[nfb-talk] Enough already!

[John G. Heim]

You'd like to make me out to be a bad guy for arguing in favor of things 
like described video, accessible money, and audible walk signals. But its 
just not true. Those issues are at least debatable. The real question is why 
there are so few people on this list on my side.

And I'd be only too willing to leave the NFB alone if it would leave me 
alone. But it keeps doing things that make my life harder and even more 
dangerous. This is an extraordinary thing for an advocacy group to do. You 
don't see groups for people in wheelchairs fighting against ramps and curb 
cuts. So again, I have to wonder why there aren't more people on my side on 
this list.

I'm pretty sure, for example, that most blind people favor DVS, accessible 
money, and audible walk signals. I mean, I haven't done any formal surveys 
but when I tell blind people about the NFB positions, they are always 
shocked. Rest assured, I do my best to fairly represent the NFB position on 
these issues. I don't hate the NFB, after all. But still, given the way most 
people react to the NFB's positions on these issues, I have to wonder why 
there aren't more people on my side on this list.

I want people to start using their heads instead of just passively accepting 
whatever the NFB tells them. The NFB tells them black is white, that up is 
down, and they just believe it. That's not even that much of an 
exaggeration. In the past few years, the NFB has told us that DVS would cost 
blind people jobs, that accessible money would cost us jobs, and that 
audible walk signals are dangerous.  These issues don't deserve debate?

Oh, I think they do.

PS: I have never complained to the moderator about anything, much less about 
being insulted on this list.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 2:05 PM
Subject: [nfb-talk] Enough already!


> David,
>
> Have you noticed the trend of discussions on this list over the past 
> couple of years or so?  I have, and I’ve double-checked the archives to be 
> sure I wasn’t reading something into it.  The pattern is that every large 
> discussion seems to involve one group of people arguing for the ability of 
> the blind, for the NFB, its policies, and its mission.  The other side of 
> the discussion is generally one person.
>
> The pattern of the discussion is that the individual says something 
> incendiary against one of the above, something I have a hard time 
> accepting is unintentional at this point.  The group reacts, some with 
> distaste, some with disagreement, and some with anger.  This last group 
> has taken the bait, if you will.
>
> This is where you come in, because inevitably the individual insists that 
> he is “offended” and “baselessly attacked” for his views.  You defend him, 
> going so far as to threaten to ban longtime regulars and well-respected 
> federationists.  The individual takes this as a sign that he may stand 
> behind you, and continue to insult not only us few here, but everything 
> this organization stands for.
>
> The fact that there is not a single person on this list that does not know 
> of whom I speak is evidence in and of itself.  It’s really got to stop. 
> Those who would not be flamed should not make a habit of setting fires. 
> Having set a few myself over the years, it comes with the territory.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 08, 2010 at 10:19:24PM -0600, David Andrews wrote:
>>This is a personal attack and is totally unacceptable.  You can disagree 
>>with someone -- but please stick to facts, not speculation etc.
>>
>>David Andrews, Moderator
>>
>>At 03:09 PM 12/6/2010, you wrote:
>>>I agree Gloria.  He is a very shallow person, and I don't care of his 
>>>$250,000 house is paid off or not.  He could rip off Bernie Madoff, the 
>>>biggest cheat in the world, and he wouldn't impress me..smile.
>>>
>>>Connie Canode
>>
>>
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