>>>>> at a conference on disabilities and inclusion in March, and this is 
>>>>>>>> exactly what I needed to be thinking about as I prep for that 
>>>>>>>> lecture.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If anyone else has some examples of experiences for me, that I 
>>>>>>>> could share with the audience, please let me know.  I want to 
>>>>>>>> really make my audience understand that blind people have the same 
>>>>>>>> passions for art and art making as anyone else. We just have to 
>>>>>>>> learn adaptive ways of working, but we can do it, and we love to do 
>>>>>>>> it and it brings us great joy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> yes, I used Drawing From the Right Side of the Brain as a textbook 
>>>>>>>> for Drawing courses at the college! I also used "The Natural Way to 
>>>>>>>> Draw" by Nicolaides.  I have worked my way through both of these 
>>>>>>>> books for years on end. Drawing is the core of everything we do as 
>>>>>>>> artists and without a good foundation in drawing, it's difficult to 
>>>>>>>> move on - it is the structure on which we build everything else no 
>>>>>>>> matter the medium we work with. Drawing puts us in touch with the 
>>>>>>>> internal dialogue and we become more aware and connected with the 
>>>>>>>> object we are drawing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The interesting thing about drawing, to me, has always been that 
>>>>>>>> all children seem to know how to draw by instinct. How does that 
>>>>>>>> "fit" in your experience, Patricia?  I have never encountered a 
>>>>>>>> child who did not know how to draw and make pictures - I have 
>>>>>>>> always thought we are born with these abilities.  I think a child 
>>>>>>>> born blind would have this same inclination, if provided with the 
>>>>>>>> tools and opportunities early on, but that is a guess on my part. I 
>>>>>>>> would love to know more about this by someone who has had the 
>>>>>>>> experience as a very small child without sight. Drawing is more, 
>>>>>>>> far more, than the thing that is left on the page after the person 
>>>>>>>> has made it. It is a whole body experience - physical and spiritual 
>>>>>>>> experience, in my experiences. So, it seems to me that no sight is 
>>>>>>>> needed to make drawings. I like to say, about my own work, that the 
>>>>>>>> "thing that is on display on the gallery wall is the residue left 
>>>>>>>> behind as I was making art."  It is not the art itself, it is the 
>>>>>>>> tracks that show I was there.  The art was what transpired within 
>>>>>>>> me as I worked on it and the piece in the gallery is the evidence 
>>>>>>>> that I was there.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have to say that without my extensive drawing background, I would 
>>>>>>>> not be who I am today as a blind person. I have a small amount of 
>>>>>>>> peripheral vision that is enough that I can detect movement. Those 
>>>>>>>> movements are "gestures" and it is through the gestures around me 
>>>>>>>> that I navigate the world and that I identify people and things. It 
>>>>>>>> is the essence of everything - gesture. When I am making my art 
>>>>>>>> these days, it is because I am accustomed to using gesture and can 
>>>>>>>> continue to do that without sight. Touch is gesture, and that is 
>>>>>>>> how I understand what I touch. I feel it's internal and external 
>>>>>>>> gesture.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OH, that is so funny about your 5 year old's comment about using 
>>>>>>>> his "girl brain."  This is what I found so fascinating when I was 
>>>>>>>> reading this book, that the entire structure of the brain is very 
>>>>>>>> different in males and females. Each individual part of the brain 
>>>>>>>> is different between the sexes - so it is a physical as well as 
>>>>>>>> psychological difference. She explored many different nuances that 
>>>>>>>> really helped me as a blind person as well, as I was reading. It 
>>>>>>>> gave me new insight into different aspects we encounter due to 
>>>>>>>> sight loss. I would highly recommend it to anyone who has interest 
>>>>>>>> in learning more about how the brain functions, and it is explored 
>>>>>>>> in a way that a non-science person like me coulnd understand and 
>>>>>>>> enjoy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is all certainly another aspect of  the discussion on 
>>>>>>>> difference between art and crafts thought process and ways of 
>>>>>>>> "seeing."  Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Patricia C. Estes <mailto:pece03 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 8:54 PM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Linda, the brain is so fascinating-or is it the mind?? My first 
>>>>>>>> real understanding of it (before I studied holistic psychology and 
>>>>>>>> energy medicine) was when our youngest was caught doing something 
>>>>>>>> or other that five year olds do, and he burst into tears and 
>>>>>>>> managed to blurt out emphatically, "My girl brain made me do it!"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, Luke, I know what you mean! But he didn't go to school, yet, 
>>>>>>>> and we didn't have a TV...I think he just *knew*.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dr. Christian Northrop teaches about the female brain, too. Her 
>>>>>>>> example is that she and her, then, husband were flying somewhere 
>>>>>>>> and she noticed that she was reading "Enriching the Mother/Daughter 
>>>>>>>> Relationship" and he was reading "How to get the most out of your 
>>>>>>>> Band Saw."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To bring art into this, I am sure you are familiar with the 
>>>>>>>> book,"Drawing on the Right side of the Brain." Pretty fascinating, 
>>>>>>>> if one has time to complicate one's life by experimenting with 
>>>>>>>> drawing things upside down.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Energetically, if you want to engage both hemispheres, Brain Gym 
>>>>>>>> says to "think of an X." And to relax the mind, think of two 
>>>>>>>> parallel lines.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OK, I'm taking my parallel lines and heading to bed,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Patty
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Lynda Lambert <mailto:llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:48 PM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" by 
>>>>>>>> Luann Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful 
>>>>>>>> information a long time ago. Raising my brood of children would 
>>>>>>>> have been so much easier if I had known these things about the 
>>>>>>>> differences between male and female brains. And, my goodness, I 
>>>>>>>> would have been a much better teacher, too. I would have a better 
>>>>>>>> understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least I do 
>>>>>>>> understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was 
>>>>>>>> so enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as 
>>>>>>>> we would ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess 
>>>>>>>> it is like this conversation we are having right now in this 
>>>>>>>> truck." This was his insight as I was rapidly sharing so much 
>>>>>>>> information as he sat quietly listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I 
>>>>>>>> understand this conversation here in this truck so much better." We 
>>>>>>>> laughed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into the 
>>>>>>>> other. We all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my 
>>>>>>>> mother taking an afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery 
>>>>>>>> stitches and to creat a picture on a linen tea towel - I was 
>>>>>>>> probably 8 years old. Then, it continues on with my precious 
>>>>>>>> neighbor taking an hour each morning, one summer, to teach me how 
>>>>>>>> to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, skirt, and then an 
>>>>>>>> entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those around us, and 
>>>>>>>> how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is an 
>>>>>>>> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with 
>>>>>>>> every stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" 
>>>>>>>> to them for giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I 
>>>>>>>> am becoming with each new day and each new idea I work with.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400 
>>>>>>>> <http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1> 
>>>>>>>> &sr=1-1
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Patricia C. Estes <mailto:pece03 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to 
>>>>>>>> articulate these distinctions.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter 
>>>>>>>> simultaneously. I am back to my art and love the discovery of 
>>>>>>>> it-but I will admit, my left brain does like rules and 
>>>>>>>> instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no put down to Boy 
>>>>>>>> Brains, just a family joke).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Right on! Right on, Linda!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> pece out
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Lynda Lambert <mailto:llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better 
>>>>>>>> get back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a 
>>>>>>>> good place for a discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line 
>>>>>>>> between the two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a 
>>>>>>>> crafter can take the exact same materials, but the mind that works 
>>>>>>>> with them is quite different and the results are quite different. 
>>>>>>>> It's really about "ideas" and "concepts" and what we are thinking 
>>>>>>>> about as we work, and where we go with the materials in our process 
>>>>>>>> of working. In Pittsburgh, PA there is a very fine museum/gallery 
>>>>>>>> called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - now, what is done 
>>>>>>>> there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and there is 
>>>>>>>> CRAFT, too. There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
>>>>>>>> very distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you 
>>>>>>>> would be very aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva 
>>>>>>>> College, in western PA)  where I was free to teach across 
>>>>>>>> disciplines, as I have my MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in 
>>>>>>>> English Literature. Because of this background, I was very 
>>>>>>>> marketable for a good position. I was able to create 
>>>>>>>> multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
>>>>>>>> art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, 
>>>>>>>> printmaking, drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary studies and doing so many projects with profs in 
>>>>>>>> other disciplines. I was very active in conferences on 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European experience for 
>>>>>>>> art and literature students and we lived in Austria every summer 
>>>>>>>> and then traveled to other countries. I even had an art exhibition 
>>>>>>>> in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so hard in 
>>>>>>>> the studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the 
>>>>>>>> month they had a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto 
>>>>>>>> Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring as part of their 
>>>>>>>> course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to visit 
>>>>>>>> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent 
>>>>>>>> our spring time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a piece 
>>>>>>>> done today!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Ann at acunningham.com <mailto:Ann at acunningham.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading this 
>>>>>>>> is still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all 
>>>>>>>> sorts of shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
>>>>>>>> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
>>>>>>>> started laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it 
>>>>>>>> from day to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a 
>>>>>>>> good pilot you know and follow rules. That is what they pay you 
>>>>>>>> for. I am an artist and I am paid to break the rules. No one wants 
>>>>>>>> to hear from me if it has already been done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ann at acunningham.com <mailto:ann at acunningham.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:llambert at zoominternet.net> >
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:artists-making-art at nfbnet.org> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am 
>>>>>>>> like you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed 
>>>>>>>> to know and was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question. 
>>>>>>>> I am furiously working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) 
>>>>>>>> getting work done for the opening of a two-person exhibition at a 
>>>>>>>> museum - the show is called _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with 
>>>>>>>> limited sight, not limited vision_ It is my pottery and mixed-media 
>>>>>>>> fiber works, and a legally blind painter. It opens one month from 
>>>>>>>> today, and if I stop to think about what else has to be done yet, 
>>>>>>>> I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep on 
>>>>>>>> working on the details. The show will appear at two locations this 
>>>>>>>> year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with the art 
>>>>>>>> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be 
>>>>>>>> teaching in the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts 
>>>>>>>> course at Geneva College. That is where I taught when I was a 
>>>>>>>> professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. I'll be 
>>>>>>>> lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the ideas 
>>>>>>>> have come from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the 
>>>>>>>> day before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>> working on every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 
>>>>>>>> 5 1/2 years ago, but I am still very much involved in everything 
>>>>>>>> but being in the classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between 
>>>>>>>> an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that 
>>>>>>>> wide. Some basic things may be similar between the two, but most 
>>>>>>>> things are very far apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and 
>>>>>>>> most have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
>>>>>>>> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>> something and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with 
>>>>>>>> no notion of where the end will be or even if it will be.  the 
>>>>>>>> crafter has a clearly defined path to the finished product. The 
>>>>>>>> artist has only some inklings of possible outcomes, but has to find 
>>>>>>>> them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that 
>>>>>>>> the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>> those rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other 
>>>>>>>> hand, the mature artist has learned that there are no rules at all. 
>>>>>>>> They may begin in the early stages by learning techniques, but 
>>>>>>>> eventually with the years of working, the light comes on in her 
>>>>>>>> brain when she discovers one day - she is free of all rules when 
>>>>>>>> making art. Everything can be challenged, everything can be 
>>>>>>>> changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is there any 
>>>>>>>> other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's the 
>>>>>>>> most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no 
>>>>>>>> rules whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to 
>>>>>>>> say it. Free, free, free, at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the 
>>>>>>>> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
>>>>>>>> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves 
>>>>>>>> on to learn something else and does that again with it. The artist 
>>>>>>>> can take crafts materials (which is what you and I both do) and 
>>>>>>>> techniques, and then take them far beyond because they will combine 
>>>>>>>> their techniques and materials with the imagination.  If you can 
>>>>>>>> teach it, it is usually a craft. If you cannot teach it, it is 
>>>>>>>> normally art. Art can begin by learning some techniques, or using 
>>>>>>>> craft materials, but then the person begins to ask the "what if" 
>>>>>>>> questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends in the road 
>>>>>>>> on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" that is 
>>>>>>>> never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>>>>>> that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the 
>>>>>>>> "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never 
>>>>>>>> understand what I have just said and will most likely be huffing 
>>>>>>>> and puffing and angry with it. An "artist" is standing and 
>>>>>>>> applauding what I have said. It is that simple, and that complex. 
>>>>>>>> The artist thrives on change and making new discoveries and each 
>>>>>>>> work leads to other querstions and more change and more new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of 
>>>>>>>> environments. One will be setting at a craft show with a table full 
>>>>>>>> of things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>> work on display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where 
>>>>>>>> they "fit" and each is very happy with where they are. They are 
>>>>>>>> different animals, with different ideas, and different end results 
>>>>>>>> and outcomes. Each one has decided their own path and each one is 
>>>>>>>> comfortable with the decision she has made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Laurie Porter <mailto:free.spirit1 at live.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin who 
>>>>>>>> is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. 
>>>>>>>> I make pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>> together with thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but 
>>>>>>>> I have always looked upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art 
>>>>>>>> and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
>>>>>>>> all arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting 
>>>>>>>> this list going as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in 
>>>>>>>> our efforts to bring blind people together who love to both create 
>>>>>>>> and appreciate the visual arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _____
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>> <mailto:Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 3
>>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 11:28:45 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] drawing the internal dialogue
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <FBEE8CE951524EB0A97347CAF39B9E92 at Wellness>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good morning,
>>>>>>>> Linda, I am glad to be of some "help" in your preparation!! I guess 
>>>>>>>> I needed a Job!
>>>>>>>> The discussions have been intriguing...in the sense that I am being 
>>>>>>>> reminded of things I already know. Everyone's input has been fun!
>>>>>>>> About drawing: APH has a tactile board for raised line 
>>>>>>>> drawings/math assignments, etc. This is what I would put in the 
>>>>>>>> hands of a blind child-the stylus can be used for lines and a type 
>>>>>>>> of "shading." And of course, it would also be useful for a blind 
>>>>>>>> child to do the same thing as a sighted child, as you mentioned: 
>>>>>>>> feel the object and draw it.
>>>>>>>> (OK, get ready, I digress a bit: This reminds me of the work I have 
>>>>>>>> done as an Infant Massage Instructor-there are certain, simple 
>>>>>>>> strokes that we teach the parents and the result is calming, of 
>>>>>>>> course ...well, unless said baby being massaged is done!... but one 
>>>>>>>> of the many objectives of this massage stroke is "to help the 
>>>>>>>> infant to organize his/her world." In this case:"These things are 
>>>>>>>> part of me...legs, arms...and this is me here and that is someone 
>>>>>>>> else over there." At which point the baby realizes that they are 
>>>>>>>> getting some undivided attention and they get all excited! And with 
>>>>>>>> a blind child, especially, or the newly blinded, this art exercise 
>>>>>>>> in observing one's world would be really helpful in sorting out, 
>>>>>>>> organizing and internalizing. But it would be helpful for *anyone* 
>>>>>>>> to do, and for the same reasons!)
>>>>>>>> I like that your intent is not to try to get students to experience 
>>>>>>>> what life is like as a blind person!! It is just an art play!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OK...about drawing/sketching, I think that is as essential as 
>>>>>>>> learning the basics of music before playing in an orchestra. As 
>>>>>>>> much as we'd love to skip right over the practice sessions, that 
>>>>>>>> just is no other way. And I do think that there are "work arounds" 
>>>>>>>> for blind artists of any age who have never seen, to learn 
>>>>>>>> perspective and to share it. (Ann would know lots about this). 
>>>>>>>> Because of my background in classical sketching with my mom, I 
>>>>>>>> could branch out to design and suggest/gesture the images...like 
>>>>>>>> fashion design and even like impressionistic painting. Reducing the 
>>>>>>>> "story" to the most interesting lines/colors. (which will be 
>>>>>>>> different for each artist and viewer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best wishes-
>>>>>>>> Patty
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 8:56 AM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] drawing the internal dialogue
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Patricia, you bring up the most fascinating things. This is 
>>>>>>>> another one of those things that is so enjoyable to think about. 
>>>>>>>> Drawing! We do not need sight to draw, I am absolutely sure of 
>>>>>>>> that. In fact, in many of my drawing courses, I had students draw 
>>>>>>>> blindfolded. They had to feel the objects, then return to the easel 
>>>>>>>> to do their drawings. They could walk over to feel it as often as 
>>>>>>>> they liked during the process, but they were not permitted to have 
>>>>>>>> a physical "look" at it with the eyes. The drawings they made were 
>>>>>>>> astounding - so full of livingness and so magical. You are making 
>>>>>>>> me remember those things that I had not thought of for a very long 
>>>>>>>> time - and this is great for me because I am going to be a speaker 
>>>>>>>> at a conference on disabilities and inclusion in March, and this is 
>>>>>>>> exactly what I needed to be thinking about as I prep for that 
>>>>>>>> lecture.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  If anyone else has some examples of experiences for me, that I 
>>>>>>>> could share with the audience, please let me know.  I want to 
>>>>>>>> really make my audience understand that blind people have the same 
>>>>>>>> passions for art and art making as anyone else. We just have to 
>>>>>>>> learn adaptive ways of working, but we can do it, and we love to do 
>>>>>>>> it and it brings us great joy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  yes, I used Drawing From the Right Side of the Brain as a textbook 
>>>>>>>> for Drawing courses at the college! I also used "The Natural Way to 
>>>>>>>> Draw" by Nicolaides.  I have worked my way through both of these 
>>>>>>>> books for years on end. Drawing is the core of everything we do as 
>>>>>>>> artists and without a good foundation in drawing, it's difficult to 
>>>>>>>> move on - it is the structure on which we build everything else no 
>>>>>>>> matter the medium we work with. Drawing puts us in touch with the 
>>>>>>>> internal dialogue and we become more aware and connected with the 
>>>>>>>> object we are drawing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  The interesting thing about drawing, to me, has always been that 
>>>>>>>> all children seem to know how to draw by instinct. How does that 
>>>>>>>> "fit" in your experience, Patricia?  I have never encountered a 
>>>>>>>> child who did not know how to draw and make pictures - I have 
>>>>>>>> always thought we are born with these abilities.  I think a child 
>>>>>>>> born blind would have this same inclination, if provided with the 
>>>>>>>> tools and opportunities early on, but that is a guess on my part. I 
>>>>>>>> would love to know more about this by someone who has had the 
>>>>>>>> experience as a very small child without sight. Drawing is more, 
>>>>>>>> far more, than the thing that is left on the page after the person 
>>>>>>>> has made it. It is a whole body experience - physical and spiritual 
>>>>>>>> experience, in my experiences. So, it seems to me that no sight is 
>>>>>>>> needed to make drawings. I like to say, about my own work, that the 
>>>>>>>> "thing that is on display on the gallery wall is the residue left 
>>>>>>>> behind as I was making art."  It is not the art itself, it is the 
>>>>>>>> tracks that show I was there.  The art was what transpired within 
>>>>>>>> me as I worked on it and the piece in the gallery is the evidence 
>>>>>>>> that I was there.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  I have to say that without my extensive drawing background, I 
>>>>>>>> would not be who I am today as a blind person. I have a small 
>>>>>>>> amount of peripheral vision that is enough that I can detect 
>>>>>>>> movement. Those movements are "gestures" and it is through the 
>>>>>>>> gestures around me that I navigate the world and that I identify 
>>>>>>>> people and things. It is the essence of everything - gesture. When 
>>>>>>>> I am making my art these days, it is because I am accustomed to 
>>>>>>>> using gesture and can continue to do that without sight. Touch is 
>>>>>>>> gesture, and that is how I understand what I touch. I feel it's 
>>>>>>>> internal and external gesture.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  OH, that is so funny about your 5 year old's comment about using 
>>>>>>>> his "girl brain."  This is what I found so fascinating when I was 
>>>>>>>> reading this book, that the entire structure of the brain is very 
>>>>>>>> different in males and females. Each individual part of the brain 
>>>>>>>> is different between the sexes - so it is a physical as well as 
>>>>>>>> psychological difference. She explored many different nuances that 
>>>>>>>> really helped me as a blind person as well, as I was reading. It 
>>>>>>>> gave me new insight into different aspects we encounter due to 
>>>>>>>> sight loss. I would highly recommend it to anyone who has interest 
>>>>>>>> in learning more about how the brain functions, and it is explored 
>>>>>>>> in a way that a non-science person like me coulnd understand and 
>>>>>>>> enjoy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  This is all certainly another aspect of  the discussion on 
>>>>>>>> difference between art and crafts thought process and ways of 
>>>>>>>> "seeing."  Lynda
>>>>>>>>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>    From: Patricia C. Estes
>>>>>>>>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 8:54 PM
>>>>>>>>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Linda, the brain is so fascinating-or is it the mind?? My first 
>>>>>>>> real understanding of it (before I studied holistic psychology and 
>>>>>>>> energy medicine) was when our youngest was caught doing something 
>>>>>>>> or other that five year olds do, and he burst into tears and 
>>>>>>>> managed to blurt out emphatically, "My girl brain made me do it!"
>>>>>>>>    Yes, Luke, I know what you mean! But he didn't go to school, 
>>>>>>>> yet, and we didn't have a TV...I think he just *knew*.
>>>>>>>>    Dr. Christian Northrop teaches about the female brain, too. Her 
>>>>>>>> example is that she and her, then, husband were flying somewhere 
>>>>>>>> and she noticed that she was reading "Enriching the Mother/Daughter 
>>>>>>>> Relationship" and he was reading "How to get the most out of your 
>>>>>>>> Band Saw."
>>>>>>>>    To bring art into this, I am sure you are familiar with the 
>>>>>>>> book,"Drawing on the Right side of the Brain." Pretty fascinating, 
>>>>>>>> if one has time to complicate one's life by experimenting with 
>>>>>>>> drawing things upside down.
>>>>>>>>    Energetically, if you want to engage both hemispheres, Brain Gym 
>>>>>>>> says to "think of an X." And to relax the mind, think of two 
>>>>>>>> parallel lines.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    OK, I'm taking my parallel lines and heading to bed,
>>>>>>>>    Patty
>>>>>>>>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>      From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>      To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>      Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:48 PM
>>>>>>>>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" 
>>>>>>>> by Luann Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful 
>>>>>>>> information a long time ago. Raising my brood of children would 
>>>>>>>> have been so much easier if I had known these things about the 
>>>>>>>> differences between male and female brains. And, my goodness, I 
>>>>>>>> would have been a much better teacher, too. I would have a better 
>>>>>>>> understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least I do 
>>>>>>>> understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was 
>>>>>>>> so enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as 
>>>>>>>> we would ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess 
>>>>>>>> it is like this conversation we are having right now in this 
>>>>>>>> truck." This was his insight as I was rapidly sharing so much 
>>>>>>>> information as he sat quietly listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I 
>>>>>>>> understand this conversation here in this truck so much better." We 
>>>>>>>> laughed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into 
>>>>>>>> the other. We all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my 
>>>>>>>> mother taking an afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery 
>>>>>>>> stitches and to creat a picture on a linen tea towel - I was 
>>>>>>>> probably 8 years old. Then, it continues on with my precious 
>>>>>>>> neighbor taking an hour each morning, one summer, to teach me how 
>>>>>>>> to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, skirt, and then an 
>>>>>>>> entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those around us, and 
>>>>>>>> how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is an 
>>>>>>>> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with 
>>>>>>>> every stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" 
>>>>>>>> to them for giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I 
>>>>>>>> am becoming with each new day and each new idea I work with.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1
>>>>>>>>        ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>        From: Patricia C. Estes
>>>>>>>>        To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>        Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>>>>>>>>        Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the 
>>>>>>>> time to articulate these distinctions.
>>>>>>>>        I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter 
>>>>>>>> simultaneously. I am back to my art and love the discovery of 
>>>>>>>> it-but I will admit, my left brain does like rules and 
>>>>>>>> instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no put down to Boy 
>>>>>>>> Brains, just a family joke).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Right on! Right on, Linda!
>>>>>>>>        pece out
>>>>>>>>          ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>          From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>          To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>          Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>>>>>>>>          Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I 
>>>>>>>> better get back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this 
>>>>>>>> should be a good place for a discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine 
>>>>>>>> line between the two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or 
>>>>>>>> a crafter can take the exact same materials, but the mind that 
>>>>>>>> works with them is quite different and the results are quite 
>>>>>>>> different. It's really about "ideas" and "concepts" and what we are 
>>>>>>>> thinking about as we work, and where we go with the materials in 
>>>>>>>> our process of working. In Pittsburgh, PA there is a very fine 
>>>>>>>> museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - now, 
>>>>>>>> what is done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts 
>>>>>>>> and there is CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the 
>>>>>>>> "Craftsman."  very distinct differences between them - and as a 
>>>>>>>> sculptor you would be very aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college 
>>>>>>>> (Geneva College, in western PA)  where I was free to teach across 
>>>>>>>> disciplines, as I have my MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in 
>>>>>>>> English Literature. Because of this background, I was very 
>>>>>>>> marketable for a good position.  I was able to create 
>>>>>>>> multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
>>>>>>>> art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, 
>>>>>>>> printmaking, drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary studies and doing so many projects with profs in 
>>>>>>>> other disciplines. I was very active in conferences on 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European experience for 
>>>>>>>> art and literature students and we lived in Austria every summer 
>>>>>>>> and then traveled to other countries. I even had an art exhibition 
>>>>>>>> in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so hard in 
>>>>>>>> the studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the 
>>>>>>>> month they had a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto 
>>>>>>>> Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring as part of their 
>>>>>>>> course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to visit 
>>>>>>>> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent 
>>>>>>>> our spring time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to 
>>>>>>>> get a piece done today!
>>>>>>>>          Lynda
>>>>>>>>            ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>            From: Ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>            To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>            Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>            Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is 
>>>>>>>> reading this is still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since 
>>>>>>>> there are all sorts of shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I 
>>>>>>>> went off on a tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather 
>>>>>>>> randomly. They started laughing and saying something akin to how do 
>>>>>>>> you make it from day to day. And I said you guys are pilots and for 
>>>>>>>> you to be a good pilot you know and follow rules. That is what they 
>>>>>>>> pay you for. I am an artist and I am paid to break the rules. No 
>>>>>>>> one wants to hear from me if it has already been done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>            Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>            303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>            ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>            http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>            http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>              Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>              From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>              Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>              To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>              <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              ?
>>>>>>>>              Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>              So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group 
>>>>>>>> though, I am like you, I just came on to ask a question about 
>>>>>>>> something I needed to know and was so glad to meet Ann who helped 
>>>>>>>> me with my question.  I am furiously working right now (oops, split 
>>>>>>>> that infinitive!) getting work done for the opening of a two-person 
>>>>>>>> exhibition at a museum - the show is called _Vision and Revision: 
>>>>>>>> Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ It is my 
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think about what 
>>>>>>>> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but 
>>>>>>>> just will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at 
>>>>>>>> two locations this year and will have a video that plays in the 
>>>>>>>> gallery with the art works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I 
>>>>>>>> will even be teaching in the gallery one afternoon, for the Women 
>>>>>>>> in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I taught when I 
>>>>>>>> was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. I'll 
>>>>>>>> be lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the 
>>>>>>>> ideas have come from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to 
>>>>>>>> speak at a conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two 
>>>>>>>> sessions, the day before we hang our show. So, I have those 
>>>>>>>> presentations to be working on every day now, too.  I officially 
>>>>>>>> retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, but I am still very much 
>>>>>>>> involved in everything but being in the classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              Here is my response to the question you have asked. 
>>>>>>>> The gap between an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, 
>>>>>>>> it is that wide. Some basic things may be similar between the two, 
>>>>>>>> but most things are very far apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              Both work with the hands, and both love working with 
>>>>>>>> the hands and most have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>              Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and 
>>>>>>>> the satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              While the crafter will usually be satisfied with 
>>>>>>>> beginning something and knowing where the end will be, the artist 
>>>>>>>> begins with no notion of where the end will be or even if it will 
>>>>>>>> be. the crafter has a clearly defined path to the finished product. 
>>>>>>>> The artist has only some inklings of possible outcomes, but has to 
>>>>>>>> find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              The other very big thing I see as a difference between 
>>>>>>>> them is that the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever 
>>>>>>>> deviate from those rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On 
>>>>>>>> the other hand, the mature artist has learned that there are no 
>>>>>>>> rules at all. They may begin in the early stages by learning 
>>>>>>>> techniques, but eventually with the years of working, the light 
>>>>>>>> comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she is free of 
>>>>>>>> all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, everything 
>>>>>>>> can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
>>>>>>>> there any other profession in this world where there are no rules? 
>>>>>>>> It's the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are 
>>>>>>>> absolutely no rules whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep 
>>>>>>>> breath just to say it. Free, free, free, at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft 
>>>>>>>> is where the person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but 
>>>>>>>> is usually content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, 
>>>>>>>> then moves on to learn something else and does that again with it. 
>>>>>>>> The artist can take crafts materials (which is what you and I both 
>>>>>>>> do) and techniques, and then take them far beyond because they will 
>>>>>>>> combine their techniques and materials with the imagination.  If 
>>>>>>>> you can teach it, it is usually a craft. If you cannot teach it, it 
>>>>>>>> is normally art. Art can begin by learning some techniques, or 
>>>>>>>> using craft materials, but then the person begins to ask the "what 
>>>>>>>> if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends in the 
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, 
>>>>>>>> but one that constantly questions, experiments, and never knows 
>>>>>>>> where the "end" will be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will 
>>>>>>>> never understand what I have just said and will most likely be 
>>>>>>>> huffing and puffing and angry with it.  An "artist" is standing and 
>>>>>>>> applauding what I have said. It is that simple, and that complex. 
>>>>>>>> The artist thrives on change and making new discoveries and each 
>>>>>>>> work leads to other querstions and more change and more new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              One can see the difference when you look at work in 
>>>>>>>> types of environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a 
>>>>>>>> table full of things that are basically all the same while the 
>>>>>>>> other will have work on display in a gallery or museum.  Each has 
>>>>>>>> decided where they "fit" and each is very happy with where they 
>>>>>>>> are. They are different animals, with different ideas, and 
>>>>>>>> different end results and outcomes. Each one has decided their own 
>>>>>>>> path and each one is comfortable with the decision she has made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>              Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>                From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>                To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>                Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>                Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person 
>>>>>>>> from wisconsin who is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my 
>>>>>>>> medium is beadwork. I make pictures and tapestries out of tiny 
>>>>>>>> little seed beads sewn together with thread. but most of my work is 
>>>>>>>> in making jewlry, but I have always looked upon my beadwork as an 
>>>>>>>> art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                so, I have a basic question. What is the difference 
>>>>>>>> between an art and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms 
>>>>>>>> of art but are all arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of 
>>>>>>>> you for getting this list going as it is something I?ve always 
>>>>>>>> dreamed of seeing in our efforts to bring blind people together who 
>>>>>>>> love to both create and appreciate the visual arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>                Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>                Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>                To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>              _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>              Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>              Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>              To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>            Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>            Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>            To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>          To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>        To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>>>>>>>> URL: 
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/pipermail/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/attachments/20140208/2d662e66/attachment-0001.html>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 4
>>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 14:03:46 -0600
>>>>>>>> From: Laurie Porter <free.spirit1 at live.com>
>>>>>>>> To: <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 
>>>>>>>> 16,
>>>>>>>> Issue 5
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <BLU177-DS22E118870BD6FD8E1EEB3AD960 at phx.gbl>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>>>>>>>> reply-type=original
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Linda:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> thanks so much for this definition of the difference between art 
>>>>>>>> and craft.
>>>>>>>> I think I am now truly where I belong, and given this explanation, 
>>>>>>>> I know
>>>>>>>> now why I have never been satisfied with just finishing a crafting 
>>>>>>>> project.
>>>>>>>> I've always found it to be decidedly limiting in imagination, 
>>>>>>>> creativity and
>>>>>>>> origionality. .
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have been so impressed with the messages I've read on this  list 
>>>>>>>> so far.
>>>>>>>> It sounds like there is some wonderful energy on this listand am 
>>>>>>>> looking
>>>>>>>> forward  read ing more.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- 
>>>>>>>> From: artists-making-art-request at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 6:00 AM
>>>>>>>> To: artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 5
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Send Artists-making-art mailing list submissions to
>>>>>>>> artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>>>>>>> artists-making-art-request at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>>>>>>> artists-making-art-owner at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>>>>>>> than "Re: Contents of Artists-making-art digest..."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>   1. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>>>>>>>>   2. Re: arts or crafts new member (Ann at acunningham.com)
>>>>>>>>   3. Re: arts or crafts new member (Jewel)
>>>>>>>>   4. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>>>>>>>>   5. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>>>>>>>>   6. Re: arts or crafts new member (Patricia C. Estes)
>>>>>>>>   7. Re: arts or crafts new member (Lynda Lambert)
>>>>>>>>   8. Re: arts or crafts new member (Patricia C. Estes)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 08:03:18 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <6FA5C73038C44B4D9FE3E40F647EF6C7 at Lambert>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am 
>>>>>>>> like you,
>>>>>>>> I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to know 
>>>>>>>> and was so
>>>>>>>> glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am furiously 
>>>>>>>> working
>>>>>>>> right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done for the 
>>>>>>>> opening
>>>>>>>> of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called _Vision 
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_  It 
>>>>>>>> is my
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens
>>>>>>>> one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has to 
>>>>>>>> be done
>>>>>>>> yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep on 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> the details. The show will appear at two locations this year and 
>>>>>>>> will have a
>>>>>>>> video that plays in the gallery with the art works, Braille 
>>>>>>>> labeling, and
>>>>>>>> artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the gallery one 
>>>>>>>> afternoon, for
>>>>>>>> the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I 
>>>>>>>> taught when
>>>>>>>> I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. 
>>>>>>>> I'll be
>>>>>>>> lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the ideas 
>>>>>>>> have come
>>>>>>>> from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a 
>>>>>>>> conference
>>>>>>>> at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the day before 
>>>>>>>> we hang
>>>>>>>> our show. So, I have those presentations to be working on every day 
>>>>>>>> now,
>>>>>>>> too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years ago, but I am 
>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>> very much involved in everything but being in the classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap between 
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. 
>>>>>>>> Some basic
>>>>>>>> things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
>>>>>>>> apart
>>>>>>>> philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands and 
>>>>>>>> most have
>>>>>>>> done it all their life.
>>>>>>>> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
>>>>>>>> satisfaction of
>>>>>>>> the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>> something and
>>>>>>>> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of 
>>>>>>>> where the
>>>>>>>> end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
>>>>>>>> defined path
>>>>>>>> to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>> outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is that 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>> those rules,
>>>>>>>> as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the mature 
>>>>>>>> artist
>>>>>>>> has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in the 
>>>>>>>> early
>>>>>>>> stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of 
>>>>>>>> working, the
>>>>>>>> light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she is 
>>>>>>>> free of all
>>>>>>>> rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, everything can 
>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>> changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is there any 
>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>> profession in this world where there are no rules? It's the most
>>>>>>>> exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
>>>>>>>> whatsoever
>>>>>>>> for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
>>>>>>>> free, free,
>>>>>>>> at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where the 
>>>>>>>> person
>>>>>>>> eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
>>>>>>>> content to
>>>>>>>> learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to learn
>>>>>>>> something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
>>>>>>>> crafts
>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>> then take
>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. 
>>>>>>>> If you
>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to 
>>>>>>>> ask the
>>>>>>>> "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>> never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" 
>>>>>>>> will be,
>>>>>>>> or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I 
>>>>>>>> have just
>>>>>>>> said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it. 
>>>>>>>> An
>>>>>>>> "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that 
>>>>>>>> simple, and
>>>>>>>> that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries and
>>>>>>>> each work leads to other querstions and more change and more new
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of 
>>>>>>>> environments.
>>>>>>>> One will be setting at a craft show with a table full of things 
>>>>>>>> that are
>>>>>>>> basically all the same while the other will have work  on display 
>>>>>>>> in a
>>>>>>>> gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" and each is 
>>>>>>>> very happy
>>>>>>>> with where they are. They are different animals, with different 
>>>>>>>> ideas, and
>>>>>>>> different end results and outcomes. Each one has decided their own 
>>>>>>>> path and
>>>>>>>> each one is comfortable with the decision she has made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>  To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from wisconsin 
>>>>>>>> who is a
>>>>>>>> fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I 
>>>>>>>> make
>>>>>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>> together with
>>>>>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always 
>>>>>>>> looked
>>>>>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an art 
>>>>>>>> and a
>>>>>>>> craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all 
>>>>>>>> arts
>>>>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
>>>>>>>> list going
>>>>>>>> as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to 
>>>>>>>> bring
>>>>>>>> blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
>>>>>>>> visual
>>>>>>>> arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>>>>>>>> URL:
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/pipermail/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/attachments/20140207/6b11d4ef/attachment-0001.html>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 2
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 07:08:33 -0700
>>>>>>>> From: <Ann at acunningham.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>>>> <20140207070833.c623b2ae39646abf92d04cdf9b47d475.1411573672.wbe at email06.secureserver.net>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>>>>>>>> URL:
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/pipermail/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/attachments/20140207/8ed00789/attachment-0001.html>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 3
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 11:23:35 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: Jewel <herekittykat2 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>>>> <CABORmNtm3Wu6C=MnMC68NHdt1eSgDN2T1hyq7dvCWkbROEPn8A at mail.gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I absolutely loved this explanation of arts versus crafts. I was 
>>>>>>>> also
>>>>>>>> wondering the difference, so this really makes it clear to me. I do
>>>>>>>> polymer clay. While I start with an expectation that it will be 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> sort of elephant or a horse or whatever, who knows what twists and
>>>>>>>> turns will happen along the way. By the way, I'm currently working 
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> a Harry Potter style house elf holding a tray that can hold 
>>>>>>>> business
>>>>>>>> ccards. The house elf is done, but the tray still needs to be
>>>>>>>> finished.
>>>>>>>> Jewel
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 2/7/14, Ann at acunningham.com <Ann at acunningham.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading 
>>>>>>>>> this is
>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>> torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of 
>>>>>>>>> shades in
>>>>>>>>> the continuum.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
>>>>>>>>> tangent
>>>>>>>>> tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
>>>>>>>>> started
>>>>>>>>> laughing
>>>>>>>>> and saying something akin to how do you make it from day to day. 
>>>>>>>>> And I
>>>>>>>>> said
>>>>>>>>> you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you know and 
>>>>>>>>> follow
>>>>>>>>> rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I am paid 
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> break
>>>>>>>>> the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already been 
>>>>>>>>> done.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>> Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>> 303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>> ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>> http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>> http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>>> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I am 
>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>>>> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to 
>>>>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
>>>>>>>>>> furiously
>>>>>>>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work 
>>>>>>>>>> done for
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is 
>>>>>>>>>> called
>>>>>>>>>> _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not 
>>>>>>>>>> limited
>>>>>>>>>> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a 
>>>>>>>>>> legally
>>>>>>>>>> blind
>>>>>>>>>> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think 
>>>>>>>>>> about what
>>>>>>>>>> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, 
>>>>>>>>>> but just
>>>>>>>>>> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two
>>>>>>>>>> locations
>>>>>>>>>> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with 
>>>>>>>>>> the art
>>>>>>>>>> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be 
>>>>>>>>>> teaching in
>>>>>>>>>> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at 
>>>>>>>>>> Geneva
>>>>>>>>>> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine 
>>>>>>>>>> arts and
>>>>>>>>>> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the historical 
>>>>>>>>>> context
>>>>>>>>>> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at a
>>>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, 
>>>>>>>>>> the day
>>>>>>>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 
>>>>>>>>>> years ago,
>>>>>>>>>> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the
>>>>>>>>>> classroom.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap 
>>>>>>>>>> between an
>>>>>>>>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. 
>>>>>>>>>> Some
>>>>>>>>>> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are 
>>>>>>>>>> very far
>>>>>>>>>> apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands 
>>>>>>>>>> and most
>>>>>>>>>> have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>>> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
>>>>>>>>>> satisfaction
>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>> the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>>>> something and
>>>>>>>>>> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion 
>>>>>>>>>> of where
>>>>>>>>>> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
>>>>>>>>>> defined
>>>>>>>>>> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings 
>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is 
>>>>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>>>>> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>>>>> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, 
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> mature
>>>>>>>>>> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may 
>>>>>>>>>> begin in the
>>>>>>>>>> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the 
>>>>>>>>>> years of
>>>>>>>>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one 
>>>>>>>>>> day
>>>>>>>>>> - she is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be 
>>>>>>>>>> challenged,
>>>>>>>>>> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the 
>>>>>>>>>> artist.
>>>>>>>>>> Is
>>>>>>>>>> there any other profession in this world where there are no 
>>>>>>>>>> rules? It's
>>>>>>>>>> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely 
>>>>>>>>>> no rules
>>>>>>>>>> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say 
>>>>>>>>>> it. Free,
>>>>>>>>>> free, free, at last!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where 
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> person
>>>>>>>>>> eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is usually 
>>>>>>>>>> content
>>>>>>>>>> to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to 
>>>>>>>>>> learn
>>>>>>>>>> something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
>>>>>>>>>> crafts
>>>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>>>> then take
>>>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a 
>>>>>>>>>> craft. If you
>>>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins 
>>>>>>>>>> to ask
>>>>>>>>>> the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and 
>>>>>>>>>> bends in
>>>>>>>>>> the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind 
>>>>>>>>>> set" that
>>>>>>>>>> is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but 
>>>>>>>>>> one that
>>>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the 
>>>>>>>>>> "end" will
>>>>>>>>>> be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand 
>>>>>>>>>> what I have
>>>>>>>>>> just said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry 
>>>>>>>>>> with it.
>>>>>>>>>>  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is 
>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>> simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on change and 
>>>>>>>>>> making new
>>>>>>>>>> discoveries and each work leads to other querstions and more 
>>>>>>>>>> change and
>>>>>>>>>> more new discoveries.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>>>>>>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table 
>>>>>>>>>> full of
>>>>>>>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>>>> work on
>>>>>>>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they 
>>>>>>>>>> "fit" and
>>>>>>>>>> each is very happy with where they are. They are different 
>>>>>>>>>> animals, with
>>>>>>>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one 
>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the 
>>>>>>>>>> decision she
>>>>>>>>>> has made.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>>>> To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'd like to introduce myself. I'm a blind person from wisconsin 
>>>>>>>>>>> who is a
>>>>>>>>>>> fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I 
>>>>>>>>>>> make
>>>>>>>>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>>>>> together
>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have 
>>>>>>>>>>> always
>>>>>>>>>>> looked
>>>>>>>>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an 
>>>>>>>>>>> art and a
>>>>>>>>>>> craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
>>>>>>>>>>> all arts
>>>>>>>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
>>>>>>>>>>> list
>>>>>>>>>>> going as it is something I've always dreamed of seeing in our 
>>>>>>>>>>> efforts to
>>>>>>>>>>> bring blind people together who love to both create and 
>>>>>>>>>>> appreciate the
>>>>>>>>>>> visual arts.
>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 4
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 11:44:39 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <00EE5DF7276148B7B8D3EE072C8258A0 at Lambert>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better 
>>>>>>>> get back to
>>>>>>>> the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good place 
>>>>>>>> for a
>>>>>>>> discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line 
>>>>>>>> between the
>>>>>>>> two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can 
>>>>>>>> take the
>>>>>>>> exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite 
>>>>>>>> different
>>>>>>>> and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" and
>>>>>>>> "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we 
>>>>>>>> go with
>>>>>>>> the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there 
>>>>>>>> is a very
>>>>>>>> fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - 
>>>>>>>> now, what is
>>>>>>>> done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and 
>>>>>>>> there is
>>>>>>>> CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you would be 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva 
>>>>>>>> College, in
>>>>>>>> western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as I 
>>>>>>>> have my MFA
>>>>>>>> in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature.  Because 
>>>>>>>> of this
>>>>>>>> background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I was able 
>>>>>>>> to create
>>>>>>>> multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
>>>>>>>> art, as
>>>>>>>> well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, printmaking, 
>>>>>>>> drawing. It was
>>>>>>>> a dream of a job, working in interdisciplinary studies and doing so 
>>>>>>>> many
>>>>>>>> projects with profs in other disciplines.  I was very active in 
>>>>>>>> conferences
>>>>>>>> on interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European experience 
>>>>>>>> for art and
>>>>>>>> literature students and we lived in Austria every summer and then 
>>>>>>>> traveled
>>>>>>>> to other countries. I even had an art exhibition in Austria for my 
>>>>>>>> students
>>>>>>>> every summer.  They worked so hard in the studio and out on 
>>>>>>>> location every
>>>>>>>> day, and at the end of the month they had a show - so much fun.  I 
>>>>>>>> also did
>>>>>>>> this with Puerto Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring 
>>>>>>>> as part
>>>>>>>> of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to 
>>>>>>>> visit
>>>>>>>> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent 
>>>>>>>> our spring
>>>>>>>> time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a piece 
>>>>>>>> done
>>>>>>>> today!
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading 
>>>>>>>> this is
>>>>>>>> still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on a 
>>>>>>>> tangent
>>>>>>>> tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They started 
>>>>>>>> laughing
>>>>>>>> and saying something akin to how do you make it from day to day. 
>>>>>>>> And I said
>>>>>>>> you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you know and 
>>>>>>>> follow
>>>>>>>> rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I am paid 
>>>>>>>> to break
>>>>>>>> the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already been 
>>>>>>>> done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>  Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>  303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>  ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>  http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>  http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>    From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>    Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>    To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>    <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    ?
>>>>>>>>    Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>    So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I 
>>>>>>>> am like
>>>>>>>> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to 
>>>>>>>> know and
>>>>>>>> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
>>>>>>>> furiously
>>>>>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done 
>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called 
>>>>>>>> _Vision
>>>>>>>> and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ 
>>>>>>>> It is my
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens
>>>>>>>> one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has to 
>>>>>>>> be done
>>>>>>>> yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep on 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> the details. The show will appear at two locations this year and 
>>>>>>>> will have a
>>>>>>>> video that plays in the gallery with the art works, Braille 
>>>>>>>> labeling, and
>>>>>>>> artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the gallery one 
>>>>>>>> afternoon, for
>>>>>>>> the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I 
>>>>>>>> taught when
>>>>>>>> I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. 
>>>>>>>> I'll be
>>>>>>>> lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the ideas 
>>>>>>>> have come
>>>>>>>> from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at 
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the 
>>>>>>>> day
>>>>>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years 
>>>>>>>> ago, but
>>>>>>>> I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
>>>>>>>> classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap 
>>>>>>>> between an
>>>>>>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. 
>>>>>>>> Some basic
>>>>>>>> things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
>>>>>>>> apart
>>>>>>>> philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands 
>>>>>>>> and most
>>>>>>>> have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>    Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
>>>>>>>> satisfaction
>>>>>>>> of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>> something and
>>>>>>>> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion of 
>>>>>>>> where the
>>>>>>>> end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
>>>>>>>> defined path
>>>>>>>> to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>> outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is 
>>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>>> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>> those rules,
>>>>>>>> as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the mature 
>>>>>>>> artist
>>>>>>>> has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin in the 
>>>>>>>> early
>>>>>>>> stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years of 
>>>>>>>> working, the
>>>>>>>> light comes on in her brain when she discovers one day - she is 
>>>>>>>> free of all
>>>>>>>> rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, everything can 
>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>> changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is there any 
>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>> profession in this world where there are no rules? It's the most
>>>>>>>> exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
>>>>>>>> whatsoever
>>>>>>>> for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
>>>>>>>> free, free,
>>>>>>>> at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is 
>>>>>>>> usually
>>>>>>>> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves 
>>>>>>>> on to
>>>>>>>> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can 
>>>>>>>> take crafts
>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>> then take
>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. 
>>>>>>>> If you
>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to 
>>>>>>>> ask the
>>>>>>>> "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>> never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" 
>>>>>>>> will be,
>>>>>>>> or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I 
>>>>>>>> have just
>>>>>>>> said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it. 
>>>>>>>> An
>>>>>>>> "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that 
>>>>>>>> simple, and
>>>>>>>> that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries and
>>>>>>>> each work leads to other querstions and more change and more new
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>>>>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table 
>>>>>>>> full of
>>>>>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>> work on
>>>>>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" 
>>>>>>>> and each
>>>>>>>> is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with
>>>>>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one 
>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the 
>>>>>>>> decision she has
>>>>>>>> made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>      From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>      To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>      Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>      Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from 
>>>>>>>> wisconsin who is
>>>>>>>> a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I 
>>>>>>>> make
>>>>>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>> together with
>>>>>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always 
>>>>>>>> looked
>>>>>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an 
>>>>>>>> art and
>>>>>>>> a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are all 
>>>>>>>> arts
>>>>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
>>>>>>>> list going
>>>>>>>> as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to 
>>>>>>>> bring
>>>>>>>> blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
>>>>>>>> visual
>>>>>>>> arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>>>>>>>> URL:
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/pipermail/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/attachments/20140207/4e3190f0/attachment-0001.html>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 5
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 11:47:54 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <687BD2626016484AB96E97E715BA11BD at Lambert>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>>>>>>>> reply-type=original
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, Jewell, the material does not matter - we can go any way we 
>>>>>>>> want to
>>>>>>>> with it.  It is the ideas we work with that determine what will 
>>>>>>>> happen along
>>>>>>>> the way, plus allowing the medium to lead us - finding that "life 
>>>>>>>> of it's
>>>>>>>> own" that is there for us - a surprise or two along the way. Your 
>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>> sounds wonderful.  Lynda
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>> From: "Jewel" <herekittykat2 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:23 AM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I absolutely loved this explanation of arts versus crafts. I was 
>>>>>>>>>also
>>>>>>>>> wondering the difference, so this really makes it clear to me. I 
>>>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>>> polymer clay. While I start with an expectation that it will be 
>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>> sort of elephant or a horse or whatever, who knows what twists and
>>>>>>>>> turns will happen along the way. By the way, I'm currently working 
>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>> a Harry Potter style house elf holding a tray that can hold 
>>>>>>>>> business
>>>>>>>>> ccards. The house elf is done, but the tray still needs to be
>>>>>>>>> finished.
>>>>>>>>> Jewel
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2/7/14, Ann at acunningham.com <Ann at acunningham.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading 
>>>>>>>>>> this is
>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>>> torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts of 
>>>>>>>>>> shades
>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>> the continuum.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on 
>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>> tangent
>>>>>>>>>> tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
>>>>>>>>>> started
>>>>>>>>>> laughing
>>>>>>>>>> and saying something akin to how do you make it from day to day. 
>>>>>>>>>> And I
>>>>>>>>>> said
>>>>>>>>>> you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you know and 
>>>>>>>>>> follow
>>>>>>>>>> rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I am 
>>>>>>>>>> paid to
>>>>>>>>>> break
>>>>>>>>>> the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already been 
>>>>>>>>>> done.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>>> Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>>> 303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>>> ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>>>> So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I 
>>>>>>>>>>> am like
>>>>>>>>>>> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed 
>>>>>>>>>>> to know
>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
>>>>>>>>>>> furiously
>>>>>>>>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work 
>>>>>>>>>>> done for
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is 
>>>>>>>>>>> called
>>>>>>>>>>> _Vision and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not 
>>>>>>>>>>> limited
>>>>>>>>>>> vision_  It is my pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a 
>>>>>>>>>>> legally
>>>>>>>>>>> blind
>>>>>>>>>>> painter. It opens one month from today, and if I stop to think 
>>>>>>>>>>> about
>>>>>>>>>>> what
>>>>>>>>>>> else has to be done yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, 
>>>>>>>>>>> but just
>>>>>>>>>>> will keep on working on the details. The show will appear at two
>>>>>>>>>>> locations
>>>>>>>>>>> this year and will have a video that plays in the gallery with 
>>>>>>>>>>> the art
>>>>>>>>>>> works, Braille labeling, and artist's talks. I will even be 
>>>>>>>>>>> teaching in
>>>>>>>>>>> the gallery one afternoon, for the Women in the Arts course at 
>>>>>>>>>>> Geneva
>>>>>>>>>>> College. That is where I taught when I was a professor of fine 
>>>>>>>>>>> arts and
>>>>>>>>>>> humanities, before I retired. I'll be lecturing on the 
>>>>>>>>>>> historical
>>>>>>>>>>> context
>>>>>>>>>>> of my work and where the ideas have come from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak at 
>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, 
>>>>>>>>>>> the day
>>>>>>>>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 
>>>>>>>>>>> years ago,
>>>>>>>>>>> but I am still very much involved in everything but being in the
>>>>>>>>>>> classroom.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap 
>>>>>>>>>>> between an
>>>>>>>>>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that 
>>>>>>>>>>> wide. Some
>>>>>>>>>>> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are 
>>>>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>>>>> far
>>>>>>>>>>> apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands 
>>>>>>>>>>> and most
>>>>>>>>>>> have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>>>> Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the 
>>>>>>>>>>> satisfaction
>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>> the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>>>>> something and
>>>>>>>>>>> knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion 
>>>>>>>>>>> of where
>>>>>>>>>>> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a 
>>>>>>>>>>> clearly
>>>>>>>>>>> defined
>>>>>>>>>>> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings 
>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>> possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is 
>>>>>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>>>>>> crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>>>>>> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, 
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> mature
>>>>>>>>>>> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may 
>>>>>>>>>>> begin in
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the 
>>>>>>>>>>> years of
>>>>>>>>>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one 
>>>>>>>>>>> day
>>>>>>>>>>> - she is free of all rules when making art. Everything can be
>>>>>>>>>>> challenged,
>>>>>>>>>>> everything can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the 
>>>>>>>>>>> artist.
>>>>>>>>>>> Is
>>>>>>>>>>> there any other profession in this world where there are no 
>>>>>>>>>>> rules? It's
>>>>>>>>>>> the most exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely 
>>>>>>>>>>> no rules
>>>>>>>>>>> whatsoever for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say 
>>>>>>>>>>> it.
>>>>>>>>>>> Free,
>>>>>>>>>>> free, free, at last!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is where 
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> person
>>>>>>>>>>> eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is 
>>>>>>>>>>> usually
>>>>>>>>>>> content
>>>>>>>>>>> to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves on to 
>>>>>>>>>>> learn
>>>>>>>>>>> something else and does that again with it. The artist can take 
>>>>>>>>>>> crafts
>>>>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>>>>> then
>>>>>>>>>>> take
>>>>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a 
>>>>>>>>>>> craft. If
>>>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins 
>>>>>>>>>>> to ask
>>>>>>>>>>> the "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and 
>>>>>>>>>>> bends in
>>>>>>>>>>> the road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind 
>>>>>>>>>>> set"
>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>> is never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but 
>>>>>>>>>>> one that
>>>>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the 
>>>>>>>>>>> "end" will
>>>>>>>>>>> be, or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand 
>>>>>>>>>>> what I
>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>> just said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry 
>>>>>>>>>>> with it.
>>>>>>>>>>>  An "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is 
>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>> simple, and that complex.  The artist thrives on change and 
>>>>>>>>>>> making new
>>>>>>>>>>> discoveries and each work leads to other querstions and more 
>>>>>>>>>>> change and
>>>>>>>>>>> more new discoveries.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>>>>>>>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table 
>>>>>>>>>>> full of
>>>>>>>>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>>>>> work
>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they 
>>>>>>>>>>> "fit" and
>>>>>>>>>>> each is very happy with where they are. They are different 
>>>>>>>>>>> animals, with
>>>>>>>>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each 
>>>>>>>>>>> one has
>>>>>>>>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the 
>>>>>>>>>>> decision she
>>>>>>>>>>> has made.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd like to introduce myself. I'm a blind person from wisconsin 
>>>>>>>>>>>> who is
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. I 
>>>>>>>>>>>> make
>>>>>>>>>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>>>>>> together
>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have 
>>>>>>>>>>>> always
>>>>>>>>>>>> looked
>>>>>>>>>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between an 
>>>>>>>>>>>> art and
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
>>>>>>>>>>>> all arts
>>>>>>>>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
>>>>>>>>>>>> list
>>>>>>>>>>>> going as it is something I've always dreamed of seeing in our 
>>>>>>>>>>>> efforts
>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> bring blind people together who love to both create and 
>>>>>>>>>>>> appreciate the
>>>>>>>>>>>> visual arts.
>>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 6
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 13:26:55 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <95E84F42EA7F4ADFA9DF888A9D45EA90 at Wellness>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to 
>>>>>>>> articulate
>>>>>>>> these distinctions.
>>>>>>>> I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter 
>>>>>>>> simultaneously. I am
>>>>>>>> back to my art and love the discovery of it-but I will admit, my 
>>>>>>>> left brain
>>>>>>>> does like rules and instructions-but my Girl Brain is winning! (no 
>>>>>>>> put down
>>>>>>>> to Boy Brains, just a family joke).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Right on! Right on, Linda!
>>>>>>>> pece out
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better 
>>>>>>>> get back
>>>>>>>> to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good 
>>>>>>>> place for a
>>>>>>>> discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line 
>>>>>>>> between the
>>>>>>>> two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can 
>>>>>>>> take the
>>>>>>>> exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite 
>>>>>>>> different
>>>>>>>> and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" and
>>>>>>>> "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we 
>>>>>>>> go with
>>>>>>>> the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there 
>>>>>>>> is a very
>>>>>>>> fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - 
>>>>>>>> now, what is
>>>>>>>> done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and 
>>>>>>>> there is
>>>>>>>> CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you would be 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva 
>>>>>>>> College, in
>>>>>>>> western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as I 
>>>>>>>> have my MFA
>>>>>>>> in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature.  Because 
>>>>>>>> of this
>>>>>>>> background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I was able 
>>>>>>>> to create
>>>>>>>> multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature and 
>>>>>>>> art, as
>>>>>>>> well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, printmaking, 
>>>>>>>> drawing. It was
>>>>>>>> a dream of a job, working in interdisciplinary studies and doing so 
>>>>>>>> many
>>>>>>>> projects with profs in other disciplines.  I was very active in 
>>>>>>>> conferences
>>>>>>>> on interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European experience 
>>>>>>>> for art and
>>>>>>>> literature students and we lived in Austria every summer and then 
>>>>>>>> traveled
>>>>>>>> to other countries. I even had an art exhibition in Austria for my 
>>>>>>>> students
>>>>>>>> every summer.  They worked so hard in the studio and out on 
>>>>>>>> location every
>>>>>>>> day, and at the end of the month they had a show - so much fun.  I 
>>>>>>>> also did
>>>>>>>> this with Puerto Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring 
>>>>>>>> as part
>>>>>>>> of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to 
>>>>>>>> visit
>>>>>>>> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent 
>>>>>>>> our spring
>>>>>>>> time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a 
>>>>>>>> piece done
>>>>>>>> today!
>>>>>>>>  Lynda
>>>>>>>>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>    From: Ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading 
>>>>>>>> this is
>>>>>>>> still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off on 
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
>>>>>>>> started
>>>>>>>> laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
>>>>>>>> to day.
>>>>>>>> And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
>>>>>>>> know and
>>>>>>>> follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
>>>>>>>> am paid to
>>>>>>>> break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
>>>>>>>> been done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>    Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>    303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>    ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>    http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>    http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>      From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>      Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>      To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>      <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      ?
>>>>>>>>      Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>      So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, I 
>>>>>>>> am like
>>>>>>>> you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed to 
>>>>>>>> know and
>>>>>>>> was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
>>>>>>>> furiously
>>>>>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done 
>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called 
>>>>>>>> _Vision
>>>>>>>> and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ 
>>>>>>>> It is my
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens
>>>>>>>> one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has to 
>>>>>>>> be done
>>>>>>>> yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep on 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> the details. The show will appear at two locations this year and 
>>>>>>>> will have a
>>>>>>>> video that plays in the gallery with the art works, Braille 
>>>>>>>> labeling, and
>>>>>>>> artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the gallery one 
>>>>>>>> afternoon, for
>>>>>>>> the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I 
>>>>>>>> taught when
>>>>>>>> I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. 
>>>>>>>> I'll be
>>>>>>>> lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the ideas 
>>>>>>>> have come
>>>>>>>> from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak 
>>>>>>>> at a
>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the 
>>>>>>>> day
>>>>>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years 
>>>>>>>> ago, but
>>>>>>>> I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
>>>>>>>> classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap 
>>>>>>>> between an
>>>>>>>> artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that wide. 
>>>>>>>> Some basic
>>>>>>>> things may be similar between the two, but most things are very far 
>>>>>>>> apart
>>>>>>>> philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Both work with the hands, and both love working with the hands 
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> most have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>      Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the
>>>>>>>> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>> and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion 
>>>>>>>> of where
>>>>>>>> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
>>>>>>>> defined
>>>>>>>> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>> outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      The other very big thing I see as a difference between them is 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>>> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the 
>>>>>>>> mature
>>>>>>>> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one 
>>>>>>>> day - she is
>>>>>>>> free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
>>>>>>>> everything
>>>>>>>> can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
>>>>>>>> there any
>>>>>>>> other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's the 
>>>>>>>> most
>>>>>>>> exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
>>>>>>>> whatsoever
>>>>>>>> for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
>>>>>>>> free, free,
>>>>>>>> at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is 
>>>>>>>> where the
>>>>>>>> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is 
>>>>>>>> usually
>>>>>>>> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves 
>>>>>>>> on to
>>>>>>>> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can 
>>>>>>>> take crafts
>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>> then take
>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. 
>>>>>>>> If you
>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to 
>>>>>>>> ask the
>>>>>>>> "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>> never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" 
>>>>>>>> will be,
>>>>>>>> or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I 
>>>>>>>> have just
>>>>>>>> said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it. 
>>>>>>>> An
>>>>>>>> "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that 
>>>>>>>> simple, and
>>>>>>>> that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries and
>>>>>>>> each work leads to other querstions and more change and more new
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>>>>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table 
>>>>>>>> full of
>>>>>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>> work on
>>>>>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" 
>>>>>>>> and each
>>>>>>>> is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with
>>>>>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one 
>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the 
>>>>>>>> decision she has
>>>>>>>> made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>        From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>        To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>        Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>        Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from 
>>>>>>>> wisconsin who
>>>>>>>> is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is beadwork. 
>>>>>>>> I make
>>>>>>>> pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>> together with
>>>>>>>> thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have always 
>>>>>>>> looked
>>>>>>>> upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        so, I have a basic question. What is the difference between 
>>>>>>>> an art
>>>>>>>> and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
>>>>>>>> all arts
>>>>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
>>>>>>>> list going
>>>>>>>> as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to 
>>>>>>>> bring
>>>>>>>> blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
>>>>>>>> visual
>>>>>>>> arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>        To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>>>>>>>> URL:
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/pipermail/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/attachments/20140207/08273715/attachment-0001.html>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 7
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 13:48:48 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <0C82603A06C14829A1FDF9CA9822F0BB at Lambert>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" by 
>>>>>>>> Luann
>>>>>>>> Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful information a 
>>>>>>>> long time
>>>>>>>> ago. Raising my brood of children would have been so much easier if 
>>>>>>>> I had
>>>>>>>> known these things about the differences between male and female 
>>>>>>>> brains.
>>>>>>>> And, my goodness, I would have been a much better teacher, too. I 
>>>>>>>> would have
>>>>>>>> a better understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least I 
>>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>> understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was 
>>>>>>>> so
>>>>>>>> enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as we 
>>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>>> ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess it is like 
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> conversation we are having right now in this truck."  This was his 
>>>>>>>> insight
>>>>>>>> as I was rapidly sharing so much information as he sat quietly
>>>>>>>> listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I understand this conversation 
>>>>>>>> here in
>>>>>>>> this truck so much better."  We laughed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into the 
>>>>>>>> other. We
>>>>>>>> all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my mother taking 
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery stitches and to 
>>>>>>>> creat a
>>>>>>>> picture on a linen tea towel - I was probably 8 years old. Then, it
>>>>>>>> continues on with my precious neighbor taking an hour each morning, 
>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>> summer, to teach me how to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, 
>>>>>>>> skirt,
>>>>>>>> and then an entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those 
>>>>>>>> around us,
>>>>>>>> and how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is 
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with 
>>>>>>>> every
>>>>>>>> stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" to them 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I am becoming 
>>>>>>>> with each
>>>>>>>> new day and each new idea I work with.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Patricia C. Estes
>>>>>>>>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to
>>>>>>>> articulate these distinctions.
>>>>>>>>  I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter 
>>>>>>>> simultaneously. I
>>>>>>>> am back to my art and love the discovery of it-but I will admit, my 
>>>>>>>> left
>>>>>>>> brain does like rules and instructions-but my Girl Brain is 
>>>>>>>> winning! (no put
>>>>>>>> down to Boy Brains, just a family joke).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Right on! Right on, Linda!
>>>>>>>>  pece out
>>>>>>>>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>    From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>>>>>>>>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I better 
>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>> back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good 
>>>>>>>> place
>>>>>>>> for a discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line 
>>>>>>>> between the
>>>>>>>> two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can 
>>>>>>>> take the
>>>>>>>> exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite 
>>>>>>>> different
>>>>>>>> and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" and
>>>>>>>> "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we 
>>>>>>>> go with
>>>>>>>> the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there 
>>>>>>>> is a very
>>>>>>>> fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - 
>>>>>>>> now, what is
>>>>>>>> done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and 
>>>>>>>> there is
>>>>>>>> CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you would be 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva 
>>>>>>>> College,
>>>>>>>> in western PA)  where I was free to teach across disciplines, as I 
>>>>>>>> have my
>>>>>>>> MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English Literature. 
>>>>>>>> Because of
>>>>>>>> this background, I was very marketable for a good position.  I was 
>>>>>>>> able to
>>>>>>>> create multi-discipline courses - alway a combination of literature 
>>>>>>>> and art,
>>>>>>>> as well as studio courses in painting, fiber arts, printmaking, 
>>>>>>>> drawing. It
>>>>>>>> was a dream of a job, working in interdisciplinary studies and 
>>>>>>>> doing so many
>>>>>>>> projects with profs in other disciplines.  I was very active in 
>>>>>>>> conferences
>>>>>>>> on interdisciplinary studies.   I created an European experience 
>>>>>>>> for art and
>>>>>>>> literature students and we lived in Austria every summer and then 
>>>>>>>> traveled
>>>>>>>> to other countries. I even had an art exhibition in Austria for my 
>>>>>>>> students
>>>>>>>> every summer.  They worked so hard in the studio and out on 
>>>>>>>> location every
>>>>>>>> day, and at the end of the month they had a show - so much fun.  I 
>>>>>>>> also did
>>>>>>>> this with Puerto Rico, and students came to PR with me each spring 
>>>>>>>> as part
>>>>>>>> of their course in Puerto Rico Culture - which I have continued to 
>>>>>>>> visit
>>>>>>>> every March even though I am now retired. It bacame how we spent 
>>>>>>>> our spring
>>>>>>>> time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a 
>>>>>>>> piece done
>>>>>>>> today!
>>>>>>>>    Lynda
>>>>>>>>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>      From: Ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>      To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>      Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is reading 
>>>>>>>> this is
>>>>>>>> still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all sorts 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went off 
>>>>>>>> on a
>>>>>>>> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
>>>>>>>> started
>>>>>>>> laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
>>>>>>>> to day.
>>>>>>>> And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
>>>>>>>> know and
>>>>>>>> follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
>>>>>>>> am paid to
>>>>>>>> break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
>>>>>>>> been done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>      Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>      303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>      ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>      http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>      http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>        Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>        From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>        Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>        To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>        <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        ?
>>>>>>>>        Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>        So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group though, 
>>>>>>>> I am
>>>>>>>> like you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed 
>>>>>>>> to know
>>>>>>>> and was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
>>>>>>>> furiously
>>>>>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done 
>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called 
>>>>>>>> _Vision
>>>>>>>> and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ 
>>>>>>>> It is my
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens
>>>>>>>> one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has to 
>>>>>>>> be done
>>>>>>>> yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep on 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> the details. The show will appear at two locations this year and 
>>>>>>>> will have a
>>>>>>>> video that plays in the gallery with the art works, Braille 
>>>>>>>> labeling, and
>>>>>>>> artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the gallery one 
>>>>>>>> afternoon, for
>>>>>>>> the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I 
>>>>>>>> taught when
>>>>>>>> I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. 
>>>>>>>> I'll be
>>>>>>>> lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the ideas 
>>>>>>>> have come
>>>>>>>> from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to speak 
>>>>>>>> at a
>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the 
>>>>>>>> day
>>>>>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years 
>>>>>>>> ago, but
>>>>>>>> I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
>>>>>>>> classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Here is my response to the question you have asked. The gap 
>>>>>>>> between
>>>>>>>> an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is that 
>>>>>>>> wide. Some
>>>>>>>> basic things may be similar between the two, but most things are 
>>>>>>>> very far
>>>>>>>> apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Both work with the hands, and both love working with the 
>>>>>>>> hands and
>>>>>>>> most have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>        Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the
>>>>>>>> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning 
>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>> and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with no notion 
>>>>>>>> of where
>>>>>>>> the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter has a clearly 
>>>>>>>> defined
>>>>>>>> path to the finished product. The artist has only some inklings of 
>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>> outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        The other very big thing I see as a difference between them 
>>>>>>>> is that
>>>>>>>> the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate from 
>>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>>> rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other hand, the 
>>>>>>>> mature
>>>>>>>> artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may begin 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the years 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one 
>>>>>>>> day - she is
>>>>>>>> free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
>>>>>>>> everything
>>>>>>>> can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
>>>>>>>> there any
>>>>>>>> other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's the 
>>>>>>>> most
>>>>>>>> exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
>>>>>>>> whatsoever
>>>>>>>> for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
>>>>>>>> free, free,
>>>>>>>> at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is 
>>>>>>>> where the
>>>>>>>> person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is 
>>>>>>>> usually
>>>>>>>> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves 
>>>>>>>> on to
>>>>>>>> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can 
>>>>>>>> take crafts
>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>> then take
>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. 
>>>>>>>> If you
>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to 
>>>>>>>> ask the
>>>>>>>> "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>> never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" 
>>>>>>>> will be,
>>>>>>>> or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I 
>>>>>>>> have just
>>>>>>>> said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it. 
>>>>>>>> An
>>>>>>>> "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that 
>>>>>>>> simple, and
>>>>>>>> that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries and
>>>>>>>> each work leads to other querstions and more change and more new
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        One can see the difference when you look at work in types of
>>>>>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table 
>>>>>>>> full of
>>>>>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>> work on
>>>>>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" 
>>>>>>>> and each
>>>>>>>> is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with
>>>>>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one 
>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the 
>>>>>>>> decision she has
>>>>>>>> made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>          From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>          To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>          Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>          Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from 
>>>>>>>> wisconsin
>>>>>>>> who is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is 
>>>>>>>> beadwork. I
>>>>>>>> make pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>> together
>>>>>>>> with thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have 
>>>>>>>> always
>>>>>>>> looked upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          so, I have a basic question. What is the difference 
>>>>>>>> between an art
>>>>>>>> and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but are 
>>>>>>>> all arts
>>>>>>>> considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting this 
>>>>>>>> list going
>>>>>>>> as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our efforts to 
>>>>>>>> bring
>>>>>>>> blind people together who love to both create and appreciate the 
>>>>>>>> visual
>>>>>>>> arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>          To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
>>>>>>>> account info
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>        _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>        To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>> for Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/ann%40acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>      Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>      To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>    Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/pece03%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>  Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Artists-making-art:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org/llambert%40zoominternet.net
>>>>>>>> -------------- next part --------------
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 8
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 20:54:43 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: "Patricia C. Estes" <pece03 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>> <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <35AF1D7D30354C14A11963A2A17E797B at Wellness>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Linda, the brain is so fascinating-or is it the mind?? My first 
>>>>>>>> real
>>>>>>>> understanding of it (before I studied holistic psychology and 
>>>>>>>> energy
>>>>>>>> medicine) was when our youngest was caught doing something or other 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> five year olds do, and he burst into tears and managed to blurt out
>>>>>>>> emphatically, "My girl brain made me do it!"
>>>>>>>> Yes, Luke, I know what you mean! But he didn't go to school, yet, 
>>>>>>>> and we
>>>>>>>> didn't have a TV...I think he just *knew*.
>>>>>>>> Dr. Christian Northrop teaches about the female brain, too. Her 
>>>>>>>> example is
>>>>>>>> that she and her, then, husband were flying somewhere and she 
>>>>>>>> noticed that
>>>>>>>> she was reading "Enriching the Mother/Daughter Relationship" and he 
>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>> reading "How to get the most out of your Band Saw."
>>>>>>>> To bring art into this, I am sure you are familiar with the 
>>>>>>>> book,"Drawing on
>>>>>>>> the Right side of the Brain." Pretty fascinating, if one has time 
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> complicate one's life by experimenting with drawing things upside 
>>>>>>>> down.
>>>>>>>> Energetically, if you want to engage both hemispheres, Brain Gym 
>>>>>>>> says to
>>>>>>>> "think of an X." And to relax the mind, think of two parallel 
>>>>>>>> lines.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OK, I'm taking my parallel lines and heading to bed,
>>>>>>>> Patty
>>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>  From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>  To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>  Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:48 PM
>>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Patricia, I just finished reading the book "The Female Brain" by 
>>>>>>>> Luann
>>>>>>>> Brizendine, and OH, HOw I wish I had this wonderful information a 
>>>>>>>> long time
>>>>>>>> ago. Raising my brood of children would have been so much easier if 
>>>>>>>> I had
>>>>>>>> known these things about the differences between male and female 
>>>>>>>> brains.
>>>>>>>> And, my goodness, I would have been a much better teacher, too. I 
>>>>>>>> would have
>>>>>>>> a better understanding of my fellow human beings - but at least I 
>>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>> understand a lot more about it now since reading this book. It was 
>>>>>>>> so
>>>>>>>> enlightening to me and I was telling my husband all about it as we 
>>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>>> ride along in the truck. One day he said to me, "I guess it is like 
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> conversation we are having right now in this truck."  This was his 
>>>>>>>> insight
>>>>>>>> as I was rapidly sharing so much information as he sat quietly
>>>>>>>> listening...lol  I said, "Yes, now I understand this conversation 
>>>>>>>> here in
>>>>>>>> this truck so much better."  We laughed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Of course we are both crafters and artists - one feeds into the 
>>>>>>>> other. We
>>>>>>>> all begin somewhere - and for me, it begins with my mother taking 
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> afternoon to teach me how to do some embroidery stitches and to 
>>>>>>>> creat a
>>>>>>>> picture on a linen tea towel - I was probably 8 years old. Then, it
>>>>>>>> continues on with my precious neighbor taking an hour each morning, 
>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>> summer, to teach me how to read a pattern and how to sew a blouse, 
>>>>>>>> skirt,
>>>>>>>> and then an entire outfit - I was about 10. We learn from those 
>>>>>>>> around us,
>>>>>>>> and how lucky we were to have them in our life. What I do today, is 
>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>> homage to those women in my life so long ago. I celebrate them with 
>>>>>>>> every
>>>>>>>> stitch  I make in my art these days. And, I say "thank you" to them 
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> giving me the beginnings of who I am today, and who I am becoming 
>>>>>>>> with each
>>>>>>>> new day and each new idea I work with.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.amazon.com/Louann-Brizendine/e/B001H6RZB8/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1391798400&sr=1-1
>>>>>>>>    ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>    From: Patricia C. Estes
>>>>>>>>    To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>    Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 1:26 PM
>>>>>>>>    Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Hooray for "outrageous and for all of you for taking the time to
>>>>>>>> articulate these distinctions.
>>>>>>>>    I absolutely agree and have been an artist and crafter 
>>>>>>>> simultaneously. I
>>>>>>>> am back to my art and love the discovery of it-but I will admit, my 
>>>>>>>> left
>>>>>>>> brain does like rules and instructions-but my Girl Brain is 
>>>>>>>> winning! (no put
>>>>>>>> down to Boy Brains, just a family joke).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Right on! Right on, Linda!
>>>>>>>>    pece out
>>>>>>>>      ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>      From: Lynda Lambert
>>>>>>>>      To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>      Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 11:44 AM
>>>>>>>>      Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      Well, this is an outrageous conversation, I know. lol   I 
>>>>>>>> better get
>>>>>>>> back to the studio before I cause a riot, but this should be a good 
>>>>>>>> place
>>>>>>>> for a discussion like this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      That is great, Ann! So true. There is really not a fine line 
>>>>>>>> between
>>>>>>>> the two, it is very clear and distinct. And artist or a crafter can 
>>>>>>>> take the
>>>>>>>> exact same materials, but the mind that works with them is quite 
>>>>>>>> different
>>>>>>>> and the results are quite different. It's really about "ideas" and
>>>>>>>> "concepts" and what we are thinking about as we work, and where we 
>>>>>>>> go with
>>>>>>>> the materials in our process of working.  In Pittsburgh, PA there 
>>>>>>>> is a very
>>>>>>>> fine museum/gallery called the Society of Contemporary Crafts - 
>>>>>>>> now, what is
>>>>>>>> done there, and shown there is high art. So there is crafts and 
>>>>>>>> there is
>>>>>>>> CRAFT, too.  There is the "crafter" and there is the "Craftsman." 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> distinct differences between them - and as a sculptor you would be 
>>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>>> aware of this, too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      I was so fortunate to teach in a small private college (Geneva
>>>>>>>> College, in western PA)  where I was free to teach across 
>>>>>>>> disciplines, as I
>>>>>>>> have my MFA in painting/printmaking, and my MA in English 
>>>>>>>> Literature.
>>>>>>>> Because of this background, I was very marketable for a good 
>>>>>>>> position. I
>>>>>>>> was able to create multi-discipline courses - alway a combination 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> literature and art, as well as studio courses in painting, fiber 
>>>>>>>> arts,
>>>>>>>> printmaking, drawing. It was a dream of a job, working in 
>>>>>>>> interdisciplinary
>>>>>>>> studies and doing so many projects with profs in other disciplines. 
>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>> very active in conferences on interdisciplinary studies.   I 
>>>>>>>> created an
>>>>>>>> European experience for art and literature students and we lived in 
>>>>>>>> Austria
>>>>>>>> every summer and then traveled to other countries. I even had an 
>>>>>>>> art
>>>>>>>> exhibition in Austria for my students every summer.  They worked so 
>>>>>>>> hard in
>>>>>>>> the studio and out on location every day, and at the end of the 
>>>>>>>> month they
>>>>>>>> had a show - so much fun.  I also did this with Puerto Rico, and 
>>>>>>>> students
>>>>>>>> came to PR with me each spring as part of their course in Puerto 
>>>>>>>> Rico
>>>>>>>> Culture - which I have continued to visit every March even though I 
>>>>>>>> am now
>>>>>>>> retired. It bacame how we spent our spring time.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      OK, back to my studio where I am working my tail off to get a 
>>>>>>>> piece
>>>>>>>> done today!
>>>>>>>>      Lynda
>>>>>>>>        ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>        From: Ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>        To: An exploration of art by and for blind persons
>>>>>>>>        Sent: Friday, February 07, 2014 9:08 AM
>>>>>>>>        Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Lynda, Nice answer to craft and art. If someone who is 
>>>>>>>> reading this
>>>>>>>> is still torn I wouldn't be surprised though since there are all 
>>>>>>>> sorts of
>>>>>>>> shades in the continuum.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        I was talking to my daughter and a friend one day. I went 
>>>>>>>> off on a
>>>>>>>> tangent tangling all sorts of events together rather randomly. They 
>>>>>>>> started
>>>>>>>> laughing and saying something akin to how do you make it from day 
>>>>>>>> to day.
>>>>>>>> And I said you guys are pilots and for you to be a good pilot you 
>>>>>>>> know and
>>>>>>>> follow rules. That is what they pay you for. I am an artist and I 
>>>>>>>> am paid to
>>>>>>>> break the rules. No one wants to hear from me if it has already 
>>>>>>>> been done.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        What did you teach before you retired? Ann
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        Ann Cunningham
>>>>>>>>        Tactile Art - a creative way to see the world!
>>>>>>>>        303 238 4760
>>>>>>>>        ann at acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>        http://www.acunningham.com
>>>>>>>>        http://www.sensationalbooks.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>>>          Subject: Re: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new 
>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>          From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>>>>>>>          Date: Fri, February 07, 2014 6:03 am
>>>>>>>>          To: "An exploration of art by and for blind persons"
>>>>>>>>          <artists-making-art at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          ?
>>>>>>>>          Hi Laurie,
>>>>>>>>          So nice to see you here.  I did not start this group 
>>>>>>>> though, I am
>>>>>>>> like you, I just came on to ask a question about something I needed 
>>>>>>>> to know
>>>>>>>> and was so glad to meet Ann who helped me with my question.  I am 
>>>>>>>> furiously
>>>>>>>> working right now (oops, split that infinitive!) getting work done 
>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>> opening of a two-person exhibition at a museum - the show is called 
>>>>>>>> _Vision
>>>>>>>> and Revision:  Two artists with limited sight, not limited vision_ 
>>>>>>>> It is my
>>>>>>>> pottery and mixed-media fiber works, and a legally blind painter. 
>>>>>>>> It opens
>>>>>>>> one month from today, and if I stop to think about what else has to 
>>>>>>>> be done
>>>>>>>> yet, I'll get nervous. So, I won't do that, but just will keep on 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> the details. The show will appear at two locations this year and 
>>>>>>>> will have a
>>>>>>>> video that plays in the gallery with the art works, Braille 
>>>>>>>> labeling, and
>>>>>>>> artist's talks. I will even be teaching in the gallery one 
>>>>>>>> afternoon, for
>>>>>>>> the Women in the Arts course at Geneva College. That is where I 
>>>>>>>> taught when
>>>>>>>> I was a professor of fine arts and humanities, before I retired. 
>>>>>>>> I'll be
>>>>>>>> lecturing on the historical context of my work and where the ideas 
>>>>>>>> have come
>>>>>>>> from when creating it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          To make matters even more difficult, I am scheduled to 
>>>>>>>> speak at a
>>>>>>>> conference at Slippery Rock University of PA for two sessions, the 
>>>>>>>> day
>>>>>>>> before we hang our show. So, I have those presentations to be 
>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>> every day now, too.  I officially retired from teaching 5 1/2 years 
>>>>>>>> ago, but
>>>>>>>> I am still very much involved in everything but being in the 
>>>>>>>> classroom.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Here is my response to the question you have asked. The 
>>>>>>>> gap
>>>>>>>> between an artist and a crafter is like crossing the ocean, it is 
>>>>>>>> that wide.
>>>>>>>> Some basic things may be similar between the two, but most things 
>>>>>>>> are very
>>>>>>>> far apart philisophically.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Both work with the hands, and both love working with the 
>>>>>>>> hands and
>>>>>>>> most have done it all their life.
>>>>>>>>          Both love the materials, and the handling of them, and the
>>>>>>>> satisfaction of the finished product that comes out of it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          While the crafter will usually be satisfied with beginning
>>>>>>>> something and knowing where the end will be, the artist begins with 
>>>>>>>> no
>>>>>>>> notion of where the end will be or even if it will be.  the crafter 
>>>>>>>> has a
>>>>>>>> clearly defined path to the finished product. The artist has only 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> inklings of possible outcomes, but has to find them as she works.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          The other very big thing I see as a difference between 
>>>>>>>> them is
>>>>>>>> that the crafter has 'rules" to follow and seldom will ever deviate 
>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>> those rules, as they are set in stone in her mind. On the other 
>>>>>>>> hand, the
>>>>>>>> mature artist has learned that there are no rules at all.  They may 
>>>>>>>> begin in
>>>>>>>> the early stages by learning techniques, but eventually with the 
>>>>>>>> years of
>>>>>>>> working, the light comes on in her brain when she discovers one 
>>>>>>>> day - she is
>>>>>>>> free of all rules when making art. Everything can be challenged, 
>>>>>>>> everything
>>>>>>>> can be changed, and everything is fair game, for the artist. Is 
>>>>>>>> there any
>>>>>>>> other profession in this world where there are no rules? It's the 
>>>>>>>> most
>>>>>>>> exhilerating feeling to know that there are absolutely no rules 
>>>>>>>> whatsoever
>>>>>>>> for me. Wow, makes me take a deep breath just to say it. Free, 
>>>>>>>> free, free,
>>>>>>>> at last!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Laurie, the biggest difference between art and a craft is 
>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>> the person eventually takes the techniques, I think.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          A crafter seldom takes things to a different level but is 
>>>>>>>> usually
>>>>>>>> content to learn something then duplicate it endlessly, then moves 
>>>>>>>> on to
>>>>>>>> learn something else and does that again with it. The artist can 
>>>>>>>> take crafts
>>>>>>>> materials (which is what you and I both do) and techniques, and 
>>>>>>>> then take
>>>>>>>> them far beyond because they will combine their techniques and 
>>>>>>>> materials
>>>>>>>> with the imagination.  If you can teach it, it is usually a craft. 
>>>>>>>> If you
>>>>>>>> cannot teach it, it is normally art.  Art can begin by learning 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> techniques, or using craft materials, but then the person begins to 
>>>>>>>> ask the
>>>>>>>> "what if" questions, and takes lots of risks, failures, and bends 
>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>> road on the way to it becoming a work of art. It is a "mind set" 
>>>>>>>> that is
>>>>>>>> never satisfied with just the learning of something new, but one 
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> constantly questions, experiments, and never knows where the "end" 
>>>>>>>> will be,
>>>>>>>> or even if it will be.  A "crafter" will never understand what I 
>>>>>>>> have just
>>>>>>>> said and will most likely be huffing and puffing and angry with it. 
>>>>>>>> An
>>>>>>>> "artist" is standing and applauding what I have said. It is that 
>>>>>>>> simple, and
>>>>>>>> that complex.  The artist thrives on change and making new 
>>>>>>>> discoveries and
>>>>>>>> each work leads to other querstions and more change and more new
>>>>>>>> discoveries.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          One can see the difference when you look at work in types 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> environments.  One will be setting at a craft show with a table 
>>>>>>>> full of
>>>>>>>> things that are basically all the same while the other will have 
>>>>>>>> work on
>>>>>>>> display in a gallery or museum.  Each has decided where they "fit" 
>>>>>>>> and each
>>>>>>>> is very happy with where they are. They are different animals, with
>>>>>>>> different ideas, and different end results and outcomes. Each one 
>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>> decided their own path and each one is comfortable with the 
>>>>>>>> decision she has
>>>>>>>> made.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          Lynda
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>>            From: Laurie Porter
>>>>>>>>            To: Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>            Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 7:26 PM
>>>>>>>>            Subject: [Artists-making-art] arts or crafts new member
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            Hi Folks:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            I?d like to introduce myself. I?m a blind person from 
>>>>>>>> wisconsin
>>>>>>>> who is a fledgling and budding beginner artist. my medium is 
>>>>>>>> beadwork. I
>>>>>>>> make pictures and tapestries out of tiny little seed beads  sewn 
>>>>>>>> together
>>>>>>>> with thread. but most of my work is in making jewlry, but I have 
>>>>>>>> always
>>>>>>>> looked upon my beadwork as an art form.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            so, I have a basic question. What is the difference 
>>>>>>>> between an
>>>>>>>> art and a craft? I do believe that all crafts are forms of art  but 
>>>>>>>> are all
>>>>>>>> arts considered crafts? Thanks linda and all of you for getting 
>>>>>>>> this list
>>>>>>>> going as it is something I?ve always dreamed of seeing in our 
>>>>>>>> efforts to
>>>>>>>> bring blind people together who love to both create and appreciate 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> visual arts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>            _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>            Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>            Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>          _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art mailing list
>>>>>>>>          Artists-making-art at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/artists-making-art_nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>        _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>        Artists-making-art mailing list
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>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> End of Artists-making-art Digest, Vol 16, Issue 5
>>>>>>>> *************************************************
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Digest Footer
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>>>>>>>> *************************************************
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>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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