[blindkid] FW: [nabs-l] Line Ups

Sun Dec 7 18:35:49 UTC 2008

Dear Mike,
In a sense, that is precisely my point; in asking people to look deeper for
the subtleties. For many of these students the molehills have become
mountains (due to lack of proper training, independent practice
opportunities, over-protection from home and school, and a lack of
confidence)--and it is a great thing they have a non-judgmental safe place
to air it out with peers and find solutions (the NABS-list). I think it is
good for parents to get a window in to the future too-of the results of not
living a lifestyle of normal expectations in even the small things daily,
daily, daily...and relying on the school to take the responsibility for
normal life activities (better known in some pro circles as Expanded Core
Curriculum). 

I have seen over and over these "molehills" get in the way of students--(in
this case for example)even avoiding lunch altogether because of the
discomfort or unsure-ness of what to do. These things become REAL
mountains...these kids need our encouragement and to be built up. I find
that they regularly "call" each other on low expectations for self. It is a
great non-threatening way to read about how others are doing something so
simply and plainly--and to measure yourself privately about it. It is good
to see how the others who have gotten training or had normal expectations
teach the ones who need it. I am real glad for the list, I think it is
changing lives and brining many to face their true need for further training
or gaining of confidence or to raise the bar for themselves. These students
need our support and cheerleading, not frustration at their struggles...it
is the system that has failed them that is where our frustration should turn
in my opinion.  We can not fail them.

Love, 

Carrie Gilmer, President
National Organization of Parents of Blind Children
A Division of the National Federation of the Blind
NFB National Center: 410-659-9314
Home Phone: 763-784-8590
carrie.gilmer at gmail.com
www.nfb.org/nopbc

-----Original Message-----
From: blindkid-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindkid-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Freeman
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 11:55 PM
To: NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List,(for parents of blind children)
Subject: Re: [blindkid] FW: [nabs-l] Line Ups

Carrie:

Seems to me what the below posts truly show is the all-too-prevalent 
tendency on NABS-L to make mountains out of molehills.

Seems to me it's simple: you ask where the end of the line is and stay 
close enough to the person in front to know when s/he moves. If you 
don't, the people behind you will certainly tell you when the line 
moves. But students seem preoccupied with "looking good", not sticking 
out from the crowd and doing everything the "right way" -- whatever that 
might be.

To me, lining up was nothing compared to working in a foreign language 
imersion environment and trying to figure out what was on a cafeteria 
line when one didn't know what things were called in said foreign 
language! (grin)

Mike

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Carrie Gilmer" <carrie.gilmer at gmail.com>
To: "'NFBnet Blind Kid Mailing List,(for parents of blind children)'" 
<blindkid at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 7:40 AM
Subject: [blindkid] FW: [nabs-l] Line Ups

I find it often interesting that things that come up for us often come 
up
simultaneously on the student list--that is they bring it up and discuss
amongst themselves...here is a new example: Recall Stephanie had posted
about Kendra being shown a method that Stephanie questioned for lining 
up...
I had thought but never added...
I think there is room in first grade for a bit of line swaying, that is 
I
wouldn't expect her to be perfect like a line at a military academy or 
boot
camp. I have spent many hours at elementary schools in the last twenty
years... and observed many a line. The sighted kids do not line up
perfectly...

I would also ask you to observe the subtle things in the discussion 
below
and the differences between what they were taught and where they were 
taught
it....

Carrie Gilmer, President
National Organization of Parents of Blind Children
A Division of the National Federation of the Blind
NFB National Center: 410-659-9314
Home Phone: 763-784-8590
carrie.gilmer at gmail.com
www.nfb.org/nopbc

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
Behalf
Of Valerie Gibson
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 8:42 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Line Ups

Hi all,

when i went to the Louisiana center for the blind a long while back,
we were taught to put the tip of the cane on the heel of the person in
front of us.  However when the person is moving around or hovering on
the outskirts of the line where it becomes confusing, i just think the
best way is to ask where the end of the line is, and when you find the
end of the line, as the person when you can ove up.  or rather, if
they could tell you when it's time to move up.

I'm shy too. part of the reason i've not posted to the list much, but
college teaches me that you have to take what you need, and do what
you've got to do to get things done, even if it's a matter of waiting
in line.

On 12/4/08, hannah <sparklylicious at suddenlink.net> wrote:
> I think the best way would be to light put your cane to the heel
> of the person in front of you.
> Best,
> Hannah
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Serena" <serenacucco at verizon.net
>>To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 19:54:51 -0500
>>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Line Ups
>
>>With respect, I disagree.  I think putting your hand on a sighted
> person's
>>shoulder is inappropriate, especially if it's a stranger.  Also,
> some
>>sighted strangers may interpret this as wanting sighted guide and
> grab your
>>arm without worning you!
>
>>Serena
>
>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Karrie Kinstetter" <skittlesfreak69 at gmail.com
>>To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>><nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 8:37 PM
>>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Line Ups
>
>
>>> Sarah, When I went to the school for the blind and other places
> that had a
>>> setting like this, I usually just put my hand on the person in
> front of
>>> me.
>>> This also helps a great deal seeing as I have a rocking tendency
> so if I
>>> put
>>> my hand on the person's shoulder, they usually don't mind and
> are
>>> perfectly
>>> fine with it.
>>> Mind you, those are the blind people.
>>> If it's the sighted people, they just usually kindly tell me to
> move up.
>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org
> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Sarah Jevnikar
>>> Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 1:30 AM
>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Line Ups
>
>>> Hi All,
>>> I was in my university cafeteria today and thought of one aspect
> we hadn't
>>> yet discussed.  How do you guys manage line ups? How do you know
> if it's
>>> your
>>> turn or where the line ends? In my caf there are several lines
> that
>>> converge
>>> so things can get confusing.  I know the obvious thing would be
> to ask the
>>> people near you, but I find I get shy and tongue-tied when I'm
> in
>>> unfamiliar
>>> settings alone so sometimes that doesn't work so well.  Any
> other thoughts?
>>> Thank you,
>>> Sarah
>
>
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