[Blindmath] JAWS and Nemeth - Newbie question

Fri Feb 18 19:52:44 UTC 2011

I have not done much work with braille technology, but I would imagine
that braille support could be implemented in a way which allows
mapping from MathML to the specific braille code used. The Lambda
project did this and, I believe, with some success. At least they are
the editor of choice in much of central and eastern Europe.
The LibLouis library has also done some work in the area as well as
LaTeX mapping.

The specifics of the braille support may not be as important as just
creating the discussion and making A.T. vendors aware of the demand
and need for math braille support.
Just creating an active dialog about braille support for math and
science within screen readers would be a major step forward,
regardless of the actual implementation, which would be the next step.
I will hopefully post back this weekend with petition details. I am
getting in touch with the gentleman who collected the signatures for
the WayFinder petition, for ideas and advice on how best to do this. I
have met him a few times and I hope he can give me tips and tricks.
I will post those and then someone can take charge of the project. I´d
be happy to do this myself, but if Jose, or someone else, wants to
lead the way I´d be happy to let them take over. I just think it is
vital that we get together and express our concerns.
Thanks and good weekend to all.
-Birkir

On 2/18/11, Neal <neal at duxsys.com> wrote:
> FYI:
> Unlike music braille, there is no standard braille math code for the world.
> It all depends on where you are.
>
> I think the term "math support" will mean different math braille codes to
> people in different places.
>  In the USA it will mean Nemeth braille code, in the UK it will probably
> mean the BAUK braille math code, in France it will probably mean the French
> braille math code, in much of Germany it will probably mean the Marburg
> braille math code.
>
> Cheers,
> Neal
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Jose Tamayo
> Sent: Friday, February 18, 2011 2:56 PM
> To: andrew.stacey at math.ntnu.no; 'Blind Math list for those interested in
> mathematics'
> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] JAWS and Nemeth - Newbie question
>
> I agree and would consider wording the statement in a way that positions
> certain standards such as Nemeth Code for Mathematics.  Certain vendors
> might decide that UEB is sufficient for Math support.
>
> I received a message recently asking to desist from requesting Nemeth Math
> support because UEB is the standard.  I urge that we find a way to work
> around those rejections / opinions.
>
> I was told that Dr. Nemeth is protecting his turf and that he would
> recommend his code.  My argument against it was that Nemeth Code is a
> standard and was accepted in 1972 and should be supported.  Beyond the
> issues of turf, the problem remains:  people that rely on the Standard
> Nemeth Code for Mathematics are not able to function because of the outrage
> about turf protection.  Quite frankly, I don't care about turf.  I care
> about facilitation and choosing a system that works for me.  If nemeth and
> UEB are standards, then they should be enabled in screen readers.
>
> I will add that, while my position might seem biased, I should remind that I
> started using nemeth about three years ago and thought it to be well
> structured.  I don't have an opinion on UEB only because I did not have the
> time to "play" with another standard.
>
> I digress!
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Andrew Stacey
> Sent: Friday, February 18, 2011 1:11 PM
> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] JAWS and Nemeth - Newbie question
>
> On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 05:34:03PM +0000, Birkir Rúnar Gunnarsson wrote:
>> What do people think about creating a web-based petition for screen
>> reader vendors to add Nemeth support for refreshable braille?
>
> This would also make it easier for sighted people to support you.  I don't
> feel that I could email a company directly and say "Support maths in your
> screen reader!" because I don't use a screen reader.  But I could sign
> a petition that said something like "Making maths accessible is extremely
> important and I support the petition to encourage companies to make their
> screen readers work with mathematics.".
>
> I suspect that you might get quite a bit of support from the wider
> mathematics
> community for that - we're well aware of the inherent difficulties in
> communicating mathematics and so are generally in favour of anything that
> removes barriers that have no reason to be there.
>
> Hmm, not sure if that makes sense.  What I mean is that we know well enough
> that there are already massive barriers to making mathematics available to
> all
> that where these barriers are external and have nothing to do with the
> mathematics itself, then we're all the more ready to tear them down.
>
> Andrew
>
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