[nagdu] Feedeing lunch WAS relieving at airports was Denver airport
Nicole Torcolini
ntorcolini at wavecable.com
Thu Jun 12 00:28:21 UTC 2014
Raven,
Even though I haven't dealt with scavenging, that is pretty much
what I thought as far as it being a behavior rather than a need.
I don't necessarily agree with not feeding lunch. I don't remember
the exact process that I used to determine that Lexia needed lunch and when
to feed it and what, but I do remember that it involved several messy and
unpleasant incidents. I don't think that increasing the size of her
breakfast would necessarily fix the problem as her stomach would still be
empty long enough before dinner to cause her to vomit.
Nicole and Lexia
-----Original Message-----
From: Raven Tolliver [mailto:ravend729 at gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2014 11:37 PM
To: Nicole Torcolini; NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide
Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Feedeing lunch WAS relieving at airports was Denver
airport
Daryl,
Scavenging is like jumping up on people: it's an inappropriate behavior that
a dog has learned is rewarding. It is not out of a need for more food or
nutrients unless your dog is scavenging in an herb garden or something like
that. Dogs are more likely to perform those behaviors that yield rewards, so
until the undesirable behavior no longer yields rewards, or an alternative
behavior yields a higher value reward than the undesirable behavior, it will
still rear its ugly head.
On the subject of meals, feeding lunch is not necessary. If you find your
dog has higher caloric requirements due to energy level, simply increase one
meal or both appropriately, or feed food that is nutrient-dense.
he only time I would advise someone to feed three separate meals is if they
are switching from ki**le to food, or supplementing ki**le with food. Food
digests at a different rate than ki**le, so it's important to feed the two
separately.
On 6/10/14, Nicole Torcolini via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> I don't know if it would help with scrounging as that is not the
> reason for Lexia getting three meals a day. Breakfast and dinner are
> about 1.5 times the size of lunch, and lunch is a different food with
> more fiber. Lexia seems to need a certain amount of fiber to keep
> things working right. Also, Lexia is one of those dogs who will vomit
> bile (not pretty) if she does not have anything in her stomach. In
> addition, she also gets occasional snacks consisting of either a
> greenie (which she absolutely loves) or a few of the Science Diet
> biscuits. Out of curiosity, what food do you feed and how much?
> Does your dog seem extra hungry when you feed her? She's a lab, right?
> Some dogs just love to eat, even if they are not particularly hungry,
> but, then again, maybe she is not getting enough food, especially if
> she has a lot of energy and has a high level of activity
>
> Lexia is my first guide dog, so I don't really have anything with
> which to compare her, but, from what I have heard, it seems that the
> scrounging problem is just a personality/habit thing that may not
> really have any particular cause. Lexia does not do that much
> sniffing/looking for food, so I haven't really had to deal with it.
> Occasionally, she might try to grab something off of the floor in a
> restaurant or on the plane, but it's usually to late to do anything
> about it by the time I figure out what has happened.
> She knows to just dive after food that is out in the open. I've
> spilled a few pieces of dog food without knowing it until someone told
> me later, and she did not go after it.
>
> Nicole and Lexia who eats lunch
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Daryl Marie
> via nagdu
> Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2014 7:52 PM
> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [nagdu] Feedeing lunch WAS relieving at airports was Denver
> airport
>
> Nicole,
> You mention feeding lunch... Do you feed your dog more than 1-2 times
> a day?
> i.e. breakfast, lunch dinner? Curious... wondering if this might help
> with the general scrounging problem...?
>
> Daryl
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Nicole Torcolini via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> To: 'Gary Steeves' <rainshadowmusic at shaw.ca>, 'NAGDU Mailing List, the
> National Association of Guide Dog Users' <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tue, 10 Jun 2014 20:36:44 -0600 (MDT)
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] relieving at airports was Denver airport
>
> Lexia is also a grass reliever. Once, I took her to the indoor
> relieving room at the Seatac Airport, but, she, too, would have
> nothing to do with it.
> If I remember correctly, the outdoor area at the Mineta San José
> International-Silicon Valley Airport is fake grass, but it was not
> really an issue as it smelled enough from other dogs having done their
> business.
> The flight that I take the most is from San Jose to Seatac, which is
> not that long. I get up early enough for Lexia to have two
> opportunities to relieve before departing for the airport, and I don't
> let her drink immediately after the second time. I sometimes move her
> lunch a little later, depending on the time of the flight. Just before
> getting on the airplane, when I am doing my business for the last
> time, I give Lexia a
> *tiny* bit of water. As soon as I land in Seatac, I take her out, and
> she usually does everything, but that is more from the excitement of
> seeing my parents than from having to hold it. As a side note, one way
> to help avoid accidents is to know what can make your dog need to go more.
>
> Nicole and Lexia the frequent flyer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Gary
> Steeves via nagdu
> Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2014 12:39 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] relieving at airports was Denver airport
>
> Hi All:
>
> Bogart and I fly qutie often and I agree with everything Michael was
> saying.
> With bogart i stop food 12 hours before flying and water about 6 hours
> if the flight is over 3 hours. Even on my flight to London England he
> didn't seem to have any problems. Once I got him outside and he went
> pee I made sure he got some water. If I can I try to get him a run in
> before heading on long trips. This can be managed at my end but
> usually doesn't work out in the place I'm visiting. I know that
> Bogart often goes 12 hours without going out over night so I don't
> worry about flights. We took a look at the relieving room in the San
> Diego airport and bogart was having nothing to do with any of that.
> Bogart is a grass reliever so you can imagine the issues we had
> walking around down town London where ther just isn't much grass.
> He
> finally dragged me to a tree coming out of a grate and let loose a
> great deal of liquid. I do worry about him when we travel,
> especially when there are delays but it is more my anxiety than his
> discomfort.
>
> Cheers
> Gary
>
> PS: don't know why the previous message sent before it was done being
> typed.
> Not so smart phones. :)
>
> On May 28, 2014 7:19:02 PM PDT, Michael Hingson via nagdu
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>>Hi Kristen and all,
>>
>>Go in a regular bathroom? It does sounds as if someone in Denver
>>needs some educating.
>>
>>It is not the responsibility of anyone else to take your dog outside
>>to relieve. One possible option would be to take you outside inside
>>the security area, but there may or may not be people to do this, and
>>the kind of area on which your dog is use to relieving may not be
>>available.
>>
>>I think it is appropriate to make one additional observation. In my
>>experience most guide dog schools discuss preparing to take a dog on a
>>trip.
>>We discuss with instructors how to cut down on water before traveling.
>>We
>>are also told that it might be wise to not give our dogs a meal before
>>traveling if the dog is prone to needing to relieve. All this is to
>>say that with proper preparation a healthy dog should be able to go
>>six to eight hours without relieving.
>>
>>We can make life more stressful by assuming that our dogs need to go
>>out at every stop. By doing this the dogs come to expect the trip out
>>and we get upset when we can't take our dogs outside to relieve. I
>>have taken several guide dogs on long trips without any need to
>>relieve, but I worked to train the dogs to expect this and I helped by
>>insuring that their bladders and other parts were as empty as possible
>>before leaving home or by taking advantage of a relieving area at the
>>airport before going through Security.
>>
>>As one instructor put it to me once, "keep in mind that your dogs
>>sleep through the night and so they can go long periods of time
>>without relieving if you set the stage". Let me be clear. Some dogs
>>may have health issues and do need to relieve more often. However,
>>the average dog can go for fairly long to very long times without the
>>need to relieve. I have taken dogs to New Zealand, Korea, Japan and
>>the Netherlands without any stop to relieve. I travel across the
>>United States several times a month and never look for a relief area
>>during a lay-over except to know where they are if available in case
>>of a future emergency.
>>
>>You must do your part and you must instill confidence in the dog and
>>yourself, but it can be done. I hope my thoughts help.
>>
>>
>>Best,
>>
>>
>>Michael Hingson
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kristen via
>>nagdu
>>Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 02:12 PM
>>To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>Subject: Re: [nagdu] Denver airport
>>
>>I did have an issue with that airport about a month ago. We had a
>>layover there, and they told us that we wouldn't be able to get past
>>security after taking Corvette outside (they had no inside
>>area) and have time to make our flight. They also didn't offer to take
>>him out for me and said that he should hold it or be able to go in a
>>regular bathroom. (He did end up holding it for about 6 hours that
>>day.) Maybe you'll have better luck!
>>--
>>Kristen
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: sheila via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>><nagdu at nfbnet.org Date sent: Wed, 28 May 2014 14:34:36 -0600
>>Subject: Re: [nagdu] Denver airport
>>
>>okay that is good. I won't borrow trouble. I've never had trouble in
>>other airports so I'll assume that I won't and just handle things if
>>they come up.
>>On 5/28/2014 2:06 PM, Sherry Gomes via nagdu wrote:
>>I just flew in and out of Denver when I went to and returned from GDB.
>>I
>>was never put in any separate sort of room. I had some trouble with
>>ground assistance on the return but that was only with one person.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of sheila via
>>nagdu
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 1:45 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: [nagdu] denver airport
>>
>> denver airport has anyone had any
>>trouble when
>>flying out of the denver airport as far as being put is a separate
>>room instead of near or at the departing gate?
>>
>>
>>--
>>
>>sheila leigland
>>
>>
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>>aw.ca
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
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--
Raven
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