[Ct-nfb] Can you stop using this forum for your personal opinions and negativity

Sandee Kush slkush93 at att.net
Fri Nov 9 22:49:32 UTC 2012


Those of you having the ACB discussion relative to the  HR, would it be
possible for you to
1,  Develop a group email to converse back and forth?
2.  Once again, email the person directly that  you want to debate or
whatever 
3.  Create a blog

I am sure I speak for many of those on the list serve.  Personally, I am
revising my opinion of people based on their comments, developing concern
about leadership skills and just plain bewildered that anyone thinks this is
a constructive dialogue.

Please do not respond to me on the List serve.
And please...stop the "public" debate.
Thank you.   

-----Original Message-----
From: Ct-nfb [mailto:ct-nfb-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of ntwales
Sent: Friday, November 09, 2012 12:19 PM
To: ct-nfb at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [Ct-nfb] FW: ACB Resolution on H.R. 3086

Rich - Thank you for your excellent message.
Chris - I couldn't disagree with you more on several points.  First, though,
I should state that, like Justin, I too received a national scholarship from
ACB while an undergrad and attended their national convention.  I did meet
many pleasant, articulate, and successful members there--and most were
pleasant and welcoming to me even though they knew clearly that I was an NFB
member.  I spoke a couple of months later with President Maurer about this,
and he was glad I went, and he showed no animosoty towards the ACB during
our conversation.  Also before moving to Connecticut, as an NFB leader in
California I worked closely with ACB leaders on a handful of joint issues,
including establishing a separate rehabilitation agency for the blind and
increasing availability of public transit, and I found everyone pleasant to
work with and, on other matters such as the level of access to public rights
of way, pleasant to disagree with.  Now:
1. You wrote, "I've met people at national convention who are members of
both NFB and ACB--although Dr. Maurer [you gave him the title doctor; he
himself does not and I endeavor not to; his brother interestingly enough
holds a doctorate] would certainly excommunicate them if he found out."
While President Maurer would support excommunicating these dual members, it
isn't about him.  The NFB constitution forbids such dual membership.  This
is an organizational constitutional matter, and I think most members would
agree that, just like you can't be registered as a Republican and a
Democrat, you can't be a dual member--and, as we practiced at our state
convention, our NFB could vote to change that about our constitution if we
ever changed our minds.
2. You wrote, "ACB's decision not to support HR 3086 is hardly comparable to
Hitler gassing the Jews or the English exterminating Native Americans."
While Hitler gasing the Jews (he also gased the
disabled) and the English killing Native Americans on their face seem like
extreme examples, they are both predicated upon the same belief that some
human life is less valuable than other human life.  ACB deliberating to be
silent is more properly comparable to those in Nazi Germany who remained
silent while the Holocaust went on around them, while trains and marches of
prisoners passed their towns and woods and churches.  How Nazi Germany rose
to such power personally fascinates me, and maybe we've heard a small
insight into how.  Who will be left to stand up for the ACB...
3. You mention the statistic that few blind people are paid less than the
minimum wage under the infamous Section 14(c).  This is a tired argument,
and with Rich's public admission I now know of three NFB of CT leaders who
were devalued by this provision.  And it's not just Goodwill, of course,
like Semens and Phillips weren't the only users of concentration camp labor
in Nazi Germany, but they are the worst--they'd have you think they're a
charity!  The other two NFB of CT members were devalued at shops not
affiliated with Goodwill.  Knowing so many blind people who have been
devalued by this provision, in the context of this clip from the ACB
convention I, as a thoughtful Republican and regular viewer of Fox News (I
knew it was over when they called it for Obama!), will never think of the
99% and the 1% the same way again...
Best,
Nathanael

On 09.11.2012 11:03, Richard McGaffin wrote:
> --- On wrote:
>
>> From: Chris Kuell <ckuell at comcast.net>
>> Subject: Re: [Ct-nfb] FW: ACB Resolution on H.R. 3086
>> To: "NFB of Connecticut Mailing List" <ct-nfb at nfbnet.org>
>> Date: Friday, November 9, 2012, 8:33 AM
>>
>> I know many ACB members who are capable, competent blind people.
>> They believe in independence, Braille, and the right of all blind
>> people to become active members in the workplace and society. Marcia
>> dresser, who used to live in Connecticut and was the first VP of the
>> ACB here, worked with us to help pass a Braille bill back in 1999. I
>> was on several BESB committees with her, and I admire Marcia and her
>> husband Steve, also blind and an active ACB member, very much. I've
>> met people at national convention who are members of both NFB and
>> ACB--although Dr. Maurer would certainly excommunicate them if he
>> found out. Again, these are capable, competent, admirable blind
>> people, who are networking and not judging people by affiliation,
>> but rather by character.
>>
>> I see the ACB and NFB as completely analogous to republicans and
>> democrats. Both groups have a vision for our country, but they have
>> different ideas on how to get there. Neither side is evil, although
>> I have my doubts about the folks at Fox news, but for some reason,
>> people get fired up when they feel they have an enemy, which is how
>> far too many NFBers and ACBers react. I've studied both
>> organizations, and choose to be an NFB member because I think our
>> philosophy best matches my own personality. But I don't think the
>> ACB is wrong, just different. I would summarize this way: The NFB
>> wants training and opportunities for blind people, while the ACB
>> wants understanding and accommodations.
>>
>> I listened to the ACB audio clip, twice, and I find it fascinating
>> how different people react to the same stimuli. I didn't hear any
>> slamming of the NFB, I just heard a single sentence saying 'it's an
>> NFB bill'. The sentence wasn't said with love or enthusiasm, and in
>> fact probably held a little disdain, but I certainly wouldn't call
>> it slamming.
>>
>> ACB's decision not to support HR 3086 is hardly comparable to Hitler
>> gassing the Jews or the English exterminating Native Americans. It's
>> a decision based on facts, math, and mission. NIB doesn't pay blind
>> workers below minimum wage. Good will does, but by my
>> calculation,it's very few blind people. The large majority of the
>> few hundred disabled workers who receive below minimum wage are
>> multi-disabled, almost all with severe cognitive disabilities. And
>> the small percentage of blind people who are included in this class
>> are also multi-disabled, with blindness the least of their troubles.
>> Traditionally, the NFB has not fought on behalf of other
>> disabilities, and DR. Maurer himself told me personally that 'it
>> dilutes our message'. The NFB has decided to fight on behalf of
>> people with other disabilities in taking on HR 3086, while the ACB
>> has decided that they won't. It's not evil, it's simply a different
>> viewpoint.
>>
>> Deb, are you sorry you asked? Smile.
>>
>> chris
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ct-nfb mailing list
>>
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