[Electronics-talk] Captias
cheez
cheez at cox.net
Fri Apr 27 03:18:13 UTC 2012
One problem I find is that I don't know if there are supposed to be spaces
between letters or words in captchas. Also, are some of the letters
uppercase or lowercase?
The best one I found was at a site that played a phrase from a movie or news
report, and they had you type 3 words that you hear. It didn't matter if
they were in the correct order or not. To bad that isn't a uniform practice
for all websites. I know I'd love it.
Vince
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chelsey Duranleau " <cduranleau88 at gmail.com>
To: <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 6:16 AM
Subject: [Electronics-talk] Captias
> Hi Julie,
>
> Usually what I do is put on headphones and crank up the volume really
> loud.
> Usually the numbers / letters you have to type in are louder than the
> other
> backwards symbols (or at least what some of them sound like to me). Hope
> this helps! :)
> Chelsey
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
> electronics-talk-request at nfbnet.org
> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:00 PM
> To: electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Electronics-talk Digest, Vol 72, Issue 28
>
> Send Electronics-talk mailing list submissions to
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Keeping On Topic (David Andrews)
> 2. Alternatives to Windws and ... [was "Re: Tissot vibrating
> watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]"] (Christopher Chaltain)
> 3. Re: Keeping On Topic (Christopher Chaltain)
> 4. Re: Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports
> Watch"]
> (tina birenbaum)
> 5. Re: Alternatives to Windws and ... [was "Re: Tissot vibrating
> watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]"] (tina birenbaum)
> 6. System Access (Tony Sohl)
> 7. Re: Keeping On Topic (Jenny Keller)
> 8. Re: Alternatives to Windws and ... [was "Re: Tissot vibrating
> watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]"] (Jenny Keller)
> 9. Re: Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]
> (Jenny Keller)
> 10. Re: Alternatives to Windws and ... [was "Re: Tissot vibrating
> watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]"] (tina birenbaum)
> 11. Re: System Access (JULIE PHILLIPSON)
> 12. capchas (JULIE PHILLIPSON)
> 13. Re: Alternatives to Windws and ... [was "Re: Tissot vibrating
> watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]"] (Jenny Keller)
> 14. Re: capchas (Gerald Levy)
> 15. Re: capchas (Beverly Hunter)
> 16. iPhone Discussions (Beverly Hunter)
> 17. Re: capchas (Baracco, Andrew W)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2012 21:30:31 -0500
> From: David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com>
> To: electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Keeping On Topic
> Message-ID: <auto-000057557722 at mailfront4.g2host.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> List Members,
>
> Discussions of the economics of blindness, employment etc., are off
> topic for this list. Please keep to the proper topics, the
> accessibility of electronics and home appliances. Otherwise people
> get discouraged and unsubscribe.
>
> David Andrews, Moderator
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2012 21:47:32 -0500
> From: Christopher Chaltain <chaltain at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Alternatives to Windws and ... [was "Re:
> Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports Watch"]"]
> Message-ID: <4F961444.8090107 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> For me, I run Ubuntu and use Orca/Speakup/Emacspeak on my PC, so I don't
> pay the expensive up front costs for a Mac, and I don't have to pay for
> Windows or a a screen reader. Another option would be NVDA, a free
> screen reader for Windows. I guess you'd have to upgrade Windows
> periodically, but Windows releases are supported for much more than 2
> years, and I don't understand at all why you'd have to upgrade a PC and
> Windows more frequently than a Mac.
>
> As stated before, I don't agree with the rest of your rant. I don't see
> how a watch maker who makes a braille or vibrating watch for the blind,
> and prices it the same as the rest of their watches, is doing anything
> wrong. In fact, I think it's just the opposite. If more companies did
> what Seico, Wenger and Tissot did then we'd have even more choices as
> blind consumers. Since they're making quality watches, making
> modifications to them so the blind can use them, and not jacking up the
> price over their other watches, I guess you could say they're already
> doing what you suggest because as others have said, with the lower
> demand, they're not going to recover the additional cost in making those
> watches accessible. Of course, I have no idea what the markup is on
> these watches or how much it costs to make a limited run of
> braille/vibrating watches.
>
> I can't speak to what other blind people get in other countries or what
> other disability groups get in the US, so I won't even comment on that.
> I suspect you have a lot of legitimate gripes, but if it all hinges on
> the fact that a luxury watch maker is making a luxury watch that just
> happens to be usable by the blind and they choose to continue to charge
> luxury prices for their watches then I think you need to find a better
> argument.
>
> On 23/04/12 19:23, Jenny Keller wrote:
>> Well, I can tell you that I have had to use Apple products as my main
> screen reader and cell phone because it's the only thing that doesn't cost
> a
> bloody fortune every two years to update.
>>
>> Yes, I've had to spend more up front than the apple, but I'll be able to
> use it much longer than any PC you can buy, and I don't have to pay
> hundreds
> of dollars for screen reader updates each year.
>>
>> As for the watches. Again, to get one of any quality, you gotta pay for
> it, and to get one that looks half way decent you also have to pay quite a
> bit of money, which makers of these adaptive aids know most of us don't
> have.
>>
>> If there are such things are rich blind people, maybe they need to spread
> some of the wealth around and help those of us who can't work have things
> that are of better quality. Yes, I've gotten watches and little aids from
> the state, but they've all been of lesser quality than someone of means
> would buy, and they don't look near as nice either.
>>
>> that, in my opinion, is where other countries have us beat in so many
> ways. they provide computers for people in australia because they know
> that
> you can't live without them anymore in society, etc.
>>
>> the people in wheelchairs and deaf get more adaptive equipment and
> consideration and for free than the blind and it sucks and isn't equality
> by
> a long shit.
>>
>> sorry to rant but I'm generally frustrated with the whole situation about
> equality for the disabled. As far as the blind are concerned, there is no
> such thing.
>>
>> Jenny
>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 6:46 PM, Drew Hunthausen wrote:
>>
>>> Jenny,
>>> I agree with everything your saying as I am a poor college student.
> However,
>>> you have to consider that it is very expensive to make something
>>> specifically for the blind as we are such a small population. I
>>> currently
>>> cannot afford the more expensive Tissot watch, but I can understand the
>>> merits of making a upscale watch that can both serve the blind as well
>>> as
>>> sited people who want to spend the money. Companies do this as to
>>> attract
> a
>>> more diverse population in effort to stay in business. I also wish
>>> things
>>> were less expensive and we had just as many options as our sited peers.
>>>
>>> Drew
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jenny Keller
>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 4:26 PM
>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>>>
>>> When 70 percent of the blind population is unemployed and that statistic
> is
>>> probably a little higher. It is rediculous to expect us to have the
> money
>>> to purchase quality adaptive equipment.
>>>
>>> the fact is, the things the state provides are not the highest of
> quality,
>>> and on fixed incomes, most blind people can't afford a seco, not to
> mention
>>> the kind of watches you're talking about.
>>>
>>> I don't see anything wrong with living with your parents to save money,
> but
>>> for those of us who don't have that option and are barely surviving,
>>> it's
> a
>>> kick in the teeth when any accessable product, watch or not, isn't
> available
>>> to them in any kind of quality, unless you have a job. Which I said
> before
>>> since 70 percent of us are unemployed, it's a kick in the teeth.
>>>
>>> JMO,
>>>
>>> Jenny
>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 5:45 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm not sure I understand this message. There are blind people across
>>>> the economic spectrum, so there are plenty of blind people who could
>>>> afford to or choose to purchase such a watch, whether they live at
>>>> home or not. Furthermore, I don't think there's anything wrong with
>>>> someone living at home, and if they save enough on living expenses
>>>> that they can afford such a watch, more power to them. IMHO, this is a
>>>> personal decision that each person has to make based on their own
>>> situation.
>>>>
>>>> On 23/04/12 16:13, Tone wrote:
>>>>> yeah. not everyone lives at homewith mom and dad, and could blow 300
>>>>> on a watch.
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller"
>>>>> <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 2:52 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Nothing is wrong with that. I just don't think you should have to
>>>>>> be rich to have a quality watch that doesn't scream I'M BLIND, look
>>>>>> at me or hear me check the time. I also don't think you should have
>>>>>> to pay huge amounts of money to get a watch that isn't ugly, or a
>>>>>> watch that works right when it's not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> sorry for the rant. I'm on a fixed income, have health problems
>>>>>> that preclude me from working, and frankly, feel screwed out of most
>>>>>> blindness related options because I'm not rich enough to afford them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It doesn't work that way in other countries, and this great USA
>>>>>> aught to follow suit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 12:25 PM, Baracco, Andrew W wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What's wrong with a blind person being rich?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Andy
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 6:14 AM
>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>> Talking Sports Watch"]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, as I think I said in a previous message, I'm not sure this
>>>>>>> watch was intended solely for the blind. I've also read that it was
>>>>>>> meant for the businessman who didn't want to be seen checking her
>>>>>>> watch or the sportsman who wasn't able to look at their watches face
>>> for some reason.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Remember too that this is a Tissot. They aren't going to make a
>>>>>>> cheap watch.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Finally, although a lot of blind people are on fixed incomes, not
>>>>>>> all of them are. I'm not going to say I can afford this watch
>>>>>>> myself, but I think it's a good thing that a company that makes
>>>>>>> quality watches, like Tissot, makes a watch that a well to do blind
>>>>>>> person could aspire to own someday. If someone can't afford a
>>>>>>> Tissot, there are other options out there.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 07:32, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>>>>> sorry, but I find it rediculous that a watch that is helpful for
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> blind, who a lot of us are on fixed incomes, costs that much.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I guess it's for those who just have jobs and/or money to burn.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:11 AM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> As I said in the attached email, Amazon is again selling the
>>>>>>>>> Tissot Silen-T watch. This is the watch that a blind person can
>>>>>>>>> use to tell time by feeling vibrations on the watches face. It's
>>>>>>>>> currently selling for $470, but it was selling for $350, as a
>>>>>>>>> promotional deal,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> a few weeks ago.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I found it on Amazon just using Google, but if anyone wants, I
>>>>>>>>> can rerun my Google search and post the specific links.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure what the Tissot Vibren watch does, but I suspect the
>>>>>>>>> poster was thinking of the Silen-T watch.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 06:56, Stephen guerra wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> I believe you can only get the tissot vibrating watch from ebay
>>>>>>>>>> as they are not actively being sold anymore and they run over
>>>>>>>>>> $200
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 2:20 AM
>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not familiar with the Tissot Vibren watch, and I wasn't able
>>>>>>>>>> to find it via Google, but in the Tissot T-Touch series, the
>>>>>>>>>> Silen-T is
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> the accessible vibrating watch that a blind person could use.
>>>>>>>>>> The other watches in the series vibrate, but not in a way that
>>>>>>>>>> you could
>>>>>>> tell the time.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The Tissot Silen-T is available again, but the $349 price from
>>>>>>>>>> Amazon was a promotional price that ended at the end of March.
>>>>>>>>>> It looks like the current price is around $469.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 21/04/12 19:01, Alan Siman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It was probably the Tissot vibren watch which apparently has
>>>>>>>>>>> come back on the market for $349.00 at amazon (I think).
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/21/2012 4:27 PM, Annette Carr wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been looking for a vibrating watch. I came across one
>>>>>>>>>>>> advertised a very long time ago that some how vibrated as you
>>>>>>>>>>>> ran your finger around the outside rim of the face, but cannot
>>>>>>>>>>>> find it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> any more. I don't like talking watches because I also do not
>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone to hear that I am checking the time, and many times I
>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot hear what it says because of my hearing loss.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I struggle with braille watches as I have some loss of feeling
>>>>>>>>>>>> in my hands.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny Keller
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 4:14 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> don't ask em where, but I could swear I have seen a water
>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant, or water proof sports watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I can't remember where cause it's been a long time since I
>>>>>>>>>>>> looked for a talking watch as I hate them with a passion.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm 4 feet 11 inches and the faces on them are just too big,
>>>>>>>>>>>> no matter where I look.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, I don't want everyone and their mother to know if I want
>>>>>>>>>>>> to check the time during church or something like that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I had one that I liked cause the face was blue and I really
>>>>>>>>>>>> liked the way it looked, but it actually started running
>>>>>>>>>>>> backwards and wouldn't sinc with the talking part, and
>>>>>>>>>>>> quidckly after that happened the talking part went berserk too.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh well, I'm stuck with a braille watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2012, at 6:12 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check out this inexpensive talking sports watch from Future
> Aids.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>> not water resistant (I don't think there are any water
>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant talking timepieces on the market because there is no
>>>>>>>>>>>> way to prevent water from penetrating the speaker), but at
>>>>>>>>>>>> $14.95 with free shipping, it is a good deal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.braillebookstore.com/view.php?T=Talking+Sports+Wat
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ch
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gerald
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Chao"
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mattchao at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 7:03 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am also looking for same.--Matthew Chao
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> At 11:11 PM 4/20/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been trying to find a high quality talking sports
>>>>>>> watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am hoping to find one that is somewhat water resistant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and am
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hoping to find something like a nice Seiko or something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>> that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would love some of the nice sports watches on the market
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now but they are not talking watches so I am unfortunately
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>> looking.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you know of something I would really appreciate it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks so much and sorry for my ramblings :) Linnie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/andre
>>>>>>> w.bar
>>>>>>> acco%40va.gov
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlper
>>>>>>> due3%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/high10
>>>>>> sion%40sbcglobal.net
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltai
>>>>> n%40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue
>>>> 3%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
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>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/dhunthausen%40
>>> gmail.com
>>> -----
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>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gma
> il.com
>
>
> --
> Christopher (CJ)
> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2012 21:55:32 -0500
> From: Christopher Chaltain <chaltain at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Keeping On Topic
> Message-ID: <4F961624.6080709 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Sorry David. I sent another message on the economics of blindness and PC
> alternatives to the list. I think I was composing it when this message
> came in. I apologize to you and the list for sending out that last
> message and the previous messages I sent on the topic. I should have
> realized early on that I wasn't going to change anyone's opinions, and I
> was just going to repeat myself. I also apologize if I slighted anyone
> or unintentionally made light of anyone's situation. Again, I apologize,
> and I hope no one left the list due to my poor behavior.
>
> On 23/04/12 21:30, David Andrews wrote:
>> List Members,
>>
>> Discussions of the economics of blindness, employment etc., are off
>> topic for this list. Please keep to the proper topics, the
>> accessibility of electronics and home appliances. Otherwise people get
>> discouraged and unsubscribe.
>>
>> David Andrews, Moderator
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gma
> il.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Christopher (CJ)
> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2012 23:09:55 -0400
> From: tina birenbaum <tinabir at samobile.net>
> To: electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
> TalkingSports Watch"]
> Message-ID: c9c1314a-3ce0-4209-b34f-a0a420b38d90 at samobile.net
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed"
>
> These vibrating watches probably could appeal to a wider audience if
> people botherd with marketing. I am sure someone would buy one, some
> people who just can and like collecting stuff, others who would
> actually use it. that would bring
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 01:01:40 -0400
> From: tina birenbaum <tinabir at samobile.net>
> To: electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Alternatives to Windws and ... [was
> "Re: Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports
> Watch"]"]
> Message-ID: 002924b7-ae30-46f7-910c-ae682043d278 at samobile.net
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed"
>
> There's also system access which has a screen reader in it as well as
> many other things in the package and best of all the company offers
> payment plans. That's how i was able to get it. and it's very nice to
> have life time updates that just go to all users so you don't have to
> pay what some of the companies want just for updates.
> Original message:
>> For me, I run Ubuntu and use Orca/Speakup/Emacspeak on my PC, so I don't
>> pay the expensive up front costs for a Mac, and I don't have to pay for
>> Windows or a a screen reader. Another option would be NVDA, a free
>> screen reader for Windows. I guess you'd have to upgrade Windows
>> periodically, but Windows releases are supported for much more than 2
>> years, and I don't understand at all why you'd have to upgrade a PC and
>> Windows more frequently than a Mac.
>
>> As stated before, I don't agree with the rest of your rant. I don't see
>> how a watch maker who makes a braille or vibrating watch for the blind,
>> and prices it the same as the rest of their watches, is doing anything
>> wrong. In fact, I think it's just the opposite. If more companies did
>> what Seico, Wenger and Tissot did then we'd have even more choices as
>> blind consumers. Since they're making quality watches, making
>> modifications to them so the blind can use them, and not jacking up the
>> price over their other watches, I guess you could say they're already
>> doing what you suggest because as others have said, with the lower
>> demand, they're not going to recover the additional cost in making those
>> watches accessible. Of course, I have no idea what the markup is on
>> these watches or how much it costs to make a limited run of
>> braille/vibrating watches.
>
>> I can't speak to what other blind people get in other countries or what
>> other disability groups get in the US, so I won't even comment on that.
>> I suspect you have a lot of legitimate gripes, but if it all hinges on
>> the fact that a luxury watch maker is making a luxury watch that just
>> happens to be usable by the blind and they choose to continue to charge
>> luxury prices for their watches then I think you need to find a better
>> argument.
>
>> On 23/04/12 19:23, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>> Well, I can tell you that I have had to use Apple products as my main
>>> screen reader and cell phone because it's the only thing that doesn't
>>> cost a bloody fortune every two years to update.
>
>>> Yes, I've had to spend more up front than the apple, but I'll be able
>>> to use it much longer than any PC you can buy, and I don't have to pay
>>> hundreds of dollars for screen reader updates each year.
>
>>> As for the watches. Again, to get one of any quality, you gotta pay
>>> for it, and to get one that looks half way decent you also have to pay
>>> quite a bit of money, which makers of these adaptive aids know most of
>>> us don't have.
>
>>> If there are such things are rich blind people, maybe they need to
>>> spread some of the wealth around and help those of us who can't work
>>> have things that are of better quality. Yes, I've gotten watches and
>>> little aids from the state, but they've all been of lesser quality than
>>> someone of means would buy, and they don't look near as nice either.
>
>>> that, in my opinion, is where other countries have us beat in so many
>>> ways. they provide computers for people in australia because they know
>>> that you can't live without them anymore in society, etc.
>
>>> the people in wheelchairs and deaf get more adaptive equipment and
>>> consideration and for free than the blind and it sucks and isn't
>>> equality by a long shit.
>
>>> sorry to rant but I'm generally frustrated with the whole situation
>>> about equality for the disabled. As far as the blind are concerned,
>>> there is no such thing.
>
>>> Jenny
>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 6:46 PM, Drew Hunthausen wrote:
>
>>>> Jenny,
>>>> I agree with everything your saying as I am a poor college student.
> However,
>>>> you have to consider that it is very expensive to make something
>>>> specifically for the blind as we are such a small population. I
> currently
>>>> cannot afford the more expensive Tissot watch, but I can understand the
>>>> merits of making a upscale watch that can both serve the blind as well
> as
>>>> sited people who want to spend the money. Companies do this as to
> attract a
>>>> more diverse population in effort to stay in business. I also wish
> things
>>>> were less expensive and we had just as many options as our sited peers.
>
>>>> Drew
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jenny Keller
>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 4:26 PM
>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>
>>>> When 70 percent of the blind population is unemployed and that
>>>> statistic
> is
>>>> probably a little higher. It is rediculous to expect us to have the
> money
>>>> to purchase quality adaptive equipment.
>
>>>> the fact is, the things the state provides are not the highest of
> quality,
>>>> and on fixed incomes, most blind people can't afford a seco, not to
> mention
>>>> the kind of watches you're talking about.
>
>>>> I don't see anything wrong with living with your parents to save money,
> but
>>>> for those of us who don't have that option and are barely surviving,
> it's a
>>>> kick in the teeth when any accessable product, watch or not, isn't
> available
>>>> to them in any kind of quality, unless you have a job. Which I said
> before
>>>> since 70 percent of us are unemployed, it's a kick in the teeth.
>
>>>> JMO,
>
>>>> Jenny
>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 5:45 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>
>>>>> I'm not sure I understand this message. There are blind people across
>>>>> the economic spectrum, so there are plenty of blind people who could
>>>>> afford to or choose to purchase such a watch, whether they live at
>>>>> home or not. Furthermore, I don't think there's anything wrong with
>>>>> someone living at home, and if they save enough on living expenses
>>>>> that they can afford such a watch, more power to them. IMHO, this is a
>>>>> personal decision that each person has to make based on their own
>>>> situation.
>
>>>>> On 23/04/12 16:13, Tone wrote:
>>>>>> yeah. not everyone lives at homewith mom and dad, and could blow 300
>>>>>> on a watch.
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller"
>>>>>> <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 2:52 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>
>
>>>>>>> Nothing is wrong with that. I just don't think you should have to
>>>>>>> be rich to have a quality watch that doesn't scream I'M BLIND, look
>>>>>>> at me or hear me check the time. I also don't think you should have
>>>>>>> to pay huge amounts of money to get a watch that isn't ugly, or a
>>>>>>> watch that works right when it's not.
>
>>>>>>> sorry for the rant. I'm on a fixed income, have health problems
>>>>>>> that preclude me from working, and frankly, feel screwed out of most
>>>>>>> blindness related options because I'm not rich enough to afford
>>>>>>> them.
>
>>>>>>> It doesn't work that way in other countries, and this great USA
>>>>>>> aught to follow suit.
>
>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 12:25 PM, Baracco, Andrew W wrote:
>
>>>>>>>> What's wrong with a blind person being rich?
>
>>>>>>>> Andy
>
>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 6:14 AM
>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>>> Talking Sports Watch"]
>
>>>>>>>> Well, as I think I said in a previous message, I'm not sure this
>>>>>>>> watch was intended solely for the blind. I've also read that it was
>>>>>>>> meant for the businessman who didn't want to be seen checking her
>>>>>>>> watch or the sportsman who wasn't able to look at their watches
>>>>>>>> face
>>>> for some reason.
>
>>>>>>>> Remember too that this is a Tissot. They aren't going to make a
>>>>>>>> cheap watch.
>
>>>>>>>> Finally, although a lot of blind people are on fixed incomes, not
>>>>>>>> all of them are. I'm not going to say I can afford this watch
>>>>>>>> myself, but I think it's a good thing that a company that makes
>>>>>>>> quality watches, like Tissot, makes a watch that a well to do blind
>>>>>>>> person could aspire to own someday. If someone can't afford a
>>>>>>>> Tissot, there are other options out there.
>
>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 07:32, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>>>>>> sorry, but I find it rediculous that a watch that is helpful for
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> blind, who a lot of us are on fixed incomes, costs that much.
>
>
>>>>>>>>> I guess it's for those who just have jobs and/or money to burn.
>
>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:11 AM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>> As I said in the attached email, Amazon is again selling the
>>>>>>>>>> Tissot Silen-T watch. This is the watch that a blind person can
>>>>>>>>>> use to tell time by feeling vibrations on the watches face. It's
>>>>>>>>>> currently selling for $470, but it was selling for $350, as a
>>>>>>>>>> promotional deal,
>
>>>>>>>>>> a few weeks ago.
>
>>>>>>>>>> I found it on Amazon just using Google, but if anyone wants, I
>>>>>>>>>> can rerun my Google search and post the specific links.
>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure what the Tissot Vibren watch does, but I suspect the
>>>>>>>>>> poster was thinking of the Silen-T watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 06:56, Stephen guerra wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> I believe you can only get the tissot vibrating watch from ebay
>>>>>>>>>>> as they are not actively being sold anymore and they run over
>>>>>>>>>>> $200
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 2:20 AM
>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not familiar with the Tissot Vibren watch, and I wasn't able
>>>>>>>>>>> to find it via Google, but in the Tissot T-Touch series, the
>>>>>>>>>>> Silen-T is
>
>>>>>>>>>>> the accessible vibrating watch that a blind person could use.
>>>>>>>>>>> The other watches in the series vibrate, but not in a way that
>>>>>>>>>>> you could
>>>>>>>> tell the time.
>
>>>>>>>>>>> The Tissot Silen-T is available again, but the $349 price from
>>>>>>>>>>> Amazon was a promotional price that ended at the end of March.
>>>>>>>>>>> It looks like the current price is around $469.
>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 21/04/12 19:01, Alan Siman wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> It was probably the Tissot vibren watch which apparently has
>>>>>>>>>>>> come back on the market for $349.00 at amazon (I think).
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/21/2012 4:27 PM, Annette Carr wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been looking for a vibrating watch. I came across one
>>>>>>>>>>>>> advertised a very long time ago that some how vibrated as you
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ran your finger around the outside rim of the face, but cannot
>>>>>>>>>>>>> find it
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more. I don't like talking watches because I also do not
>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone to hear that I am checking the time, and many times I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot hear what it says because of my hearing loss.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I struggle with braille watches as I have some loss of feeling
>>>>>>>>>>>>> in my hands.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny Keller
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 4:14 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't ask em where, but I could swear I have seen a water
>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant, or water proof sports watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can't remember where cause it's been a long time since I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> looked for a talking watch as I hate them with a passion.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm 4 feet 11 inches and the faces on them are just too big,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> no matter where I look.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, I don't want everyone and their mother to know if I want
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to check the time during church or something like that.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I had one that I liked cause the face was blue and I really
>>>>>>>>>>>>> liked the way it looked, but it actually started running
>>>>>>>>>>>>> backwards and wouldn't sinc with the talking part, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> quidckly after that happened the talking part went berserk
>>>>>>>>>>>>> too.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh well, I'm stuck with a braille watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2012, at 6:12 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check out this inexpensive talking sports watch from Future
> Aids.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> not water resistant (I don't think there are any water
>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant talking timepieces on the market because there is no
>>>>>>>>>>>>> way to prevent water from penetrating the speaker), but at
>>>>>>>>>>>>> $14.95 with free shipping, it is a good deal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.braillebookstore.com/view.php?T=Talking+Sports+Wat
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ch
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gerald
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Chao"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mattchao at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 7:03 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am also looking for same.--Matthew Chao
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> At 11:11 PM 4/20/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been trying to find a high quality talking sports
>>>>>>>> watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am hoping to find one that is somewhat water resistant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and am
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hoping to find something like a nice Seiko or something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>> that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would love some of the nice sports watches on the market
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now but they are not talking watches so I am unfortunately
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>> looking.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you know of something I would really appreciate it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks so much and sorry for my ramblings :) Linnie
>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/andre
>>>>>>>> w.bar
>>>>>>>> acco%40va.gov
>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlper
>>>>>>>> due3%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/high10
>>>>>>> sion%40sbcglobal.net
>
>
>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltai
>>>>>> n%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue
>>>>> 3%40gmail.com
>
>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/dhunthausen%40
>>>> gmail.com
>>>> -----
>>>> No virus found in this message.
>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>> Version: 10.0.1424 / Virus Database: 2411/4954 - Release Date: 04/23/12
>
>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>
>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gma
> il.com
>
>
>> --
>> Christopher (CJ)
>> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/tinabir%40samo
> bile.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2012 23:07:43 -0700
> From: "Tony Sohl" <tonysohl at cox.net>
> To: <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] System Access
> Message-ID: <D226C6E0C9A5488BA093ED2186C7F64C at melissac300ff8>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Does the company offer a demo to try for 30 days or can I order a disc
> from
> and does it conflict with other software programs? How does it do with
> Captuas??
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 07:39:34 -0500
> From: Jenny Keller <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Keeping On Topic
> Message-ID: <7CED81DF-B033-4105-A4A9-4E6D90A526B0 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Sorry,
>
> It was nt fault. Please except my sincerest apology.
>
>
> Jenny
> On Apr 23, 2012, at 9:30 PM, David Andrews wrote:
>
>> List Members,
>>
>> Discussions of the economics of blindness, employment etc., are off topic
> for this list. Please keep to the proper topics, the accessibility of
> electronics and home appliances. Otherwise people get discouraged and
> unsubscribe.
>>
>> David Andrews, Moderator
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 07:49:11 -0500
> From: Jenny Keller <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Alternatives to Windws and ... [was
> "Re: Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports
> Watch"]"]
> Message-ID: <0F5352D1-237F-412D-BEA0-4ACE6D34024C at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> I supposedly have SA and am still making payments on it but it's not
> working
> on any of our PC's or the thumb drive.
>
> I have to call them this week and find out why, or tell them that my
> payment
> contract is null and void since it hasn't worked in almost a year.
>
> Jenny
> On Apr 24, 2012, at 12:01 AM, tina birenbaum wrote:
>
>> There's also system access which has a screen reader in it as well as
>> many
> other things in the package and best of all the company offers payment
> plans. That's how i was able to get it. and it's very nice to have life
> time
> updates that just go to all users so you don't have to pay what some of
> the
> companies want just for updates.
>> Original message:
>>> For me, I run Ubuntu and use Orca/Speakup/Emacspeak on my PC, so I don't
>>> pay the expensive up front costs for a Mac, and I don't have to pay for
>>> Windows or a a screen reader. Another option would be NVDA, a free
>>> screen reader for Windows. I guess you'd have to upgrade Windows
>>> periodically, but Windows releases are supported for much more than 2
>>> years, and I don't understand at all why you'd have to upgrade a PC and
>>> Windows more frequently than a Mac.
>>
>>> As stated before, I don't agree with the rest of your rant. I don't see
>>> how a watch maker who makes a braille or vibrating watch for the blind,
>>> and prices it the same as the rest of their watches, is doing anything
>>> wrong. In fact, I think it's just the opposite. If more companies did
>>> what Seico, Wenger and Tissot did then we'd have even more choices as
>>> blind consumers. Since they're making quality watches, making
>>> modifications to them so the blind can use them, and not jacking up the
>>> price over their other watches, I guess you could say they're already
>>> doing what you suggest because as others have said, with the lower
>>> demand, they're not going to recover the additional cost in making those
>>> watches accessible. Of course, I have no idea what the markup is on
>>> these watches or how much it costs to make a limited run of
>>> braille/vibrating watches.
>>
>>> I can't speak to what other blind people get in other countries or what
>>> other disability groups get in the US, so I won't even comment on that.
>>> I suspect you have a lot of legitimate gripes, but if it all hinges on
>>> the fact that a luxury watch maker is making a luxury watch that just
>>> happens to be usable by the blind and they choose to continue to charge
>>> luxury prices for their watches then I think you need to find a better
>>> argument.
>>
>>> On 23/04/12 19:23, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>> Well, I can tell you that I have had to use Apple products as my main
> screen reader and cell phone because it's the only thing that doesn't cost
> a
> bloody fortune every two years to update.
>>
>>>> Yes, I've had to spend more up front than the apple, but I'll be able
>>>> to
> use it much longer than any PC you can buy, and I don't have to pay
> hundreds
> of dollars for screen reader updates each year.
>>
>>>> As for the watches. Again, to get one of any quality, you gotta pay
>>>> for
> it, and to get one that looks half way decent you also have to pay quite a
> bit of money, which makers of these adaptive aids know most of us don't
> have.
>>
>>>> If there are such things are rich blind people, maybe they need to
> spread some of the wealth around and help those of us who can't work have
> things that are of better quality. Yes, I've gotten watches and little
> aids
> from the state, but they've all been of lesser quality than someone of
> means
> would buy, and they don't look near as nice either.
>>
>>>> that, in my opinion, is where other countries have us beat in so many
> ways. they provide computers for people in australia because they know
> that
> you can't live without them anymore in society, etc.
>>
>>>> the people in wheelchairs and deaf get more adaptive equipment and
> consideration and for free than the blind and it sucks and isn't equality
> by
> a long shit.
>>
>>>> sorry to rant but I'm generally frustrated with the whole situation
> about equality for the disabled. As far as the blind are concerned, there
> is no such thing.
>>
>>>> Jenny
>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 6:46 PM, Drew Hunthausen wrote:
>>
>>>>> Jenny,
>>>>> I agree with everything your saying as I am a poor college student.
> However,
>>>>> you have to consider that it is very expensive to make something
>>>>> specifically for the blind as we are such a small population. I
> currently
>>>>> cannot afford the more expensive Tissot watch, but I can understand
>>>>> the
>>>>> merits of making a upscale watch that can both serve the blind as well
> as
>>>>> sited people who want to spend the money. Companies do this as to
> attract a
>>>>> more diverse population in effort to stay in business. I also wish
> things
>>>>> were less expensive and we had just as many options as our sited
>>>>> peers.
>>
>>>>> Drew
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jenny Keller
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 4:26 PM
>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>>
>>>>> When 70 percent of the blind population is unemployed and that
> statistic is
>>>>> probably a little higher. It is rediculous to expect us to have the
> money
>>>>> to purchase quality adaptive equipment.
>>
>>>>> the fact is, the things the state provides are not the highest of
> quality,
>>>>> and on fixed incomes, most blind people can't afford a seco, not to
> mention
>>>>> the kind of watches you're talking about.
>>
>>>>> I don't see anything wrong with living with your parents to save
>>>>> money,
> but
>>>>> for those of us who don't have that option and are barely surviving,
> it's a
>>>>> kick in the teeth when any accessable product, watch or not, isn't
> available
>>>>> to them in any kind of quality, unless you have a job. Which I said
> before
>>>>> since 70 percent of us are unemployed, it's a kick in the teeth.
>>
>>>>> JMO,
>>
>>>>> Jenny
>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 5:45 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>
>>>>>> I'm not sure I understand this message. There are blind people across
>>>>>> the economic spectrum, so there are plenty of blind people who could
>>>>>> afford to or choose to purchase such a watch, whether they live at
>>>>>> home or not. Furthermore, I don't think there's anything wrong with
>>>>>> someone living at home, and if they save enough on living expenses
>>>>>> that they can afford such a watch, more power to them. IMHO, this is
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> personal decision that each person has to make based on their own
>>>>> situation.
>>
>>>>>> On 23/04/12 16:13, Tone wrote:
>>>>>>> yeah. not everyone lives at homewith mom and dad, and could blow 300
>>>>>>> on a watch.
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller"
>>>>>>> <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 2:52 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>>
>>
>>>>>>>> Nothing is wrong with that. I just don't think you should have to
>>>>>>>> be rich to have a quality watch that doesn't scream I'M BLIND, look
>>>>>>>> at me or hear me check the time. I also don't think you should
>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>> to pay huge amounts of money to get a watch that isn't ugly, or a
>>>>>>>> watch that works right when it's not.
>>
>>>>>>>> sorry for the rant. I'm on a fixed income, have health problems
>>>>>>>> that preclude me from working, and frankly, feel screwed out of
>>>>>>>> most
>>>>>>>> blindness related options because I'm not rich enough to afford
> them.
>>
>>>>>>>> It doesn't work that way in other countries, and this great USA
>>>>>>>> aught to follow suit.
>>
>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 12:25 PM, Baracco, Andrew W wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>> What's wrong with a blind person being rich?
>>
>>>>>>>>> Andy
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 6:14 AM
>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>>>> Talking Sports Watch"]
>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, as I think I said in a previous message, I'm not sure this
>>>>>>>>> watch was intended solely for the blind. I've also read that it
>>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>>> meant for the businessman who didn't want to be seen checking her
>>>>>>>>> watch or the sportsman who wasn't able to look at their watches
> face
>>>>> for some reason.
>>
>>>>>>>>> Remember too that this is a Tissot. They aren't going to make a
>>>>>>>>> cheap watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>> Finally, although a lot of blind people are on fixed incomes, not
>>>>>>>>> all of them are. I'm not going to say I can afford this watch
>>>>>>>>> myself, but I think it's a good thing that a company that makes
>>>>>>>>> quality watches, like Tissot, makes a watch that a well to do
>>>>>>>>> blind
>>>>>>>>> person could aspire to own someday. If someone can't afford a
>>>>>>>>> Tissot, there are other options out there.
>>
>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 07:32, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> sorry, but I find it rediculous that a watch that is helpful for
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> blind, who a lot of us are on fixed incomes, costs that much.
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>> I guess it's for those who just have jobs and/or money to burn.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:11 AM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> As I said in the attached email, Amazon is again selling the
>>>>>>>>>>> Tissot Silen-T watch. This is the watch that a blind person can
>>>>>>>>>>> use to tell time by feeling vibrations on the watches face. It's
>>>>>>>>>>> currently selling for $470, but it was selling for $350, as a
>>>>>>>>>>> promotional deal,
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> a few weeks ago.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I found it on Amazon just using Google, but if anyone wants, I
>>>>>>>>>>> can rerun my Google search and post the specific links.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure what the Tissot Vibren watch does, but I suspect
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> poster was thinking of the Silen-T watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 06:56, Stephen guerra wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> I believe you can only get the tissot vibrating watch from ebay
>>>>>>>>>>>> as they are not actively being sold anymore and they run over
>>>>>>>>>>>> $200
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 2:20 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not familiar with the Tissot Vibren watch, and I wasn't
>>>>>>>>>>>> able
>>>>>>>>>>>> to find it via Google, but in the Tissot T-Touch series, the
>>>>>>>>>>>> Silen-T is
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> the accessible vibrating watch that a blind person could use.
>>>>>>>>>>>> The other watches in the series vibrate, but not in a way that
>>>>>>>>>>>> you could
>>>>>>>>> tell the time.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The Tissot Silen-T is available again, but the $349 price from
>>>>>>>>>>>> Amazon was a promotional price that ended at the end of March.
>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks like the current price is around $469.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 21/04/12 19:01, Alan Siman wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It was probably the Tissot vibren watch which apparently has
>>>>>>>>>>>>> come back on the market for $349.00 at amazon (I think).
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/21/2012 4:27 PM, Annette Carr wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been looking for a vibrating watch. I came across one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> advertised a very long time ago that some how vibrated as you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ran your finger around the outside rim of the face, but
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> find it
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more. I don't like talking watches because I also do not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone to hear that I am checking the time, and many times
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot hear what it says because of my hearing loss.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I struggle with braille watches as I have some loss of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feeling
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in my hands.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny Keller
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 4:14 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't ask em where, but I could swear I have seen a water
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant, or water proof sports watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can't remember where cause it's been a long time since I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looked for a talking watch as I hate them with a passion.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm 4 feet 11 inches and the faces on them are just too big,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no matter where I look.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, I don't want everyone and their mother to know if I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to check the time during church or something like that.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I had one that I liked cause the face was blue and I really
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> liked the way it looked, but it actually started running
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> backwards and wouldn't sinc with the talking part, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quidckly after that happened the talking part went berserk
> too.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh well, I'm stuck with a braille watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2012, at 6:12 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check out this inexpensive talking sports watch from Future
> Aids.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not water resistant (I don't think there are any water
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant talking timepieces on the market because there is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way to prevent water from penetrating the speaker), but at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $14.95 with free shipping, it is a good deal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.braillebookstore.com/view.php?T=Talking+Sports+Wat
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ch
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gerald
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Chao"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mattchao at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 7:03 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am also looking for same.--Matthew Chao
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> At 11:11 PM 4/20/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been trying to find a high quality talking sports
>>>>>>>>> watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am hoping to find one that is somewhat water resistant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and am
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hoping to find something like a nice Seiko or something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>>> that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would love some of the nice sports watches on the market
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now but they are not talking watches so I am unfortunately
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>> looking.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you know of something I would really appreciate it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks so much and sorry for my ramblings :) Linnie
>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/andre
>>>>>>>>> w.bar
>>>>>>>>> acco%40va.gov
>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlper
>>>>>>>>> due3%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/high10
>>>>>>>> sion%40sbcglobal.net
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltai
>>>>>>> n%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue
>>>>>> 3%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/dhunthausen%40
>>>>> gmail.com
>>>>> -----
>>>>> No virus found in this message.
>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>>> Version: 10.0.1424 / Virus Database: 2411/4954 - Release Date:
>>>>> 04/23/12
>>
>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>>
>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gma
> il.com
>>
>>
>>> --
>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/tinabir%40samo
> bile.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>
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> ail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 07:55:50 -0500
> From: Jenny Keller <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
> TalkingSports Watch"]
> Message-ID: <518BD4C4-72DA-47BF-8827-419300CA2A67 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Sorry to disappoint you, but I have medical issues that don't allow me to
> get a job. Not just blindness.
>
> Jenny
> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:55 PM, Steve Deeley wrote:
>
>> Jenny do not rely on the government or state to find equality for you.
>> You
> must go out and find your own by getting a job so that you can buy nice
> things that look good and work great. Steve
>>
>> Sent from Steve Deeley's iPhone
>>
>>
>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 8:31 PM, Jenny Keller <jlperdue3 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah, I have too, cause I think there is no agreement here.
>>>
>>> I don't think that its wrong to buy a nice watch if you have the money.
> It's just for those of us who haven't, for most of their life, and have
> had
> to except the lowest quality and the ugliest watches and other aids that
> didn't work as well as the higher quality aids simply because they have
> issues that keep them from working, and the companies know this and so do
> the state agencies, that spend as little as possible and then think they
> are
> so great because they did something great for the blind should be ashamed
> of
> themselves.
>>>
>>> As far as the companies that make watches or any other adaptable
> equipment or not, as seco for example. they make enough money that they
> could give those of us with fixed incomes a break if it didn't come down
> to
> the all mighty dollar.
>>>
>>> I'll no longer continue this post because we're not getting anywhere.
>>>
>>> JMO,
>>>
>>> Jenny
>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:07 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well, I don't think it's a kick in the teeth. I don't think the Seico
>>>> braille watches are significantly more expensive than the Seico watch a
>>>> sighted person would buy. Ditto for the Wenger or the Tissot watches. I
>>>> don't think it would be right for us to get a watch that a sighted
>>>> person would pay $100 for for say something like $30, or whatever you
>>>> think a watch should cost. Maybe I haven't looked at enough watches,
>>>> but
>>>> I don't think Seico, Wenger or Tissot put out a braille or vibrating
>>>> watch for the blind and then jacked up the price. I think these three
>>>> companies make nicer watches and that's what they cost, whether you're
>>>> blind or not.
>>>>
>>>> To be honest, I'm not sure what the problem is here. Not every sighted
>>>> person can afford every watch out there. Why wouldn't that also be true
>>>> for the blind? Are you saying that since some blind people can't afford
>>>> a luxury watch than no one should be able to buy such a watch?
>>>>
>>>> When I was younger, I'd get the cheapest braille watch I could find. I
>>>> don't know what I spent, but they never lasted me more than a few
>>>> years.
>>>> In the last 30 years, I've had two Seico watches. I paid between $100
>>>> and $150 for them, so they cost me less than $10 a year, which I'm
>>>> pretty sure was less than I was paying when I was buying cheaper
> watches.
>>>>
>>>> When I bought my wife a nice watch for a birthday or anniversary, I
>>>> paid
>>>> as much as I have for either of my Seico's, and she isn't blind. My
>>>> understanding is that good watches will cost a couple of hundred
>>>> dollars
>>>> whether you're sighted or not.
>>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:23:43 -0400
> From: tina birenbaum <tinabir at samobile.net>
> To: electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Alternatives to Windws and ... [was
> "Re: Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports
> Watch"]"]
> Message-ID: dab82d3c-131a-490f-8051-cbe228f26595 at samobile.net
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed"
>
> Yes, call them. I've used it on multiple computers and my flash drive
> which i need to update with no problem and I'm sure they can help you
> figure it out.
> Original message:
>> I supposedly have SA and am still making payments on it but it's not
>> working on any of our PC's or the thumb drive.
>
>> I have to call them this week and find out why, or tell them that my
>> payment contract is null and void since it hasn't worked in almost a
>> year.
>
>> Jenny
>> On Apr 24, 2012, at 12:01 AM, tina birenbaum wrote:
>
>>> There's also system access which has a screen reader in it as well as
>>> many other things in the package and best of all the company offers
>>> payment plans. That's how i was able to get it. and it's very nice to
>>> have life time updates that just go to all users so you don't have to
>>> pay what some of the companies want just for updates.
>>> Original message:
>>>> For me, I run Ubuntu and use Orca/Speakup/Emacspeak on my PC, so I
>>>> don't
>>>> pay the expensive up front costs for a Mac, and I don't have to pay for
>>>> Windows or a a screen reader. Another option would be NVDA, a free
>>>> screen reader for Windows. I guess you'd have to upgrade Windows
>>>> periodically, but Windows releases are supported for much more than 2
>>>> years, and I don't understand at all why you'd have to upgrade a PC and
>>>> Windows more frequently than a Mac.
>
>>>> As stated before, I don't agree with the rest of your rant. I don't see
>>>> how a watch maker who makes a braille or vibrating watch for the blind,
>>>> and prices it the same as the rest of their watches, is doing anything
>>>> wrong. In fact, I think it's just the opposite. If more companies did
>>>> what Seico, Wenger and Tissot did then we'd have even more choices as
>>>> blind consumers. Since they're making quality watches, making
>>>> modifications to them so the blind can use them, and not jacking up the
>>>> price over their other watches, I guess you could say they're already
>>>> doing what you suggest because as others have said, with the lower
>>>> demand, they're not going to recover the additional cost in making
>>>> those
>>>> watches accessible. Of course, I have no idea what the markup is on
>>>> these watches or how much it costs to make a limited run of
>>>> braille/vibrating watches.
>
>>>> I can't speak to what other blind people get in other countries or what
>>>> other disability groups get in the US, so I won't even comment on that.
>>>> I suspect you have a lot of legitimate gripes, but if it all hinges on
>>>> the fact that a luxury watch maker is making a luxury watch that just
>>>> happens to be usable by the blind and they choose to continue to charge
>>>> luxury prices for their watches then I think you need to find a better
>>>> argument.
>
>>>> On 23/04/12 19:23, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>> Well, I can tell you that I have had to use Apple products as my main
>>>>> screen reader and cell phone because it's the only thing that doesn't
>>>>> cost a bloody fortune every two years to update.
>
>>>>> Yes, I've had to spend more up front than the apple, but I'll be able
>>>>> to use it much longer than any PC you can buy, and I don't have to pay
>>>>> hundreds of dollars for screen reader updates each year.
>
>>>>> As for the watches. Again, to get one of any quality, you gotta pay
>>>>> for it, and to get one that looks half way decent you also have to pay
>>>>> quite a bit of money, which makers of these adaptive aids know most of
>>>>> us don't have.
>
>>>>> If there are such things are rich blind people, maybe they need to
>>>>> spread some of the wealth around and help those of us who can't work
>>>>> have things that are of better quality. Yes, I've gotten watches and
>>>>> little aids from the state, but they've all been of lesser quality
>>>>> than
>
>>>>> someone of means would buy, and they don't look near as nice either.
>
>>>>> that, in my opinion, is where other countries have us beat in so many
>>>>> ways. they provide computers for people in australia because they
>>>>> know
>
>>>>> that you can't live without them anymore in society, etc.
>
>>>>> the people in wheelchairs and deaf get more adaptive equipment and
>>>>> consideration and for free than the blind and it sucks and isn't
>>>>> equality by a long shit.
>
>>>>> sorry to rant but I'm generally frustrated with the whole situation
>>>>> about equality for the disabled. As far as the blind are concerned,
>>>>> there is no such thing.
>
>>>>> Jenny
>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 6:46 PM, Drew Hunthausen wrote:
>
>>>>>> Jenny,
>>>>>> I agree with everything your saying as I am a poor college student.
> However,
>>>>>> you have to consider that it is very expensive to make something
>>>>>> specifically for the blind as we are such a small population. I
> currently
>>>>>> cannot afford the more expensive Tissot watch, but I can understand
> the
>>>>>> merits of making a upscale watch that can both serve the blind as
>>>>>> well
> as
>>>>>> sited people who want to spend the money. Companies do this as to
> attract a
>>>>>> more diverse population in effort to stay in business. I also wish
> things
>>>>>> were less expensive and we had just as many options as our sited
> peers.
>
>>>>>> Drew
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jenny
>>>>>> Keller
>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 4:26 PM
>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>
>>>>>> When 70 percent of the blind population is unemployed and that
> statistic is
>>>>>> probably a little higher. It is rediculous to expect us to have the
> money
>>>>>> to purchase quality adaptive equipment.
>
>>>>>> the fact is, the things the state provides are not the highest of
> quality,
>>>>>> and on fixed incomes, most blind people can't afford a seco, not to
> mention
>>>>>> the kind of watches you're talking about.
>
>>>>>> I don't see anything wrong with living with your parents to save
> money, but
>>>>>> for those of us who don't have that option and are barely surviving,
> it's a
>>>>>> kick in the teeth when any accessable product, watch or not, isn't
> available
>>>>>> to them in any kind of quality, unless you have a job. Which I said
> before
>>>>>> since 70 percent of us are unemployed, it's a kick in the teeth.
>
>>>>>> JMO,
>
>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 5:45 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>
>>>>>>> I'm not sure I understand this message. There are blind people
>>>>>>> across
>>>>>>> the economic spectrum, so there are plenty of blind people who could
>>>>>>> afford to or choose to purchase such a watch, whether they live at
>>>>>>> home or not. Furthermore, I don't think there's anything wrong with
>>>>>>> someone living at home, and if they save enough on living expenses
>>>>>>> that they can afford such a watch, more power to them. IMHO, this is
> a
>>>>>>> personal decision that each person has to make based on their own
>>>>>> situation.
>
>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 16:13, Tone wrote:
>>>>>>>> yeah. not everyone lives at homewith mom and dad, and could blow
>>>>>>>> 300
>>>>>>>> on a watch.
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller"
>>>>>>>> <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 2:52 PM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>
>
>>>>>>>>> Nothing is wrong with that. I just don't think you should have to
>>>>>>>>> be rich to have a quality watch that doesn't scream I'M BLIND,
>>>>>>>>> look
>>>>>>>>> at me or hear me check the time. I also don't think you should
> have
>>>>>>>>> to pay huge amounts of money to get a watch that isn't ugly, or a
>>>>>>>>> watch that works right when it's not.
>
>>>>>>>>> sorry for the rant. I'm on a fixed income, have health problems
>>>>>>>>> that preclude me from working, and frankly, feel screwed out of
> most
>>>>>>>>> blindness related options because I'm not rich enough to afford
> them.
>
>>>>>>>>> It doesn't work that way in other countries, and this great USA
>>>>>>>>> aught to follow suit.
>
>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 12:25 PM, Baracco, Andrew W wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>> What's wrong with a blind person being rich?
>
>>>>>>>>>> Andy
>
>
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 6:14 AM
>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>>>>> Talking Sports Watch"]
>
>>>>>>>>>> Well, as I think I said in a previous message, I'm not sure this
>>>>>>>>>> watch was intended solely for the blind. I've also read that it
> was
>>>>>>>>>> meant for the businessman who didn't want to be seen checking her
>>>>>>>>>> watch or the sportsman who wasn't able to look at their watches
> face
>>>>>> for some reason.
>
>>>>>>>>>> Remember too that this is a Tissot. They aren't going to make a
>>>>>>>>>> cheap watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>> Finally, although a lot of blind people are on fixed incomes, not
>>>>>>>>>> all of them are. I'm not going to say I can afford this watch
>>>>>>>>>> myself, but I think it's a good thing that a company that makes
>>>>>>>>>> quality watches, like Tissot, makes a watch that a well to do
> blind
>>>>>>>>>> person could aspire to own someday. If someone can't afford a
>>>>>>>>>> Tissot, there are other options out there.
>
>>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 07:32, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> sorry, but I find it rediculous that a watch that is helpful for
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> blind, who a lot of us are on fixed incomes, costs that much.
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>> I guess it's for those who just have jobs and/or money to burn.
>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:11 AM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> As I said in the attached email, Amazon is again selling the
>>>>>>>>>>>> Tissot Silen-T watch. This is the watch that a blind person can
>>>>>>>>>>>> use to tell time by feeling vibrations on the watches face.
>>>>>>>>>>>> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>> currently selling for $470, but it was selling for $350, as a
>>>>>>>>>>>> promotional deal,
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> a few weeks ago.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I found it on Amazon just using Google, but if anyone wants, I
>>>>>>>>>>>> can rerun my Google search and post the specific links.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure what the Tissot Vibren watch does, but I suspect
> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> poster was thinking of the Silen-T watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 06:56, Stephen guerra wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I believe you can only get the tissot vibrating watch from
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ebay
>>>>>>>>>>>>> as they are not actively being sold anymore and they run over
>>>>>>>>>>>>> $200
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 2:20 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not familiar with the Tissot Vibren watch, and I wasn't
> able
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to find it via Google, but in the Tissot T-Touch series, the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Silen-T is
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the accessible vibrating watch that a blind person could use.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The other watches in the series vibrate, but not in a way that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> you could
>>>>>>>>>> tell the time.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Tissot Silen-T is available again, but the $349 price from
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Amazon was a promotional price that ended at the end of March.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks like the current price is around $469.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 21/04/12 19:01, Alan Siman wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It was probably the Tissot vibren watch which apparently has
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> come back on the market for $349.00 at amazon (I think).
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/21/2012 4:27 PM, Annette Carr wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been looking for a vibrating watch. I came across
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> advertised a very long time ago that some how vibrated as
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ran your finger around the outside rim of the face, but
> cannot
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> find it
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more. I don't like talking watches because I also do
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone to hear that I am checking the time, and many times
> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot hear what it says because of my hearing loss.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I struggle with braille watches as I have some loss of
> feeling
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in my hands.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny Keller
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 4:14 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't ask em where, but I could swear I have seen a water
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant, or water proof sports watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can't remember where cause it's been a long time since I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looked for a talking watch as I hate them with a passion.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm 4 feet 11 inches and the faces on them are just too big,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no matter where I look.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, I don't want everyone and their mother to know if I
> want
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to check the time during church or something like that.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I had one that I liked cause the face was blue and I really
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> liked the way it looked, but it actually started running
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> backwards and wouldn't sinc with the talking part, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quidckly after that happened the talking part went berserk
> too.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh well, I'm stuck with a braille watch.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2012, at 6:12 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check out this inexpensive talking sports watch from Future
> Aids.
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not water resistant (I don't think there are any water
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant talking timepieces on the market because there is
> no
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way to prevent water from penetrating the speaker), but at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $14.95 with free shipping, it is a good deal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> http://www.braillebookstore.com/view.php?T=Talking+Sports+Wat
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ch
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gerald
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Chao"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mattchao at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 7:03 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am also looking for same.--Matthew Chao
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> At 11:11 PM 4/20/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been trying to find a high quality talking sports
>>>>>>>>>> watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am hoping to find one that is somewhat water resistant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and am
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hoping to find something like a nice Seiko or something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>>>> that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would love some of the nice sports watches on the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> market
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now but they are not talking watches so I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unfortunately
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>>> looking.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you know of something I would really appreciate it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks so much and sorry for my ramblings :) Linnie
>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/andre
>>>>>>>>>> w.bar
>>>>>>>>>> acco%40va.gov
>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlper
>>>>>>>>>> due3%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/high10
>>>>>>>>> sion%40sbcglobal.net
>
>
>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltai
>>>>>>>> n%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue
>>>>>>> 3%40gmail.com
>
>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/dhunthausen%40
>>>>>> gmail.com
>>>>>> -----
>>>>>> No virus found in this message.
>>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>>>> Version: 10.0.1424 / Virus Database: 2411/4954 - Release Date:
> 04/23/12
>
>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>
>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gma
> il.com
>
>
>>>> --
>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/tinabir%40samo
> bile.net
>
>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/tinabir%40samo
> bile.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:47:27 -0400
> From: "JULIE PHILLIPSON" <jbrew48 at verizon.net>
> To: "Tony Sohl" <tonysohl at cox.net>, "Discussion of accessible
> electronics and appliances" <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] System Access
> Message-ID: <A2451E5B3264468BAC008C293C57C16D at JulieHP>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=original
>
> Tony go to satogo.com as long as you are connected to the internet you can
> use it for free.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tony Sohl" <tonysohl at cox.net>
> To: <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 2:07 AM
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] System Access
>
>
>> Does the company offer a demo to try for 30 days or can I order a disc
>> from and does it conflict with other software programs? How does it do
>> with Captuas??
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40veri
> zon.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:23:08 -0400
> From: "JULIE PHILLIPSON" <jbrew48 at verizon.net>
> To: "electronics talk" <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] capchas
> Message-ID: <3A08573D5BA54DCC869DE47814194DD4 at JulieHP>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Does anyone have a good way to handle these beside vision? I can not
> understand them and when I type what I think I hear well it doesn't take
> it.
> So far I have just avoided sites that use them because I have no other
> choice. I rarely have someone around that can help me with it when I need
> them. I've tried to call or contact the company but guess what no phone
> number and contact us email never gets a response! I've seen some very
> easy
> to understand capchus a couple of times but others are just to obscurer to
> understand. Anyone have any good idea's of how to handle them accept with
> good old vision?
> Julie Phillipson
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:24:33 -0500
> From: Jenny Keller <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Alternatives to Windws and ... [was
> "Re: Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re: TalkingSports
> Watch"]"]
> Message-ID: <259C8255-BE9C-4D00-BF80-3CA2E9ABDCAD at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> thanks.
>
> Jenny
> On Apr 24, 2012, at 8:23 AM, tina birenbaum wrote:
>
>> Yes, call them. I've used it on multiple computers and my flash drive
> which i need to update with no problem and I'm sure they can help you
> figure
> it out.
>> Original message:
>>> I supposedly have SA and am still making payments on it but it's not
> working on any of our PC's or the thumb drive.
>>
>>> I have to call them this week and find out why, or tell them that my
> payment contract is null and void since it hasn't worked in almost a year.
>>
>>> Jenny
>>> On Apr 24, 2012, at 12:01 AM, tina birenbaum wrote:
>>
>>>> There's also system access which has a screen reader in it as well as
> many other things in the package and best of all the company offers
> payment
> plans. That's how i was able to get it. and it's very nice to have life
> time
> updates that just go to all users so you don't have to pay what some of
> the
> companies want just for updates.
>>>> Original message:
>>>>> For me, I run Ubuntu and use Orca/Speakup/Emacspeak on my PC, so I
> don't
>>>>> pay the expensive up front costs for a Mac, and I don't have to pay
>>>>> for
>>>>> Windows or a a screen reader. Another option would be NVDA, a free
>>>>> screen reader for Windows. I guess you'd have to upgrade Windows
>>>>> periodically, but Windows releases are supported for much more than 2
>>>>> years, and I don't understand at all why you'd have to upgrade a PC
>>>>> and
>>>>> Windows more frequently than a Mac.
>>
>>>>> As stated before, I don't agree with the rest of your rant. I don't
>>>>> see
>>>>> how a watch maker who makes a braille or vibrating watch for the
>>>>> blind,
>>>>> and prices it the same as the rest of their watches, is doing anything
>>>>> wrong. In fact, I think it's just the opposite. If more companies did
>>>>> what Seico, Wenger and Tissot did then we'd have even more choices as
>>>>> blind consumers. Since they're making quality watches, making
>>>>> modifications to them so the blind can use them, and not jacking up
>>>>> the
>>>>> price over their other watches, I guess you could say they're already
>>>>> doing what you suggest because as others have said, with the lower
>>>>> demand, they're not going to recover the additional cost in making
> those
>>>>> watches accessible. Of course, I have no idea what the markup is on
>>>>> these watches or how much it costs to make a limited run of
>>>>> braille/vibrating watches.
>>
>>>>> I can't speak to what other blind people get in other countries or
>>>>> what
>>>>> other disability groups get in the US, so I won't even comment on
>>>>> that.
>>>>> I suspect you have a lot of legitimate gripes, but if it all hinges on
>>>>> the fact that a luxury watch maker is making a luxury watch that just
>>>>> happens to be usable by the blind and they choose to continue to
>>>>> charge
>>>>> luxury prices for their watches then I think you need to find a better
>>>>> argument.
>>
>>>>> On 23/04/12 19:23, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>>> Well, I can tell you that I have had to use Apple products as my main
> screen reader and cell phone because it's the only thing that doesn't cost
> a
> bloody fortune every two years to update.
>>
>>>>>> Yes, I've had to spend more up front than the apple, but I'll be able
> to use it much longer than any PC you can buy, and I don't have to pay
> hundreds of dollars for screen reader updates each year.
>>
>>>>>> As for the watches. Again, to get one of any quality, you gotta pay
> for it, and to get one that looks half way decent you also have to pay
> quite
> a bit of money, which makers of these adaptive aids know most of us don't
> have.
>>
>>>>>> If there are such things are rich blind people, maybe they need to
> spread some of the wealth around and help those of us who can't work have
> things that are of better quality. Yes, I've gotten watches and little
> aids
> from the state, but they've all been of lesser quality than someone of
> means
> would buy, and they don't look near as nice either.
>>
>>>>>> that, in my opinion, is where other countries have us beat in so many
> ways. they provide computers for people in australia because they know
> that
> you can't live without them anymore in society, etc.
>>
>>>>>> the people in wheelchairs and deaf get more adaptive equipment and
> consideration and for free than the blind and it sucks and isn't equality
> by
> a long shit.
>>
>>>>>> sorry to rant but I'm generally frustrated with the whole situation
> about equality for the disabled. As far as the blind are concerned, there
> is no such thing.
>>
>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 6:46 PM, Drew Hunthausen wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> Jenny,
>>>>>>> I agree with everything your saying as I am a poor college student.
> However,
>>>>>>> you have to consider that it is very expensive to make something
>>>>>>> specifically for the blind as we are such a small population. I
> currently
>>>>>>> cannot afford the more expensive Tissot watch, but I can understand
> the
>>>>>>> merits of making a upscale watch that can both serve the blind as
> well as
>>>>>>> sited people who want to spend the money. Companies do this as to
> attract a
>>>>>>> more diverse population in effort to stay in business. I also wish
> things
>>>>>>> were less expensive and we had just as many options as our sited
> peers.
>>
>>>>>>> Drew
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jenny
> Keller
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 4:26 PM
>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>>
>>>>>>> When 70 percent of the blind population is unemployed and that
> statistic is
>>>>>>> probably a little higher. It is rediculous to expect us to have the
> money
>>>>>>> to purchase quality adaptive equipment.
>>
>>>>>>> the fact is, the things the state provides are not the highest of
> quality,
>>>>>>> and on fixed incomes, most blind people can't afford a seco, not to
> mention
>>>>>>> the kind of watches you're talking about.
>>
>>>>>>> I don't see anything wrong with living with your parents to save
> money, but
>>>>>>> for those of us who don't have that option and are barely surviving,
> it's a
>>>>>>> kick in the teeth when any accessable product, watch or not, isn't
> available
>>>>>>> to them in any kind of quality, unless you have a job. Which I said
> before
>>>>>>> since 70 percent of us are unemployed, it's a kick in the teeth.
>>
>>>>>>> JMO,
>>
>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 5:45 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I understand this message. There are blind people
> across
>>>>>>>> the economic spectrum, so there are plenty of blind people who
>>>>>>>> could
>>>>>>>> afford to or choose to purchase such a watch, whether they live at
>>>>>>>> home or not. Furthermore, I don't think there's anything wrong with
>>>>>>>> someone living at home, and if they save enough on living expenses
>>>>>>>> that they can afford such a watch, more power to them. IMHO, this
>>>>>>>> is
> a
>>>>>>>> personal decision that each person has to make based on their own
>>>>>>> situation.
>>
>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 16:13, Tone wrote:
>>>>>>>>> yeah. not everyone lives at homewith mom and dad, and could blow
> 300
>>>>>>>>> on a watch.
>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jenny Keller"
>>>>>>>>> <jlperdue3 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 2:52 PM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>>>> TalkingSports Watch"]
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>> Nothing is wrong with that. I just don't think you should have
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> be rich to have a quality watch that doesn't scream I'M BLIND,
> look
>>>>>>>>>> at me or hear me check the time. I also don't think you should
> have
>>>>>>>>>> to pay huge amounts of money to get a watch that isn't ugly, or a
>>>>>>>>>> watch that works right when it's not.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> sorry for the rant. I'm on a fixed income, have health problems
>>>>>>>>>> that preclude me from working, and frankly, feel screwed out of
> most
>>>>>>>>>> blindness related options because I'm not rich enough to afford
> them.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> It doesn't work that way in other countries, and this great USA
>>>>>>>>>> aught to follow suit.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 12:25 PM, Baracco, Andrew W wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> What's wrong with a blind person being rich?
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Andy
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 23, 2012 6:14 AM
>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Electronics-talk] Tissot vibrating watch [was "Re:
>>>>>>>>>>> Talking Sports Watch"]
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Well, as I think I said in a previous message, I'm not sure this
>>>>>>>>>>> watch was intended solely for the blind. I've also read that it
> was
>>>>>>>>>>> meant for the businessman who didn't want to be seen checking
>>>>>>>>>>> her
>>>>>>>>>>> watch or the sportsman who wasn't able to look at their watches
> face
>>>>>>> for some reason.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Remember too that this is a Tissot. They aren't going to make a
>>>>>>>>>>> cheap watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Finally, although a lot of blind people are on fixed incomes,
>>>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>>>> all of them are. I'm not going to say I can afford this watch
>>>>>>>>>>> myself, but I think it's a good thing that a company that makes
>>>>>>>>>>> quality watches, like Tissot, makes a watch that a well to do
> blind
>>>>>>>>>>> person could aspire to own someday. If someone can't afford a
>>>>>>>>>>> Tissot, there are other options out there.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 07:32, Jenny Keller wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> sorry, but I find it rediculous that a watch that is helpful
>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> blind, who a lot of us are on fixed incomes, costs that much.
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess it's for those who just have jobs and/or money to burn.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2012, at 7:11 AM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> As I said in the attached email, Amazon is again selling the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tissot Silen-T watch. This is the watch that a blind person
>>>>>>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>>>>>> use to tell time by feeling vibrations on the watches face.
> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> currently selling for $470, but it was selling for $350, as a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> promotional deal,
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a few weeks ago.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I found it on Amazon just using Google, but if anyone wants, I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> can rerun my Google search and post the specific links.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure what the Tissot Vibren watch does, but I suspect
> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> poster was thinking of the Silen-T watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 23/04/12 06:56, Stephen guerra wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I believe you can only get the tissot vibrating watch from
> ebay
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as they are not actively being sold anymore and they run over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $200
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Christopher Chaltain
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2012 2:20 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not familiar with the Tissot Vibren watch, and I wasn't
> able
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to find it via Google, but in the Tissot T-Touch series, the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Silen-T is
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the accessible vibrating watch that a blind person could use.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The other watches in the series vibrate, but not in a way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you could
>>>>>>>>>>> tell the time.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Tissot Silen-T is available again, but the $349 price
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Amazon was a promotional price that ended at the end of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> March.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks like the current price is around $469.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 21/04/12 19:01, Alan Siman wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It was probably the Tissot vibren watch which apparently has
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> come back on the market for $349.00 at amazon (I think).
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/21/2012 4:27 PM, Annette Carr wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been looking for a vibrating watch. I came across
> one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> advertised a very long time ago that some how vibrated as
> you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ran your finger around the outside rim of the face, but
> cannot
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> find it
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any more. I don't like talking watches because I also do
> not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone to hear that I am checking the time, and many
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> times
> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cannot hear what it says because of my hearing loss.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I struggle with braille watches as I have some loss of
> feeling
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in my hands.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny Keller
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 4:14 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't ask em where, but I could swear I have seen a water
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant, or water proof sports watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can't remember where cause it's been a long time since I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looked for a talking watch as I hate them with a passion.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm 4 feet 11 inches and the faces on them are just too
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> big,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no matter where I look.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, I don't want everyone and their mother to know if I
> want
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to check the time during church or something like that.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I had one that I liked cause the face was blue and I really
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> liked the way it looked, but it actually started running
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> backwards and wouldn't sinc with the talking part, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quidckly after that happened the talking part went berserk
> too.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh well, I'm stuck with a braille watch.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2012, at 6:12 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check out this inexpensive talking sports watch from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Future
> Aids.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not water resistant (I don't think there are any water
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resistant talking timepieces on the market because there is
> no
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way to prevent water from penetrating the speaker), but at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $14.95 with free shipping, it is a good deal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> http://www.braillebookstore.com/view.php?T=Talking+Sports+Wat
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ch
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gerald
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Chao"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <mattchao at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 7:03 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] Talking Sports Watch
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am also looking for same.--Matthew Chao
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> At 11:11 PM 4/20/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have been trying to find a high quality talking sports
>>>>>>>>>>> watch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am hoping to find one that is somewhat water resistant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and am
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hoping to find something like a nice Seiko or something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>>>>> that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would love some of the nice sports watches on the
> market
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now but they are not talking watches so I am
> unfortunately
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>>>> looking.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you know of something I would really appreciate it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks so much and sorry for my ramblings :) Linnie
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/andre
>>>>>>>>>>> w.bar
>>>>>>>>>>> acco%40va.gov
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlper
>>>>>>>>>>> due3%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/high10
>>>>>>>>>> sion%40sbcglobal.net
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltai
>>>>>>>>> n%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue
>>>>>>>> 3%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/dhunthausen%40
>>>>>>> gmail.com
>>>>>>> -----
>>>>>>> No virus found in this message.
>>>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>>>>> Version: 10.0.1424 / Virus Database: 2411/4954 - Release Date:
> 04/23/12
>>
>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>>
>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gma
> il.com
>>
>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>>> chaltain at gmail.com
>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/tinabir%40samo
> bile.net
>>
>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>>
>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/tinabir%40samo
> bile.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/jlperdue3%40gm
> ail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:44:25 -0400
> From: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited at verizon.net>
> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] capchas
> Message-ID: <423786CAA10A463087346436BF91558F at glevy>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=original
>
>
> There is an add-on for Mozilla Firefox called Webvisum that solves image
> captchas with the press of a keystroke and places the result on your
> clipboard, ready to be pasted into the appropriate edit field. Many blind
> computer users like me use Firefox strictly for this purpose and use IE as
> our primary browser. I never bother with audio captchas because they
> almost
> never work, and use Webvisum, which works most of the time.
>
> Gerald
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JULIE PHILLIPSON" <jbrew48 at verizon.net>
> To: "electronics talk" <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 10:23 AM
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] capchas
>
>
>> Does anyone have a good way to handle these beside vision? I can not
>> understand them and when I type what I think I hear well it doesn't take
>> it. So far I have just avoided sites that use them because I have no
>> other choice. I rarely have someone around that can help me with it when
>> I need them. I've tried to call or contact the company but guess what no
>> phone number and contact us email never gets a response! I've seen some
>> very easy to understand capchus a couple of times but others are just to
>> obscurer to understand. Anyone have any good idea's of how to handle
>> them
>
>> accept with good old vision?
>> Julie Phillipson
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/bwaylimited%40
> verizon.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:50:49 -0400
> From: "Beverly Hunter" <bhunter at nfbga.org>
> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] capchas
> Message-ID: <3FFAA454B20A48608CCA593ADC61A727 at NFBGA03>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> This is the best way that I have found.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited at verizon.net>
> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 10:44 AM
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] capchas
>
>
>
> There is an add-on for Mozilla Firefox called Webvisum that solves image
> captchas with the press of a keystroke and places the result on your
> clipboard, ready to be pasted into the appropriate edit field. Many blind
> computer users like me use Firefox strictly for this purpose and use IE as
> our primary browser. I never bother with audio captchas because they
> almost
> never work, and use Webvisum, which works most of the time.
>
> Gerald
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JULIE PHILLIPSON" <jbrew48 at verizon.net>
> To: "electronics talk" <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 10:23 AM
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] capchas
>
>
>> Does anyone have a good way to handle these beside vision? I can not
>> understand them and when I type what I think I hear well it doesn't take
>> it. So far I have just avoided sites that use them because I have no
>> other choice. I rarely have someone around that can help me with it when
>> I need them. I've tried to call or contact the company but guess what no
>> phone number and contact us email never gets a response! I've seen some
>> very easy to understand capchus a couple of times but others are just to
>> obscurer to understand. Anyone have any good idea's of how to handle
>> them
>> accept with good old vision?
>> Julie Phillipson
>> _______________________________________________
>> Electronics-talk mailing list
>> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Electronics-talk:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/bwaylimited%40
> verizon.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Electronics-talk mailing list
> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/bhunter%40nfbg
> a.org
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 11:08:36 -0400
> From: "Beverly Hunter" <bhunter at nfbga.org>
> To: "electronics" <Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>, "nfb blind talk"
> <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>, "Georgia"
> <georgia-statewide-coalition-on-blindness at googlegroups.com>
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] iPhone Discussions
> Message-ID: <1A8990000BBB49EDAC23AC2510F5CF2B at NFBGA03>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> There will be an iPhone discussions conference call on Wednesday, April
> 25,
> at 7:00 PM. The number to call is 616-883-2999 followed by the pound, and
> the room is 2428. The topic is ring tones. So if you are interested in
> making your own tones, or just would like to download an app to learn how
> to
> use it, then this call is for you!
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:44:10 -0700
> From: "Baracco, Andrew W" <Andrew.Baracco at va.gov>
> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] capchas
> Message-ID:
>
> <EE84AA38E4FCDD42AE64E566B9247B9A0F214086 at VHAV22MSGA1.v22.med.va.gov>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> The whole purpose of CAPTCHA's is to be difficult to understand. The
> theory is that if they are difficult to understand, that they will block
> computers from accessing the site. The problem is that computers are
> becoming smarter. As far as I know, if sighted assistance is not
> available, the best solution is to use Firefox with the Webvisum
> plug-in.
>
> Andy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
> [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of JULIE
> PHILLIPSON
> Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2012 7:23 AM
> To: electronics talk
> Subject: [Electronics-talk] capchas
>
> Does anyone have a good way to handle these beside vision? I can not
> understand them and when I type what I think I hear well it doesn't take
> it. So far I have just avoided sites that use them because I have no
> other choice. I rarely have someone around that can help me with it
> when I need them. I've tried to call or contact the company but guess
> what no phone number and contact us email never gets a response! I've
> seen some very easy to understand capchus a couple of times but others
> are just to obscurer to understand. Anyone have any good idea's of how
> to handle them accept with good old vision?
> Julie Phillipson
> _______________________________________________
> Electronics-talk mailing list
> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/andrew.bar
> acco%40va.gov
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Electronics-talk mailing list
> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
>
>
> End of Electronics-talk Digest, Vol 72, Issue 28
> ************************************************
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Electronics-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Electronics-talk:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/electronics-talk_nfbnet.org/cheez%40cox.net
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