[Faith-talk] this week's reflection - what is the right way? -understanding others

Sat Apr 30 00:14:52 UTC 2011

Very interesting Joshua.
Certainly I'll look into it.

I wasn't aware that there was a "church" and then a split, I was taught that there was the Catholic church and then everything split from there,
but,
I will research before I say more.
Jorge

On Apr 29, 2011, at 7:41 PM, Joshua Lester wrote:

> Jesus is the creator.
> Did I not clarify that he was the Father in creation?
> I showed you that God was a spirit, (John 4:24.)
> That spirit was made manifest in flesh, (1 Timothy, 3:16.)
> Jesus was God that created, who wrapped himself in flesh, (Son,) to
> redeem, and now lives in us as the Holy Ghost in regeneration.
> The holy Ghost is Christ in us, the hope of glory.
> Romans, 8:9 says, that if we don't have the spirit of Christ, (the
> Holy Ghost,) we're none of his.
> The church was founded in 29 A.D.
> The Roman Catholic Church was founded in 325, A.D.
> They don't teach what the early church taught, because Constantine
> added idol worship, (IE worship of the Roman Gods,) to the christian
> faith.
> They even had icons, (pictures,) to worship.
> They condemned the early church, and persecuted them.
> Many were stoned, burned at the steak, or imprisoned, as heretics,
> because they preached this very message.
> God has always had a church, and he has restored the 1st century church.
> Those of us that hold to the Apostolic message, (those things which
> were preached by Jesus, and the apostles,) are the restoration of the
> 1st century church.
> They baptized in Jesus's name, taught that there was only one God,
> (not a trinity,) and they believed in receiving the Holy Ghost
> evidenced by speaking in other tongues, as the Spirit gives utterance.
> What's the right way?
> Go back to the 1st century Christian church.
> Find an apostolic Pentecostal Church, (because they're teaching what
> was preached by the Apostles.
> Repent, get baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of
> sin, and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
> Acts, 2:38 is still essential for salvation.
> Blessings, Joshua
> 
> On 4/29/11, Jorge Paez <computertechjorgepaez at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Notice,
>> for the glory of God.
>> 
>> In that lays your flaw,
>> anything that is done for the glory of God shall be rewarded,
>> not just in the name of Jesus,
>> but in the name of the creator.
>> 
>> The Creator, the Almighty, is the supreme power.
>> 
>> All religions accept this.
>> 
>> Are they all right?
>> Maybe not.
>> Do I agree with everything that has ever been written?
>> Certainly not,
>> but as long as people honor the universal truths taught by Jesus, and God's
>> other messengers they are safe.
>> 
>> 
>> On Apr 29, 2011, at 12:52 AM, Alan Wheeler wrote:
>> 
>>> Yes, you are right. In fact, we find in Phillipians:
>>> 
>>> Philippians 2
>>> 
>>> 5 ¶You must have the same attitude that Christ Jesus had.
>>> 6 ¶Though he was God, ¶he did not think of equality with God ¶as something
>>> to cling to.
>>> 7 ¶Instead, he gave up his divine privileges; ¶he took the humble position
>>> of a slave ¶and was born as a human being. ¶When he appeared in human
>>> form,
>>> 8 ¶he humbled himself in obedience to God ¶and died a criminal’s death on
>>> a
>>> cross.
>>> 9 ¶Therefore, God elevated him to the place of highest honor ¶and gave him
>>> the name above all other names,
>>> 10 ¶that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, ¶in heaven and on
>>> earth
>>> and under the earth,
>>> 11 ¶and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, ¶to the glory of
>>> God
>>> the Father.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Not "some knee shall bow" or "some tongues confess", but *EVERY* knee and
>>> *EVERY* tongue.
>>> 
>>> This is specifically why missionaries are sent all over the world!
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>> On Behalf Of Amy Ragain
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 11:34 PM
>>> To: Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion
>>> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] this week's reflection - what is the right way?
>>> -understanding others
>>> 
>>> no one can truly say they haven't herd! I don't know where its found,
>>> maybe
>>> someone can help me with that, but doesn't the bible say that the heavens
>>> declare the work of the Lord!
>>> 
>>> On Apr 28, 2011, at 8:18 PM, Kirt Manwaring wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Joshua,
>>>> But Jesus wasn't sent to the whole world.  Most people throughout
>>>> history have not understood his message, billions of people who lived
>>>> throughout the world never even heard the name Jesus.  Does God not
>>>> care about them?
>>>> God bless,
>>>> Kirt
>>>> 
>>>> On 4/28/11, Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu> wrote:
>>>>> Jorge, this is the same "new thought," "seeker sensitive," stuff, we
>>>>> see in today's churches.
>>>>> The Jews didn't accept Jesus, but the Bible is clear, that every knee
>>>>> shall bow, and every tongue shall confess, that Jesus Christ is Lord.
>>>>> There's only one way to Heaven, and that's through Jesus Christ.
>>>>> There's no way around it.
>>>>> The other religions aren't correct.
>>>>> Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life, and no man cometh to the
>>>>> Father, but by him.
>>>>> That's what Jesus said.
>>>>> He wasn't sent to Christians, because there weren't any Christians,
>>>>> until Antioch.
>>>>> The Bible says, that they were called Christians first, at Antioch.
>>>>> Jesus was sent to the world, those who accept him are Christians.
>>>>> What constitutes a true Christian?
>>>>> Acts, 2:38 tells us where to begin our Christian walk.
>>>>> "then Peter said unto them,
>>>>> "Repent, and be baptized, everyone of you, in the name of Jesus
>>>>> Christ, for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of
>>>>> the Holy Ghost."
>>>>> There are 3 steps to salvation, according to Peter.
>>>>> #1. Repentence, #2. Baptism in Jesus's name, and #3. Receiving the
>>>>> Holy Ghost, with the initial sign of speaking in other tongues, as
>>>>> the Spirit gives utterance, (see Acts, 2:4.) If you're going to call
>>>>> yourself a Christian, you need to start with the way the Apostles
>>>>> did.
>>>>> Just my thoughts.
>>>>> Blessings, Joshua
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 4/28/11, Jorge Paez <computertechjorgepaez at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> There is no clear answer on what the "right" way is.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Of course for us Christians it is knowing Jesus, but the other
>>>>>> religions have different perspectives.
>>>>>> Take this theologians line:
>>>>>> "Muhammad was sent to the Muslims, as Jesus was sent to the
>>>>>> Christians, as Moses was sent to the jews."
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> What does this tell you?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Well, if you realize the fact that the jews never accepted Jesus as
>>>>>> Christus (greek for Christ), but just as one more teacher, so to
>>>>>> speak, and that their main holiday to celebrate the glory of God is
>>>>>> passover, in which God leads the Jewish nation out of Israel, and
>>>>>> the fact that we celebrate our revelation from God, Easter, on the
>>>>>> very week, it shows you that the right way isn't set in stone.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Because our 2 religions have 2 completely different revelations, one
>>>>>> from Moses and one from Jesus, both who were messengers of God (and
>>>>>> for Christians, Jesus is part of the holy trinity, which is God) In
>>>>>> effect, both revelations were made by God on to us in different eras
>>>>>> and in different forms.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Now add to that one more layer.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In the gospel, Jesus says something very interesting after the first
>>>>>> revelation of his passion to the 12 disciples. When Peter asks,
>>>>>> "Master, why do the scribes say that Elisha must come first?"
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Jesus replied "I assure you Elisha will come…" then says "…but
>>>>>> surely Elisha has already come, and man has done on to him what they
>>>>>> will."
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> That part caught my attention. If you know your old testament, you
>>>>>> know that Elisha, as known by the Christians, has already come. His
>>>>>> book is written years before the new testament even begins.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> But… where and when and who is the Elisha that Jesus says will come?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I believe the answer is, and I hope that you take this with a
>>>>>> theological point and not with bias, but I think it was a reference
>>>>>> to the Muslim prophet Mohammed.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Is this not "unChristian?" you ask.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> My answer is this,
>>>>>> God is the ultimate creator, and the ultimate power, all religions
>>>>>> agree on this do they not?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Some may ask why Mohammed never appeared in the bible, or any of the
>>>>>> later religious figures.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Simple answer.
>>>>>> For each his own messenger was sent.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Signs in times of trouble.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> First came Moses, in the old testament. His people were inslaved in
>>>>>> Egypt at the time. If you remember the old testament well, due to
>>>>>> the writings of the time, the Hebrews are called "God's people" in
>>>>>> the text. Without diving into too much detail, Moses saved the
>>>>>> people of Israel, and led them not only out of Egypt, but set
>>>>>> standards for them in a life in Israel, in accordance with the will
>>>>>> of God.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Then came Jesus.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Jesus appeared in a time where Israel was controlled by the Romans,
>>>>>> and the religious leaders at the time were many times corrupt and
>>>>>> power hungry.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Notice that his teachings brought on huge crowds, but soon after,
>>>>>> and at the birth of Christianity, the jews that had followed Jesus
>>>>>> split into 2 groups.
>>>>>> Those who called themselves Christians, and those who stuck to the
>>>>>> original Torah.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Notice now the appearance of Mohammed.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> He, too, like Jesus, was born to a family of humble station. They
>>>>>> were merchants. Soon he became well known for his honest business.
>>>>>> When he turned 40, he had his first vision, threw the angel Jabril,
>>>>>> known in English as Gabriel.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> He too, preached in a time when there was a lack of morals and values.
>>>>>> Unlike Jesus, who preached to the Jews, who had been given previous
>>>>>> commandments, the people of Mecca at the time were polytheists.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> And now consider my last example.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The Buddha.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> This prince, born in one of the royal families of India, renounced
>>>>>> all wealth, and lived in poverty before finding the middle path
>>>>>> threw meditation.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> He too, stressed the same exact code of behavior as Jesus, as did
>>>>>> Moses, as did Mohammed (peace be upon them all) but in different
>>>>>> language.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I believe the right way is not a single religion, or a sect, it is a
>>>>>> way of life.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> If you do kindness, be generous, and humble, despite whatever
>>>>>> greatness you might reach, then you are, though perhaps unknown to
>>>>>> you, obeying the same code that almost all religious figures have
>>>>>> taught threw out the years.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> And now if I say that the right way is one, why different religions?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Simply a matter of understanding and language.
>>>>>> My statement as far as that goes will be this:
>>>>>> pick the faith not that your parents had, but that YOU have.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> That means,
>>>>>> it doesn't matter what faith your parents had, but as long as it is
>>>>>> something in which you are strong in faith, that is your true
>>>>>> religion.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Thanks for reading, and remember no one else is better then oneself.
>>>>>> Converting others to your religion is simply changing the language
>>>>>> of a message that is already there--but I believe you should
>>>>>> convert, as long as you don't defame the name of God, or any of his
>>>>>> messengers, no matter what their name may be.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Jorge
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>>>> 
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> 
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