[nabs-l] Grabbing and streetcrossing help

Wed Nov 16 01:59:11 UTC 2011

Thank you, Bridgit! You read my mind! You're awesome like that! 
LOL! It's called interdependence, guys.

Chris

"The real problem of blindness is not the loss of eyesight.  The 
real problem is the misunderstanding and lack of education that 
exists.  If a blind person has the proper training and 
opportunity, blindness can be reduced to a mere physical 
nuisance."
-- Kenneth Jernigan (President, National Federation of the Blind, 
1968-1986

P.S.  The I C.A.N.  Foundation helps blind and visually impaired 
youth in Maryland say "I can," by empowering them through 
providing assistive technology and scholarships to camps and 
conventions which help them be equal with their sighted peers.  
For more information about the Foundation and to support our 
work, visit us online at www.icanfoundation.info!

Sent from my BrailleNote Apex

 ----- Original Message -----
From: Bridgit Pollpeter <bpollpeter at hotmail.com
To: <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Fri, 11 Nov 2011 15:34:49 -0600
Subject: [nabs-l] Grabbing and streetcrossing help

Mark,

I like thinking outside the box, smile! What you say is very 
true.  And
one point I have failed to state is that even when using sighted 
guide,
or a guide of any kind, always, always keep your cane.  And just 
because
a person touches, in some way, someones body, it doesn't mean 
they are
being led around, or are dependent.  For the longest time, my 
husband and
I wouldn't hold hands when public because we didn't want anyone 
thinking
one was leading the other around, but eventually we grew tired of 
this.
We're in love and we like to hold hands.  Others will think what 
they
want; we know the truth.  And if people can't deal with this, 
screw them.
It's not like we're maneuvering the other into bathroom stalls, 
or
chairs, or inching them along.  It's ridiculous how caught up on 
this
stuff we can become as blind people.

We put certain definitions on things like sighted guide, but when 
you
think about it, we could just as easily place those definitions 
on other
things.

Since when did independence mean doing something literally alone? 
True,
a basic definition means acting on your own, but independence is 
also
about being efficient and being the best possible person in order 
to
live your life based on your terms.  To assume touching, or 
holding, a
persons arm or hand automatically equates to dependence is a 
ridiculous
idea.

We need to give people room to grow and explore.  We all come to 
certain
crossroads in our own time, and making snap judgments and placing 
strict
definitions, doesn't lead to an environment cultivating growth.  
None of
us have "made it," and if you think you have, you are sadly 
mistaken and
have a huge growth of your own to make.

Getting caught up on analyzing every encounter, every action is 
just as
stupid as not releasing your feelings in a given situation.  Who 
cares
how every little thing I do is perceived? I don't have time to 
care.  If
I decide to hold the back of a friends arm while we walk and 
talk, I
can't be concerned if you, or others, think I'm being dependent.  
If I
let my husband refill my drink at a restaurant, why do I have to 
worry
about how this is perceived? I have nothing to prove to the world 
beyond
living my life the best way I see fit.

Thank you, Mark, for stepping outside the box and giving us 
something to
think about rather than some rigidly defined standard in which to
measure up to our own lives.  Thinking is what cultivates true 
change,
not blanket standards set by those who can't open their minds to 
other
things.  It's about separating truth from perception.

Sincerely,
Bridgit Kuenning-Pollpeter
Read my blog at:
http://blogs.livewellnebraska.com/author/bpollpeter/

"History is not what happened; history is what was written down."
The Expected One- Kathleen McGowan

Message: 15
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2011 16:26:57 -0700
From: Marc Workman <mworkman.lists at gmail.com
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
	<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Grabbing and streetcrossing help
Message-ID: <1309521D-304E-4145-BA30-217D5F4F266E at gmail.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Jedi wrote,
 we can't claim that we want to be independent travellers and ask 
for a
sighted guide everywhere we go.

I take this to mean that, if you are unable to travel anywhere 
without
sighted guide, you cannot call yourself an independent traveller.  
This
seems right and uncontroversial.  But I think others, and I'm not
referring to the statement above, have made statements, which I'm 
too
lazy right now to find and cite directly, that suggest it is 
better, in
general, not to go sighted guide even when it is available.  
There are
times when it's appropriate no doubt, but as a rule, independence
requires foregoing sighted guide even when you are walking with a
sighted person.  Perhaps there are more nuanced positions, and 
I'd be
interested in hearing those, but this is a sentiment I believe 
I've
picked up on.

The thing that puzzles me is that it seems to be acceptable to 
"depend"
on the person with whom you are walking in certain ways (for 
example,
it's okay to listen to footsteps, or the persons voice, or follow
directions like left or right), but it's not acceptable to 
"depend" on
the person if it involves putting two fingers on the back of 
someone's
elbow.  Why is one form of dependence acceptable while the other 
is not?

Now, this could be a difference in the definition of sighted 
guide.
When I go sighted guide, I continue to rely on my cane to find 
curbs,
stairs, poles, etc.  I've always thought it strange to put the 
cane away
during sighted guide, not because I care about dependence or
independence, but because I would feel unsafe.  I suppose if you 
put
away the cane and relied exclusively on the sighted person, this 
would
constitute a difference between sighted guide and listening to
footsteps, but as I said, this isn't my version of sighted guide.  
For
me, a light touch on the elbow is just a more convenient way of 
tracking
the person with whom I'm talking than is listening to footsteps 
or
voice.  I do the same thing with my girlfriend who is also blind.

I go sighted guide nearly all of the time when I'm walking and 
talking
with another person even if that person is not sighted.  
Obviously, if
I'm travelling alone, there is no sighted guide, and I'm 
perfectly
comfortable with that.  I don't think this is a matter of 
dependence or
independence since, whether I depend on 
footsteps/voice/directions or a
light touch on the elbow, I'm equally dependent.  To me, this is 
a
matter of convenience.  I could go from my apartment to my 
office, which
involves a bus ride, an LRT ride, and a walk across campus, 
without my
cane.  I've walked it enough times that I'm sure I could do it, 
but it
would be far less convenient to do it this way.  Yet no one would
suggest that I'm dependent on my cane, or at least no one would 
suggest
that I ought to try to be less dependent on my cane.  Similarly, 
when
I'm having a conversation or receiving assistance from another 
person, I
could listen to footsteps/voice/directions, but I find this far 
less
convenient than lightly touching an elbow.

I recognize that some people may see this and believe that I 
could not
do it on my own, but they would be mistaken.  I also know that 
those
same people might assume that all blind people are like me and 
would not
be able to do it on their own either and that these beliefs might
affect, probably negatively, their interactions with other blind 
people.
Again, however, this would be their mistake, their prejudice, and 
their
discrimination.  And while I regret that situation, I won't let 
people's
ignorance and stupidity dictate my behaviour.

Cheers,

Marc

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