[Blindtlk] Braille

Thu Jan 25 08:04:02 UTC 2018

I can live with ueb, I just wish b.a.n.a. had done work on standards for 
bookkeeping.  Anyone who has taken college-level accounting and uses 
braille knows what I'm writing about here and if anyone needs a 
reminder, properly braille an adjusted trial balance with all of those 
columns please.
The computer-using professionals were neglected too with respect to data 
flow diagrams and entity relation diagrams and uml diagrams probably 
among others by now I know nothing about.  What's the symbol for a cloud 
in braille or a bubble or an arrow with writing inside it?  No standard 
for flowcharts either.  As a result I used hipo diagrams and system 
narratives to handle what I had to handle earlier.  There's a symbol in 
data flow diagrams that is described by sighted people as a home plate. 
What is that symbol's actual name and standardized braille equivalent? 
The book on nemeth code National Braille press produced with symbols and 
descriptions has missing names descriptions and examples for some of 
those symbols though reading through it was helpful.  I just wish I had 
that book in my hands in 1972 when I started algebra and geometry.

On Wed, 24 Jan 2018, Cory McMahon via blindtlk wrote:

> Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2018 21:55:25
> From: Cory McMahon via blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List' <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Cory McMahon <cory.j.mcmahon at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Braille
> 
> I, too, wish they hadn't changed to UEB.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jasmine
> Kotsay via blindtlk
> Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 2:30 AM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Jasmine Kotsay <jasmine.kotsay at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Braille
>
> Hi,
> 	I am also a proponent of Braille.  It is unfortunate that the BANA
> changed the version of Braille we read to UEB.  I have been experiencing
> this type of change since I am trying to be a TVI.  I prefer the version of
> Braille that I learned when I was six, 23 years ago.  I feel as though
> Braille is the only way to be truly literate.  When listening to audio
> books, which I love, I realize that I cannot understand how certain names,
> places, and words are spelled.  This is not a good thing.  I believe that
> having words at your fingertips is extremely important.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Marianne Haas via blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org Date sent: Sat, 20 Jan
> 2018 10:52:46 -0800
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Braille
>
> Good Morning,
> My name is Marianne and I live in Northern CA.  I learned Braille early on
> and several different languages.  I am retired from teaching students with
> visual impairments.  I am definitely a proponent of braille.
>
> There is one thing I did not see in this discussion:
> Teachers of students with visual impairments have huge case loads,
> especially if they have to travel to different schools.
> Therefore, they
> leave the teaching of braille to Assistants or encourage the students not to
> learn braille.  Parents need to be forceful in demanding that braille is
> being taught.  I also found that students do not want to learn braille as
> they do not want to be different.  I always let those students know, that
> they can learn something exciting and they have something sighted students
> do not have.  For myself, I never got in trouble when I read at night when I
> was supposed to be sleeping.  My Sister always was caught reading as her
> lamp was hot, while mine was cold.
>
> I started my own little business, tutoring especially students with special
> needs and advocating for parents of students with special needs in my area.
> I do a lot business with bartering services.  In fact, I hope I will get
> more clients.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Judy Jones
> via blindtlk
> Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018 10:29 AM
> To: 'Annely Rose'; 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
> Cc: Judy Jones
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Braille
>
> You are so right about everything you do with braille.  My husband and I do
> the same,although we also use the audio.  Audio is secondary to braille, and
> really not necessary.  We grew up in an age where we were adults before
> large-scale audio was available, went to college, and held down professional
> positions, all without relying heavily on audio, but braille.
>
> We use braille for bookkeeping, and there is nothing like holding a little
> on in your lap while you both read a print/braille book.
>
> When in a new city or having moved to a new area, I make braille notes when
> familiarizing myself to an area, so I can go back to them very conveniently.
>
> AT the job working for the state from which I recently retired, I was the
> office manager, plus had my own case load, ran my own budget, ran a small
> supplies store, and assisted another colleague.  Braille helped me to get
> all this done quickly and efficiently.
>
> Judy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Annely Rose
> via blindtlk
> Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018 10:05 AM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Cc: Annely Rose
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Braille
>
> Well said, Judy.  Thank you for your response.
>
> Annely
> --------------------------------------------
> On Sat, 1/20/18, Judy Jones via blindtlk <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Braille
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> Cc: "Judy Jones" <sonshines59 at gmail.com
> Date: Saturday, January 20, 2018, 1:00 PM
>
> Hi,
>
> I would recommend you getting information from  the National Organization
> Of  Parents Of  Blind Children www.nopbc.org.
>
> I would also encourage you to ask this question  on the NFB Blind Educators
> list.
>
> My background is as school
> teacher, parent, and person who has had ten and a  half years'
> experience
> in the blindness  field.
>
> First of all people
> need to understand that braille is "text" read  with the fingers.  It is
> not a language.  It need not be slower than reading print.
> It
> is a literacy tool, while audio is not.  Different parts of  the brain are
> used when reading braille or  print, and if you use audio only, no matter
> how  proficient you are at it, you are functionally "illiterate."  This is
> not a  slam  on any individual personally, just a given fact, since  braille
> is a  literacy tool.
>
> Phrases like "learn
> braille," and "use braille," should be out  the door, and exchanged for the
> simple verb,  "read," because that is what it is, plain and
> simple:  reading.
>
> Blind adults and children learning to
> "read" need to work at it
> consistently, 20 minutes daily, just as their  sighted counterparts are
> taught in school.  Print and braille are BOTH forms of reading, and if you
> practice,  you will succeed.
>
> Question:  Would any sighted
> parent be satisfied if a school declared that  their children would be
> relegated to audio  experience only?  I think not!
>
> Audio only learners are spotted early, because  of poor spelling,
> punctuation, and document  layout.  Granted, screen readers have all the
> tools for you to check these things, but a  person has no concept of a
> realtime document  if they are audio learners only.
>
> I am acquainted personally with a child who has  very limited vision, but
> because there is  some vision, braille was not encouraged.  This elementary
> school child, according to the  parents, has never seen a whole word or
> sentence, does not have a concept of what that  looks like, as the child can
> only see one  letter at a time with a magnifier.  After speaking with  my
> husband and I, the parents are getting  serious about getting their child
> some good  braille training.
>
> Also, I
> have seen figures that state in this country that out of the blind persons
> who are competitively  employed, approximately 90% read using braille.  The
> earlier one is exposed to  braille, no matter how young or level of  visual
> acuity, the better.
>
> "If you can read, you can lead."
>
> Can you tell, I am a proponent
> of braille.  :)
>
> Judy
>
>
> -----Original
> Message-----
> From: blindtlk [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
> On Behalf Of adrijana
> prokopenko via
> blindtlk
> Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018
> 12:19 AM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Cc: adrijana prokopenko
> Subject: [Blindtlk] Braille
>
> What do you consider great when it comes to  introducing, promoting and
> using  braille and  what would you use to encourage the future generations
> to do  so  and for some special ed teachers and the  public to realize that
> braille is  as  important as print and should be viewed as such.
>
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