[Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] ACCB resolutionon changes tohave certification for service dogs

Sun Apr 6 21:54:48 UTC 2014

Thank you Marion.

Even though you and I have not always seen eye to eye,I've always 
appreciated and respected your opinion.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "National Association of Guide Dog Users" <blind411 at verizon.net>
To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] ACCB resolutionon changes tohave 
certification for service dogs

> Patricia,
> I didn't mean to imply that you specifically stated there was a loop
> hole in the law; this was my characterization. I would also like to add
> that, lacking any standards and requirements for certification, even the
> program-trained dogs are not certified by any entity except themselves. 
> This
> amounts to nothing more than self-certification and has no value, 
> especially
> since the identification card serves no legitimate purpose except for the
> waiver of county licensing fees. Perhaps if the training programs would 
> stop
> issuing these worthless cards and guide dog users would stop presenting
> them, those who buy the cards for their pets might stop buying them and
> entities would rely more upon the behavior of the dog than a worthless 
> I.D.
> card!
>
> Though there is an accrediting body for guide dog training programs
> - the International Guide Dog Federation (IGDF) -I am of the opinion that
> even such accreditation is worthless, as their accreditation or lack 
> thereof
> has no consequences and has little value. When Southeastern Guide Dogs was
> granted accreditation, the IGDF made a site visit and reviewed their
> program. On literally the business day after the site visit team left, Bob
> DeBusque, Southeastern's Executive Director at the time,  layed off 
> several
> seasoned trainerswhich represented more than 80 years combined experience.
> Knowing this and without further review, IFGDS accredited Southeastern. 
> This
> causes me to wonder if the real standard for accreditation is the payment 
> of
> a fee, rather than compliance with rigorous standards. This smacks of NAC,
> ANOTHER WORTHLESS ACCREDITING BODY!
> Fraternally yours,
> Marion Gwizdala
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Patricia A.
> Lipovsky
> Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 12:39 PM
> To: Florida Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolutionon changes tohave
> certification for service dogs
>
> Thank you Janet for your comments.  I for one, appreciate and respect
> everyone's input on this topic.
>
> First, I do agree.  Until we can get the law changed, we must educate.
> Also, I want to clarify that I was not the one who mentioned a "loop 
> Hole."
> Second, when I talked about the law being revised, it was in reference to
> adding  a stiff consequence or penalty to deter anyone who decides to 
> commit
> what I'm going to refer to as "Pet Fraud", not to restrict folks who are
> legit, as someone implied.    This would not restrict anyone, but instead,
> would, in the long run, benefit and protect them.  Again, if I may, if you
> are driving a car, and you don't have a license, there is a consequence.
>
> Now, having said all that, I realize there are many hoops that need to be
> jump through to get this done, but I think in the long run, it is worth 
> it.
> We as legitimate guide dog users need to be protected.  Although some
> believe being our own policeman is enough, we also need something concrete
> to back us up when faced with these challenges, as more and more of the
> general public learns what they can get away with, it's only  destined to
> get worse.
>
>   respectfully
>
> Patricia A. Lipovsky
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Janet DeLuca" <janetsyear2010 at gmail.com>
> To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, April 06, 2014 8:15 AM
> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolutionon changes tohave
> certification for service dogs
>
>
>> Good Morning,
>>
>> After giving this some thought and reading  Marion's thoughtful
>> responses we must all be proactive. We need to continue to educate the
>> public!
>> Yes Fl did revise the ADA Law for fair housing, with a penalty of 3
>> months of community service for those that break the law.
>> I have spoke with some Senators, Veterinarians, and State Legislators
>> that would like to see the DOJ revise the Law by adding stiffer
>> penalties for those that break the law with a "Fake" service dog, but
>> again that takes a lot of time and many steps.
>> There  are many people listed above, that would love to even see a
>> Commercial made about how  this is a "Real" service dog, this is a "Fake"
>> service dog and letting people know their legal rights as a owner of a
>> business.IE. Even if it's a service dog misbehaving they can ask them
>> to leave.
>> There are many business owners that are afraid to ask someone to
>> leave, only to end up on that evening news.
>> I think Pat may have used the wrong word when saying "Loop Hole"  no
>> matter what we as handlers need to get the correct information out to
>> the public, and or businesses. Those of us that have a service dog
>> that is well behaved, and are doing the job there trained for, are the
>> ones that are losing out because of those with a "Fake" service dog
>> that is acting out!
>>
>>        Respectfully, Janet DeLuca
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of National
>> Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 7:17 PM
>> To: 'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes tohave
>> certification for service dogs
>>
>> Patricia,
>> Just for the record, there is no loop hole in the implementing
>> regulations concerning service animals. Those regulations clearly
>> state that an entity must modify their policies, practices, and
>> procedures to allow a disabled individual to be accompanied by a
>> service dog in any place the general public are allowed. Just because
>> some people believe this allows them to take their pets into such
>> places without consequences does not imply there is a loop hole. Once
>> entities come to understand that the rights of a disabled person are
>> not absolute and begin demanding proper behavior, those with
>> ill-behaved dogs - whether service dog or not - will leave their dogs
>> behind. The National Federation of the Blind and the National
>> Association of Guide Dog Users is opposed to any change in the
>> implementing regulations concerning service animals. I also believe
>> the Department of Justice is not inclined to restrict the rights of a
>> disabled person accompanied by a service dog in order to curb the
>> abuse by those who are misinformed.
>>
>> Fraternally yours,
>> Marion Gwizdala
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Patricia A.
>> Lipovsky
>> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 6:03 PM
>> To: Florida Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes tohave
>> certification for service dogs
>>
>> I agree Janet.  The problem with the general public is they are
>> learning they can take advantage of the law, and take their pets out
>> into public places without any recourse.  Until we can get the DOJ to
>> revamp the law, I think we should all try to educate the businesses in
>> our own areas as to what they need to watch out for, and what they fan
>> expect from a legitimately trained service animal.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Janet DeLuca" <janetsyear2010 at gmail.com>
>> To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 11:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes tohave
>> certification for service dogs
>>
>>
>>> Hello All,
>>>
>>> I was wondering which idea you are interested in.
>>> The only 2 problems I see with sending stickers out is.
>>>  Most businesses won't uses sticker, because they shift things around
>>> a lot. (I also dated myself with time clock, since most use computers.)
>>>   Most people that get stickers, with a donation envelope end up
>>> throwing it out. You may get  a quarter of donations that you mail.
>>> The bottom line it takes a lot to get a Bill on the floor, so until
>>> that could be done, we should think of a way of dealing with
>>> educating the public. However again restaurants have a high turnover
> rate.
>>>
>>>      Janet
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Flagdu [mailto:flagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Patricia A.
>>> Lipovsky
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2014 10:01 AM
>>> To: Florida Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes to have
>>> certification for service dogs
>>>
>>> My goodness, what happened? We had such a good dialogue going, with
>>> so many expressing themselves, sharing their thoughts and ideas.
>>> Perhaps we ran this topic into the ground?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Toni King" <tkk at samobile.net>
>>> To: <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2014 12:49 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] FW: [nagdu] A CCB resolution on changes to have
>>> certification for service dogs
>>>
>>>
>>>> That is a good thought and I know several  companies that would post
>>>> such a sign.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Check out my blog
>>>> www.samobile.net/users/tkk/
>>>>
>>>> Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature....
>>>> Life is either a daring adventure or nothing.
>>>>   Helen Keller, The Open Door (1957)
>>>>
>>>> Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole.
>>>> -Roger Caras
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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