[nfbcs] Activating Wireless and Bluetooth Drivers In A LaptopWithout their Respective Buttons.
Jim Barbour
jbar at barcore.com
Sun Nov 16 00:54:32 UTC 2014
To be clear, it is the Fn key, not the function key.
Jim
Written While on the Move
> On Nov 15, 2014, at 4:00 PM, Nicole Torcolini via nfbcs <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
> I do not know if there is a way to do it with software. Usually, it is the
> function key, not insert, so try that instead. When I toggle it on mine, it
> plays the sound for connecting or disconnecting a USB device.
>
> Nicole
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ahmed Khater via
> nfbcs
> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2014 3:23 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Subject: [nfbcs] Activating Wireless and Bluetooth Drivers In A
> LaptopWithout their Respective Buttons.
>
> Hi all,
>
> One of my colleagues who is totally blind, has got a new laptop.
> Unfortunately, there is no way to be able to locate the buttons for
> activating the Bluetooth and Wireless drivers. In my Dell laptop, I press
> Insert+F2 to activate both drivers. There are various combinations of
> Insert+keys
> for different computer models.
>
> But my question is: Is there any way whereby we can use our Windows 7 or 8
> software to activate the Bluetooth and Wriless without such combinations of
> buttons? If yes, can you provide me with a description of what happens when
> I try to activate a Bluetooth or wireless connections using this software.
>
> Thank you very much for your expected assistance.
>
> Best Regards
>
> Ahmed Khater
> Aakhater.ios at gmail.com
> It's always hope that gives meaning to life
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nicole Torcolini
> via nfbcs
> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2014 11:03 PM
> To: Larry Wayland
> Cc: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Screen Reader Support Models - was NVDA product
> question
>
> Before I say any more, I have a question. Steve, did you deliberately choose
> Microsoft and Google as specific examples?
>
> Nicole
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Nov 15, 2014, at 11:23 AM, Larry Wayland <lhwayland at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> I don't see why you would disagree with that statement. The big companies
> may not do it on purpose, but that is usually the way it turns out.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nicole Torcolini
> via nfbcs
> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:08 PM
> To: 'Steve Jacobson'; 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Screen Reader Support Models - was NVDA product
> question
>
> I agree with most of your points. However, I do question this one:
>
> "Large companies like Google and Microsoft and make sweeping changes to
> their software, provide very basic accessibility by exposing the information
> in their changes, and then leave it to the screen reader developers to make
> it all work for you and me."
>
> Nicole
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Steve Jacobson
> via nfbcs
> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 8:06 AM
> To: nfbcs list
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Screen Reader Support Models - was NVDA product
> question
>
> This article and the issues it raises are very important in my opinion. I
> think we have a somewhat false sense of security regarding our ability to
> use computers and access software in many ways.
>
> First, I did not interpret anything Tim said in his article as minimizing
> the efforts of those working on NVDA. I certainly keep a copy on my
> computer as a means to help me out when my main screen reader hangs up, and
> NVDA has a lot of power. My interpretation of his point was more like this.
> How would it go over if sighted people on the job had to depend upon
> volunteers to build and support their computer monitors? That just wouldn't
> be accepted.
> I don't see why you would disagree with that statement. The big companies
> may not do it on purpose, but that is usually the way it turns out.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nicole Torcolini
> via nfbcs
> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:08 PM
> To: 'Steve Jacobson'; 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Screen Reader Support Models - was NVDA product
> question
>
> I agree with most of your points. However, I do question this one:
>
> "Large companies like Google and Microsoft and make sweeping changes to
> their software, provide very basic accessibility by exposing the information
> in their changes, and then leave it to the screen reader developers to make
> it all work for you and me."
>
> Nicole
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Steve Jacobson
> via nfbcs
> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 8:06 AM
> To: nfbcs list
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Screen Reader Support Models - was NVDA product
> question
>
> This article and the issues it raises are very important in my opinion. I
> think we have a somewhat false sense of security regarding our ability to
> use computers and access software in many ways.
>
> First, I did not interpret anything Tim said in his article as minimizing
> the efforts of those working on NVDA. I certainly keep a copy on my
> computer as a means to help me out when my main screen reader hangs up, and
> NVDA has a lot of power. My interpretation of his point was more like this.
> How would it go over if sighted people on the job had to depend upon
> volunteers to build and support their computer monitors? That just wouldn't
> be accepted.
> Our screen readers are our computer monitors, and I think he was asking why
> we should expect anything less for something that is so important. Those of
> you who are working for someone else are likely very aware of how really
> fragile our accessibility is. If you are in full control over the software
> you use, the picture is a good bit better because you can control what you
> use and could, for example, pick software that works with NVDA. Where I
> work, I regularly use two programs that work fairly well with JFW and
> Window-Eyes and do not work with NVDA. I am not blaming NVDA as these are
> both older pieces of software, but both JAWS and Window-Eyes are a little
> more robust and offer some ability for a user to stretch their functionality
> somewhat easier than is the case with NVDA. Since it means money in my
> pocket, paying the price for a commercial screen reader is worth it to me.
> However, that doesn't mean I would not donate to NVDA, and NVDQA has often
> been better at implementing modern approaches to accessibility. That is a
> valuable contribution that cannot be over-stated. The Wikipedia model was
> mentioned in another note, and while I use that resource some, I don't see
> that as an effective approach to screen reader development that needs to
> exist in employment settings where there is security involved. A screen
> reader is not a collection of information that you can cross-check for
> accuracy, it is closer to a computer monitor that bridges software to
> hardware. I am not arguing that there might not be changes to the model
> that supports NVDA that we couldn't consider. Discussing alternatives is
> the point to all of this after all.
>
> The commercial screen reader model isn't perfect either. As I see it,
> screen readers, including NVDA, are so busy trying to keep up with new
> versions of Windows and Microsoft Office that they don't have a lot of
> resources to try to really innovate. Software and web pages have changed
> dramatically over the past ten years, but how we get information has not
> changed all that much. Even the efforts of screen readers to take advantage
> of ARIA seems to be painful. Large companies like Google and Microsoft and
> make sweeping changes to their software, provide very basic accessibility by
> exposing the information in their changes, and then leave it to the screen
> reader developers to make it all work for you and me. The time and money
> that they have to spend just to keep up is not insignificant and a lot of
> the money that we pay for upgrades goes to just staying even with what
> particularly the large companies change. I have personally witnessed the
> time it can take to figure out why something doesn't work right and it can
> be extreme. We expect our screen readers to know when a menu pops up and to
> track menu selections as they have been doing for twenty years. If finances
> were unlimited, a dream, I know, shouldn't there be a way to automatically
> tell us what is important on a web page in a similar manner? There are
> tools we can use, but thinking about what is really important on a web page
> isn't something screen readers really have time to to research to any major
> degree, and they have concentrated on what they can get from HTML, but could
> useful analysis of appearance help us?
> How about a command to jump to the text with the largest fonts or analyze
> text color for example?
>
> What about the third model, building in a screen reader into the operating
> system? From a technical point of view, this is probably the most sound
> approach. However, I, again, have the same reservations as were expressed
> in the article. I won't mention Apple as he did, as that always leads to an
> emotional battle. I know, though, that there have been bugs with
> accessibility both in Microsoft office and Windows for a few years that are
> known to Microsoft. Microsoft sends us updates all the time to their
> software and operating system. How often do you run Windows or Office
> Update? But some accessibility bugs have to wait for the "next major
> release" whatever that means. We have also seen Microsoft leave out or
> complicate keystroke access to Office
> 2013 that can only have happened because making keystrokes work well isn't a
> real priority. This is within their own software, and keyboard access is
> something some sighted people still use, but it still gets what appears to
> be casual consideration at best. How can I feel confident that they would
> maintain a screen reader over time, and what priority would they give bugs
> that might be present in handling competing products? What priority would a
> Microsoft screen reader give to Open Office support, for example? There are
> similar questions one could ask about Apple although the environment is
> somewhat different.
>
> The point is that there are some real drawbacks to all of the current
> models. Add to that the fact that software and web development are
> extremely dynamic right now and probably will be for some time to come. Now
> look at our market size which is relatively small. Also look at the laws
> that require accessibility which apply most completely to us and state
> governments with only limited application to the private sector. Add to
> that that people are finding that many web sites and some software used
> within government where laws do apply are not very accessible or accessible
> at all. It isn't that efforts are not being made, but the numbers of web
> pages are huge and the pressure to change is great.
>
> As consumers, we really need to think about all of this as we move forward.
> It is one thing to evaluate all of this in terms of our leisure activities.
> That can be frustrating but it is mostly manageable because we have some
> control over our environment. But in particular, how do we deal with web
> sites and software used within parts of the private sector where even ADA
> may not apply all that completely, where "undo burden" may accurately
> describe the changes that would need to be made in some cases?
> These are real challenges that go beyond insulting one's favorite screen
> reader or web browser, and this is what we really need to try to address.
> When I attended the first Microsoft Accessibility "Summit" in 1995 and when
> I participated in discussions of the accessibility of JAVA in 1998, I never
> dreamed we would still be fighting for accessibility as we must in 2014.
> There needs to be serious thought as to how we can do better in the future,
> and we need to discuss it thoroughly and reasonably.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Steve Jacobson
>
>> On Thu, 13 Nov 2014 19:11:58 -0800, Mike Freeman via nfbcs wrote:
>>
>> George:
>
>> I consider Mother Theresa and Lions Clubs just as paternalistic as
>> anything having to do with the blind. I *do* subscribe to Tim's logic.
>
>> Mike
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of George via
>> nfbcs
>> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2014 6:38 PM
>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] NVDA product question
>
>> Yes, Aaron, I totally agree with you.
>
>> Tim's thinking is not convincing and it's too much centered on affairs
>> of the blind, leaving aside a big reality.
>
>> For example,
>>> Do we
>>> welcome it simply because the recipients are people with a disability?
>
>> Not at all. These philanthropic efforts have been made for many
>> centuries in
>
>> other areas, too. Just think of Lion's Club, Mother Theresa, etc.
>> History shows us many philanthropic actions made by kings and rich
>> people, in art, for example, a rich madam supported Beethoven and now
>> we
> have his music.
>> So there's nothing wrong with the fund model they chose for NVDA and,
>> in fact, I think it's the most appropriate one for such an enterprise.
>> It's a growing trend nowadays, when many people try to help each other.
>> We can't deny all this efforts without disregarding today's reality.
>> Like wikipedia, there are many projects and they are very useful, not
>> only to the
>
>> blind, and they are based on donations. Saying that all these projects
>> have a weaker base is absolutely wrong, I think. Companies also go out
>> of business.
>> Being blind doesn't require to stick to a business model.
>
>> George
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Aaron Cannon via nfbcs" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> To: "Gary Wunder" <gwunder at earthlink.net>; "NFB in Computer Science
>> Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2014 11:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] NVDA product question
>
>
>>> I think the reason we haven't seen more arguments with Tim's article
>>> is that, frankly, his main points are hard to track. I can't
>>> complain too much though, as I suspect that he writes much more
>>> clearly than I do. :)
>>>
>>> As for what he says about NVDA:
>>> "The work that the developers of NVDA have done is exceptional. On a
>>> small budget they have developed a really good product and have
>>> provided a free screen reader to many thousands of people around the
>>> world who couldn't previously afford one, especially in developing
>>> countries. Their technical skills and dedication are to be applauded;
>>> however, I have a problem with the funding model they have chosen.
>>> Philanthropic funding is at best a fragile beast, and it often
>>> doesn't extend to covering services like training and support, which
>>> can be the most important components of accessibility (especially in
>>> education). The bigger issue of equity and why we accept such a
>>> fundamental right as access to a computer to be at the whim of
>>> philanthropic generosity should be of tremendous concern. Do we
>>> welcome it simply because the recipients are people with a disability?
>>> Why is this particular group of people not worthy of a business model
>>> that guarantees standards of support, service, and viability? The
>>> developers of NVDA need investors, not handouts."
>>>
>>> Perhaps my brain just isn't working right this morning, but I am
>>> having a hard time following his objections to NVDA. If I understand
>>> it right, he is saying that the funding model for NVDA is fragile, so
>>> we shouldn't trust it. He also seems to be arguing that it's based
>>> on charity, and so beneath us, and besides, it doesn't allow for user
>>> support and training.
>>>
>>> If this is correct, I remain unconvinced. NVDA support is available
>>> from various organizations, for a fee. Jaws users, on the other
>>> hand, end up also paying for support, but they do so up front,
>>> whether they need it or not.
>>>
>>> Training is also available for a fee, but that's certainly not unique
>>> to NVDA. Jaws does come with some training materials, but similar
>>> materials are also available for free for NVDA.
>>>
>>> I agree that NVDA funding is more fragile than we should like, but
>>> much of what we the blind rely on is philanthropic in nature. And,
>>> if one source of funding dries up, another one is found. And anyway,
>>> I don't see traditional sources of investment funding being
>>> substantially more reliable than philanthropic ones.
>>>
>>> Investors/donors come, and investors/donors go, and organizations
>>> either find new ones, figure out a way to due without, or fail. So
>>> far, NVAccess seems to have been able to find new ones when needed.
>>>
>>> Consider what would happen if FS and NVAccess went under, and all the
>>> developers moved on to bigger and better things (or at least things
>>> that would provide them with a paycheck). Jaws would be gone.
>>> You're already installed copies would probably work, but there would
>>> be no way to install the full version on new machines.
>>>
>>> NVDA, on the other hand, would still be available. Not only would it
>>> still be available to install, but it would be available to improve,
>>> fix, and whatever else someone wanted to do with it, within the
>>> bounds of the GPL license. It's even possible that a new group of
>>> developers would come along and keep the project going.
>>>
>>> In short, Jaws belongs to FS. NVDA belongs, in a very literal sense,
>>> to everyone. I'd much rather see money invested into something I own
>>> than into something I don't.
>>>
>>> That's all for now.
>>>
>>> Aaron
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
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