[nfbcs] FW: Scientific Calculator

[Anonymous]

Well just getting out of high school I can tell you the following:
1. Might be a input error due to the model of the device used, most of
the time speach devices like this are older then the non talking ones.
Not due to the fact that they do not have a newer one, but the cost is
a problem for some people.
2. When you set up something like (2+9) (2+3) you are telling it to do
unless you have * inbetween it. 9+2=11 (2+3)=5 and unless you put * it
does not know what to do with the data. It is seeing it as two
diffrent problems. An example of it combining the problems would be
(9+2)*(2+5)
9+2 = 11
2+5 =7
7+11= 18
3. Where you Parentheses matter is math and it really does in Algebra.
Remember it is “please excuse my dear aunt sally
1. Parentheses
2. Exponents
3. Multiply
4. Divide
5. Add
6. Subtract
When you have something like 9x*10 you do the opposite
9/10 = .90/9 = .10 or 1 over 10 or 10%  Moving parentheses in the
wrong spot would create havoc.
9x*10/32
First: 10*32 = 320 and to brake, the 9 free from the x you divide 320/9= 35.5
9x*(10/32) that means divide 10/32 first instead of multiplying it =
0.1235/9 would get you two repeating, so the first problem and the
second problem change amounts by a lot due to where they are at.

 4. If you have another talking device on hand try that have the math
teacher try and see if gets the right thing, if he does it another
problem. Then have the student try it if she comes up with the wrong
problem, it is the student if it comes out the same the other thing is
not working right odds are, but have the math teacher try the same
thing on old one and you can know if the thing is not working or if it
is math error.

Good luck let me know if that halpped at all

On 6/27/12, Jim Barbour <jbar at barcore.com> wrote:
> I think Leah is saying that on her TI 84 calculator if there's no operator
> between a number and a grouping, her TI 84 calculator assumes the missing
> operator is multiplication; but, Angie's calculator does not make this
> assumption.
>
> So  5 (3 + 2) would equal 25.  NOTE: read the equation character by
> character if you're using a screen reader.
>
> I question Leah's statement that her TI 84's behavior is the "normal" or
> "correct" behavior.  However, she is the teacher, and it is her class.
>
> I guess my suggestions fall along the lines of teaching Angie how to use the
> calculator she has correctly, learning how to use an RPN calculator where
> parens are not necessary, finding an accessible TI calculator program for
> her computer (unlikely I think), or working with a reader to use the
> calculator her classmates are using.
>
> Does this help get things started?
>
> Jim
>
> On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 04:30:09PM -0700, Humberto Avila wrote:
>> Based on my recent knowledge of Algebra, I definitely agree with Mike.
>> Parentheses are not multiplication but are used to separate numbers and
>> follow order of operations. And no, computer calculators do not interpret
>> parentheses as multiplications either. I have tried simple calculations
>> before, and it just treats the parentheses, when being used instead of the
>> multiply (*) sign, as just numbers and leaves the first number entered out
>> and gives the second number as the result.
>>
>> The issue with what this scientific calculator is doing may mean a couple
>> of things:
>> A.  either the calculator is interpreting the parentheses when used as
>> grouping symbols wrong, or
>> B.  the student is inputting the information wrong on the calculator, or
>> C.  there may be confusion between the student and / or the DSS
>> coordinator with the instructor regarding calculating solutions to the
>> problems with the material being covered in class.
>>
>> I might be wrong, but this is what I know of this so far.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>> Of Mike Freeman
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 4:15 PM
>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] FW: Scientific Calculator
>>
>> Parentheses aren't multiplication; they're grouping symbols.
>>
>> Mike Freeman
>> sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>> On Jun 27, 2012, at 16:02, "David W Bundy" <bundy at pobox.com> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > I wonder if any of you have any suggestions re the below situation.  She
>> > is using the Orion TI35.  (I have removed names from the original e-mail
>> > to preserve confidentiality)
>> >
>> > From: ****Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 5:09 PM
>> > Subject: FW: Scientific Calculator
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I need to inform you that ****’s math instructor, ****, has made a
>> > disturbing discovery.  ****’s talking scientific calculator does not
>> > compute correctly (see email below).  I have a different brand of
>> > talking scientific calculator in my office, and unfortunately, it has
>> > the same limitation.  This is completely unfair and unfortunate for
>> > ****.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > The error in computing caused ****to get many of her homework and test
>> > problems wrong, even though she may have entered the information into
>> > the calculator correctly (in the format that is taught and is standardly
>> > used).  We would like to correct this problem as soon as possible.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I am requesting that you investigate other calculator options that would
>> > work for **** in an educational setting; this would be one that reads
>> > parentheses as multiplication.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I would be glad to discuss this further if you would like.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Thank you for your attention to this!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Sally Herlong, M.Ed.
>> >
>> > Department Manager
>> >
>> > Special Resources/Disability Services
>> >
>> > York Technical College
>> >
>> > 452 S. Anderson Rd., Rock Hill, SC 29730
>> >
>> > Tel: 803.325.2896 | Fax: 803.325.2897
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > The information transmitted via this email is intended only for the
>> > addressee and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any
>> > interception, review, retransmission, dissemination, or taking of any
>> > action upon this information by persons or entities other than the
>> > intended is strictly prohibited. If you receive this communication in
>> > error, please contact us at 803.981.7111, and delete the communication
>> > from any computer or network system.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: Leah Hollingsworth
>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:52 AM
>> > To: Sally Herlong
>> > Subject: Scientific Calculator
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Sally,
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > As we discussed, Angie’s scientific calculator is not reading
>> > parentheses as multiplication. For a basic compounding interest problem,
>> > I would enter in “12000(1+.09)^7” into my TI 84. (See the screen shot
>> > below.)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Screenshot of correct processing of a scientific calculator. It reads:
>> > 12000 (1+.09) raised to the 7th power = 21,936.46945.
>> >
>> > TI 84 calculator screenshot 1
>> >
>> > However, when I entered it into Angie’s calculator, using the same
>> > notation of “12000(1+.09)^7”, my answer was 1.828039121,which is
>> > (1+.09)^7. It is not reading the parentheses as multiplication. I then
>> > attempted the problem again, however pressing Enter twice, to see if
>> > that would take into account the multiplication of 12000 out front and
>> > it didn’t. The answer it gave me was 68.21790833, which is 1.828039121
>> > raised to the 7th power.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I asked two colleagues whether they thought a “scientific” calculator
>> > should be reading parentheses as multiplication and they both agreed.
>> > Even basic calculators are able to read parentheses as multiplication.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Please let me know if you need any more information from me or if I can
>> > do anything else to help.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> > Leah
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Leah Hollingsworth
>> >
>> > Instructor
>> >
>> > Mathematics
>> >
>> > York Technical College
>> >
>> > 452 S. Anderson Rd., Rock Hill, SC 29730
>> >
>> > Tel: 803.981.7720 | Fax: 803.981.7216
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > The information transmitted via this email is intended only for the
>> > addressee and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any
>> > interception, review, retransmission, dissemination, or taking of any
>> > action upon this information by persons or entities other than the
>> > intended is strictly prohibited. If you receive this communication in
>> > error, please contact us at 803.981.7111, and delete the communication
>> > from any computer or network system.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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