[nfbcs] Inaccessible Training - again

Sat Feb 16 19:13:26 UTC 2013

Dave, Gabe
I agree with your points, especially the one about not griping on the job,
but I think discussion should be wide open. Discussion is a normal thing in
the work place and should include accessibility when necessary.
Thinking outside the box is a good idea as well, but not everyone has that
capability, at least to the point necessary to adapt work sites to the
extent some of them need to be adapted.  Engineers are trained to think
outside the box. Not everyone has that ability and there are job situations
where thinking outside the box will do no good at all. I don't see what
could be done to make a customer site accessible if is not. The companies
using the software are not going to let you make changes to the software and
all the work is right there in front of you either you can fill in the boxes
or you can't. If you can talk the companies into letting you try to fix the
problems with scripts or adjust the access software they sure are not going
to give you much time. They want production and I don't blame them. The
software should be accessible from the drawing board. I think only laws
backed by education has any chance of working. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione
Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2013 11:43 AM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Inaccessiable Training - again

David and Gabe, I'm sure we all know these points.  But, if the training is
just not accessible, I can spend all the time in the world looking at it,
and still be where I was when I started.  Now, I could possibly log in from
home and hire someone at home to do the mouse clicking.  That will work for
training that doesn't involve anything confidential.  Otherwise, if there's
no one at work who can help me, I'm S.O.L.
Tracy

----- Original Message -----
From: "david hertweck" <david.hertweck at sbcglobal.net>
To: "NFB in Computer Science Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2013 8:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Inaccessiable Training - again

> As a blind engineer and now a manager working for a large company I found 
> the best approach is:
> 1. Try and find a way to do your job, be creative, think out of the box, 
> make it work.
> 2. Put in extra hours.  I know a lot of sighted engineers if they are not 
> as effective as other people they put in the extra time so we should be 
> willing to do this.
> 3. Remember everyone has tasks to complete and completing yours can not 
> interfere with others.
> 4. Before asking for help have an exact plan for how can that person help 
> you.  What does not work is to ask someone to make "X" accessible for you.
> 5. Never "complain" find answers. It is super to "complain" in this forum 
> but not at work.
> 6. Always remember your manager most likely has more work and certainly 
> more responsibilities than you do, so you should never add to them for 
> accessibility problems.
> 7. Always remember you are there for the company not the company for you.
>
> thanks
>
>
>
>
> through out my work life
> and now as a manager of course they are not overwellming
>
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: majolls at cox.net
> Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2013 10:50 AM
> To: nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Inaccessiable Training - again
>
> Gary and all
>
> I think you hit the nail on the head.  To what end do you "complain"?  If 
> you don't, you don't get anywhere.  And if you do (too much) you are 
> perceived as a burden ... and managers would rather not deal with you and 
> get someone else that doesn't have the requirement that you do.  I work 
> for a large corporation.  I found that while managers can be sympathetic, 
> others just don't care.  it really depends on your luck of the draw 
> regarding what manager you do get.
>
> I can remember voicing concern about sitting in a large room for a 
> presentation where they had big monitors up on the wall.  A presenter 
> would be running his demo, and the display was up on the "big screen". 
> Unfortunately, I couldn't read the big screen.  I was just too far away 
> and I'm just too blind.  When I voiced concern, what I mostly got was 
> "just do your best" ... which was absolutely no help.  I finally came up 
> with the idea ... "just run a data feed to a separate monitor that can be 
> placed on a table that I can sit close to".  That idea really worked, but 
> it took me ... not them ... to come up with the idea.  The managers ... 
> who are supposed to help you ... didn't have a clue what I needed, or what

> might work.  And, if I complained too much, they just said ... "do your 
> best" and sort of turned a deaf ear.
>
> And as far as going to bat for you ... trying to get the application 
> changed so it's accessible ... I think most managers have priorities on 
> what they have to get done.  When you require someone to sit with you 
> (meaning time and money) or when you ask your manager to help you ... 
> they'll do it as long as it isn't excessive ... meaning as long as it 
> doesn't take a lot of time and money.  If it does, you're kind of on your 
> own.  And as far as them modifying software to be accessible ... that's 
> only an option if your company doesn't have a lot of other "business 
> requirements" they have to get done first.  Where I'm at, that's always 
> the case.
>
> I guess we all just need to be experts on Accessibility programming so we 
> can do it ourselves.  Wish I had better things to say, but I've only had 
> 35 years of experience in dealing with this.  And it doesn't sound like 
> the federal government is any better than private industry.  People 
> (managers) are people no matter where you go I suppose.
>
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