[Blindtlk] National Federation of the Blind SecuresCourtRulingAgainst Cardtronics

[Chris Nusbaum]

Hi Gary,

I've had the opposite problem; they've put APS's at some of the 
busiest intersections in my area, but the traffic is so busy and 
the APS is so quiet that you can't hear the APS.  Because of 
this, I really still think that traffic sounds are the most 
reliable and accurate sources of information when lining up to 
cross a street.  I will post another message with a different 
subject line later, as I want to get opinions on a question I had 
about APS's.

Chris

"The real problem of blindness is not the loss of eyesight.  The 
real problem is the misunderstanding and lack of education that 
exists.  If a blind person has the proper training and 
opportunity, blindness can be reduced to a mere physical 
nuisance."
-- Kenneth Jernigan (President, National Federation of the Blind, 
1968-1986

 The I C.A.N.  Foundation helps blind and visually impaired youth 
in Maryland say "I can," by empowering them through providing 
assistive technology and scholarships to camps and conventions 
which help them be equal with their sighted peers.  For more 
information about the Foundation and to support our work, visit 
us online at www.icanfoundation.info!

 ----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Wunder" <GWunder at earthlink.net
To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Mon, 19 Dec 2011 20:42:17 -0600
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] National Federation of the Blind 
SecuresCourtRulingAgainst Cardtronics

Hi Kelby.  Perhaps your mind is already made up about the NFB's 
position on
audible traffic signals, and perhaps you understand the position 
very well.
My experience, however, is that most people simply believe that 
we are
opposed to them, without considering where we think they are 
appropriate and
what must be incorporated into their design so that they are not 
a hazard
for blind pedestrians.  There was certainly a time when I was 
uncomfortable
with our position about audible signals because I considered it 
so
inflexible that anyone with the least interest in installing them 
probably
would not talk with us.  I believe this changed in the 1990s, 
with our
acceptance of the vibro-tactile signals, and a changing 
environment which
made many streets less pedestrian friendly than they were 
previously.

When I was growing up, there were two audible traffic signals 
where I
traveled.  One Was a Block from the Kansas City Association for 
the Blind
and the second was two blocks from the Missouri school for the 
blind.  Both
of those audible signals used a shrill buzzer which sounded for
approximately 5 seconds.  Both were so loud that they totally 
obscured the
sound of traffic.  Even a person who has never studied physics 
knows that
the most important thing to know before crossing the street is 
not the color
of the light but the presence or absence of a moving vehicle in 
one's path.

Perhaps such signals would never have been developed or would 
quickly have
been replaced by more suitable instruments had we taken a less 
firm stance,
but I have to tell you that listening to the politicians talk 
about how
those signals made their cities more blind friendly did not set 
well with
me, especially when they were more of an impediment than they 
were a help.
I don't know that such signals still exist, and I've personally 
been on
committees where we've recommended the installation of a 
signaling device
that the blind can use.  In those cases where our recommendation 
has been
accepted, I think the signals are both useful and non-obtrusive.

My apology if you knew most of this already.

Gary



-----Original Message-----
From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
Sent: Monday, December 19, 2011 6:27 PM
To: Blind Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] National Federation of the Blind Secures
CourtRulingAgainst Cardtronics

Not to be terribly pedantic--because this is good news--but it
seems to me that the NFB can be a little selective in its
campaign for access to mainstream technolog.  I'm thinking here
of the NFB's well-known and longstanding opposition to audible
walking signals--signals which the sighted have access to.  I
could likely as not come up with other examples.


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