[nagdu] Questions about Federal regs regarding paratransit

Fri Jan 23 21:36:21 UTC 2009

Hi Linda,

No, I don't think I should have smiled and handled it later. I think that, 
blind or not, we're human, and we have crappy days like the rest of society. 
I don't consider myself Miss Super Blindy, who has no problems, just smiles 
at everyone, and just goes through life nonchilantly, never in a bad mood. I 
was raised to speak my mind and speak up to things like that and if I don't 
want to do something, I don't do it, period. It has nothing to do with 
blindness in particular, I hold that attitude with everything I do in life. 
I'm very outspoken and I march to the beat of my own drum, I don't just go 
along with the way others think it ought to be done. If everyone is running 
right, I'm running left. I don't like this thing in society that says you 
have to do it such and such way, and I am the first to object if someone 
says it *has* to be done a certain way, I'll show them that it necessarily 
doesn't. If I don't want to sit, I won't sit, regardless of the 
circumstances. And if they are reluctant to help a blind person in the 
future because of their experiences with one blind person, than that shows 
their shallowness. That would be like me saying, "Gee, I'd rather not have a 
blonde help me through the store this time, because last time, my shopping 
assistant had blonde hair and she did a bad job, so this one will too." If 
they want to stereotype and get all huffy puffy because I won't comply to 
their every wish, that is their problem. We're human, and that's just the 
way the world is. Like I said, this is not the way I feel only about 
blindness issues, but everything. I am not just going to comply because it 
might look good. And what kind of impression does that leave with others 
watching? If she was persistent and kept on my case to go with her, and I 
just submissively complied, do you think that was a good impression to leave 
on people either? Either way, you can leave a bad impression no matter what 
you do. Not everyone is going to love your actions and be your number one 
fan, so you have to do what you think is best. I really don't understand all 
these people who think we should never be rude toward anyone, we should just 
walk out the door like we're on cloud 9 with smiles on our faces because, 
after all, we have to represent the entire blind community. I may be blind, 
but I don't feel I have to have a certain agenda or act a certain way to 
represent all blind people. I live my life as an individual, and I do what I 
can to help others who are blind, but I don't necessarily always think I 
should act certain ways to represent the entire blind population of America. 
As far as her being reluctant to help another blind person, I'm sure if 
another blind person needed assistance, they could find a way to get it if 
they had their head half way on their shoulders, and I'm sure if a blind 
person outright asked her for help she would do it. If not, they can cross 
that bridge when they get to it. You are only one person, you can't solve 
every problem for every person. Every group of people is stereotyped, and 
I'm not sure why we think we need to act certain ways just to make a point. 
We are no exception, every group is stereotyped in certain ways whether it 
be men, women, black people, Asians, etc. And people are going to think 
certain ways whether we like it or not, so I don't act certain ways just to 
look good. Kind of like celebrities - if you meet one person once and 
they're in a bad mood, a lot of people may think they're not a nice person. 
But I personally would understand that they may just be in a bad mood that 
day, after all, they're human like the rest of us. I don't think my refusal 
to go with her showed anything about blind people and if that's what she got 
out of it, that's on her. I think it just showed that I'm human and I chose 
to make my own decision like any adult should be able to do. And if I 
snapped at her, it showed that I was in a hurry, the weather was crappy, I 
was in a bad mood and I just wanted to get home out of the nasty ice and 
rain that particular day.

Chasity
Check out the tribute page I created for my guide dog Vanda at:
www.myspace.com/vandaandchasity
Listen to my radio show every Thursday from 4-7pm on the Q Online:
www.theqonline.net
Visit my MySpace page and add me at
www.myspace.com/chasityandvanda
Listen to my podcast at:
http://www.gcast.com/u/Chasityvanda/main.xml
Or by phone at: (559) 553-4627
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <lindagwizdak at peoplepc.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2009 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Questions about Federal regs regarding paratransit

> Hi Chasity,
> Don't you think there may have been a better way to deal with the 
> supervisor on the train? Don't you think it would have been better to 
> smile, take the seat and then deal with it later with the train's higher 
> ups? Wouldn't it be less stressful for you to just wait til later and talk 
> to the guy's boss?
>
> To me, this would have made the supervisors want to say, "The hell with 
> those @%&* blind people!"  OK, maybe you wanted to stand, but I can't 
> stand much with my knees and feet. The rememberance of the nasty blind gal 
> would make him less likely to give assistance to a blind person who really 
> did need that kind of help.
>
> Please everyone, please think before you snap at people who are wanting to 
> be helpful.  I know it gets old and it's hard sometimes (grin!).  Just 
> smile and say thank you and then deal with their boss.  I have had people 
> say to me that they were reluctant to give me assistance because of a 
> negative reaction from another blind person.
>
> The supervisor should have respected your wishes to stand on the train - 
> for sure. If you talked to the supervisor's boss, then that education 
> coould happen and they'd learn that not all blind people's needs or wants 
> are alike.
>
> Chasity, pleasse don't take this as me dumping on you - I understand the 
> frustration all too well of over zeolous "helpers" around!  I'm just 
> saying not to get nasty at these people - they're probably doing their job 
> as they've been told by their boss.  (smile!)
> Regards,
>
> Linda and Landon
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Chasity Jackson" <chasityvanda at charter.net>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2009 7:10 AM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Questions about Federal regs regarding paratransit
>
>
>> HI Marion,
>>
>> Actually, when I make a reservation on paratransit, they do always ask 
>> "Will your service animal be with you?" Also, when I call cabs they do 
>> the same thing. So what do you advise we tell them when they ask?
>>
>> As far as transportation and people making choices for you...I had this 
>> happen while traveling with my dog about a month ago. I was standing at a 
>> metrolink station waiting for the train. Chris and I had his luggage, 
>> because he had just returned home from a visit with his family. We only 
>> had to go one or two stops, so since we had the luggage, we wanted to 
>> stand. As we were standing there waiting for the train, there were two 
>> security guards and their supervisor standing behind us. I heard the 
>> supervisor tell the security people, "As soon as the train gets here, go 
>> on and make the person in the front seat move, and put these people 
>> there." I turned around and told her it was not necessary to help and 
>> we've done this before. She said, "Yes, but I'm their supervisor." Just 
>> then, the train came, and we got on board, and stood and held the poll. 
>> One of the security guards started yelling, "Ma'am, over here, over here. 
>> Sit in this seat up front." I calmly said, "I have it under control, 
>> thanks." And then she came over and said, "My supervisor said you have to 
>> sit up front," and I snapped back, "I don't *have* to do anything!" So 
>> finally they got off the train and we had a smooth ride.
>>
>> Chasity
>> Check out the tribute page I created for my guide dog Vanda at:
>> www.myspace.com/vandaandchasity
>> Listen to my radio show every Thursday from 4-7pm on the Q Online:
>> www.theqonline.net
>> Visit my MySpace page and add me at
>> www.myspace.com/chasityandvanda
>> Listen to my podcast at:
>> http://www.gcast.com/u/Chasityvanda/main.xml
>> Or by phone at: (559) 553-4627
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Marion & Martin" <swampfox1833 at verizon.net>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2009 7:22 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Questions about Federal regs regarding paratransit
>>
>>
>>> Dear All,
>>>    the problem that arises when one is asked about whether a service 
>>> animal will be accompanying a person is the potential for 
>>> discrimination. This may not occur with paratransit, however, it could 
>>> happen with private transportation services. For instance, if a taxi 
>>> company flags someone in their system and, when that person calls for a 
>>> ride is asked the same question, it could result in an unequal 
>>> treatment. Should the dispatcher place a call for a pick-up in what is 
>>> known as a "bid" system in which the call is placed and drivers respond 
>>> that they are willing to take the fare, as is true here in Tampa, we 
>>> could wait an inordinate amount of time for a ride. If the dispatcher 
>>> says, "I have a fare with a dog in zone 50." and drivers are not willing 
>>> to take my dog, they will not bid on that fare and I am being 
>>> discriminated against because of my choice to use a guide dog.
>>>    Another instance is with the airlines. If you tell them in advance 
>>> that you will be accompanied by a service animal, any of the personnel 
>>> who have access to your information will see that and make certain 
>>> assumptions "in your best interest"! For instance, they will 
>>> automatically assume you want to sit in the bulkhead (or not), that you 
>>> will want to pre-board, will need certain assistance, etc. Frequently 
>>> airline personnel will insist that you accept such accomodation, whether 
>>> or not you want them and, when you decline them, insist it is "Federal 
>>> regulation", which it is not. In fact, Federal regulations say we have 
>>> the right to refuse any accommodation. HTH!
>>>
>>> Fraternally,
>>> Marion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Margo and Elmo" <margo.downey at verizon.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 9:41 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Questions about Federal regs regarding paratransit
>>>
>>>
>>>> Charlene, I just spoke with a couple of folks in the know about these 
>>>> things.
>>>>
>>>> Generally speaking, they are not doing anything illegal by asking you 
>>>> to mention that your guide dog is accompanying you on each trip.  Now, 
>>>> it was suggested to me that perhaps it might be possible that the 
>>>> paratransit service might be using an outdated software program on 
>>>> their computers. it was further suggested that they look at a software 
>>>> called Trapeze which is extremely accurate--not perfect but accurate. 
>>>> For example, our paratransis sytem which is a very good and reliable 
>>>> system uses Trapeze. On the application I filled out, I checked that I 
>>>> have a guide dog.  that info went into my records on this software and 
>>>> that fact automatically goes into my trip when I make a paratransit 
>>>> reservation. the reason they like to know these things is to ensure 
>>>> comfortable space for the dog. They also know about scooters, 
>>>> wheelchairs, PCA's and such to ensure space on the van.
>>>>
>>>> hope this helps.
>>>>
>>>> margo and Elmo
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Charlene Ota" <caota at hawaii.rr.com>
>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2009 11:27 PM
>>>> Subject: [nagdu] Questions about Federal regs regarding paratransit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Several of us in Hawaii are having a problem with guide dogs on 
>>>>> paratransit.
>>>>> We've all notified the company and validated that the fact that we 
>>>>> have
>>>>> guide dogs is in our records and the reservationists see this at the 
>>>>> time we
>>>>> make reservations.  However, even so, we're having a problem if we 
>>>>> make a
>>>>> reservation when we are picked up we are at times given a hard time 
>>>>> about
>>>>> because we didn't tell the reservationists that we have a service dog. 
>>>>> The
>>>>> other day I was almost put out of a cab from one of the companies that
>>>>> paratransit contracts with. When I pointed out to the reservationists 
>>>>> that
>>>>> it is in my record that I have a guide dog so why do I have to tell 
>>>>> you
>>>>> every time that I take him she kept arguing that it's assumed that if 
>>>>> you
>>>>> don't mention that you're taking the dog then you're not taking the 
>>>>> dog. She
>>>>> compared it to having a PCA. I tried to tell them that it's actually 
>>>>> the
>>>>> norm for me to have my guide dog with me, but this didn't matter to 
>>>>> her.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, my question is, can we be put off of paratransit if we don't
>>>>> specifically mention our dog every time we make a reservation? Is a 
>>>>> service
>>>>> dog or guide dog comparable to a PCA? Personally, I think this is 
>>>>> going too
>>>>> far and it is verging on discrimination.  Also, one final question, 
>>>>> are our
>>>>> HIPA rights violated when our information is discussed over the air of 
>>>>> the
>>>>> radio or cell phone with the drivers?  To me, paratransit is public
>>>>> transportation and I don't feel they have the right to do some of 
>>>>> these
>>>>> things. But, I need the Federal regs to do much about the situation.
>>>>>
>>>>> Any help would be appreciated.
>>>>>
>>>>> Charlene
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
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>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
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>>
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>
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