[Blindtlk] Yesterday's Encounter of the Southwest Airlines Kind

Peter Donahue pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com
Sat Jun 4 17:40:21 UTC 2011


Hello Steve and everyone,

    Yesterday I finally bought Mary's ticket for her flight to Orlando for 
the national convention. Several of the agents I spoke with were surprised 
that I did not purchess hers and my ticket at the same time. I made no bones 
about telling them that it was thanks to their Customer of Size Policy that 
we were forced to do it this way. To get the best rate for her fare we'll be 
taking separate flights home on the 10th. On the good side Mary will be on 
the same flight as one of our other chapter members leaving me behind to 
check out and be sure we remove all of our belongings from the room before 
leaving for home.

    Whenever we arrive home we're always tripping over each other trying to 
unintentionally race to see who can get totally unpacked first. With her 
arriving before me she'll have the chance to unpack and settle down without 
my being in her way. However it would have been nice if we could have 
traveled too and from Orlando together.

When buying Mary's ticket was finished the conversation turned to my 
treatment by Southwest two years ago. I let the agent know that I understood 
he was a reservations agent and not a power that be for that airline and I 
didn't want him to feel I was trying to take it out on him. For those who 
would want to treat me like a child be assured the conversation remained 
civil between him and several other agents. Sebastian told me that the phone 
conversation was being recorded and that they were very much interested in 
customer feedback and not to feel bad about airing my concerns.

    To put it short and sweet I told him that Southwest would do well to 
install wider seats on their new planes and any planes whose interior is 
slated to be upgraded particularly with the merger of Southwest and Airtran. 
Sebastian told me that he understood that their newly-purchased Boeing 
737-800 aircraft are supposed to have wider seats and a much  more roomier 
cabin. A story that aired on our 10:00 news last night confirms what he told 
me as American is currently taking delivery of the same aircraft model. He 
even admitted that the whole customer of size policy has caused lots of 
problems for that airline.

    Having disgruntled large customers with service animals in the picture 
only makes things worse. I told him that their statement about the space a 
service animal can occupy in the airplane cabin was what caused me to 
believe that they would automatically block off one of the seats next to me 
and there would be no need for me to pay for it and that this point needs to 
be clarified so others will not be trapped in the same sea of confusion. He 
responded by saying that the whole customer of size policy has become very 
tricky. I told him that I agreed and reiterated that installing wider seats 
on all of their planes will fix this situation for all concerned. It will 
insure that all can fly on that airline regardless of size and as a residual 
benefit will insure that there will be ample room for service animals at a 
passenger's seat particularly if the animal is rather large. The Air Carrier 
Access Act (ACAA) does state that if a service animal is too large to travel 
in the cabin an airline may require the animal to be transported in the 
hold. If an airline has wider seats and corresponding floorspace for each 
passenger the likelihood of this happening will be reduced.

    As for the equipment several of their agents heard from me concerning 
the damage to it in 2009. I had just bought it about a month before the 2009 
convention. Everything made it to Detroit intact but one of my wireless mic 
transmitters and several of the mics themselves were damaged due to 
mishandling by Southwest's cargo personnel and machinery. When we traveled 
to Kansas later that year I kept the equipment pack with me until I got on 
the plane at which time I gave it to a cargo person so it could be placed in 
the hold. They returned it to me when I got off the plane thus the equipment 
remained under my control for most of the trip. The Southwest agents told me 
that I could most likely keep the equipment with me prior to boarding the 
plane but that I should check concerning retrieving it at the gate after we 
deplane. If they can return a passenger's wheelchair to them at the gate 
they ought to be able to return a pack containing sensitive recording 
equipment to its owner the same way. I told them that if we can follow the 
same procedure Delta used when we traveled to Kansas that should protect the 
equipment from further harm. Another plus this time around is that both of 
our flights between San Antonio and Orlando are non-stop so there'll be less 
handling of my equipment by Southwest's baggage handling system. additional 
travel insurance wouldn't hurt either.

    As for transporting such sensitive equipment on a commercial airline 
folks know that we've been exploring the use of private air charter for 
future trips. Currently such a proposition remains out-of-reach for most 
individuals but there are changes a foot that promise to change that. Being 
able to travel privately would solve many issues for fliers such as seating 
concerns, issues related to service animals )It's a common practice of air 
charter companies to allow pets to travel in the cabin with their owners so 
traveling with a guide dog shouldn't be an issue) and passengers can still 
have access to their belongings including sensitive equipment during flight. 
I told the Southwest folks that they had two potential air charter 
passengers should they decide to offer private charter in the future. Delta, 
British Airways, and Lufthansa all ready offer private charters to 
complement their scheduled service. Perhaps Southwest and other airlines 
should consider doing the same and pricing it so many more people can avail 
themselves of this opportunity. For what we paid to travel to Orlando next 
month for a little more we could charter a four-passenger jet and flown to 
Houston or Dallas for a day. If divided over four people it works out to 
about $600.00 per person. This is a situation where it's all about 
convenience not price. A Southwest agent named Jan even admitted that flying 
is no longer what it was at one time and didn't blame me for seeking an 
alternative to schedule service to recapture those days. She told me she had 
been around the airline industry for over 20 years and observed many of the 
changes many of them for the worse and didn't blame people for wanting a new 
way to fly.

    Finally I told them I was aware of their technique for telling 
disgruntled passengers to "Sit down and shut up", but of course not in those 
exact words.) If they thought they were going to make me feel better by 
offering me free flights I told them that they picked the wrong passenger to 
try that stuff on. I told them that the only way I would consider their 
having "Made things right" with me is when the language in their service 
animal policy was clarified as to what large passengers with service animals 
should do with respect to a second seat is concerned and that the 
installation of wider seating that will accommodate passengers of any size 
would be a better investment than giving away vouchers for free travel while 
these issues go on unresolved. The only conditions under which I would 
except such travel vouchers is if the situation that caused my inconvenience 
was beyond an airline's control weather and air traffic congestion for 
example. Rather than give angry large passengers free travel vouchers they 
would do well to invest that money in fixing the source of their complaint 
I.e. installing wider seats on all of their planes something that would also 
benefit passengers traveling with large guide dogs too. I believe they 
realized they had a live one on their hands and didn't have much to say 
after taking so much cannon from me. If they felt I was being rude and 
wasn't worth talking to I wouldn't have been able to discuss this situation 
along with the purchess of Mary's ticket with so many agents. Perhaps one of 
them was a supervisor.

    There you have it. Let's see what goes down at crunch time. All the 
best.

Peter Donahue




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve P. Deeley" <stevep.deeley at insightbb.com>
To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2011 10:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest


In the 1970's, I would bet most business had problems dealing with service
animals.  At that time it was a matter of education.  As far as sensitive
electronic equipment, I don't think I would transport that sort of equipment
in that manner.Steve
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com>
To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2011 9:55 PM
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest


> Hello Steve and everyone,
>
>    If you read all of the messages on this post you would have seen some
> examples. Here's hoping that this will be the first and last time we'll
> have
> to deal with them!
>
> Peter Donahue
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Steve P. Deeley" <stevep.deeley at insightbb.com>
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2011 7:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>
>
> How about giving us some examples of "mistreatment".  I'll take free all
> day
> long if the company made an honest mistake.
> Steve
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Peter Donahue" <pdonahue2 at satx.rr.com>
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 12:08 PM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>
>
>> Good morning everyone,
>>
>> Their horrendous treatment of passengers with special needs goes beyond
>> the
>> accessibility of their Web Site.     In addition to the blind large
>> passengers know this all too well!Yours truly knows this from personal
>> experience. I'm mentioning this issue as it illustrates a pattern of
>> behavior by Southwest and other airlines.
>>
>>    Just a word to the wise. Whenever a passenger receives less than
>> favorable treatment by this airline they have a crafty way of telling
>> disgruntled fliers to "Sit down and shut up" by issuing them vouchers for
>> free travel! My advice, don't fall for his crap!Other airlines did this
>> whenever blind passengers were mistreated by giving them vouchers for
>> free
>> travel. Fortunately the NFB told them that this stuff wouldn't fix the
>> problem and Southwest needs to hear the same message. We once sued them
>> for
>> $10,000,000 due to their mistreatment of a passenger with a guide dog
>> back
>> in the early 1970s.
>>
>>    Southwest believes that issuing passengers vouchers for free travel is
>> a
>> way for them to "Make it right" so they can continue to do their "Dirty
>> work." If you asked me this is nothing but a form of appeasement and
>> absolute horsepuckey! If Southwest and other airlines can afford to give
>> away free travel to discontented passengers they can afford to make their
>> Web site accessible, implement better cargo handling procedures to
>> prevent
>> damage to sensitive items such as professional recording equipment,
>> install
>> wider seats on their planes (Especially the new aircraft they currently
>> have
>> on order and those they will obtain due to their merger with
>> Airtran),work
>> with organizations such as the NFB to insure that their personnel know
>> the
>> best ways to assist blind passengers, the list goes on.
>>
>>    Again if anyone experiences ill treatment by Southwest or any airline
>> and is told to "Sit down and shut up" in the form of the issuance of
>> vouchers for free flights don't fall for it! Let them know that you will
>> only consider them having "Made things right" with you by their doing
>> nothing less than fixing the problem that caused your dissatisfaction
>> with
>> them in the first place.
>>
>>    By the way the line "Sit down and shut up" comes from Dr. Maurer. He
>> gave a speech in 1986 in which he repeated it over and over again.
>>
>> Peter Donahue whose fuze from mistreatment by Southwest Airlines two
>> years
>> ago is still lit and who is not looking forward to having to fly with
>> them
>> again.
>>
>>
>> Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Bryan Schulz" <b.schulz at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 9:41 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>>
>>
>> hi,
>>
>> so a resolution was passed.
>> "we strongly urge"' doesn't mandate squat!
>>
>> Bryan Schulz
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "David R.Stayer" <davidandloristayer at verizon.net>
>> To: <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 9:17 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>>
>>
>>> Perhaps w4e caN GET AN UPDATE AT CONVENTGION.
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: cheryl echevarria <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
>>> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>>> Date: Friday, May 27, 2011 06:03:35 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes but many people have been having issues with the Southwest.com
>>>> website, this issue has not been rectified, when I use the website, it
>>>> is
>>>> not recognizable either I have to call Southwest.com and the
>>>> reservationists don't know anything about it.
>>>>
>>>> But it is not that accessible.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Leading the Way in Independent Travel
>>>>
>>>> Cheryl Echevarria
>>>> http://www.Echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
>>>> 631-456-5394
>>>> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
>>>> CST-1018299-10
>>>> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise and
>>>> Travel,
>>>> Inc.
>>>>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>   From: David R.Stayer<mailto:davidandloristayer at verizon.net>
>>>>   To: blindtlk at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>   Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 9:11 AM
>>>>   Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>   We passed a resolution regarding this issue last year.
>>>>
>>>>   ----- Original Message -----
>>>>   From: mr. hooper
>>>> <james_hooper at earthlink.net<mailto:james_hooper at earthlink.net>>
>>>>   To:  <blindtlk at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindtlk at nfbnet.org>>
>>>>   Date: Friday, May 27, 2011 02:58:10 AM
>>>>   Subject: [Blindtlk] nfb and southwest
>>>>
>>>>   >
>>>>   >
>>>>   > greetings all federationists am i correct that their was an issue
>>>> between nfb and southwest?
>>>>   >  at one time up to a week ago   their site had a link that made it
>>>> very usable.  they hav since moved the link to a different screen
>>>> making
>>>> it vertually imposible  to book a flight i was just wondering what
>>>> nfb's
>>>> sbance had been with accessability of their website.
>>>>   >   i have contacted both southwest and their response was we don't
>>>> have to comply with scrreen readers. i also contacted nfb's answer line
>>>> in terms of technology so hopefully they can fesove the issue.  when i
>>>> first contacted southwest a week ago i wasn't confruntational at all,
>>>> i
>>>> just wanted to point out that at one time their site worked quite well.
>>>>   > _______________________________________________
>>>>   > blindtlk mailing list
>>>>   > blindtlk at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>   >
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org>
>>>>   > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for
>>>> blindtlk:
>>>>   >
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/davidandloristayer%40verizon.net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/davidandloristayer%40verizon.net>
>>>>
>>>>   Each day is a precious gift.
>>>>   David R. Stayer,  LCSW-R
>>>>
>>>>   _______________________________________________
>>>>   blindtlk mailing list
>>>>   blindtlk at nfbnet.org<mailto:blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org>
>>>>   To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> blindtlk:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotmail.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotmail.com>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> blindtlk mailing list
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>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> blindtlk:
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>>>
>>> Each day is a precious gift.
>>> David R. Stayer,  LCSW-R
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
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>>
>>
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>
>
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> 02:34:00
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> _______________________________________________
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