[Faith-Talk] South Carolina avenue, Christ in Truth

Tue Dec 17 02:54:05 UTC 2019

Why are you on this list?

You are speaking the truth as you see it.  We Christians speak the truth as we 
see it.  Each of us thinks we have been given our information from God.  You 
think we are wrong.  We think you are wrong.  There will be no meeting of the 
minds, especially if you persist in your warped perception of Christianity. 
Anyway, as you have been told many times, this is not the place to discuss it.

I urge you to stop.  I thought at one time I might be able to engage you in 
some meaningful dialogue with short responses to your questions, but I have 
changed my mind.  No one on this list will risk dialogue with you because this 
is not the list on which to do it.

If blindness is not your thing, then find another list.  Joy

-----Original Message-----
From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Mustafa Almahdy 
via Faith-Talk
Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 4:59 PM
To: Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion 
<faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Mustafa Almahdy <against.trump2001 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] South Carolina avenue, Christ in Truth

I'd like to make it clear to everyone here, that I am not suppose to talk about 
blindness unless I have proper motive to do so. For me, before being blind, I 
am a theologist who knows about both, Islam and Christianity. I'd like to add 
some points to my previous rebuttal.
Although the story of Adam and Eve is mentioned in Genesis, the current concept 
of Original Sin as known by Christians has been later developed by Saul of 
Tarsus whom Christians today refer to as, Saint Paul. This concept is basically 
the backbone of Christian faith as we know it today. Unlike the Koran, the 
Bible is thought to be divided to Old and New Testaments. In the Old Testament, 
God is clearly one and such concepts of Jesus being divine, the Trinity etc, 
haven't been mentioned there. True, Christian apologists unsuccessfully attempt 
to strangely interpret things like, let's make man in our immage and so on, 
still, that doesn't explicitly speak of what has been later inserted by Paul 
and other authors. There are 29 verse of Jesus praying throughout the parables. 
I just don't know folks, where could I go with Luke 6:12 as it says: "It was at 
this time that He went off to the mountain to pray, and He spent the whole 
night in prayer to God." How could he be divine afterward? How are you folks 
able to intently dispose of such plain evidence and falsely  stick to what is 
implicitly construed? It is quite odd for me to be deceitful of myself as such. 
Jesus has been plainly portrayed as someone who devotes himself to submit in 
full recognition and obeisance to Allah glory be to Him. Had he been divine, he 
would have not demanded to implore onto the most High. At his time of 
cataclysm, he prayed onto his Lord to help him. In Matthew 26:39, Jesus says: 
"And He went a little beyond them, and fell on His face and prayed, saying, "My 
Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me; yet not as I will, but as 
You will." Is this the disposal of an exalted being? Muslims therefore believe, 
that Jesus, peace be upon him was sent to people by God to deliver His message 
to them. That was the same mission of Moses, David, Solomon, John, Zechariah, 
Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, Jacob and so on. Implicit in that, Islam is the 
religion of all those prophets, as they have been sealed by Muhammad, peace and 
blessings be upon him. In Islam, God doesn't need someone to die on the Cross 
to forgive us. He glory be to Him is providentially Omnipotent  and eminently 
Self-sufficient to do so. The Christian concept of redemption is intellectually 
purblind. As plainly stated in the parables, Jesus has unappeasably implored to 
God in seclusion. That's the common temperament of the pious. He thence couldn't 
be worshipping and being worshipped simultaneously. I urge you folks to seek 
the truth and deferentially comply to it. Despite the consequences, truth is 
loud and worthy to be unconditionally consecrated. Let us just be impartial as 
we view such critical matters.

On 12/15/19, Mustafa Almahdy via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Well, blindness doesn't resemble a major element of my life. I am not
> used to speak, blindness blindness. Faith is rather a crucial factor
> of my life.
>
> On 12/15/19, David Andrews via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> The key words there are faith and blindness -- not just faith.
>>
>> Dave
>>
>> At 11:21 PM 12/14/2019, you wrote:
>>>Well, David, the threat of removing me for speaking briefly about my
>>>religion is not delineated in the listâ?Ts major guidelines. On the
>>>listâ?Ts info page, it says this:
>>>â?oFaith-talk is a list where people can discuss matters related to
>>>faith and/or blindness.
>>>Persons of all faiths are welcome.â?  It never conditioned specific
>>>subjects not to be discussed as long as they fit in these two main
>>>categories, faith, and, blindness. So, donâ?Tt threaten me with
>>>removing me, just do it if you want to. I simply donâ?Tt appreciate
>>>such tone, clear? Well again, Jesus said, I am the way to the Father.
>>>He also said, I and the Father are one. Both mean the same thing my
>>>dear. Did he ever say, I and the Father are the same. Jesus is the
>>>only way to the Father, and so, is Muhammad, Moses, David, Solomon,
>>>Noah, Abraham, Lot etc etc. They all came to us with the same
>>>message, calling people to worship God alone. In Islam, God is
>>>providentially Omnipotent. He thence is able to forgive us, without
>>>the need to formulate this dramatic scenario. People are not expected
>>>to be perfect. They just need to do their best to get morally
>>>elicited and to spiritually be elevated, gradually bit by bit until
>>>they reach up to the celestial realm. I urge you once again, to make
>>>sure that you type the name of prophet Muhammad correctly. Youâ?Tve
>>>misspelled it twice and I dislike to assume that of being somewhat
>>>deliberate. So, based on what Jesus said and did, in the Bible you
>>>wholly hold up to, he simply cannot be God. Thatâ?Ts why, Christians
>>>constantly demand to methodologically palter as it comes to this
>>>critical concern. How could we explain then my dear, Jesus implores
>>>to God, on multiple occasions throughout the parables. Well, here are
>>>some quotes of that.
>>>Hebrews 5:7, â?oIn the days of His flesh, He offered up both prayers
>>>and supplications with loud crying and tears to the One able to save
>>>Him from death, and He was heard because of His piety.â?  Three
>>>questions here, first, if he is truly divine, why was he praying
>>>then? Second, How could he be described as pious if he is divine?
>>>Third, if he is divine indeed, why was
>>>he yelling for redemption?    Well, here is
>>>another quote: â?oMatthew 14:23, â?oAfter He had sent the crowds
>>>away, He went up on the mountain by Himself to pray; and when it was
>>>evening, He was there alone.â?  Well, my question here is, does God
>>>need to unfeignedly implore in seclusion? Just call it a day folks,
>>>itâ?Ts either black or white. Jesus cannot be human and divine at the
>>>same time. That just cannot be discerned. You will tell me then,
>>>well, God can do whatever he wants eh? Well, can he die? Can God die?
>>>According to you, yes. But, if he is fully capable of doing anything,
>>>why couldnâ?Tt he just forgive us? In Islam, when Adam and Eve
>>>sinned, God taught them how to repent and they have been forgiven,
>>>simple, easy and straightforward. God is all wise and he doesnâ?Tt do
>>>things that are quite illogical and meaningless. Can God oppress
>>>someone? According to your eccentric narrative of the tale, he
>>>actuallly has done. When he sacrificed the innocent on the behalf of
>>>the guilty. He thence ordains us of maintaining justice. How is that
>>>possibly conciliated? As you guys can see, the matter here
>>>exacerbates. I genuinely do not destine to provoke or offend anyone
>>>here. I just urge people to ponder in the light of what the scripture
>>>has actually taught. Lastly, kindly, if Iâ?Tll be unsubscribed for
>>>whatever motive, just keep me noticed in advanced, thank you. On
>>>12/15/19, David Moore via Faith-Talk <faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote: >
>>>What about Jesus saying in John 14 where Jesus says, > â?oI am the
>>>way, the truth, and the life. No man comes to the Father but by > me!
>>>> That sure sounds like Jesus is God himself to me! > What does that
>>>mean to you? > How this in Acts chapter 4; > Salvation is found in
>>>nobody else, for there is no other name under Heaven, > given to man
>>>by which one must be saved! > What does that mean to you? > Next, did
>>>Muhamad rise from the dead for you to be your advocate in heaven >
>>>between you and the Father? > Do you believe you need to be perfect
>>>to enter Heaven! > Scripture says that none of us our perfect. > That
>>>is why we need a savior to forgive all of our sins! > We need every
>>>sin forgiven, scripture says, to enter heaven! > Islam just does not
>>>jive with these scriptures, show me how it does! > David Moore > >
>>>Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > >
>>>From: Mustafa Almahdy via Faith-Talk > Sent:
>>>Saturday, December 14, 2019 7:24 AM > To:
>>>debbiedrylie at gmail.com; moore at donaldmoore.org; >
>>>dlgoza at jeffersonbaptist.org; erickelly at bellsouth.net;
>>>a.bentson at comcast.net; > vance.jenkins at bsumc.com;
>>>beverly.clapp at bsumc.com; joyce.ford at bsumc.com; >
>>>robpowl306 at gmail.com; chris.malaska at bsumc.com;
>>>stacy.phillips at bsumc.com; > debbie.friddle at bsumc.com;
>>>faithfreedom2 at gmail.com; faith-talk at nfbnet.org; >
>>>kbaggett at brainerdbaptist.org; adooley at ebcjackson.org; >
>>>amanda.poff at nashvillefirst.org;
>>>tom.crow at nashvillefirst.org; >
>>>kelly.ablaza at longhollow.com;
>>>mike.anthony at longhollow.com; >
>>>onecrowsnest at gmail.com; josh.hrbc at gmail.com; hrbcmusic at gmail.com; >
>>>wandawiles at charter.net; lee3066 at bellsouth.net > Cc: Mustafa Almahdy >
>>>Subject: [Faith-Talk] South Carolina avenue, Christ in Truth > > On
>>>each and every Sunday, Christians around the world gather at >
>>>Churches to glorify Christ. They consider him deified.
>>>Nonetheless, he > never expressed that about himself explicitly. It
>>>is immensely > perilous to lay Christians to dig into the Bible
>>>themselves because > it's most unlikely that they'll find Jesus
>>>enjoining people to worship > him. There are two main set of
>>>statements regarding Jesus's > phraseology in the scripture. Explicit
>>>and implicit statements.
>>>What > is an explicit statement? It is what has been stated plainly,
>>>readily > observable, leaving nothing to implication. Such as Jesus
>>>saying in > John 3:17:; "Now this is eternal life, that they know
>>>you, the only > true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent." So
>>>here, Jesus > clearly acknowledges divinity and monotheism to the One
>>>and true God > and declares himself being sent by Him to convey His
>>>message to > people. Then, we have implicit statements, whereas some
>>>of them are > allegedly attributed to Jesus or possibly misconstrued
>>>by some > apologists for essentially systematic theology motives.
>>>Such as Jesus > saying in John 10:30; "I and the Father are one".
>>>Christian apologists > assert he has meant they are one in entity
>>>while the text > presumptively entails they are one in identity.
>>>Another instance, > where Jesus explicitly distinguishes between
>>>himself and God. Jesus > says in John 8:40; "As it is, you are
>>>looking for a way to kill me, a > man who has told you the truth that
>>>I heard from God." According to > the Bible you wholly hold up to,
>>>this was Jesus speaking to the Jews. > This particular passage has
>>>three crucial messages to catch. First > off, Jesus declared that
>>>Jews attempted to kill him. Thence, I > actually don't fathom the
>>>awkward relationship today between those who > allegedly are the
>>>followers of Jesus and those who, according to > scripture, were
>>>sternly hostile to him. Second, Jesus unambiguously > stated that he
>>>is a man who heard the word of God and destined to pass > it through
>>>to people. He didn't say I am God in man incarnate or any > of that.
>>>So, the personification of the divine in the character of > Jesus is
>>>a later developed doctrine called the Hypostatic union. It is >
>>>interesting to note, that historically, this particular doctrine has
>>>> only been prefaced at the Council of Chalcedon in the year (451). >
>>>Consequently, it is demonstratively fallacious to embrace such tenet
>>>> as it has been decisively probed to be absolutely mendacious. >
>>>Moreover, according to your own version of the Bible, in English, the
>>>> description of Jesus's mission precisely befits the definition of >
>>>prophethood in Islam. Third, Jesus says he heard the truth from God.
>>>> So, what is it? It is the message that he plainly stated in John
>>>3:17 > as quoted above.
>>>Furthermore, Jesus spoke the truth as he delivered > the message to a
>>>tremendous croud as he uttered a magnanimous speech > known
>>>biblically as sermon on the mount. In this major discourse, he >
>>>taught the public what is biblically known as the Lord's prayer. If >
>>>you Read this, while parallelly citing the opening of the Koran >
>>>translated into English, you will discover a gravely unexpected >
>>>similarity. I won't be taken aback, because it is yet the same
>>>message > of Monotheism. Jesus implored to God.
>>>If he was himself God, it would > have been quite irrational of Jesus
>>>praying to himself. I urge > pastoral staff and their loyally fellow
>>>congregants, to unfeignedly > seek the truth regarding Jesus's solely
>>>spoken word in the Gospel. > Trust me, after I read the Bible many
>>>times, my faith and conviction > of Islam being the true pathway to
>>>the celestial realm has > strengthened leastwise two fold. I do hope
>>>that you find this message > to you encouraging not frustrating. It
>>>is not my nature to deride or > marginalise someone's belief. Please,
>>>read the whole gospel and > earnestly seek to find what Jesus says in
>>>it. I do not recognise the > words spoken by Paul or others about
>>>Jesus. I only care about what was > directly spoken by Jesus.
>>>The essence of this message is quite plain. > Find the truth and
>>>stick to it. I wholeheartedly say to you, If I knew > that
>>>Christianity is indeed the truth and only path to salvation, I >
>>>would have unhesitatingly embraced it. This is not a joke nor it
>>>bears > to be. > > _______________________________________________ >
>>>  Faith-Talk mailing list > Faith-Talk at nfbnet.org >
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Faith-Talk mailing list
>> Faith-Talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/faith-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Faith-Talk:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/faith-talk_nfbnet.org/against.trump
>> 2001%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Faith-Talk mailing list
> Faith-Talk at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/faith-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Faith-Talk:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/faith-talk_nfbnet.org/against.trump2
> 001%40gmail.com
>

_______________________________________________
Faith-Talk mailing list
Faith-Talk at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/faith-talk_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
Faith-Talk:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/faith-talk_nfbnet.org/breslauerj%40gmail.com