[Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolutionon changes tohave certification for service dogs

Sun Apr 6 18:54:26 UTC 2014

Patricia,
	I didn't mean to imply that you specifically stated there was a loop
hole in the law; this was my characterization. I would also like to add
that, lacking any standards and requirements for certification, even the
program-trained dogs are not certified by any entity except themselves. This
amounts to nothing more than self-certification and has no value, especially
since the identification card serves no legitimate purpose except for the
waiver of county licensing fees. Perhaps if the training programs would stop
issuing these worthless cards and guide dog users would stop presenting
them, those who buy the cards for their pets might stop buying them and
entities would rely more upon the behavior of the dog than a worthless I.D.
card!

	Though there is an accrediting body for guide dog training programs
- the International Guide Dog Federation (IGDF) -I am of the opinion that
even such accreditation is worthless, as their accreditation or lack thereof
has no consequences and has little value. When Southeastern Guide Dogs was
granted accreditation, the IGDF made a site visit and reviewed their
program. On literally the business day after the site visit team left, Bob
DeBusque, Southeastern's Executive Director at the time,  layed off several
seasoned trainerswhich represented more than 80 years combined experience.
Knowing this and without further review, IFGDS accredited Southeastern. This
causes me to wonder if the real standard for accreditation is the payment of
a fee, rather than compliance with rigorous standards. This smacks of NAC,
ANOTHER WORTHLESS ACCREDITING BODY!
Fraternally yours,
Marion Gwizdala

-----Original Message-----
From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Patricia A.
Lipovsky
Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 12:39 PM
To: Florida Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolutionon changes tohave
certification for service dogs

Thank you Janet for your comments.  I for one, appreciate and respect
everyone's input on this topic.

First, I do agree.  Until we can get the law changed, we must educate. 
Also, I want to clarify that I was not the one who mentioned a "loop Hole." 
Second, when I talked about the law being revised, it was in reference to
adding  a stiff consequence or penalty to deter anyone who decides to commit
what I'm going to refer to as "Pet Fraud", not to restrict folks who are 
legit, as someone implied.    This would not restrict anyone, but instead, 
would, in the long run, benefit and protect them.  Again, if I may, if you
are driving a car, and you don't have a license, there is a consequence.

Now, having said all that, I realize there are many hoops that need to be
jump through to get this done, but I think in the long run, it is worth it. 
We as legitimate guide dog users need to be protected.  Although some
believe being our own policeman is enough, we also need something concrete
to back us up when faced with these challenges, as more and more of the
general public learns what they can get away with, it's only  destined to
get worse.

   respectfully

Patricia A. Lipovsky
----- Original Message -----
From: "Janet DeLuca" <janetsyear2010 at gmail.com>
To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolutionon changes tohave
certification for service dogs

> Good Morning,
>
> After giving this some thought and reading  Marion's thoughtful 
> responses we must all be proactive. We need to continue to educate the 
> public!
> Yes Fl did revise the ADA Law for fair housing, with a penalty of 3 
> months of community service for those that break the law.
> I have spoke with some Senators, Veterinarians, and State Legislators 
> that would like to see the DOJ revise the Law by adding stiffer 
> penalties for those that break the law with a "Fake" service dog, but 
> again that takes a lot of time and many steps.
> There  are many people listed above, that would love to even see a 
> Commercial made about how  this is a "Real" service dog, this is a "Fake"
> service dog and letting people know their legal rights as a owner of a 
> business.IE. Even if it's a service dog misbehaving they can ask them 
> to leave.
> There are many business owners that are afraid to ask someone to 
> leave, only to end up on that evening news.
> I think Pat may have used the wrong word when saying "Loop Hole"  no 
> matter what we as handlers need to get the correct information out to 
> the public, and or businesses. Those of us that have a service dog  
> that is well behaved, and are doing the job there trained for, are the 
> ones that are losing out because of those with a "Fake" service dog 
> that is acting out!
>
>        Respectfully, Janet DeLuca
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of National 
> Association of Guide Dog Users
> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 7:17 PM
> To: 'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'
> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes tohave 
> certification for service dogs
>
> Patricia,
> Just for the record, there is no loop hole in the implementing 
> regulations concerning service animals. Those regulations clearly 
> state that an entity must modify their policies, practices, and 
> procedures to allow a disabled individual to be accompanied by a 
> service dog in any place the general public are allowed. Just because 
> some people believe this allows them to take their pets into such 
> places without consequences does not imply there is a loop hole. Once 
> entities come to understand that the rights of a disabled person are 
> not absolute and begin demanding proper behavior, those with 
> ill-behaved dogs - whether service dog or not - will leave their dogs 
> behind. The National Federation of the Blind and the National 
> Association of Guide Dog Users is opposed to any change in the 
> implementing regulations concerning service animals. I also believe 
> the Department of Justice is not inclined to restrict the rights of a 
> disabled person accompanied by a service dog in order to curb the 
> abuse by those who are misinformed.
>
> Fraternally yours,
> Marion Gwizdala
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Patricia A.
> Lipovsky
> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 6:03 PM
> To: Florida Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes tohave 
> certification for service dogs
>
> I agree Janet.  The problem with the general public is they are 
> learning they can take advantage of the law, and take their pets out 
> into public places without any recourse.  Until we can get the DOJ to 
> revamp the law, I think we should all try to educate the businesses in 
> our own areas as to what they need to watch out for, and what they fan 
> expect from a legitimately trained service animal.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Janet DeLuca" <janetsyear2010 at gmail.com>
> To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 11:33 AM
> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes tohave 
> certification for service dogs
>
>
>> Hello All,
>>
>> I was wondering which idea you are interested in.
>> The only 2 problems I see with sending stickers out is.
>>  Most businesses won't uses sticker, because they shift things around 
>> a lot. (I also dated myself with time clock, since most use computers.)
>>   Most people that get stickers, with a donation envelope end up 
>> throwing it out. You may get  a quarter of donations that you mail.
>> The bottom line it takes a lot to get a Bill on the floor, so until 
>> that could be done, we should think of a way of dealing with 
>> educating the public. However again restaurants have a high turnover
rate.
>>
>>      Janet
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Patricia A.
>> Lipovsky
>> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 10:01 AM
>> To: Florida Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes to have 
>> certification for service dogs
>>
>> My goodness, what happened? We had such a good dialogue going, with 
>> so many expressing themselves, sharing their thoughts and ideas.  
>> Perhaps we ran this topic into the ground?
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Toni King" <tkk at samobile.net>
>> To: <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2014 12:49 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes to have 
>> certification for service dogs
>>
>>
>>> That is a good thought and I know several  companies that would post 
>>> such a sign.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Check out my blog
>>> www.samobile.net/users/tkk/
>>>
>>> Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature....
>>> Life is either a daring adventure or nothing.
>>>   Helen Keller, The Open Door (1957)
>>>
>>> Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole.
>>> -Roger Caras
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Flagdu mailing list
>>> Flagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>> for
>>> Flagdu:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/plipovsky%40cfl.
>>> r
>>> r
>>> .com
>>>
>>>
>>> -----
>>> No virus found in this message.
>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6792 - Release Date:
>>> 04/03/14
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Flagdu mailing list
>> Flagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Flagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/janetsyear2010%40
>> g
>> mail.c
>> om
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Flagdu mailing list
>> Flagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> Flagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/plipovsky%40cfl.r
>> r
>> .com
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6804 - Release Date:
>> 04/05/14
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Flagdu mailing list
> Flagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Flagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon
> .net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Flagdu mailing list
> Flagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Flagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/janetsyear2010%40g
> mail.c
> om
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Flagdu mailing list
> Flagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> Flagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/plipovsky%40cfl.rr
> .com
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3722/6807 - Release Date: 
> 04/06/14
> 

_______________________________________________
Flagdu mailing list
Flagdu at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/flagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
Flagdu:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/flagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.net