[Faith-Talk] serving and connection

Sat Aug 10 23:33:38 UTC 2024

Andrew,

You aren't getting suggestions because people are judging you.  You are getting suggestions because people care.  We are brothers and sisters in Christ, and we have all needed to hear hard truths from time to time, butit is you that has to do for yourself.

Make a list of these suggestions people have given, figure out which is the easiest for you to tackle, even if you can only do a tiny bit of one suggestion.  Keep at it.

Let me ask you:  What were you hoping or expecting to hear when you presented the first e-mail to the list?  What outcome are you looking for?

Judy

“Embrace each day with His mercies and blessings.”

-----Original Message-----
From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of andrew edgcumbe via Faith-Talk
Sent: Saturday, August 10, 2024 4:09 PM
To: Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
Cc: andrew edgcumbe <rollercoasterman86 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] serving and connection

well i don't see a r3eason to do anything then because all i am getting
from people is judgment and stuff.

On Sat, Aug 10, 2024 at 11:21 AM Sarah Blake LaRose via Faith-Talk <
faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi Andrew.
> First, the person hindering you most is yourself. You know your
> capabilities and it is up to you to let people know what you can do. If you
> let people do things for you because they keep doing them, then they will
> think you can't do them. So, if the driver tries to put your seatbelt on
> for you and you are perfectly capable of doing it, tell him you don't need
> that help thank you very much.
> What will help your advocacy skills is experience, not someone else doing
> it for you.
> Also, please take time to proofread your emails. I am certain that you can
> write well. Your emails are coming out very jumbled because you are not
> taking time to proofread. If sighted people are reading this kind of mail
> from you, this is likely contributing to your problem. Write as well as you
> speak, in good complete sentences. Communicate clearly.
> Knowing your way around an area is not a prerequisite to having fun. If
> you want to participate with a group on a field trip, go and plan to be
> included. Let people know what you would like to do. You are doing a lot of
> assuming that there are all the things you can't do. The rest of the world
> is already doing this on your behalf. Assume there are ways you can do
> things and start seeking them out. Make the world your ally instead of
> letting them make you theirs.
>
>
> Sarah Blake LaRose, D.Min.
> sarah at sarahblakelarose.com
> http://www.sarahblakelarose.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Deborah via
> Faith-Talk
> Sent: Saturday, August 10, 2024 10:52 AM
> To: 'Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion' <
> faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Deborah <deborahb14 at verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] serving and connection
>
> My church has a Lyft account that they use when I can't take the bus.
> They have actually used it for me sometimes when the bus is running.  If
> your town is very small, that is not an option.  Sometimes if you get
> yourself there, people are more willing to help you get home.  That
> sometimes works for evening activities because the bus is still running at
> the beginning of the event but not at the end.
>
> Also, if you join a group activity, you have to attend for a little while
> to decide if the group is for you.  I also think we all need to remember
> that our ministry is to serve God rather than just participate in an
> organizational activity.  If you know of an elderly person who is not
> getting visitors, visit them on your own.  This is a little hard for those
> of us who do not have our own transportation, because sometimes a sickly
> person wants a short visit and sometimes they want to talk for two hours,
> and there is no way of predicting what they will want.  Try to find
> opportunities to study the Bible with one other person.
>
> Debbie Brown
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Faith-Talk [mailto:faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
> bruce&joy breslauer via Faith-Talk
> Sent: Saturday, August 10, 2024 5:13 AM
> To: 'Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion' <
> faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: bruce&joy breslauer <breslauerj at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] serving and connection
>
> Do you have a service or a program that can teach you orientation and
> mobility skills, or is there somewhere you could go to learn daily living
> skills like cooking, cleaning, laundry, hygiene, handling finances, reading
> Braille, using computers, learning job skills, or whatever it is you need
> to learn or need to build up your confidence doing?  I don't know if
> blindness is your only disability. I don't know what you need so I'm just
> including a random list.  You say you live in a small town, so I don't know
> what transportation options are available to you.  Some places have busses
> or vans for the elderly or handicapped, and some have busses that anybody
> can ride if you know the schedule.  Are there any groups who help the blind
> learn things they need to learn in order to be on their own successfully?
> You say there aren't any other blind people around, so you can't learn from
> someone as a mentor.  But I know there is a Canadian group for the blind.
> I just looked it up and there is more than one.  The first one I came to
> was the Canadian National Institute for the Blind.  They say they have
> local chapters all over Canada, and they might even have at large chapters
> which meet by phone or by zoom if you are too far from a local chapter.  If
> you look up your province on the list, they will tell you the phone number
> to call. I don't know if that interests you, but if they can't help you,
> perhaps they can point you in the direction of someone who can.
>
> I just came across a really cool thing on their web site.  They have a
> mobile van that they can bring to your community at no cost.  Here is what
> their web site says about it:
> Meet the CNIB Mobile Hub – a new program delivery model where we visit
> your community to deliver in-person programming at no cost to you. Drop in
> to meet CNIB staff and learn more about free programs and resources for
> people who are blind, Deafblind, or have low vision. Enjoy a day of
> recreational and social activities, technology workshops, and much more.
> Experience the latest breakthroughs in assistive tech from CNIB SmartLife
> and connect with other members of the sight loss community.
>
> To see where we’re headed next, check out our tour schedule.
> https://www.cnib.ca/programs-and-services/live/cnib-mobile-hub
>
> I hope some of this helps.
>
> I think some of the changes you're seeking may start with you.  You're the
> one who knows yourself best and knows what you need.  Joy
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of andrew
> edgcumbe via Faith-Talk
> Sent: Saturday, August 10, 2024 2:16 AM
> To: Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion <
> faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: andrew edgcumbe <rollercoasterman86 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] serving and connection
>
> Hi  I know  I guess the thing that stops me is not only  self confident
> end of thing that is stopping me but in my area  i wouldn't be welcomed on
> to most construction sights I think that kind of is really  well I don't
> know.
> My family never  has never pushed me to advokate in anyway.
>
> While I  for most part moved out on my own  most cases my family  has
> never  whatever I think that even they don't know what blind people to do
> because they have never bothered to educate themselves.
>
> I have conversations with people  from latest c latest church i currently
> go to and they say it is to bad that  or say they understand i want to do
> more  but no effort was ever made for me to help out.
>
> There is no hiking groups in my area at all. I tried to look for them and
> look for  stuff along those lines.
> With trips and stuff i just don't know how to even find way  ways to go to
> these places i would want to go to. going on these adventures to me is not
> a problem but it is finding people to do these things with Water parks
> would be harder to do if person doesn't ride water slide because I wouldn't
> know my way around in water parks and stuff.
>
> I really  far as youth group did go on few of the trips actually as well
> like he did accomidate way in a sence.
>
> There is hardly any other blind people seen in the community here. So i
> live in a smaller town in a sence.
>
> allot of people around here don't have the blind person can do it attitude
> and for me to  be  advocating for myself totally alone or like the lone
> ranger trying to advocate myself is very hard or would be very hard and to
> me it is hard to  and very tiring to explaine to people i cn can cross a
> street and stuff like that for example.
>
> Not every place in town is excessible I can only get to one grocery store
> in town out of the 2 or 3 others bu by myself because of the
> inexcessibility of the parking lots no way for pudestrians to get in there
> without dealing with bunch of cars in and out  I can't go to a sub place at
> all one of them because there is no safe way to get there at all even o and
> m never could figure it out.
>
> part of me really wishes that somebody could at least help me with the
> advokating part of things at the very least that is the thing.
>
> Like I do go to a day program for people with disabilities but most times
> i am just sitting there doing nothing.  I am always left out of the games
> they are doing and left out of video games and i used to be in another day
> program last year but they didn't do very good at getting me playing games
> because these certain ones were playing the card or board games I never got
> a turn or anything like that.
>
> Also they never gave me chance to know my way around at all they never
> gave me chance to They never  whatever I never used the bathroom while
> there because I didn't feel i could be independent over  independent
> because they were almost treating me differently like you need help with
> this and that type of thing.
> even their vollunteer drivers especially one in particular ansisted on
> putting my seatbelt on but that was only one he put it on before i had
> chance to say anything so when I was coming home and he was doing something
> else i quickly put it on.
>
> So i ended up leaving that particular program.
>
>
> People around here really don't want me to help out with stuff  each time
> i mention it to my mom she is like i don't know what to tell you.
>
>
> I just feel so alone in my struggles and i hate being so alone in the end
> of advocacy and i know i need to do it probably but i don't know how to
> really build that self confidence when people are not as open to me doing
> things or blind people doing things.
>
> It feels like i am always being watched and stuff.
>
> I don't mind people helping me but when they help me to much just because
> i am blind it can really be over whelming.
>
> I don't know how to use discord I can never get it to work for me and  i
> been trying to figure it out on my computer but it is very hard because
> allot of the time i don't know how to make it work and how to whatever.  as
> allot of things are not excessible.
>
> I have a real hard time finding out about events in my area weather it is
> restaurants or web sites not always info is even excessible and miss stuff.
>
> I had been trying to fix that events thing by having a facebook group
> somebody else helped start but facebook becao became un became the option
> that is out the door because i have not been able to log in for whole month
> because i kept getting error messages like sorry we will fix it something
> went wrong usually it fixed but this time it is that way for 4 weeks now or
> a month i use facebook on my computer so i can't access the group on
> facebook. i even tried resetting passwords and everything so no go.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 10, 2024 at 2:38 AM Ashley Bramlett via Faith-Talk <
> faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > That is too bad you did not feel too included as a Christian teenager.
> > Well, its too bad you did not have your mom or family member advocate.
> > It sounds like the adult leaders had misconceptions and did not seek
> > to educate themselves about inclusion and that is real sad.
> >
> > When I was in youth groups, I did most things but not other activities.
> > Like you though, I went to because I wanted to be out of the house and
> > my parents just said it was available and I should go like my brothers
> did.
> > I think they told the youth group leaders about sighted guide and to
> > describe things to me such as when they served dinner or snacks to
> > tell me the options before serving me; but not too much else.
> > I was finding myself as a teen like all other teens and did not know
> > all of what I needed but did do some advocating.
> >
> > If the group did sports, I was left out, but for most activities, I
> > went to them. It was a long time ago so I do not even remember what we
> > did. I think we did some prayer, stories, drama, simply socializing, and
> singing.
> > We also had some fun outings and some I attended such as bowling.
> > I have some memories of youth retreats too.
> > The adult leaders did accommodate me sometimes.
> > At the time I did not have a braille Bible so when we did our Bible
> > story time, I think one of the leaders read to me.
> > Much of the retreat was to hang out and talk and have plenty of food.
> > I remember having a good time overall.
> >
> > I think you need to advocate for yourself! Maybe you can find other
> > friends with your same disability to hang out. In my area, there are
> > day programs for people with developmental disabilities so maybe try
> > to find one. If you use a Ipad or Iphone, there are apps to chat with
> > people who share your interests such as the clubhouse app. Oh and
> > there is discord too. Not the same as a real place to hang out but it
> > would give you the connection to talk to people.
> >
> > You can certainly go to adventure activities such as amusement parks,
> > Andrew!
> > In my area there are clubs for that. There is a hiking club and a
> > running club and some others. Maybe try finding a club to do this with.
> > Just go sighted guide and have someone tell you the rides they see
> > around and pick some to go on. Its fun.
> >
> > If someone told you that you cannot work with the elderly, that is
> > real discriminatory and you should absolutely not have to bring
> > someone with you to perform that task of being a friendly visitor.
> >
> > Finally, you can certainly do hands on activities. I do not know what
> > is stopping you still. I just think you lack self confidence.
> > So, look for a service project and go for it. Fill out the
> > applications and steps for it and go for it.
> > If they tell you no, go to the head of the organization. If no
> > resolution, if it were me, I'd blast them! I'd go to the media, write
> > letters to the editor about me being barred from serving and working
> > for no money expected, and then get the equivalent of NFB involved. I
> > know you have something like the NFB in Canada
> >
> > I've not done much hands on work and moving around tables and chairs,
> > but I know blind people who did do it. I also have heard of several
> > blind people doing it from NFB articles and lists.
> > You could serve on a house project with the equivalent of Habitat for
> > Humanity. You could serve at a soup kitchen. Some nonprofits here have
> > projects to move in donated furniture and beautify houses and you
> > could do that.
> > I'm sure your country has something similar.
> > Blind people have done these things. Just have someone show you what
> > to do. If its hands on work, that can be done by touching the tools.
> > You could perhaps start by organizing items or participating by
> > handing group members tools or help lifting things assuming you have
> > the strength to do it. For instance, if you are bringing in supplies
> > to repair something in a home, you can help carry it and unload supplies.
> > If you go on a campfire outing and you want to help get the fire
> > ready, carry the supplies over for it.
> >
> > These service projects are doable and you should not be stopped. I'll
> > send a few links to articles about people serving in ministry to help
> > the homeless and other vonerable populations.
> >
> > I have some vision and use a cane. So,  I have to first tell them a
> > little about what I do not see since I look normal. Sometimes it seems
> > like totally blind people are accepted less. If you have blindisms,
> > like rocking, try to stop. That is off putting to people.
> >
> > It can be done. These articles speak of overcoming the misconceptions
> > other sighted people had but they did it and participated.
> >
> > HTH,
> > Ashley
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of andrew
> > edgcumbe via Faith-Talk
> > Sent: Saturday, August 10, 2024 1:20 AM
> > To: Faith-talk, for the discussion of Blindness in faith and religion
> > < faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
> > Cc: andrew edgcumbe <rollercoasterman86 at gmail.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Faith-Talk] serving and connection
> >
> > I have even asked my mom and stuff about vollunteer opportunities and
> > she has no idea's for me either.
> > I did go to youth groups and stuff earlier and I like Ashley was left
> > out of some activities in fact I was all by myself when they went to
> > play their games in the Gym.
> > They often didn't include me in much but i still went to get out of
> > the house.
> >
> > I also asked some young people to hang with me as well at times and i
> > always found that they just didn't seem to want to and it was like
> > they didn't care to hang with me.
> >
> > People don't seem to want to do much with me I don't know if it is
> > because they trh think they need to help me or they think there is  or
> > it is to complicated to hang out with a blind person I just don't know
> what it is.
> >
> > or if it is because people don't want to deal with those with
> disabilities.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 9, 2024 at 11:45 PM Brian Hatgelakas via Faith-Talk <
> > faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >
> > > you said it 100 percent correctly!
> > >
> > > On Fri, Aug 9, 2024 at 11:15 PM Ashley Bramlett via Faith-Talk <
> > > faith-talk at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > > It sounds like you are lonely.
> > > > It sounds like you want someone to assist you with walking and
> > > > getting
> > > out
> > > > in the community for fitness participation and social activities.
> > > > I'm going to a church with my dad which is also small and most
> > > > members
> > > are
> > > > older or maybe adults middle age with families.
> > > >
> > > > I have not exactly asked to serve but I suspect they would be fine
> > > > with most activities. I have considered helping out with the youth
> > > > group.
> > > >
> > > > I am also seeking a fitness buddy to have nature walks with or
> > > > simple
> > > trail
> > > > walking or tandem biking.
> > > > But, so far I did not find anyone. I asked our nearest chapter of
> > > Achilles
> > > > international, dc chapter,
> > > > But did not find anyone; no response yet.
> > > > So, I know what you mean about needing a guide to do activities
> > > > with and finding no one. I can and do exercise alone at a gym such
> > > > as by using the seated bikes or treadmills but I do so much desire
> > > > to do some outside
> > > walks
> > > > or biking and go with someone so I can focus on the walk and
> > > > exercise,
> > > not
> > > > my mobility skills.
> > > > I also want more social connections either from the church or
> > elsewhere.
> > > >
> > > > It sounds like you have other disabilities given how this is
> > > > written and how you write here. I do not know your full situation.
> > > > I'm just speculating.
> > > > It would be helpful to know what you really mean. So far your
> > > > emails are vague saying that You simply are not accepted and you
> > > > are not finding connections.
> > > > What do you want to do? Some examples? What were some things you
> > > > tried
> > > and
> > > > were rejected from?
> > > > Saying you have lack of opportunity does not tell us much.
> > > >
> > > > I do not mean to be critical but you have written things like this
> > > > before and it comes up year after year.
> > > > Only by getting specific can we help some.
> > > >
> > > > Writing things like this
> > > > " It is like people have been so hazatant to do anything or to
> > > > support me or help me find those opportunities either as part of a
> > > > church or even ministry and stuff like that."
> > > > Does not say much.
> > > >
> > > > Have you tried finding connections through a community website?
> > > > Here we have www.meetup.com, but I'm not sure you have that.
> > > > I've not used this myself, but I know it's a way to find groups to
> > > > meet
> > > up
> > > > with.
> > > >
> > > > I do hope you find something. If there is a Christian ministry for
> > > > the blind in Canada where you are, maybe you can help them, even
> > > > if its remotely.
> > > > Here in the USA we have Christian Record Services and Lutheran
> > > > Braille Workers; both are far from my home of VA but I've
> > > > considered trying to do something with them  remotely. Maybe
> > > > writing something or conducting something over a video platform like
> zoom.
> > > >
> > > > You have to educate people about your abilities too. You may not
> > > > be asked to help as they do not know what you can do or how you
> > > > can do it, so do educate them.
> > > >
> > > > Anyways, with more specifics, maybe we can give more suggestions.
> > > >
> > > > Ashley
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Faith-Talk <faith-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of
> > > > andrew edgcumbe via Faith-Talk
> > > > Sent: Friday, August 9, 2024 10:27 PM
> > > > To: Faith-talk, for the discussion of faith and religion
> > > > <faith-talk at nfbnet.org>
> > > > Cc: andrew edgcumbe <rollercoasterman86 at gmail.com>
> > > > Subject: [Faith-Talk] serving and connection
> > > >
> > > > Hi
> > > > My name is Andrew for those who don't know me.
> > > >
> > > > I have just had struggle after struggle with  just being able to
> > > > serve as part of a church body and stuff like that other then
> > > > maybe music and
> > > stuff
> > > > like that.
> > > > To me the experience is they don't know what to do with me because
> > > > of my blindness and stuff like that.
> > > > It is like people have been so hazatant to do anything or to
> > > > support me
> > > or
> > > > help me find those opportunities either as part of a church or
> > > > even ministry and stuff like that.
> > > > The answer I always get is just pray about it while we should do
> > > > that
> > > and i
> > > > been doing that all along but faith should be followed up by
> > > > action to
> > > and
> > > > stuff like that.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > While I don't know other area's speciffically my church is a very
> > > > small church so it is limited but I want to find christian
> > > > ministries who actually let blind people serve even if it is from
> > > > home or some other way.
> > > >
> > > > The other area is that i have trouble making connections that
> > > > really
> > > foster
> > > > into more then just sunday morning fellowship.
> > > > I have tried to find hiking partners and finding other things.
> > > > i reached out to couple of the other churches for walking buddies
> > > > and
> > > stuff
> > > > like that and just other people whom perhaps i can really make
> > > > connection with from a church to do coffee with or do other things
> > > > with and I don't know they are afraid of the fact i am blind I
> > > > don't
> > know what it is.
> > > > I just been really looking for answers as to what to do with
> > > > myself like
> > > i
> > > > have few people in building i connect with but they have
> > > > disabilities
> > > that
> > > > keep them from doing walks with me or  other adventures I would
> > > > like to
> > > be
> > > > able to go on and stuff like that.
> > > >
> > > > I struggle making connection through or  church or community  like
> > > > I said even a buddy of mine has tried to talk to t others about
> > > > others about walking with me or what not but there is great
> > > > hazatation and never had
> > > any
> > > > luck weather it is walking or ki hiking and stuff like that.  or
> > > > even people to really connect with.
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > >
> > > > --
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> > > --
> > > *Brian P. Hatgelakas | *
> > > 318 Washington Road, #212, Pittsburg, PA 15216
> > > C: 412.862.8644  *I* E: bhatgelakas at gmail.com
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