[Blindtlk] Refusal To Use A Cane

Tue Dec 18 16:50:00 UTC 2012

Hi, David. I should have read further before posting. It seems you already
said what I later tried to say.

Warmly,

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of David Evans
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 5:54 PM
To: blinddog3 at charter.net; Blind Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Refusal To Use A Cane

Dear All,

Under the ADA, a person can not be forced to accept a accommodation they do
not wish to have or use.
You can lead a horse to water, but you can not make him drink.

Forcing anyone to do something they do not want to do is the wrong way to go
about changing a mind.
I have dealt with this issue many times in the past, with showing others, by
example, what they need to do to be successful with dealing with Blindness.
People don not want to carry a cane for many reasons and until that person
is ready to change their mind set, you are wasting your time trying to put a
hammerlock on them to let you screw a cane handle into their hand.
You need to show them with a good example and keep putting forth the
question, " which is better, to bump into everything you come to or use a
travel aid to help you detect and avoid things in your path.
Most people, I find, do not want to carry a cane as it tells everyone they
are blind and can not see.  People resist crossing that line because they
have not really crossed that line in their own mind, or they are at least
afraid to cross that line, mentally and accept their Blindness.
It is a blow to their pride and a come down they have not yet come to grips
with and they will resist accepting it.
It must come in its own time.  We can only provide good examples to these
people and offer our wisdom and patience until they are ready to change.

We need to keep showing the example and asking the question as to what is
better and remind them that they do not have to reinvent the wheel, just do
what the successful Blind people do.
If you drive them away, you can not help them at all.

David Evans and GD Jack.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Johnson" <blinddog3 at charter.net>
To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2012 8:36 AM
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Refusal To Use A Cane

> Peter,
> Although I am not an attorney, I am well-versed in the ADA, and with all 
> due
> respect, I do not believe the ADA has any application here as the concept 
> of
> direct threat, applies to Title I, covering provisions of employment; not
> Titles II or III.  It's a choice by this individual to go out into public
> without the use of an aide such as a cane, or guide, but their choice is
> sighted guide.  They are not posing a risk to anyone but themselves, but I
> can assure you that if this person was employed, the application might be
> viable.
>
> Steve
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Peter
> Donahue
> Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2012 6:53 AM
> To: nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> Cc: NFBnet Blind Talk Mailing List; Daniel Carr; NFBnet Blind Law Mailing
> List; NFB of Florida Internet Mailing List
> Subject: [Blindtlk] Refusal To Use A Cane
>
> Good morning everyone,
>
>    An who belonged to our Florida Affiliate recently moved to San Antonio
> and wishes to join our chapter. This person is totally blind and 
> absolutely
> refuses to use a cane. They recently showed up at our Christmas party and
> had to be helped in to and out of the meeting room we used for this event.
> Members were surprised when they discovered that this person showed up
> without their cane. When later questioned about this the person began 
> giving
> us all manner of excuse. They told us that their neurologist and past O&M
> instructors recommended against the use of the cane due to this person's
> having seizures. This individual attended Perkins along with a number of
> other schools for the blind. I know for a fact that at least while at
> Perkins this individual lived in a cottage with another person who also 
> has
> seizures and is one of the best travelers I know. Like this person, the
> confident cane user is totally blind and is someone I came to know well. 
> The
> individual in question undoubtedly met many other successful blind cane
> users with other disabilities. I myself have seizures and sleep apnea and
> use both a cane and a dog depending on the situation.
>
>    The individual refusing to use their cane has all ready been told by
> several members in the area that if they wish to visit them the/she must
> bring their cane and use it to get from their transportation in to our
> residence and if necessary use the cane during their visit.
>
>    When attempting to reason with the person in question members have been
> accused of "Bullying" them and have heard all excuses in the book why 
> he/she
> cannot use a cane proficiently. The individual has been told that
> neurologists are not qualified to determine whether or not the use of a
> travel aid can effect one's seizures. The evidence to the contrary is over
> whelmingly against this horsepuckey. As we also know not all blindness
> professionals have true belief in the capabilities of the blind. This
> individual obviously had a few such persons in their life to sell them 
> short
> on their ability to travel independently and on the importance of using a
> cane or a dog. The individual has been told that if they show up at any of
> our homes without their cane we will call them a cab and promptly send 
> them
> home at their expense something they can avoid simply by listening to 
> reason
> and using their cane whenever traveling. We're busy people. The last thing
> we need to have to do is take someone to the emergency room when we know
> that an individual has complete disregard for their personal safety and as
> negligent. It seems like direct threat provisions of the ADA may apply in
> this situation where public venues are concerned. The lawyers can help us
> wit this one.
>
>    We want to help this person achieve a higher degree of independence and
> be an active member of our chapter. While we won't prohibit them from
> joining us they'll be a more effective contributor to the cause if they
> would embrace the alternative techniques of blindness and use them
> regularly. Thanks for your help and suggestions.
>
>
> Peter Donahue
>
> "No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper."
> Isaiah 54:17
>
> "While for our princes they prepare
> In caverns deep a burning snare,
> He shot from heaven a piercing ray,
> And the dark treachery brought to day."
> Anonymous
>
>
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