[Blindmath] Performing calculations as a blind students, tips, tricks and advice for the NFB Youth Slam

Sharon Clark sharonjackson03 at comcast.net
Wed Jul 13 20:21:57 UTC 2011


Ken,

I agree with your statement that when using a reader/scribe for math one
needs a person with a math background.  When taking stats., I ran into the
same issue.  Now that I am a teacher of the visually impaired, I have my
students ask for a list of symbols and the equivalent name so that they
always have a reference on hand for the high school level. 

The students must have as many tools in their toolbox (low and high tech.)
to accomplish the task.  I always show a student the concrete method first
then they can use what method works for them.  For example, I have students
demonstrate their knowledge of graphs using a rubberized board with push
pins and rubber bands.  Once they understand the concepts, I show them how
to use the Audio Graphing Calculator.  The same goes for using an Abacus
before using the calculator.  On some assessments, the students are asked to
use mental math and are not able to use a calculator.  The Abacus is their
pencil and paper.

Sharon Clark, NJ TVI 
  

-----Original Message-----
From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Ken Perry
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 11:55 AM
To: 'Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics'
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Performing calculations as a blind students,
tips,tricks and advice for the NFB Youth Slam



I agree with this 100%.  I majored in Software Engineering and had to take
Matrixes, Trig, and three levels of Calculus.  I lost my site in the
military and was not a skilled Braille user.  So I did everything in a
scrolling calculator and a text editor. Assisted by a reader when I had
assignments I would do them my computer based method and have the reader
write them out.  Yes this was not an optimal solution but it got me through
math.  I was skilled in math since my field in the military was Electronics
and found that by the time I took Trig I was already able to do quite large
problems in my head.  The instructor used to call on me to tell him what
steps came next because he knew I kept up that well.  That or he just wanted
to see if he could  stump me.  That continued through Calculus.  I tried to
make sure to pick instructors that gave homework but did not require  it as
a grade.  This way I could do the amount of problems I needed to, to
understand each problem type without going nuts on repetitive work.  I would
only call the reader in if I had to either take a quiz, test or turn in some
homework which I found was pretty rare.

You might think I didn't learn much this way but I did turn around and help
my sons, daughters, and my brother all through math courses and in some
cases  equivalent courses.  I couldn't do a 3rd Integral today but I know
what one could be used for and I know where to find functions in math
libraries for my job if I need them.  I use math in coding almost every day
but I haven't had to have a reader for some time because in a coding job its
more if you use the fastest possible method and get the most accurate answer
not if you can write it out on a piece of paper.

When I was in college I also tutored for another blind student who had no
idea what a graph looked like.  This amazed me since we were in a college
setting I would have thought someone would have taught him earlier.  I
actually went to home depo cut up some peg board and created a large
graphing board we could work on.  That I think helped him more than anything
as he was getting going in  Algebra it's amazing what you can do with some
peg board, rubber bands, and golf pins.

I am only now learning nemeth Braille 20 years after I lost my site and I am
doing that for a project I am working on.  I am probably to slow at it to
make it very useful but I will give it a shot.

I will say though if you're going to use readers writers for your math make
sure they have a math background.  I had a reader in my trig class that was
an English major.  When I told her X^2+x-22=5 she wrote

X to the power of two plus x minus twenty two equals five

If you don't see what is wrong with what she wrote read character by
character and you will.  My trig teacher gave me a 96 on the test but he
said it took him 2 hours to grade the thing.  I doubt it took that long but
from that point on I always asked for someone who at least knew what I was
talking about.
 
Ken  


-----Original Message-----
From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Steve Jacobson
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 10:33 AM
To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics;
john.gardner at orst.edu
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Performing calculations as a blind students, tips,
tricks and advice for the NFB Youth Slam

Birkir,

I won't say too much about my experience as it predates the use of personal
computers as they are used today.  However, there are a couple of things
that 
I think are worth considering.  

Students need to have some idea of how much math they are going to take.
Nowadays, if one plans on majoring in math, for example, it is going to be 
worth their time to become familiar with some sort of math system such as
Latex to do their math, and students need to keep up with other
developments.  I 
am less certain, though, that this investment is worth it for students
trying to simply fulfill a math requirement for a major in another area.  I
have known 
students to get bogged down in trying to come up with an independent way of
dealing with accessibility issues at the expense of their coursework.  
Particularly if a student is using braille, knowing Nemeth Code, writing it
on paper and using a reader is still not an option to be ignored.  John's
point that 
when writing one may well use a relaxed form of Nemeth with their own
shorthand is a good one.  Becoming stuck on writing something the right way
when 
you are the only one reading it doesn't make sense.  The point needs to be
made that the most independent way of approaching a situation may not always

be the most efficient.  Also, when I was in school, the role of math in
other sciences such as physics required a completely different level of
rigor than did my 
math classes.  I gather this is still the case, and the role of calculating
and stastical software is going to play a more important role for someone
studying 
other sciences than will mathematical notation.  

I would also tell your students that if one is serious about taking a lot of
math, some of the investigation and learning of notation systems needs to
take place 
outside of ones classes and should best be done beforehand.  It doesn't wash
to say that one couldn't complete an assignment because one was still slow 
at using Latex or other notation system.  Yes, it is an additional level of
knowledge that we may have to deal with, but it is one that should and can
be 
anticipated.

Students have to think carefully about the role of a computer.  I still see
high school kids who are sighted using paper a lot to solve equasions.  This
doesn't 
mean there isn't a role for the computer, but thought has to be given to
what that role should be.  I have no doubt that the use of paper is going to
die out, 
especially with the flexibility of pad style computers, and in time that may
help us as well, but blind students have to realize that there isn't just
one answer, 
and part of their responsibility as students is to figure out the approach
that will work best for them.  While no approach is perfect, at least there
are some 
options, and that is exciting.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

On Tue, 12 Jul 2011 18:57:54 -0700, John Gardner wrote:

>Hello Birker, it is certainly possible to solve algebraic equations 
>using Latex notation, but that is pretty verbose and clumsy.  As is 
>just about every other standard notation.  Most blind people who have 
>to do this sort of thing seem to invent their own shorthand. Even 
>people who work in
braille
>often use shortcuts instead of official Nemeth.

>For years after losing my sight, I used an abbreviated form of Latex 
>for working out algebraic equations.  It worked but was pretty clumsy.  
>My
group
>developed WinTriangle with the purpose of reducing notation to a 
>minimum, and I used that for a while too.  It was really nice, having 
>single keystrokes for many common symbols such as Greek letters, 
>integral sign, raised symbols for superscripts, dropped symbols for 
>subscripts, etc.  It was the most compact way I have ever seen for 
>writing math on a computer. Unfortunately, Triangle also had 
>disadvantages, and they have meant that it is no longer a viable thing 
>with modern OS.  ChattyInfty is not quite as compact as WinTriangle, 
>but it is pretty close.  I would recommend it as
the
>best alternative that I know for writing and developing math equations 
>on a computer.  Among other benefits, you can cut, copy, and paste 
>parts of equations.  And copy them into separate files for pasting in a 
>number of times.  That's a great advantage when working with 
>complicated equations.

>Good luck with your tutorial.

>John

>-----Original Message-----
>From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org 
>[mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Birkir R. Gunnarsson
>Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 5:11 PM
>To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>Subject: [Blindmath] Performing calculations as a blind students, tips, 
>tricks and advice for the NFB Youth Slam

>Hey yea wise people.

>I am giving a presentation to the NFB Youth Slam students next week on 
>math accessibility and issues to deal with in college. There has been a 
>lot of talk and a lot of resources on reading math, and not 
>insignificantly, to writing math as well. However one thing I feel 
>often gets lost in the mix is techniques for actually performing 
>calculations and working one's way through equations in order to find a 
>solution i.e. the calculation part itself.
>I have some experience of course, but I'd be curious to hear what
>works for people around here, especially VI or blind folks who have
>completed STEM degrees in college.
>Did you use LaTeX, Nemeth or some other code to write your way through
>each step in the process of solving your calculations?
>If not, how did you do it?
>Is some software particularly useful for those (anyone remember
>Derive? It was a dos software and it saved my behind quite a lot in
>high school and college, but I am not even sure it is available any
>more, and it was too powerful for some things).
>I want to devote a few minutes to this in my presentation, but I am
>having trouble finding material that is not just based on my own
>experience.
>Any input is more than welcome.
>Cheers
>-B

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