[NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper

Aaron Cannon cannona at fireantproductions.com
Mon Jun 21 18:02:08 UTC 2021 

Thanks for reporting back on this. You have inspired me to pick up
some tags of my own and give this a try.

Aaron

On 6/19/21, Sabra Ewing via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> I know you don't need a connection to the Internet to use them, but they are
> so expensive. I have gotten some tags. I got 50 tags for $12. I can put up
> to 500 characters on the tag before I run out of memory. I had to pay $2.99
> for the version of the app mentioned above, NFC tools, so that I could save
> more than two tags. I also forgot to read the part that said the tags I
> bought did not come with adhesive, but I have rubber cement so I just use
> that to put the tags on. They do work. For my first eight items I do need
> more memory, but in other cases where I don't need as much memory, I could
> get more tags for even cheaper. If I only need a tag where I can write maybe
> 40 characters I could probably get over 100 tags for $12. $60 for 25 tags is
> way too expensive. You don't need Internet connection to use these tags
> either. You just need to check the usable memory of the tag so that you will
> have enough memory for what you need. Then you go to the app, you create one
> or multiple records, then you say write tag, OK, scan it, and it is on
> there. In order to be able to write a new tag you do need to be able to save
> it though. To save it, you go to read tag, name tag, and save it. I had
> never used such an app before and didn't really have any instructions but
> was able to figure it out pretty fast. A few times it said connection error
> and then it couldn't write, but then I scanned it again and it worked.
>
> Sabra Ewing
>
>> On Jun 14, 2021, at 4:12 AM, Christopher Chaltain <chaltain at outlook.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I can't tell if this is clear or not, but you don't need a connection to
>> the internet to use Way Around tags. You can read and write them just fine
>> without accessing the cloud.
>>
>> --
>> Christopher (AKA CJ)
>> Chaltain at Outlook
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Sabra Ewing via NFBCS
>> Sent: Monday, June 14, 2021 1:53 AM
>> To: Sabra Ewing <SABRA1023 at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Sabra Ewing <sabra1023 at gmail.com>; Tracy Carcione
>> <carcione at access.net>; NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper
>>
>> I found some where it is 50 tags for $12, and the usable memory is 500 for
>> bites. That means you should be able to write 504 characters, which should
>> be enough. That would be about 50 words, which is a lot more than I could
>> get onto the package in braille. Way around charges about $60 for 25 tags
>> you can lock them so the data can't be changed but I might just leave mine
>> unlocked in case I ever want to update something. Hopefully putting text
>> on them won't be that complicated. If you have a cloud system where are
>> you store files, you can have the times link to those and have even more
>> instructions, but I want to be able to use my tags without needing the
>> Internet. If I leave my tags unlocked as well I can put them on a new
>> product and then change the date when the new product expires. I think
>> these ones I'm getting it don't work on metal. They don't say they do but
>> I don't really need them to work on metal. It would be really handy to put
>> one on a suitcase when you pack it as well as a link to a list of
>> everything that is in there so once you repack it again you can make sure
>> you didn't forget anything. I wonder if you can create one where the phone
>> will sound an alarm if you get too far away from it so you could put it to
>> your purse or your keys or something and an alarm would start blaring as
>> soon as you left without them? Perhaps you left your phone behind but you
>> have your keys, and then the alarm on the phone will start blaring to tell
>> you to come back and pick it up. Or you have your phone but you left your
>> keys in the same thing would happen. If you left them both behind
>> obviously it wouldn't work but it could be a fail safe if you remember one
>> of them but not the other one.
>>
>> Sabra Ewing
>>
>>> On Jun 13, 2021, at 10:17 PM, Sabra Ewing <SABRA1023 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't want to enter a password. I want the date to be ready and come
>>> to me as fast as possible. I don't want to have to remember a password to
>>> get it.
>>>
>>> Sabra Ewing
>>>
>>>>> On Jun 13, 2021, at 3:31 PM, Aaron Cannon via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for the correction! I'm glad to know that you can write as
>>>> well as read them.
>>>>
>>>> I'll just add one more interesting thing you can do with an NFC tag
>>>> on ios, is you can use it to trigger a task via the shortcuts app. I
>>>> haven't thought of a reason to do this yet, but it sounds cool. :)
>>>>
>>>> Thanks.
>>>>
>>>> Aaron
>>>> --
>>>> This message was sent from a mobile device
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> On Jun 13, 2021, at 10:31, charles.vanek at gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> I use an app on iPhone called NFC Tools.  There's a couple other good
>>>>> ones for iOS as well.  Reading & writing text is free on NFC Tools.
>>>>> Don't quote me but some features like writing a NFC tag that can
>>>>> automatically setup and connect to a wi-fi network you do need to pay,
>>>>> which isn't a NFC Tag standard thing, it's just how the app developers
>>>>> pays for their work.  I think for the most of us it's the text that is
>>>>> important.
>>>>>
>>>>> So yes.  An iPhone can write text to a NFC Tag for free.  And you can
>>>>> have unlimited tags and allow anyone's Smartphone or NFC tag reader
>>>>> read them.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are "password" options for NFC Tags.  This may also be a paid
>>>>> feature needed on the App.  But I have never used them.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'll also note that NFC stands for Near Field Communication.  And when
>>>>> they say near they aren't kidding.  The first set of NFC tags I bought
>>>>> I thought were bad or the app wasn't working.  The problem was actually
>>>>> that I was positioning the tag in the middle of the back of the iPhone
>>>>> when in fact the NFC reader on iPhone is at the top.  So you just kind
>>>>> of press the top of the phone on to the NFC tag.
>>>>>
>>>>> One of the great things about NFC tags though is it can be read through
>>>>> relatively thin material.  So if labeling a music collection the tag
>>>>> can be inside the case but likely can still be read without opening the
>>>>> case.
>>>>>
>>>>> So all you really need to buy is the NFC tags if you already have an
>>>>> iPhone or Android from say the last several years.  I do think Aaron is
>>>>> correct that some phones may only be able to read and not write, but I
>>>>> think iPhone 8 or beyond can do both read and write.  Google for your
>>>>> phone specifications to be sure.
>>>>>
>>>>> Enjoy!
>>>>> Charles
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Aaron Cannon via
>>>>> NFBCS
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, June 13, 2021 8:03 AM
>>>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Cc: Aaron Cannon <cannona at fireantproductions.com>; Tracy Carcione
>>>>> <carcione at access.net>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper
>>>>>
>>>>> Other than the amount of data that a tag can hold, there should be no
>>>>> limit. There may be a write limit, but I believe it's far beyond
>>>>> anything you might hit when just labeling things. Otherwise, you can
>>>>> use as many as you can buy. They are often used by the
>>>>> tens-of-thousands or more in industrial settings, so you should be
>>>>> fine.
>>>>>
>>>>> The tags can be read by any modern IPhone, and many Android devices. No
>>>>> other hardware is required for reading. For writing however, you will
>>>>> need a separate device.
>>>>>
>>>>> All that said, I have not personally tried any of this, so YMMV.
>>>>>
>>>>> Good luck.
>>>>>
>>>>> Aaron
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> This message was sent from a mobile device
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Jun 13, 2021, at 07:31, Tracy Carcione via NFBCS
>>>>>>> <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do NFC tags have any limits, other than the number of characters?  My
>>>>>> husband has a huge music collection.  He labels things with the Pen
>>>>>> Friend, but eventually he runs out of labels, way before he's run out
>>>>>> of things to label.  Could he label thousands of things with NFC tags?
>>>>>>  And what app reads the tags?
>>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: NFBCS [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>> nancy.l.coffman--- via NFBCS
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2021 6:45 PM
>>>>>> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
>>>>>> Cc: nancy.l.coffman at gmail.com
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Although Pen Friend is an alternative, keep in mind that Way Around
>>>>>> tags can also be reused. Pen Friend tags can only be used with the Pen
>>>>>> Friend device they were recorded with. WayAround backs up tag
>>>>>> information to your account in the cloud so if you upgrade your device
>>>>>> your tags can still be used.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nancy Coffman
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Sabra Ewing via
>>>>>> NFBCS
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2021 5:13 PM
>>>>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Cc: Sabra Ewing <sabra1023 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes those tags are just what I need. They do not need to be encrypted.
>>>>>> I don't care if someone else is able to access the data. If they need
>>>>>> the data on those tags then they should have it. It won't have
>>>>>> anything private on it. I know how to use these items already, but if
>>>>>> my anxiety gets big and I forget, then I needed to tell me. If the
>>>>>> tags would be big enough to put the instructions then I would want to
>>>>>> do that but I don't want to find that the tags are only big enough to
>>>>>> put one word. Even if I can't put all of the instructions that came
>>>>>> with, I would like to be able to put between 15 and 30 words. For
>>>>>> example, I would like to be able to put, anti-diarrheal: Two tabs with
>>>>>> first loose stool. One Tab with every loose stool after. No more after
>>>>>> two days. Exp date. Or I would like to put, rehydration salts: mix
>>>>>> packet with 1 L of water. Use within 24 hours. I have put Braille on
>>>>>> them in case I don't have my phone but I can't really fit that much.
>>>>>> Or with Band-Aids I know what they are but I don't know what size they
>>>>>> are and I don't want to put a lot of braille on them and make it
>>>>>> harder to get them out of the package. Somethings I don't have to
>>>>>> label like with my bottle of liquid skin I know what it is just by
>>>>>> feeling it but I'm not sure if I should label it in case my anxiety
>>>>>> goes haywire in an emergency. I don't know if I would forget
>>>>>> everything or not. But it is only for blisters and things like that so
>>>>>> if I forgot what it was when my anxiety was huge that might not be as
>>>>>> big of a deal. I have already been in an earthquake so I need to be
>>>>>> ready. Plus I live alone so I need to be able to access the items in
>>>>>> my larger first aid kit quickly if I ever need one. Plus I can't get
>>>>>> my first eight items confused with Vivian's first aid items because if
>>>>>> I ever gave her anything like aspirin or Tylenol thinking it was
>>>>>> Pepcid or Benadryl that would be very dangerous and she could die.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sabra Ewing
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jun 12, 2021, at 9:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS
>>>>>>>> <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Agree & thanks Aaron for putting a point on the size of most tags.
>>>>>>> The usable space on tags can vary.  Aaron’s message for example is
>>>>>>> about 270 characters with spaces & punctuation.  So a tag that is
>>>>>>> roughly 540 bytes would support his statement and maybe a little
>>>>>>> more.  The tags I have are 540 bytes and support according to the NFC
>>>>>>> Tools app I’m using is 491 bytes of that 540 total. This message I’ve
>>>>>>> written including this sentence is 491 bytes all the way up to the
>>>>>>> period  here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If that above paragraph is enough to describe what you need then the
>>>>>>> NFC tags may be your solution.  You could obviously use two tags for
>>>>>>> one description I suppose.  But you know your use case the best.  I
>>>>>>> did try looking up on Amazon for the tags I bought a year or more ago
>>>>>>> and can’t find them in my orders, so maybe I didn’t buy on Amazon.  I
>>>>>>> am seeing some around 50 cents, even some with backing so that you
>>>>>>> can use on metal surfaces which is another important point.  You can
>>>>>>> also research tags beyond 540 bytes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best of luck!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From: Aaron Cannon <cannona at fireantproductions.com>
>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2021 7:55 AM
>>>>>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Cc: charles.vanek at gmail.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sadly, this is an overestimation of the storage capacity of most NFC
>>>>>>> tags. You would, however, have enough room for a filename. So you
>>>>>>> could put the info inside files, and then store the name of the file
>>>>>>> in the tag. Not exactly a very fast solution though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Good luck.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.nfcinteractor.com/question/how-much-data-can-i-store-o
>>>>>>> n-a
>>>>>>> -
>>>>>>> tag/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This message was sent from a mobile device
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jun 12, 2021, at 07:40, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS
>>>>>>>> <nfbcs at nfbnet.org <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> > wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Sabra,
>>>>>>> I'm not a big fan of way around and way tags.  I do think you are
>>>>>>> in the right mindset though.
>>>>>>> Way tags are simply a proprietary NFC tag which uses durable &
>>>>>>> encrypted tags that only work with the Way Around app signed into the
>>>>>>> owners account.
>>>>>>> This makes their system both more expensive & less versatile to be
>>>>>>> used with multiple phones or if disconnected from the internet.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For first aide information the encryption of way tags is certainly
>>>>>>> not a concern.  So what I would suggest is you research NFC tags.
>>>>>>> Since these are an open standard, Apple and Android phones made in
>>>>>>> the last
>>>>>>> 3 or so years can all easily read them.  There are also various
>>>>>>> apps which can easily read & write data to them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> NFC tags can also be purchased fairly cheap on Amazon.  There are
>>>>>>> flexible adhesive tags about the size of a quarter but thin as
>>>>>>> braille paper.  They probably range in price from 20 to 30 cents
>>>>>>> each if bought in packs of say
>>>>>>> 10 - 20.  With these you can write out your instructions then
>>>>>>> stick right on to the bottles, boxes, tubes, etc.  I would also
>>>>>>> think there are options like way tags where it not adhesive backed
>>>>>>> but is something you could tie with a string onto items where the
>>>>>>> adhesive won't work; or you can I'm sure imagine a way to stick it
>>>>>>> to card stock and poke a hole for a string if needed to tie on.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Off the top of my head I can't remember how much data an NFC tag
>>>>>>> can hold, but I'm pretty sure first aide instructions will be able to
>>>>>>> fit.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best of luck,
>>>>>>> Charles
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> <mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> > On Behalf Of Sabra Ewing via
>>>>>>> NFBCS
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, June 11, 2021 10:45 PM
>>>>>>> To: nfbcs at nfbnet.org <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Cc: Sabra Ewing <sabra1023 at gmail.com <mailto:sabra1023 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Subject: [NFBCS] Accessible app like way around, but cheaper
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I need some way to label first aid items with lots of information
>>>>>>> and instructions where braille will not fit. I want to put all of
>>>>>>> the instructions that are on the product in an accessible format.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The way around app seemed like it would be a great option for what
>>>>>>> I needed, but the tags for it are so expensive. Is there something
>>>>>>> that uses a similar concept, but cheaper? I do not have a printer
>>>>>>> and even if I did, I wouldn't be able to tell what print it out so
>>>>>>> I would prefer to be able to get premade labels or tags, but for
>>>>>>> cheap. I was looking at some barcode labels that are cheap, but
>>>>>>> they seem to be for things like stores. I wish I knew of an option
>>>>>>> that would work without electricity during an emergency but this
>>>>>>> is the only thing I can think of. Attaching a page or two of
>>>>>>> braille to each item is not going to work because then I can't
>>>>>>> have a portable first aid kit. You might think you shouldn't need
>>>>>>> so many instructions because you should be able to use the item,
>>>>>>> but I want all of the instructions that are on the item just in
>>>>>>> case, and sometimes were talking about a small space like 2" x 2"
>>>>>>> where I can't write any type of instruction at all and can barely fit
>>>>>>> the name.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sabra Ewing
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> NFBCS mailing list
>>>>>>> NFBCS at nfbnet.org <mailto:NFBCS at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>> 0gm
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> il.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>
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