[Electronics-talk] My brailled ATM cards are here

Sat May 9 03:10:58 UTC 2015

Yes, I agree.

All of us need help from others, no matter if we are blind or not.
Everyone uses computers, but how many of us can build a computer from 
scratch?
Everyone takes planes, but how many of us can drive one?
When we eat in a restaurant, we even entrust our lives and health to 
someone we don't know; what if we start worrying and thinking that 
he/she might have poisoned our meals?
This can be endless.
All of us have to get help and to trust someone else.
What happens when we buy something on the phone, using our "Brailled 
credit cards"?
We have to tell someone we don't know the number, the expiration date 
and the security number of the "Brailled credit card" and he/she will 
surely write down all the information needed to charge you.
Why should we be so independent, that we can't ask anyone we know, then?

I have used credit cards for about twenty years and I never imagined 
that there could be brailled credit cards until I read these messages 
and, even now, I don't think they are necessary.
If I don't have someone I can trust to read my new credit card, I think 
I would use my tongue to read the numbers on it (Normally you can feel 
them and I suppose that very independent blind people like me know how 
numbers in print look like).  Please disinfect the card first, just in case.
I would guess the expiration date, just I would need to add five years 
to the last expiration date and remember the month.
Then, if I am so afraid of being deceaved, I would show someone only the 
reverse of my credit card and ask about the security number or I would 
cover some of the numbers if the security number is on the front face.

I think that we can't, and shouldn't, expect the world or society to 
cover all our special needs; we should adapt to it as much as possible, 
because we are the blind, after all.
We should do our part to solve our problems if we expect to be accepted 
in society as common people and not as a burden and I think this 
includes "refraining from asking for excessive help from the sighted to 
adapt to our needs".

I don't intend to offend anyone with this, but this is how I feel and 
how I have done since I was little (I'm totally blind from birth).  I 
feel that many people help me much more and more efficiently after they 
see my own efforts to solve my problems myself; when they see my 
efforts, they become eager to help and they start thinking to help other 
blind people, too.
Before they see my efforts to solve my problems, I feel many people try 
to flee from me.
Of course, expecting everything from others seems to be very 
comfortable, but I don't recommend that to blind people or to sighted 
people.

Having a brailled credit card might be interesting and convenient, but, 
if they are costly and, if getting one gives me a lot of stress, I don't 
need it. I don't think I need one after all.  Instead, I wont to be sure 
that the person in charge of making/renewing my credit card won't try to 
flee from me the next time I need a credit card.

Now, to the people who have Brailled credit cards, please enjoy them and 
do not forget to thank the banks that provided them.
If you need my idea, I think that it might be much easier to add a 
function to ATMs to tell you your card number, expiration date, ETC, 
once you insert it, but I don't need this function; adding a new 
function to the ATMs should be costly, anyway, but the problem would be 
solved forever and for all the blind people who would need that function 
at once. Banks might be interested in implementing this solution if we 
help them realize how many blind people are using ATM cards and that 
they might get some subsidy from governments to add this function to the 
existing ATMs. This will also solve the potential problem of special 
Brailled cards stuck in ATMs.

HTH
George

On 2015/05/09 8:40, Drew Hunthausen via Electronics-talk wrote:
> I'll just throw in my two cents, but this is definitely an issue that I wish
> I didn't have to deal with. What I've learned since losing all my eye sight
> at age 11 is that being blind no matter how good you are at technology or
> mobility or whatever it is, there are always going to be cercumstances where
> we need help from someone with eye sight. Whether it's reading a credit card
> or having someone help you with a visual issue on your computer, nothings
> perfect. I think probably the most important thing I've learned since
> becoming disabled is when to ask for help and when to fight for
> accessibility so I can do it myself. Havig someone else read a credit card
> number for you does take some trust, but in my opion and only in my opinion
> it takes a lot less trust than many of the other things us people who are
> blind need to get help with. I'm not trying to start a big debate, I just
> don't see this credit card issue being so huge.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Electronics-talk [mailto:electronics-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Jim Barbour via Electronics-talk
> Sent: Friday, May 08, 2015 12:55 PM
> To: Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances
> Cc: Jim Barbour
> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] My brailled ATM cards are here
>
> I am having a hard time understanding the problem here. You need a leader in
> order to read the print. It will need to be a person, or a Technology like
> the KNFB reader.
>
> Jim
>
> Written While on the Move
>
>> On May 8, 2015, at 12:41 PM, Gerald Levy via Electronics-talk
> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Yes, the inability to read the security code without having a sighted
> person physically pick up the card and read it is a big problem.  What are
> the blindness advocacy groups doing to address this issue?  Nothing, as
> usual.
>>
>> Gerald
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barb O'Connor via
>> Electronics-talk" <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>> To: "Discussion of accessible electronics and appliances"
>> <electronics-talk at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: "Barb O'Connor" <broconnor1972 at comcast.net>
>> Sent: Friday, May 08, 2015 3:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Electronics-talk] My brailled ATM cards are here
>>
>>
>>> So, how do you get that all-important security number then?  You'll once
> again have to wait till someone sighted whom you trust is available to help
> you as the credit card companies or banks won't help you at all.  It would
> have been nice if they would have added that, too.
>>>
>>> Barb
>>> ----- Original Message -----  From: Diane Vlasoff via
>>> Electronics-talk
>>> To: electronics talk n f b list serve
>>> Cc: Diane Vlasoff
>>> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2015 4:54 PM
>>> Subject: [Electronics-talk] My brailled ATM cards are here
>>>
>>>
>>> I told you all I would keep you up-to-date. My ATM card in braille
> arrived today!
>>> They have my account number my name and the expiration date on them it
> doesn't happen. It doesn't have the security number on the back ground
> unfortunately but this is great! Also please excuse any odd things in this
> message I'm using Siri.
>>>
>>> Diane Vlasoff
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