[nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando

Peter Donahue pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com
Mon Jul 11 16:07:07 UTC 2011


Hello Mike and everyone,

    Mary received one of those pat-downs" when we left last Saturday and 
when she returned home yesterday morning. Interestingly enough I'm usually 
the one to receive the pat-down. By making a long leash I commanded my guide 
dog Johnny to sit while I stepped through the metal detector. I got through 
without any trouble and did not receive the pat-down although they gave 
Johnny one.

    At least we won't need to worry about pat-downs in the future as we 
intend to fly privately. Our challenge is not to allow anyone or anything to 
turn us in to liars. What a great admission!

Peter Donahue

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael Hingson" <info at michaelhingson.com>
To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2011 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando


Any pat down without offering the choice to do so in a private location is a
DIRECT violation of TSA's rules.

I do think the pat down was unnecessary, but doing it publicly if no private
screening was offered is absolutely wrong.  Also, Joe had the right to speak
to a supervisor.  Asking for one should have IMMEDIATELY stopped all
proceedings until a supervisor came.

This all was discussed at the NAGDU meeting last Tuesday with, guess what, a
TSA representative.


Mike H.

The Michael Hingson Group, INC.
 "Speaking with Vision"
Michael Hingson, President
(415) 827-4084
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-----Original Message-----
From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Steve Jacobson
Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2011 2:16 PM
To: NFB Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando

Mike,

While I generally just send my cane through the scanner and walk the three
feet without it, my impression was the fact
that the search and pat down appears to be a punishment for what Joe did
rather than a security procedure was the
issue.  I have taken my cane through the detector, and have generally found
that if I keep the tip on the floor it
doesn't set it off, but of course, that doesn't guarantee it isn't loaded
with gun powder or something.  If I am interpreting
what Joe said correctly, though, I don't blame him for feeling upset.  I
truly feel that some of the security people get off
on the power that they have and use it to win a battle of wills needlessly.
However, I don't think we're going to win
anything in court these days if it involves security.  Whether that is right
or wrong is really irrelevent for now because it
is the way things are.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

On Sun, 10 Jul 2011 12:31:36 -0700, Mike Freeman wrote:

>Joseph:

>In my opinion, your outrage is misplaced. Courts all the way up to the
>Supreme Court have ruled that civil rights are extensively modified in
>airports and that, in effect, TSA can violate your personal space in ways
>that would not be tolerated in other settings. I know some will disagree
>with me here but if one can't walk three feet through a metal detector
>without one's cane, one is pretty badly off! Abstract principles don't
>matter in these cases: as I say, you won't win in court.

>Mike


>-----Original Message-----
>From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>Behalf Of T. Joseph Carter
>Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2011 9:33 AM
>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>Subject: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando

>I am copying Scott LaBarre on this message for his opinion, but have
>not done so openly to keep him from receiving every single reply to
>this message as well.

>I had absolutely no trouble in my home state of Oregon getting
>through Transportation Security Administration security screening.
>The TSA officials at Portland International Airport know the blind
>quite well, and they know the laws.  They follow them.

>In Florida, however, returning from convention, I was told that I was
>required by law to relinquish my cane and step through the scanner
>with a sighted guide.  I said that once scanned, I could step through
>with my cane.  It contains metal only on its tip.

>The TSA official told me that was against the law.

>I insisted that it was not, and offered to share the specific
>regulations in question.

>The TSA officer did not want to see the regulations.  She told me
>that hundreds of blind people were coming through the airport, and
>not one single person before me had protested being required to
>travel without their cane.

>I once again offered the copy of the regulations, which were not
>accepted.  Another officer offered to send a supervisor at this
>point, which the officer declined as well.

>I was told at that point that I would be allowed to have my cane, but
>that the consequence of my unwillingness to comply with being
>stripped of my dignity would be a full security pat-down.  I was told
>this before I ever stepped through the metal detector.

>I did not set off the metal detector upon stepping through, as you
>might predict using a rigid fiberglass NFB cane.  I was, however,
>still subjected to the humiliating additional screening as a punitive
>matter.

>During this full security pat-down, I was forced, in full view of
>other passengers, to remove articles of clothing, had my groin and
>other personal areas felt by security personnel, and tested for
>explosive chemical residues among other things.  I was told that this
>was all being done because I had in fact set off the metal detector,
>though it had made no sound when I passed through it as it had when
>the officer before me had done so.

>After another five minutes, most (but not all) of my belongings were
>returned to me.  The TSA officers refused to account for my things,
>and threatened arrest when I would not leave the testing area,
>without the return of all of my possessions.  To defuse this
>situation, an officer who had not been part of the preceding was came
>over and located my missing items and returned them to me.

>I want to know why it is that the government is permitted to treat
>the blind in this shameful way?  And to whom do we register our
>formal, written complaint?  At the very least, the TSA of this
>particular airport need training in the law concerning passengers
>with disabilities.  More properly, a full investigation of the
>repeated lies and attempts by officers to cover up this incident
>through threats and intimidation is also warranted.

>TSA records video of their checkpoints, and I think that video will
>show, for example, that I did not actually set off the metal detector
>upon passing through it, among other things.  They do not record
>audio, however, so we may not be able to prove the lies, the threats,
>and the intimidation unless others were denied their canes (which I
>already know they were) and any others stood up for their rights
>(which the TSA say none ever did.)

>What I can prove is that we of the National Federation of the Blind
>do not request the same dignity that is afforded to the sighted
>public.  To do so would be to presume the possibility that we ought
>to be treated any differently.  No, we insist upon it!  If my own
>treatment is any indication, the Transportation Security
>Administration seems to believe that we are merely asking for equal
>treatment.  They seem to feel as if they are free to answer in the
>negative.  I think it is time that we ensure they learn that they are
>mistaken.  What do you think?

>T. Joseph Carter
>Just a blind guy trying to get home


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