[nagdu] Guide dog or guard dog?
Linda Gwizdak
linda.gwizdak at cox.net
Sat Jan 16 05:25:31 UTC 2010
In this day and age, I don't think it is unreasonable to have a guide dog
who might give "the evil eye" at someone who may be contemplating something
untoward towards us.
One day back in 1996, I was at a busstop with my German shepherd guide.
These two school-age girls were fighting about something and the fight was
escalating to the point where I was beginning to think about looking for
another busstop to wait at. The whole time, my dog was staring at them with
ears up and alert. All of a sudden, one of the fighters noticed the dog and
said,"Oh we better stop this - we're upsetting that dog!" Then the fight
stopped! (grin!) I was happy about that turn of events and then my bus came
and I boarded it.
Guess the dog was giving them The Look! Also, lots of times people will ask
if my dog bites. I just say either, "You don't want to find that out." or
"He's got teeth, doesn't he?" I had to say that to some unruley kids in
Walmart today when a friend and I walked through the doors.
Lyn and Landon
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, January 15, 2010 6:22 AM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide dog or guard dog?
> You go, Gucci! /grin/ You, too!
>
> Back when I was looking into guide dogs, and around the time I first got
> my
> poodle, I would get into all sorts of trouble commenting on the "German
> Shepherd factor." Human predators, I reasoned, would be less likely to
> chance taking one on -- or its human -- than they would with other breeds.
> A cute little poodle, however, might not be such a deterrent! Although
> I've
> heard tell she has "the look" when she wants to. She just doesn't have
> the
> reputation to back it up. /smile/
>
> Some people were really shocked that I would even mention the protection
> factor of having a nice big dog along when walking around in the big
> world.
> Guides are *not* aggressive! They have been bred from birth and for
> generations to be pacificists. The implication seemed to be that if a
> guide
> dog would even *think* about looking funny at a shady character, then it
> wasn't fit to be a guide dog because that's aggressive!
>
> Ha! I'm with you. If Mitzi wants to look at someone sternly, or if she
> shows some other sign of discomfort when someone approaches us, I pay
> attention! This almost never happens, of course, although when she was
> still just a pup, she did growl once when someone walked into the corner
> store where I was waiting in line. I was shocked, and I reprimanded her
> and
> made sure she knew that was not okay. Several other people in line
> assured
> me that the person who had walked in made them want to growl, too! She's
> never done that again, but she will press against my leg if she has a
> concern. A time or two she has just casually positioned herself slightly
> in
> front of me at an angle, between me and whomever. So I take note and put
> on
> my extra confident 'tude just in case. /smile/
>
> A friend and I were joking around once about the problem of drunks at bus
> stops. She decided that for that little problem, an Irish wolfhound would
> be great to have as a guide. /lol/ One would have to hang the handle
> from
> the under side of the dog, but perhaps the drunks would be less
> persistent?
> /grin/
>
> Tami Smith-Kinney
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Wayne Merritt
> Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2010 7:08 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide dog or guard dog?
>
> It's interesting the number of people recently that have asked me
> questions about my German Shepherd guide and if she would protect me
> if someone tried to hurt me. A couple of weeks ago I went downtown to
> get a replacement bus card at the transit store. You never know what
> kind of characters hang about those places, so I was a little hesitant
> when someone asked me, "Does that dog bite?" Out of habit I almost
> said that she didn't, but then I paused, and said, "Well, maybe. Why?"
> The response came back that she had apparently given a nearby man a
> weird look and he claimed that she growled at him, even showing her
> teeth. I felt no such thing through the leash, but played it safe and
> left room for doubt by saying, "Oh, ok." And I left it at that. The
> man then said, "Well, I wasn't going to hurt her. I'm a nice guy." I
> shrugged and nodded while smiling, but wondered what really happened
> in those few seconds. Sometimes, it's better to let the dog's natural
> tendancies to protect their owner come out rather than question or try
> to explain them away. This was my first real experience of this type
> of thing, but I think I handled it pretty well. People have asked if
> she bites before or if she would protect me, but nothing like this
> situation at the transit store. Interesting.
>
> Wayne, and the ever alert Gucci "designer dog"
>
> On 1/14/10, Tamara Smith-Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net> wrote:
>> Linda and Dan,
>>
>> Because poodles can be very guardy, I've always worked to keep that
> instinct
>> quiet and to redirect it in Mitzi. But one night a couple of months ago,
> I
>> walked out the back door onto the porch in our fenced back yard... And
> she
>> lunged forward, nearly over the corner post, barking in a way I had never
>> heard from her before! She was totally fierce! Then I heard the
> scrambling
>> of footsteps just beneath her head, from the yard beside the porch!
>> Intruders! And, boy, did they hightail it away and over the back fence!
>>
>> I was pretty impressed, really. Although I prefer she doesn't get put
> into
>> a position to do that again. Still! My sweet, sweet angel is one scary
> dog
>> when she wants to be! /smile/
>>
>> I'm just glad Daisy was in bed with her dad at the time. She would have
>> more than scared the punks, and we probably would have had to make some
>> unpleasant choices. Still, we never have to wonder if there's someone at
>> the front door between the 2 of them. /smile/ I did have Mitzi trained
> not
>> to have bark fests over knocks at the door, but we haven't gotten Daisy
>> sorted out yet, so they both go nuts together. Sigh. At least I have no
>> trouble finding Daisy hound to get a grip on her before I open the door.
>> That dog is loud! Also, you still never know if she's going to tear into
>> someone or simply knock them over trying to love on them. /smile/ She's
>> getting better, with the help of neighbors who come to the door and a
>> generous application of training treats!
>>
>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Linda Gwizdak
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2010 10:47 AM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about ownership and retirement
>>
>> Hi Daniel,
>> Sounds like Scout is a field Lab with all his energy. Scout sounds like a
>> dog Seeing Eye would drop from the program! Field Labs are especially
>> bred
>> with hyper energy so they can be used for hunting. Hunters need a high
>> energy dog that can continuously jump into cold water retrieving
>> waterfowl
>> all day long! This trait isn't very good in a guide dog. The schools
> will
>> blend the field Lab with a conformation Lab which is very calm. With the
>> blend, you get a dog that has stamina to work but who can also chill when
>> you need it to.
>>
>> If you retire Scoout and go elsewhere for a new dog, Leader may not allow
>> you to keep Scout. He is young enough to retrain with another person.
> But,
>>
>> if they deem him unsuitable for guide work, they MAY let you keep him as
>> a
>> pet. This can be a problem with a school that has a contract and who
>> retains ownership of the dog.
>>
>> A couple of years ago, a friend of mine died. She had a dog from a
>> California school that was around seven years old at the time of my
> friend's
>>
>> death. Because she didn't have in writing who she wanted her dog to go
> to,
>> the school wouldn't allow us, her friends, to give the dog to someone
>> here
>> in San Diego who my friend had mentioned about retiring her dog to.
> Instead,
>>
>> the school took the dog back and said that the intended person had to
> apply
>> for the dog just like anyone else who wanted to adopt a retired guide or
>> career-change dog. So, I don't know whatever happened to the dog.
>>
>> If I was you, I'd try to find out your school's policy for early
> retirement
>> before doing anything. When you apply to a new school, they will check
> with
>>
>> the old school about you and if there are any problems concerning your
> guide
>>
>> dog use and dog care.
>>
>> That's great that Scout is a good watchdog! Landon would lick an intruder
> to
>>
>> death! LOL! He doesn't bark at the door - something all my dogs from
> Seeing
>>
>> Eye won't do! I think they have their puppy raisers discourage door
> barking
>>
>> from the very beginning. Not a good thing for me as I do have a hearing
>> problem and aren't always aware that someone's at my door - especially if
>> I'm at my computer in my bedroom!
>>
>> Hope all works out for you. BTW, one of my friends here has a Seeing Eye
>> dog named Scout and they work with the Navy!
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Lyn and Landon
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Dan Sweeney" <daniel.sweeney1 at comcast.net>
>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 2:00 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about ownership and retirement
>>
>>
>>> Hello Tracy,
>>> Yes, it is the same Daniel with the wild and crazy Leader Dog, Scout. I
>>> never did return the little shit, much to my surprise. I had a trainer
> out
>>> last January, 09. He admitted to me that I was not ready to leave the
>>> school
>>> with Scout when I did. He told me that he even told my instructor this,
>>> but
>>> it was ignored. But that is all water under the bridge now. He did show
> me
>>
>>> a
>>> few ways to get control of my little ever-ready bunny dog, and it has
>>> helped
>>> quite a bit. The dog is still not the guide dog I imagined, nor I had
>>> observed when I had some bit of sight. He still walks at a turbo pace,
>>> with
>>> his head to the ground most of the time. As long as I have tried to
>>> "steady" him, it has been over a year and a half now, he will only
>>> comply
>>> when he wants to. Other than that he is a great dog. He is a perfect
> guard
>>> dog around the house, and has foiled 2 intruders. He is totally
> protective
>>> of me, and will not leave my side when at home.
>>> He will belong to me in July, and I was considering attending a
>>> different
>>> school, to get a real guide dog - now that I know what to expect from a
>>> guide dog. I thought of keeping Scout as our family dog, which he has
>>> become
>>> such a part of. He is absolutely wild when he is off leash, in the
>>> backyard
>>> he runs laps continually, he never tires. He has more energy than I
>>> could
>>> ever imagine a dog to have. The comments from everyone I know is "THAT
>>> is
>>> a
>>> guide dog, you are kidding!"
>>> So, that is the why the questions on retirement, ownership and the like.
>>> Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks.
>>> Daniel and Scout
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf
>>> Of Tracy Carcione
>>> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 6:31 AM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about ownership and retirement
>>>
>>> Hi Daniel.
>>> Are you the Daniel with the wild Leader dog? How's it going?
>>>
>>> I have kept 2 retired dogs. The first, Amba, had to stop working
> because
>>> she got cancer. She lived only a few months after the diagnosis. I
> could
>>> have waited to get a new dog until she was gone, but I much prefer to
> have
>>> a dog in New York City, and we kept hoping the treatment she got would
>>> work, so I did not wait. It did interfere somewhat with the bonding
>>> process with the new dog, primarily because I was spending a lot of time
>>> and energy caring for my sick dog, and spending time with her while I
>>> could. But after her passing, the bond between me and my new dog got
>>> stronger, and everything was fine. And, even before, we could work
>>> together fine.
>>>
>>> I also kept Echo (who was the new dog I was just talking about). She
>>> retired at age 11, and is still going strong 3 years later. I had no
>>> problem bonding with my newer dog, Ben. My husband took over some of
>>> the
>>> care of Echo, taking her for walks mostly, and she and Ben don't mind
> each
>>> other. They play sometimes, and steal toys from each other, but mostly
>>> they ignore each other. Sometimes Echo still comes to the door when I
>>> pick up the harness, but really she seems happy to take life easy and
>>> let
>>> the young dude do the work.
>>>
>>> I think it really helps to have another person around when one has 2
> dogs.
>>> HTH.
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hello group,
>>>>
>>>> I am back on the list again because I missed all of everyone's helpful
>>>> comments and suggestions in the past. I have a question. What is the
>>>> earliest someone has retired their guide which they received from a
>>>> school?
>>>> Upon retirement, did you keep that dog while returning to either to the
>>>> same
>>>> school or a different school to obtain another guide? And finally, was
>>>> their
>>>> any complications at home due to the fact that the new guide was
>>>> replacing
>>>> the previous guide when it came to developing a solid bond?
>>>>
>>>> Whew! I know it is a lot to ponder, but I figured since the
>>>> conversation
>>>> seemed to be around ownership issues, at least partly, I figured it
> would
>>>> be
>>>> a good time to ask.
>>>>
>>>> Daniel.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nagdu mailing list
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nagdu:
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/daniel.sweeney1%40com
>>> cast.net
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nagdu mailing list
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nagdu:
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n
>> et
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> .net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/wcmerritt%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> My blog:
> http://wayneism.blogspot.com
> My websites:
> www.wayneism.com
> www.whitecaneday.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> .net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.net
More information about the NAGDU
mailing list