[nagdu] Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after being left ontrain in Brussels
Steve Jacobson
steve.jacobson at visi.com
Fri Feb 18 16:53:25 UTC 2011
So you are saying this was an example of being too independent? I don't get it. Do you think you should have been dropped off at the gate and skipped
the burger and beer rather than just checking in advance what your boarding pass said? To me, that would give you the best of both worlds. <smile> I
would be hard pressed to skip a burger even though I'd choose wine over beer.
There is a lot we don't know about the blind man who was left on the train. He may not have had access to alternative training, for one thing. Therefore, I
hesitate to judge him. In general, though, I don't see how we can allow ourselves to be put in a position where we absolutely have to have assistance. I'm
not saying that there are not times when one has to make a judgment as to whether assistance is more efficient. Here is my example of not being
independent enough. Fortunately, it was thirty years ago. I arrived at the airport forty-five minutes before my flight boarded. When I asked for directions at
the check-in counter, I was told that they would get someone with a cart to bring me to the gate. I gently argued that I had plenty of time and would just as
soon walk, but the agent would not relent and would not tell me which gate my flight was using. At that time, I really hated flying, and it made me extremely
nervous. After asking him again, I decided to not push the issue. I waited and waited for a cart, checking back every five or ten minutes and was assured
one was on the way but they were very busy. They were impatient with me checking, even though the cart was their idea. Finally a cart came right at the
time boarding was starting. I was rushed to the gate in the cart and people were asked to move out of the way because this blind man, meaning me, was
late for my flight. There was no explanation that I had been there well in advance or anything. I should have asked for the guy's supervisor, and he
probably would have given me directions rather than making me wait for a cart, and he wouldn't have wanted to involve his supervisor. It would have been
so simple, but I chose not to do that.
I think it is very important that we think about how we can remain in control of our own destinies, even if we need assistance sometimes. . That is what I
think we can take away from an article like this even without passing judgment.
Best regards,
Steve Jacobson
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 08:17:28 -0800, GARY STEEVES wrote:
>Hi Lisa:
>I agree with you that taking assistance doesn't mean you are not independent. On the contrary, for me it means that you are very confident and know
when you need assistance and how to get it. i often use assistance in airports or train stations. It usually helps me get to the gate on time and rlaxed. an
example of being too indepedent once was when I was still using my cane. I got the gal in the cart to drop me off at the pub diagnally across from my gate. I
thought I'd have a beer or two and a burger while I waited for my flight. I almost missed my flight because I hadn't noticed that announcements weren't
pumped into the pub. I had to ask a gal down the bar from me what time my boarding pass said boarding was. it was ten minutes ago she said. i sprung up
and headed across the hallway. "Hello Mr. steeves, we were looking for ou." :)
>with bogart, there is no chance that we will calmly sit on the plane while everyone gets off. Bogart is off as soon as he can. We get to the exit ofr the gate
and many nice things have happened. on my last trip I had my folks meeting me so once i learned that it was a straight line we just headed off rather than
wait for asistance. another time, on bogart's first trip, a nice woman asked if I needed help. i said that someone from the airline would be there soon. she
offered to have me follow her to baggage claims and then she helped me find my bags. The only thing that keeps me waiting is just getting my suitcases. I
still need a pair of eyes. Hard to get enough time with the luggage and the luggage delivery system to train bogart to identify my bags. :)
>Certainly have noticed that in settings like airports bogart and I get around much faster than I did with my cane. something to do with how much bogart
doesn't like airports. :)
>Gary
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Lisa belville <missktlab1217 at frontier.com>
>Date: Friday, February 18, 2011 6:43 am
>Subject: Re: [nagdu] Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after being left ontrain in Brussels
>To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Well, it's easy for all of us to judge and be the proverbial
>> Monday Morning quarterback with situations like this. The
>> info given is only as accurate as the reporter's research.
>>
>> I do wonder, though, why he chose to leave his dog at
>> home. Taking the dog and then having a cabby refuse to
>> transport would have been a perfect example of the
>> discrimination he was afraid of.
>>
>> Also, did this person not at least flag down another passenger
>> or a conductor and request help? I doubt if it was a
>> language barrier, and this would have been the easiest way to
>> obtain the help.
>>
>> Just sitting waiting on a train while it's being emptied out is
>> not a place I'd want to be, especially if I needed to be
>> someplace on time.
>>
>> It's one reason why I hate asking for help when flying; they
>> expect me to wait until someone has come to the gate, and to the
>> flight attendants, this means I need to sit in my seat like a
>> good little girl rather than exiting the plane with everyone
>> else. I almost missed a connection once due to this
>> attitude, so I just grab my carry-on stuff and head out with
>> everyone else.
>>
>> But, the person in this article didn't have their dog or a cane,
>> they didn't have as much autonomy.
>>
>> And before anyone says I should navigate airports alone. . . I
>> only fly once every three years or so. I don't do it often
>> enough to be good at it, so I don't learn the layouts of
>> airports and I'd prefer to get assistance when possible so I can
>> get where I need to be on time..
>>
>> IF THE HOUSEWORK IS DONE - THEN THE COMPUTER IS Broken!
>> Lisa Belville
>> missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ginger Kutsch"
>> <gingerKutsch at yahoo.com>To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National
>> Association of Guide Dog Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, February 18, 2011 5:35 AM
>> Subject: [nagdu] Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after
>> being left ontrain in Brussels
>>
>>
>> >Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after being left on train
>> >in Brussels
>> >
>> >LEFT ALONE: Tom Pey, pictured here with his guide dogBy emma
>> >curry reporters at sevenoaks-chronicle.co.uk
>> >http://www.thisiskent.co.uk/news/Blind-man-train-ordeal/article-3
>> >231003-detail/article.html
>> >
>> >A BLIND man is threatening to sue Eurostar after he was abandoned
>> >on a train in Brussels.
>> >
>> >Dr Tom Pey, chief executive of the Royal London Society for the
>> >Blind (RSLB) and Dorton House in Seal, has accused the travel
>> >firm of disability discrimination.
>> >
>> >He was travelling to the European Parliament to press for
>> >improved rights for guide dog owners at a meeting of the European
>> >Guide Dog Federation, of which he is president, on Wednesday,
>> >February 2.
>> >
>> >He had left his guide dog in Seal, worried that Belgian taxi
>> >drivers may not want to take him, and was taken to the station by
>> >his secretary Alison Nield.
>> >
>> >Unable to get through the barriers, she asked a Eurostar employee
>> >to help Dr Pey on to the train and the train conductor to guide
>> >Mr Pey off the train in Brussels.
>> >
>> >But when they arrived, Mr Pey was left alone. He waited for half
>> >an hour before struggling out of the station himself.
>> >
>> >Dr Pey said: "It's really difficult to make your way around in a
>> >foreign country at the best of times, quite apart from being
>> >visually impaired.
>> >
>> >"I was also at a real loss without my guide dog.
>> >
>> >"I eventually managed to stumble off the train and remembered
>> >that the taxi rank was near a pizza restaurant. Only problem is
>> >there are two pizza eateries at Brussels station. It was most
>> >distressing."
>> >
>> >Ms Nield said: "I usually travel with him. Tom's quite brilliant
>> >but this situation was unacceptable.
>> >
>> >"It was luck rather than judgement that got him off that train.
>> >
>> >"At this end, Eurostar knew perfectly well he needed assistance.
>> >It's ridiculous."
>> >
>> >Tim Arnold, communications manager of the RLSB, said: "Eurostar
>> >are re-defining the word 'shameful'. They have a clear
>> >responsibility under the Equalities Act to make a reasonable
>> >adjustment for disabled people.
>> >
>> >"Tom's lawyers say he has a good case for disability
>> >discrimination."
>> >
>> >A Eurostar spokesman said: "This was obviously a distressing
>> >experience for Dr Pey and we have called him to apologise
>> >unreservedly.
>> >
>> >"Situations like these are thankfully rare, but are taken
>> >extremely seriously and therefore, together with our SNCB
>> >colleagues at Brussels Midi, we are investigating why this
>> >happened as a matter of urgency."
>> >
>> >_______________________________________________
>> >nagdu mailing list
>> >nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for nagdu:
>> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/missktlab1217%40frontier.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Lisa belville <missktlab1217 at frontier.com>
>Date: Friday, February 18, 2011 6:43 am
>Subject: Re: [nagdu] Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after being left ontrain in Brussels
>To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Well, it's easy for all of us to judge and be the proverbial
>> Monday Morning quarterback with situations like this. The
>> info given is only as accurate as the reporter's research.
>>
>> I do wonder, though, why he chose to leave his dog at
>> home. Taking the dog and then having a cabby refuse to
>> transport would have been a perfect example of the
>> discrimination he was afraid of.
>>
>> Also, did this person not at least flag down another passenger
>> or a conductor and request help? I doubt if it was a
>> language barrier, and this would have been the easiest way to
>> obtain the help.
>>
>> Just sitting waiting on a train while it's being emptied out is
>> not a place I'd want to be, especially if I needed to be
>> someplace on time.
>>
>> It's one reason why I hate asking for help when flying; they
>> expect me to wait until someone has come to the gate, and to the
>> flight attendants, this means I need to sit in my seat like a
>> good little girl rather than exiting the plane with everyone
>> else. I almost missed a connection once due to this
>> attitude, so I just grab my carry-on stuff and head out with
>> everyone else.
>>
>> But, the person in this article didn't have their dog or a cane,
>> they didn't have as much autonomy.
>>
>> And before anyone says I should navigate airports alone. . . I
>> only fly once every three years or so. I don't do it often
>> enough to be good at it, so I don't learn the layouts of
>> airports and I'd prefer to get assistance when possible so I can
>> get where I need to be on time..
>>
>> IF THE HOUSEWORK IS DONE - THEN THE COMPUTER IS Broken!
>> Lisa Belville
>> missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ginger Kutsch"
>> <gingerKutsch at yahoo.com>To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National
>> Association of Guide Dog Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, February 18, 2011 5:35 AM
>> Subject: [nagdu] Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after
>> being left ontrain in Brussels
>>
>>
>> >Blind man Dr Tom Pey may sue Eurostar after being left on train
>> >in Brussels
>> >
>> >LEFT ALONE: Tom Pey, pictured here with his guide dogBy emma
>> >curry reporters at sevenoaks-chronicle.co.uk
>> >http://www.thisiskent.co.uk/news/Blind-man-train-ordeal/article-3
>> >231003-detail/article.html
>> >
>> >A BLIND man is threatening to sue Eurostar after he was abandoned
>> >on a train in Brussels.
>> >
>> >Dr Tom Pey, chief executive of the Royal London Society for the
>> >Blind (RSLB) and Dorton House in Seal, has accused the travel
>> >firm of disability discrimination.
>> >
>> >He was travelling to the European Parliament to press for
>> >improved rights for guide dog owners at a meeting of the European
>> >Guide Dog Federation, of which he is president, on Wednesday,
>> >February 2.
>> >
>> >He had left his guide dog in Seal, worried that Belgian taxi
>> >drivers may not want to take him, and was taken to the station by
>> >his secretary Alison Nield.
>> >
>> >Unable to get through the barriers, she asked a Eurostar employee
>> >to help Dr Pey on to the train and the train conductor to guide
>> >Mr Pey off the train in Brussels.
>> >
>> >But when they arrived, Mr Pey was left alone. He waited for half
>> >an hour before struggling out of the station himself.
>> >
>> >Dr Pey said: "It's really difficult to make your way around in a
>> >foreign country at the best of times, quite apart from being
>> >visually impaired.
>> >
>> >"I was also at a real loss without my guide dog.
>> >
>> >"I eventually managed to stumble off the train and remembered
>> >that the taxi rank was near a pizza restaurant. Only problem is
>> >there are two pizza eateries at Brussels station. It was most
>> >distressing."
>> >
>> >Ms Nield said: "I usually travel with him. Tom's quite brilliant
>> >but this situation was unacceptable.
>> >
>> >"It was luck rather than judgement that got him off that train.
>> >
>> >"At this end, Eurostar knew perfectly well he needed assistance.
>> >It's ridiculous."
>> >
>> >Tim Arnold, communications manager of the RLSB, said: "Eurostar
>> >are re-defining the word 'shameful'. They have a clear
>> >responsibility under the Equalities Act to make a reasonable
>> >adjustment for disabled people.
>> >
>> >"Tom's lawyers say he has a good case for disability
>> >discrimination."
>> >
>> >A Eurostar spokesman said: "This was obviously a distressing
>> >experience for Dr Pey and we have called him to apologise
>> >unreservedly.
>> >
>> >"Situations like these are thankfully rare, but are taken
>> >extremely seriously and therefore, together with our SNCB
>> >colleagues at Brussels Midi, we are investigating why this
>> >happened as a matter of urgency."
>> >
>> >_______________________________________________
>> >nagdu mailing list
>> >nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for nagdu:
>> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/missktlab1217%40frontier.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for nagdu:
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>>
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