[nfb-talk] nfb-talk] Proposal and predictions

[Alex]

On 3/1/09, nfb-talk-request at nfbnet.org <nfb-talk-request at nfbnet.org> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Braille Books Needed! (Carrie Gilmer)
>    2. Re: Proposal to Decrease Unemployment Among the   Blind
>       (David Andrews)
>    3. Re: Proposal and predictions (RyanO)
>    4. Deadline Coming for Writing Contest! (Robert Newman)
>    5. Re: The Kindle Swindle (John G. Heim)
>    6. Re: Proposal and predictions (John G. Heim)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 19:26:00 -0600
> From: "Carrie Gilmer" <carrie.gilmer at gmail.com> (by way of David
> 	Andrews	<dandrews at visi.com>)
> Subject: [nfb-talk] Braille Books Needed!
> To: david.andrews at nfbnet.org
> Message-ID: <auto-000090908402 at mailfront2.g2host.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> Greetings All,
>
> Everyone knows by now we are celebrating as never before: The year of
> Braille! At convention we will have our annual Braille Book Flea
> Market. No where else can blind kids go into a "store" and browse for
> books to their hearts delight, and get them shipped home to their
> front doors. The room is electric with their excitement every year. I
> am asking all members and friends to please help make book choices
> available like never before.
>
> Donate a new book to the flea market! You can buy a book from
> National Braille Press.org or Seedlings.org and send it to the
> address Peggy Chong will post in the near future. Or maybe you have
> an embosser and want to make a book, we'll take that too!
>
> Last year we had a dire need for good books for teenagers, 13-18.
> Girls wanted Love Stories and Mysteries, Guys wanted Sci Fi and
> action adventure. Don't forget the Classics like the Count of Monte
> Cristo or The Three Musketeers or new hot ones like the Twilight
> series. Nothing replaces a good ol' hard copy to curl up with and for
> building reading speed. We had books for teenagers but many were very
> old or the titles were more like textbook topics than leisure
> reading. Not to say they were not appreciated, but I think you know
> what I mean.
>
> We will take books for any age. The touch and feel early board books
> can be easily adapted by adding sticky Braille by many members. Have
> it be a chapter project!
>
> Help us make this the Best Flea Market ever by giving every kid a
> great choice of new and gently used books to choose from!
>
> Flea Market book questions should be directed to Peggy Chong at:
> <mailto:peggychong at eathlink.net>peggychong at earthlink.net.
>
> Thank you One and All!
>
> Reading is Fundamental and Braille Readers Are Indeed Leaders!
>
> Carrie Gilmer, President
> National Organization of Parents of Blind Children
> A Division of the National Federation of the Blind
> NFB National Center: 410-659-9314
> Home Phone: 763-784-8590
> <mailto:carrie.gilmer at gmail.com>carrie.gilmer at gmail.com
> www.nfb.org/nopbc
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 19:41:11 -0600
> From: David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com>
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Proposal to Decrease Unemployment Among the
> 	Blind
> To: NFB Talk Mailing List <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Message-ID: <auto-000087689584 at mailfront1.g2host.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> John:  You are right -- there just isn't one answer to the
> unemployment problem.  It will take lots of things done by lots of
> people and organizations.  There isn't a magic answer.
>
>
>
>
> And ... a prediction by me -- I think one of the main barriers is the
> negative attitudes of sighted persons.  It is my prediction that
> many, if not most of future blind persons will have useful artificial
> vision before we overcome those barriers to a sizable degree.  The
> only way seems to be one person at a time, and some people are
> predisposed to be influenced while others aren't.  I think usable
> artificial vision is many years away, not in my life time, but still
> closer then overcoming attitudinal barriers.
>
> Dave
>
> At 02:11 PM 2/28/2009, you wrote:
>>In my opinion, it's not really relevant that Eddy's idea won't solve
>>all of the problems faced by blind people. Nothing is going to do
>>that. People keeps saying "The real problm is this or that". Yeah,
>>maybe. But so what? The only true way to judge Eddy's idea is on
>>whether it will help and if it's worth the money and effort.
>>
>>I also think it's irrelevant that purchasing adaptive equipment
>>should be the responsibility of DVR agencies. Yeah, maybe. But we're
>>still looking at a 70% unemployment rate. Again, the only thing I'd
>>consider important about this aspect is if it could be shown that
>>DVR agencies will be less likely to do their part if the NFB does it for
>> them.
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 19:50:13 -0700
> From: "RyanO" <ryano218 at comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Proposal and predictions
> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Message-ID: <598DD8760D0A493988B7E52A9F9C5C32 at osentows7ff6f7>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> 	reply-type=response
>
> David, I fully agree with you on your prediction about synthetic vision.
> I've said before that society will come up with a "cure for blindness" long
> before it joins us in our belief that it is respectable to be blind. I heard
> a radio commercial the other day with a cheesy rendition of, "What a
> Wonderful World," in the background. The announcer asked parents to imagine
> how terrible it would be to raise a child without sight. The fact that a
> commercial like this can be aired in the mainstream today in a
> hypersensitive culture of political correctness speaks volumes.
>
> Of course, world events may take us down a much darker path than the one
> that leads to artificial vision. I firmly believe that circumstances could
> lead us to a point when it would be a common societal practice to abort
> embryos that are deemed "defective" by doctors. We may even hit a point
> where our countries cannot economically sustain programs for the disabled.
> Some have accused me of holding an extreme view on this futuristic vision,
> but I sincerely believe that it is possible. War and economic collapse often
> drive people into extreme behavior.
>
>
>
> RyanO
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 10:20:26 -0600
> From: "Robert Newman" <newmanrl at cox.net> (by way of David Andrews
> 	<dandrews at visi.com>)
> Subject: [nfb-talk] Deadline Coming for Writing Contest!
> To: david.andrews at nfbnet.org
> Message-ID: <auto-000087708740 at mailfront1.g2host.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> This is a notice for all you writers. I've asked that this message be
> placed in everyone's inbox, because writers can be found everywhere.
>
> Respectfully yours, Robert Leslie Newman, NFB Writers' Division
> President  (See you in Braille)
>
> NFB Writers' Division Writing contests For Both Youth And Adults
>
> The Division wants to give you a heads-up. For all you writers, youth
> or adult, beware there is less than a month left before the deadline
> to submissions of poetry and/or fiction short stories for our annual
> writing contests. The opening date has come and gone, but  the
> closing date (Post Marked) of April 1st is coming soon.  See all
> requirements below:
>
> Youth Writing Contest
>
> The NFB Writers' Division is hosting a Youth Writing Contest to
> promote Braille literacy and excellence in creative writing. Entries
> will be judged on creativity and quality of Braille. We are looking
> for creative writing, in the form of fiction and poetry. There is no
> charge for entering.
>
> This is a contest for students who use Braille. Entries must Be
> submitted in hand embossed Braille, either on a slate and stylus or
> on a Braille writer. No computer Braille entries will be considered.
> Submissions must be Brailled by the entrant. Elementary students
> (K-5) may submit contracted Braille, uncontracted Braille, or an
> acceptable combination of the two. Students in higher grades will be
> expected to submit stories or poetry in contracted Braille.
>
> There are six categories, as follows: Elementary Fiction; Elementary
> Poetry; Middle School Fiction; Middle School Poetry; High School
> Fiction; High School Poetry. Elementary is K-5. Middle School is 6-8.
> High School is 9-12.
>
> The contest began back on January first, and will end postmarked date
> April first. There will be three cash prizes for each of the six
> categories. First prize per contest is $25. Second prize is $15 and
> third prize is $5. Submissions for fiction may not exceed one
> thousand words. Poetry may not exceed twenty lines. Authors may
> submit multiple entries and all work must be original and unpublished.
>
> Each entrant must provide an identical print copy for possible publication.
>
> Entries must be accompanied by a cover sheet containing entrant's
> information: Name, address, phone, email, title of the entry, school
> and grade of entrant. Winners will be announced at our division
> meeting during the July 2009 NFB National convention held in Detroit,
> Michigan.
>
> Send to Fred Wurtzel, 1212 N Foster, Lansing Michigan, 48912.
>
> Adult Writing Contest
>
> The NFB Writers' Division's writing contest for short fiction and
> poetry for adults has also been open since January 1st, and will also
> be closing Post Marked April 1st.    Prizes for adults are higher
> then for youth - Top prize for each contest is $100, second $50, and
> third $25. Winners of this contest will also be announced at our
> division meeting in Detroit.
>
> Fiction: short stories can be up to 3,000 words and can be of any
> genre. All work must be original and previously unpublished. If you
> wish to submit- You are required to send a cover sheet with title of
> all entries, name, address, phone and email (if available). A second
> requirement , is please have your documents double spaced and if you
> are sending it hardcopy, it cannot be handwritten. The cost for
> submission of a single story is $5.00. You can send either a check or
> money order made out to the NFB Writers' Division.
>
> You have two choices for submission: First is the traditional method
> of sending hardcopy and check, and if you do so, send it to Tom
> Stevens address- 1203 S. Fairview Road, Columbia MO 65203. The second
> method is to email your writing and cover letter to
> <mailto:cthls at earthlink.net>cthls at earthlink.net And for payment for
> electronic submissions check our web site and see if we have PayPal
> by then URL
> <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org>http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
> Or, if you need to snail-mail the check, use Tom's address in choice one.
>
> Poetry: Entrants are invited to submit original poetry of up to 36
> lines. If you wish to submit- You are required to send a cover sheet
> with title of all entries, name, address, phone and email (if
> available). A second requirement , is please have your documents
> double spaced and if you are sending it hardcopy, it cannot be
> handwritten. The cost is $5.00 for up to 3 poems and you can send
> either a check or money order made out to the NFB Writers' Division.
>
> You have two choices for submission: First is the traditional method
> of sending hardcopy and check, and if you do so, send it to Lori
> Stayer, 2704 Beach Drive, Merrick NY 11566.
>
> The second method is to email your writing and cover letter to
> <mailto:LoriStay at aol.com>LoriStay at aol.com And for payment for
> electronic submissions check our web site and see if we have PayPal
> by then URL
> <http://www.nfb-writers-division.org>http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
> Or, if you need to snail-mail the check, use Lori's address in choice one.
>
> President NFB Writers' Division
> Robert Leslie Newman
> Email- newmanrl at cox.net
> Division Website-
> <Http://www.nfb-writers-division.org>Http://www.nfb-writers-division.org
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 10:24:02 -0600
> From: "John G. Heim" <jheim at math.wisc.edu>
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] The Kindle Swindle
> To: NFB Talk Mailing List <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Message-ID: <490D6B6E2F3742DB91818B906693D18B at mcgee>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> 	reply-type=original
>
> The writers guild is having a problem getting into the 21st century. Their
> argument, which at first glance makes sense, is that talking books are an
> important revenue source for writers and will become even more important in
> the future. It's not fair for that source of revenue to be denied them. But
> we're not talking about giving away talking books for free. You still have
> to buy the book. The only way authors are actually losing revenue would be
> in the fairly rare cases where someone might buy both the print and the
> talking books.
>
> The members of the writers guild need to wrap their minds around the fact
> that in the 21st century, people are going to look upon buying a book like
> they do buying any other license. When you buy a license, you expect to be
> able to make copies in whatever media you need and to use the product in
> whatever way works for you. You can't give somebody else a copy but you can
> copy the licensed product unto any other media for your own use.
>
> The writers guild still thinks they're selling books, not licenses.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brian Miller" <brian-r-miller at uiowa.edu>
> To: <mabullis at hotmail.com>; "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 6:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] The Kindle Swindle
>
>
>> How in the world can the Writer's Guilde make the case that a syntehsized
>> speech program constitutes a performance that would in essence require a
>> mechanical reproduction lisence to play?
>>
>> This is really taking royalty protection to an absurd level.  One should
>> pay
>> for the access to the content, not the format of that content.  Is this
>> really any different than someone taking a written copy and reading it
>> aloud?
>>
>> Brian M
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf Of Michael Bullis
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 6:18 AM
>> To: 'NFB Talk Mailing List'
>> Subject: [nfb-talk] The Kindle Swindle
>>
>> This from today's New York Times.
>> Mike Bullis
>>
>> OP-ED CONTRIBUTOR. The Kindle Swindle?.
>>
>> By ROY BLOUNT Jr.. Roy Blount Jr. is the author, most recently, of
>> 'Alphabet
>> Juice. BEING president of too many well-meaning organizations put my
>> father
>> into an early grave. The lesson in this was not lost on me. But now I am
>> president of the Authors Guild, whose mission is to sustain book-writing
>> as
>> a viable occupation. This borders on quixotic, given all the new ways of
>> not
>> getting paid that new technology affords authors. A case in point:
>> Amazon's
>> Kindle 2, which was released yesterday.
>>
>> The Kindle 2 is a portable, wireless, paperback-size device onto which
>> people can download a virtual library of digitalized titles. Amazon sells
>> these downloads, and where the books are under copyright, it pays
>> royalties
>> to the authors and publishers.
>>
>> Serves readers, pays writers: so far, so good. But there's another thing
>> about Kindle 2 -- its heavily marketed text-to-speech function. Kindle 2
>> can
>> read books aloud. And Kindle 2 is not paying anyone for audio rights.
>>
>> True, you can already get software that will read aloud whatever is on
>> your
>> computer. But Kindle 2 is being sold specifically as a new, improved,
>> multimedia version of books -- every title is an e-book and an audio book
>> rolled into one. And whereas e-books have yet to win mainstream
>> enthusiasm,
>> audio books are a billion-dollar market, and growing. Audio rights are not
>> generally packaged with e-book rights. They are more valuable than e-book
>> rights.
>> Income
>> from audio books helps not inconsiderably to keep authors, and publishers,
>> afloat.
>>
>> You may be thinking that no automated read-aloud function can compete with
>> the dulcet resonance of Jim Dale reading 'Harry Potter' or of authors,
>> ahem,
>> reading themselves. But the voices of Kindle 2 are quite listenable.
>> There's
>> even a male version and a female version. (A book by, say, Norman Mailer
>> on
>> Kindle 2 might do a brisk business among people wondering how his prose
>> would sound in measured feminine tones.)
>>
>> And that sort of technology is improving all the time. I.B.M. has patented
>>
>> a
>> computerized voice that is said to be almost indistinguishable from human
>> ones.
>> This voice is programmed to include 'ums,' 'ers' and sighs, to cough for
>> attention, even to 'shhh' when interrupted. According to Andy Aaron, of
>> I.B.M.'s Thomas J. Watson research group speech team: 'These sounds can be
>> incredibly subtle, even unnoticeable, but have a profound psychological
>> effect. It can be extremely reassuring to have a more attentive-sounding
>> voice.
>>
>> When I read that quotation, it hit me: Hey, I know Andy Aaron. Years ago,
>> he
>> said he was working on some sort of voice simulation, and asked to work my
>> Southern accent into the mix. I don't remember whether we got around to
>> that
>> or not, and this new I.B.M. software is designed, at any rate, not for
>> audio
>> books but for computer help lines. So no part of my voice is competing
>> with
>> my own audio books yet. But people who want to keep on doing creative
>> things
>> for a living must be duly vigilant about any new means of transmitting
>> their
>> work.
>>
>> What the guild is asserting is that authors have a right to a fair share
>> of
>> the value that audio adds to Kindle 2's version of books. For this, the
>> guild is being assailed. On the National Federation of the Blind's Web
>> site,
>> the guild is accused of arguing that it is illegal for blind people to use
>> 'readers, either human or machine, to access books that are not available
>> in
>> alternative formats like Braille or audio.
>>
>> In fact, publishers, authors and American copyright laws have long
>> provided
>> for free audio availability to the blind and the guild is all for
>> technologies that expand that availability. (The federation, though,
>> points
>> out that blind readers can't independently use the Kindle 2's visual,
>> on-screen
>> controls.)
>> But that doesn't mean Amazon should be able, without copyright-holders'
>> participation, to pass that service on to everyone.
>>
>> The guild is also accused of wanting to profiteer off family bedtime
>> rituals. A lawyer at the Electronic Frontier Foundation sarcastically
>> warned
>> that 'parents everywhere should be on the lookout for legal papers haling
>> them into court for reading to their kids.
>>
>> For the record: no, the Authors Guild does not expect royalties from
>> anybody
>> doing non-commercial performances of 'Goodnight Moon. If parents want to
>> send their children off to bed with the voice of Kindle 2, however, it's
>> another matter.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 10:44:35 -0600
> From: "John G. Heim" <jheim at math.wisc.edu>
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Proposal and predictions
> To: NFB Talk Mailing List <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Message-ID: <CF5E90CDD6B34A389D7C3CCC7E5B4071 at mcgee>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> 	reply-type=response
>
> We're getting off the topic of the original proposal so it's a good thing
> somebody changed the subject line. But I would like to point out that it's
> not particularly relevant that people think blindness is horrible when it
> comes to the proposal that the NFB start providing adaptive equipment. The
> idea that blindness is horrible and that we're helpless are related but not
> identical. And while supplying adaptive equipment may not help dispel the
> idea that being blind is horrible, it might help dispel the idea that we're
> helpless.
>
> Anyway, back to what you're saying...
>
> I probably have told the story about how several of my friends insist that
> if they went blind, they'd kill themselves. I ask them how they can think
> that when they see me clearly happy and successful. But they say I can
> handle it. To some degree they are complimenting my toughness but it's also
> partially that they see me as a total nerd. It's not so bad for a nerd to be
> blind but if you're a normal human being, it's horrible.
>
> Anyway, in spite of all my efforts to convince them otherwise, they insist
> that they'd kill themselves. And I'm talking about 2 groups of friends. One
> group are people I work with and the other is people I run with. They both
> know me really well and never the less think that suicide would be a valid
> option if they go blind.
>
> I also would not dispute the idea that parents would probably abort a fetus
> if they were warned in advance that it would be blind. I suspect that
> probably has already happened. If it hasn't, it's probably only because
> there's no way to detect it.
>
> The final point I'd like to make is that I think people are underestimating
> how soon we'll have artificial vision.  It' funny I got into an argument on
> this list about Ray Kurswail's predictions which I think are unrealistically
> optimistic. But we already have rudimentary artificial vision. It doesn't
> take a great deal of imagination to picture improvements that would give
> people effective artificial vision.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "RyanO" <ryano218 at comcast.net>
> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 8:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Proposal and predictions
>
>
>> David, I fully agree with you on your prediction about synthetic vision.
>> I've said before that society will come up with a "cure for blindness"
>> long before it joins us in our belief that it is respectable to be blind.
>> I heard a radio commercial the other day with a cheesy rendition of, "What
>>
>> a Wonderful World," in the background. The announcer asked parents to
>> imagine how terrible it would be to raise a child without sight. The fact
>> that a commercial like this can be aired in the mainstream today in a
>> hypersensitive culture of political correctness speaks volumes.
>>
>> Of course, world events may take us down a much darker path than the one
>> that leads to artificial vision. I firmly believe that circumstances could
>>
>> lead us to a point when it would be a common societal practice to abort
>> embryos that are deemed "defective" by doctors. We may even hit a point
>> where our countries cannot economically sustain programs for the disabled.
>>
>> Some have accused me of holding an extreme view on this futuristic vision,
>>
>> but I sincerely believe that it is possible. War and economic collapse
>> often drive people into extreme behavior.
>>
>>
>>
>> RyanO
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nfb-talk mailing list
>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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>
> End of nfb-talk Digest, Vol 10, Issue 1
> ***************************************
>