[nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?

Sun May 1 03:00:58 UTC 2011

Sherri,

I read it as you did.  /smile/  Somehow,though, far too many people read the
same article or articles on the same thing and decide the problem is ...
you guessed it!  Owner-trainers!  And they are not shy about telling any
owner-trainer they happen to come across *exactly* how big a problem they
are!  And their little dogs, too!

Which is really the point at which my brain implodes into a smoking heap of
hot rubble then bursts into flames.  Say whatever you want to me...  But
don't even think of starting in on my dog!

There are many hazards and dangers involved in owner-training a guide dog,
but the one you will never be able to avoid is people like that.  It just
never gets old.  /smile/

Tami Smith-Kinney

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Sherri
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 5:28 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?

I am pretty sure he was referring to people who pass themselves and their 
pets off as "owner/handlers" of "trained service dogs".
I am sure he is not talking about blind people who have privately trained 
their guide dogs.

You haven't visited my personal page at
http://www.raceforindependence.org/goto/Sherri.Brun
Thank you for changing what it means to be blind.
Sherri Brun
flmom2006 at gmail.com
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2011 5:10 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?

> Sheila,
>
> Makes sense, and you do have it right.  Owner-trainers, as we prefer to be
> called, are absolutely thrilled about this attitude and how many times we
> have it expressed to us by people who strongly feel we need to better
> informed about what a problem we are for everyone else.  Such public
> services as they are performing must be conducted in the most offensive 
> way
> possible, it seems and the service provider must by all means insure we
> understand that they know what they're talking about while we are 
> obviously
> much to stupid to have considered any of it ourselves.  /smile/
>
> Then, of course, there are those folks who ask questions and share
> experiences and tell what they know about the service dog industry in an
> interesting conversational fashion, so they more than make up for the 
> public
> servants.  /smile/
>
> Over the course of that past few years, I have learned more than I really
> want to know about the many layers of fraud and abuse out there.  The more

> I
> think about it and the more I turn things around in my head, the more I
> become convinced that more laws are not the solution.  More law 
> enforcement
> and stricter penalties and swifter justice would go much much further than
> putting more words on paper for people to ignore and exploit.  Not that I
> have an opinion or anything.  /grin/
>
>
>
> Tami Smith-Kinney
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Sheila Leigland
> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 10:44 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>
> Julie I read that and wondered about that myself. I've never self trained 
> a
> dog before and don't know much about what is involved but wonder about the
> atitudes of schools about this. Am I right that there are no requirements
> for certification so I suppose they question the right to self train is 
> that
> right? If I'm not making sense let me know and I'll try to clarify this.
> Thanks.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Julie J <julielj at neb.rr.com>
> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 7:06 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>
> Are the folks who are claiming that they have a disability and then 
> passing
> their pet off as a service dog putting themselves in danger?
>
> I took the statement to mean that any dog not trained by a professional
> trainer and certified (whatever that means) are dangerous either because
> they are aggressive or not responsive to the needs of the disabled 
> handler.
>
> Julie
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Steven Johnson" <blinddog3 at charter.net>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>
>
>>I believe it was referring to the actual handlers, but if we read it
>> closely, it is a comment that can be left up to interpretation.  I for
>> instance, read it as if we as *legal and authentic* service dog handlers
>> abide by what the ADA states, this could be severely jeopardized by those
>> who falsely and maliciously pass their pet as a *self-proclaimed service
>> dog*.
>> Please remember, this is just my interpretation.
>>
>> I know Ron, and I can bet you a dollar to a donut that he was not
>> referring
>> to the ability of a blind handler.
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of B Avila Guerrero
>> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 7:56 PM
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>>
>> Julie, was he talking about the people who are passing their dogs off as
>> Service Dogs?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of Julie J
>> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 5:23 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>>
>> *"We're really getting to an area that's not only dangerous for
>> the general public, but it's dangerous for the people making use
>> of those dogs," he said.*
>>
>> Ummm, so blind/disabled people are too stupid to figure out when the dog
>> they are working with isn't safe?
>>
>> Interesting
>> Julie
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Ginger Kutsch" <gingerKutsch at yahoo.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 8:37 AM
>> Subject: [nagdu] What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>>
>>
>>> What's Putting These Dogs In Danger?
>>> Wednesday, April 27, 2011
>>>
>>>
>>> DETROIT -- Service dogs spend their lives helping humans, but now
>>> more and more humans are pulling a scam online that is putting
>>> these dogs in danger.
>>>
>>> Decades have been spent fighting for service dogs to be allowed
>>> in restaurants, businesses and airplanes. Now, some say that hard
>>> work is in jeopardy.
>>>
>>> Watch video: What's Putting These Dogs In Danger
>>> http://www.clickondetroit.com/video/27697008/index.html
>>>
>>> Rod Haneline is the chief program and service officer at Leader
>>> Dogs for the Blind in Rochester Hills. He said there's a new scam
>>> popping up where people are are buying service dog ID badges and
>>> harnesses for their own household pets, instead of for a trained
>>> and certified dog.
>>>
>>> "We're really getting to an area that's not only dangerous for
>>> the general public, but it's dangerous for the people making use
>>> of those dogs," he said.
>>>
>>> Leader Dogs for the Blind has been in business since 1939, and
>>> has been providing trained dogs, free of charge, to those who
>>> utilize them.
>>>
>>> The dogs must complete a 16- to 18- week course. Haneline said
>>> about 40 percent of dogs pass the necessary requirements to
>>> become service dogs.
>>>
>>> He said the dogs handlers are trained just as rigorous.
>>>
>>> "That instructor serves a three-year apprenticeship. And, once
>>> again, they have to meet all IGDF standards throughout that
>>> apprenticeship," Haneline said.
>>>
>>> Richard Michael is a class coordinator for the company.
>>>
>>> "If we allow every dog access, or every animal access, then you
>>> will never see a service dog in an aircraft or restaurant," he
>>> said.
>>>
>>> With hundreds of hours spent on each dog's training, Michael said
>>> it's just not right for someone to be able to pay money and
>>> receive a badge saying their pet is certified.
>>>
>>> "The pet is there and we can all enjoy companionship, the service
>>> dog has a specific role to play," he said.
>>>
>>> He warned that the dogs with the fake badges could be dangerous
>>> and act out in a public setting. He said all it takes is once
>>> incident involving an unruly animal to tarnish the work of real
>>> service dogs.
>>>
>>> Under the law, a business does have the right to ensure that the
>>> dog being brought into the establishment is clean and under
>>> control. They cannot ask what the disability is but can ask what
>>> assistance the dog is providing.
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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