[Blindmath] Nemetex

Sat Jun 8 13:44:55 UTC 2013

I just wanted to let everyone know that Paul and I are working
together to try and figure out how to make Math accessible for me, as
I will be going to Amherst this fall.
Thanks a lot Michael. I was wondering though if it would be difficult
switching over completely from Nemeth to LaTeX. If you were dealing
with a really long equation, wouldn’t this involve keeping a lot of
information in your head?

Thanks,
Shalini

On 6/7/13, Michael Whapples <mwhapples at aim.com> wrote:
> I never like going the route of total reliance on software, what if it
> does not work correctly? What if the software does not undertand the
> Nemeth and comes out with rubbish, yes the instructor will know
> something is wrong but will have no other way to find out than going
> back and saying it has not worked. In the worst case the software
> produces something which seems reasonable (IE. it makes sense as
> something) but does not mean the same as the original Nemeth, the
> instructor will assume the work is wrong. Someone (individual person)
> should always be able to validate what the software has done, which
> means someone should be able to understand both inputs and outputs. When
> I did my physics degree getting Braille versions of printed documents
> was a problem, the university was relying on the software to translate
> to Braille correctly which in most cases it was not, eventually I got so
> fed up with the situation I decided to learn LaTeX and try and implement
> my own software for reading LaTeX documents.
>
> As for software to produce tactile graphics on an embosser. I have
> mainly used ViewPlus embossers for tactile graphics, the main advantage
> being that they appear just as any other printer and so you can print
> from any software. Thus I (as a blind person) have been able to use
> software to produce my own diagrams (some LaTeX packages, SVGDraw, etc).
> Of course one needs to account for tactile graphics needing to be larger
> as the resolution is lower.
>
> Michael Whapples
> On 07/06/2013 15:18, Paul Chapin wrote:
>> I'd like people's reaction to this approach.  Generate the math using
>> Nemeth code and a notetaker.  Use Nemetex to convert that to either Mathml
>> or Latex and then print that out for the instructor. She would do her work
>> in Nemeth and neither her or the instructor would have to actually know
>> Latex or Mathml.
>>
>> As for charts and graphs, does anybody have any experience using an
>> embosser with software that can generate tactile graphics?
>>
>> Paul Chapin
>> Academic Technology Specialist
>> Amherst College
>>
>> From: Shalini Menon <shalini1394 at gmail.com<mailto:shalini1394 at gmail.com>>
>> Reply-To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindmath at nfbnet.org>>
>> Date: Friday, June 7, 2013 8:46 AM
>> To: 'Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics'
>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindmath at nfbnet.org>>
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Nemetex
>>
>> Thanks for all your help Sarah! I am trying to figure out LaTeX, because
>> I
>> feel like even if I don't use it now, I probably will find it useful at
>> some
>> point of time.
>> Are you still using a Pac Mate for Math? You had mentioned that you
>> studied
>> Economics in college as well. How did you work with the Graphs? In high
>> school all my diagrams were made using wikkistix on raised graph paper,
>> but
>> I've been wondering if there's another way.
>>
>>
>> Shalini
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Sarah
>> Jevnikar
>> Sent: 07 June 2013 05:37
>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Nemetex
>>
>> Hi there,
>> I found myself in your exact position 5 years ago: realizing with a jolt
>> that my public school days of having a braill-to-print and vice-versa
>> transcriber were nearly over and I needed an alternative way, preferrably
>> using Nemeth.
>>
>> I found Nemetex, and in spite of initial bumps and many emails to the
>> developers, I got it going. Here are some tips I've learned along the
>> way.
>>
>> Disclaimer: I was using JAWS 8 and up, a Braille Lite 40 which became a
>> Pac
>> Mate BX400, and Windows XP.
>>
>> Split your work into individual questions/sections. If errors do appear,
>> you
>> don't want to have to read through a giant file for one missing main-line
>> indicator. Not that I'd know anything about that ...
>>
>> Learn enough LaTeX to get by: sometimes you can fix your own errors this
>> way. Maybe you'll want to learn the whole markup language later, but at
>> least know how math symbols are rendered. Try a trial of Nemetex and
>> translate a file of your own work: you'll know what you wrote in Braille,
>> and you'll quickly learn it's more intuitive than you'd think.
>>
>> Most symbols are recognized now, but if you're using something obscure,
>> check the list of supported symbols in the user's guide.
>>
>> If you can't access a Braille display, get acquainted with how a .txt
>> braille file is read to you with speech. (for example, a punctuation
>> indicator is a _, the = sign is .k). That way, you can fix things from
>> your
>> desktop (either from within Nemetex itself or in Notepad). If you do have
>> a
>> Braille display, have it hooked up for proofreading purposes.
>>
>> I don't mean to scare you: I have successfully used Nemetex to complete
>> first (single-variable) and second-year (multi-variable) calculus,
>> statistics and economics. But any software comes with a few quirks, so
>> it's
>> best that you're aware of them now rather than 2AM six months from now,
>> the
>> day before an assignment's due (not that I'd know anything about that,
>> either) ;)
>>
>> Learning LaTeX is a good idea, but I'm still hesitant to take the plunge.
>> Reading my Nemetex output certainly has helped make it look less
>> intimidating.
>>
>> Happy studies,
>> Sarah
>>
>> ________________________________________
>> From: Blindmath
>> [blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org>] on
>> behalf of Shalini Menon
>> [shalini1394 at gmail.com<mailto:shalini1394 at gmail.com>]
>> Sent: June 5, 2013 12:49 AM
>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Nemetex
>>
>> Thanks everyone for the advice.
>> Aine, that was really really helpful! I think the braille note sounds like
>> a
>> good idea, because I love Nemeth and I'm really comfortable with it.
>> However, as I plan to study Economics in college as well, I will probably
>> need to do a lot of Stats. I'm thinking maybe I could learn to do math on
>> a
>> computer as well, so I can switch over when ever I need to.
>>
>> Shalini
>>
>>
>> On 6/5/13, Shalini Menon
>> <shalini1394 at gmail.com<mailto:shalini1394 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>> It's really nice to see you on the list!
>>  From what I've read, the braille note taker comes with a Perkins style
>> keyboard, which will make writing in Nemeth code easier. It also has a
>> refreshable braille display, so I will be able to read everything back
>> in Braille or Nemeth. As far as I know, it also has an inbuilt daisy
>> player, which I can use to read some of my textbooks. I had contacted
>> the Carroll Center and Susan Osterhaus to get more information about
>> the Braille note taker and I will forward their emails to you. I have
>> also contacted accessisoft, the company that makes Nemetex but am
>> still waiting to hear from them.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Shalini
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> Paul Chapin
>> Sent: 04 June 2013 20:35
>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Nemetex
>>
>> I've also been looking at Nemetex for this issue. However, I hate to
>> show my ignorance, but my impression was that the Perkins Brailler
>> produces hard copy output only and Nemetex needs an electronic file.
>> We'd have to switch to either a Braille notetaker or scan the printed
>> Braille. BTW, is there any way we can use a standard notebook to do
>> the functions of a braille notetaker? Conceptually it doesn't look
>> like they're that different.
>>
>> In the interest of full disclosure,  I've done some accessibility
>> support in the past but it hasn't been my primary responsibility so
>> I'm still in the process of bringing myself up to speed.
>>
>> Paul Chapin
>>
>>
>> From: Shalini Menon
>> <shalini1394 at gmail.com<mailto:shalini1394 at gmail.com><mailto:shalini1394 at gmail.com>>
>> Reply-To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindmath at nfbnet.org><mailto:blindmath at nfbnet.org>>
>> Date: Tuesday, June 4, 2013 12:15 AM
>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> <blindmath at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindmath at nfbnet.org><mailto:blindmath at nfbnet.org>>
>> Subject: [Blindmath] Nemetex
>>
>> Hello!
>>
>> I plan to major in Math and have been trying to figure out how I would
>> work out and submit my math assignments. I've previously used a
>> Perkins brailler to work out Math problems in Nemeth code. I've been
>> looking out for a programme that converts Nemeth code into print. Has
>> anyone used Nemetex?
>> I'm
>> not really sure how it works. I've heard that it works well with the
>> braille note and I've been thinking of getting the braille note apex.
>> Does Nemetex work well with this model?
>> I've also looked into learning LaTeX, but as a braille and Nemeth code
>> user, I'm not sure if this is the best option. I would really
>> appreciate any advice or suggestions.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Shalini
>>
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