[humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
Denise Shaible via humanser
humanser at nfbnet.org
Wed May 14 02:20:52 UTC 2014
Kaiti,
I understand only too well what happened with teachers or Supervisors who
would rather give you a bad grade than work with you. Well, I don't want to
go into everything but, I want to mention what I did in my first Practicum
when I was still in Family Therapy in my Master's degree in Florida. I had
a great Supervisor for this Practicum. One time I had a family of four come
in and the parents were sitting together and the kids were sitting away from
the parents. I asked them where they were sitting, for one reason, so I'd
be able to look at them but, for another reason, so I could establish where
they were sitting because it meant something for the session. Could you ask
the clients questions or engage the other clients to tell you how one of the
others is doing? Then, you can document what happens.
I'm sure you're very qualified to do what you're doing and that the whole
thing was about your teacher. Keep going and maybe ask as many questions as
you can of your clients. You may know that I'm doing a trivia contest for
the National Convention. I'd love to have some trivia about Music Therapy
because, frankly, I don't know much about what you actually do in a session.
I hope my comments help. Take care.
Regards,
Denise
-----Original Message-----
From: humanser [mailto:humanser-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Sandy via
humanser
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2014 4:06 PM
To: Ashley Bramlett; Kaiti Shelton; Human Services Mailing List
Subject: Re: [humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
Kaiti,
I like Ashley's idea of having a resident to help, or maybe one have various
residents at different sessions. When I did teaching in elementary classes
in practicums, students took turns writing on the blackboard. In doing
this, they would at times remind the writer to dot I's and/or cross T's.
one time, to learn the idea of parts of a story (caracters, plot, etc.) we
went around the room with each child contributing some of the story, the
story went on the board, I sat and Brailled as it grew. In the evening I
would type up the part finished and make a copy of it for each child. This
was the time I used students for help the most, and it worked well, gave
them a chance of accomplishment and of being trusted to complete a task.
Some of those kids learned Braille enough to label gifts they gave me for
Christmas.
Sandy
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Ashley Bramlett via humanser" <humanser at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2014 6:05 PM
To: "Kaiti Shelton" <crazy4clarinet104 at gmail.com>; "Human Services Mailing
List" <humanser at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
> Kaiti,
> Its unfortunate the school was not more helpful and your professor
> gave you the grade he did rather than addressing the issues with you
> and having that meeting with the blind therapist to brainstorm issues.
> I'm sure you attempted to work with him when you got negative
> feedback. I think your idea to have another student observe them is a
> good one you wrote on nabs-l.
> Its hard to get around the nonverbals and your professors make a
> bigger deal out of it than you will have in the real world if you get
> through practicum to a job.
> In the real world, you form theraputic relationships with them and can
> get to know them better and ask questions to gain a sense if they are
> following you.
>
> The issue of knowing who is in a room and who sits where is an issue I
> faced when I tried to observe for my elementary ed class; I was
> discouraged and did not pursue the major. I even made braille nametags
> for them but the group was too big to go around and memorize who sat
> where. Like you, even if I heard a bunch of names, the group was too
> big to know who sat where.
>
>
> To know who walks in the room, and sits down, why not have nametags
> they can put on their chairs, this way you can walk around the back of
> the chairs and either see them in large print or read them in braille.
> For those walking out of the room, they could just sign out and I
> think you could read that in large print.
>
> Seeing movement is an even bigger challenge.
> I am guessing in music therapy they have to do certain exercises to
> music and a little movement off track makes a difference.
>
> Getting close to them with a moving chair is a good idea.
> You could also lightly touch them ocasionally with permision.
> I know in school settings blind teachers use a student as a helper
> sometimes to see things and write on the board and call on students.
> I'm wondering if you'd be allowed to have a resident as a helper lead
> the activity with you. This way they can model it and also tell you
> what is happening.
>
> Also, how much vision do you have? Do you see things straight ahead or
> to the side?
> Is there certain colors you see better and what is a good contrast for
> you?
> I know federationists tend toward nonvisual accomodations, but being
> low vision can help sometimes.
> I'm thinking that you might stand close to them to see better and move
> around. If you have your central vision, stand in front of them and
> look around by scanning. if you have side vision only, then, tilting
> your head will help you see them. If there is certain colors you see
> better, maybe you can use that. Have them hold something so you can
> see their movements. like maybe they can hold bright construction
> paper or something like that if you see bright colors well.
>
> If you have more specifics as to what you were supposed to write down,
> maybe we can help more. Apparently, your professor needs to know about
> movement beyond the general stuff that person y followed directions
> and person x did not.
> Good luck.
> I hope there's music therapists here so we can get ideas from them.
>
> Ashley
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kaiti Shelton via humanser
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2014 12:55 PM
> To: Serena Cucco ; Human Services Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
>
> Hi all,
>
> Here is a little more information.
>
> The disabilities office has generally not been very helpful. I had an
> issue with another music class last semester, and they kind of threw
> their hands in the air because they knew nothing about music. The
> music department has even contracted out to do my acccomodations (all
> my braille music is even handled through them). I think I've finally
> started to get them to come around and realize that their job is to
> advocate for a student whether or not they are familiar with what they
> are studying, but it's been a long few months to get to that point,
> and two major issues in classes I need for my major have happened.
> Meanwhile, as I said before, all the professors I'll only have once
> for gen eds have been fine.
>
> I have a really good relationship with this music therapist. I
> volunteered/job shadowed her for four years in high school, and helped
> out in some of the group sessions she led. I made some really good
> observances of things she does to accommodate herself, E.G, whenever
> someone comes in and doesn't remember to say who they are, she asks.
> She also has a closet for all her instruments and stuff that is
> impeccably organized (and possibly also braille labeled if I can
> remember correctly), and those are things I definitely would do.
>
> In practicum, my major issues were seeing movement, and also knowing
> who was there. WE had a very large group of 15 to 20 residents to
> work with. Some were regulars who came every time, and I formed good
> therapeutic relationships with them. I also learned these people's
> voices because generally, they were the more verbal members of the
> group. On the last session I used a hello song and went around the
> circle. I had every person say their name for the group, and I tried
> to remember at least the general directions of where everyone was
> sitting. That was a little challenging though with such a large
> group, at least for the majority of the people there who were not
> voluntarily shouting out answers to questions about the music or were
> contributing to conversation. The hello song method also has its
> limitations, because with a group that large it can take a while to
> get through everyone, and a hello song ideally should not take a ton
> of time because it takes away from the other experiences. Anyway, I
> did contact the music therapist to ask her how she handles
> documentation, and to see if she has any ideas for knowing who is in
> the room and where they are sitting if having them come through the
> door and announce themselves isn't an option (We have to drive to the
> practicum site off-campus, and the group is set up when we get there
> so we can make the full use of our half hour). She told me that the
> type of documentation I was doing was significantly more specific than
> anything she'd ever had to fill out, and that is likely due to changes
> in the policies for students made in the past 20 or so years. We
> agreed that the issue seemed to be that the professors needed to know
> how to have realistic expectations for accommodated documentation, and
> it would be great to have them talk with her to brainstorm, which of
> course was the plan from the beginning anyway, but now we knew it
> needed to happen.
>
> J.D makes a good suggestion which I would love to use, however the set
> up of the group would not lend itself to that. WWe had the residents
> positioned in a semicircle, with our chair for leading the session in
> the middle so all could see. Sometimes we'll go kneel down in front
> of a resident, but sitting next to them usually isn't available to us.
> It all really depends on how they're set up, and moving them would be
> time consuming since we would need to call in staff to do it. I could
> try talking to the music therapist who works there to see if seating
> might be able to be modified, E.G, leave an empty chair between groups
> of 2 or 3 people, but I don't know if she could even guarantee that to
> happen every session.
>
> My mom actually thought of an accommodation I am going to try. I told
> her about the movement issue, and she said that the easiest thing to
> do would be to ditch the chairs they have us using for a doctor's
> stool. This way I could swivel and wheel myself around the group to
> get close enough to see movements, but I can be on their eye level and
> still encorperate foot movement. Granted, my mom is a pretty creative
> person and has experience with modifying things because she's a
> pre-school teacher, but I'm surprised that she thought of such a
> simple accommodation that professionals who are trained to adapt
> sessions to individual client needs did not. There is bound to be a
> doctor's stool in the nursing home I could possibly borrow, and if not
> then I'll gladly buy my own. It was just shocking to her that no one
> was really working with me on this, because they do it for their
> clients all the time.
>
> I am not going to sue the school, because I think that is the last
> thing that I should do to get my professors to help me, but I am
> really irritated by the fact that I'm trying to have my needs met so I
> can demonstrate proper documentation, and they throw it in my face
> that I didn't advocate well, and they don't know how to teach me
> professional standards in a way that is accessible. To me, that seems
> like a crutch to try to avoid taking ownership for their failure to
> follow up where they said they would. I am also irritated that I will
> need to stay in school for a fifth year, but that is a side effect of
> all of this, and it could get even worse if something isn't done to
> help it.
>
> On 5/14/14, Serena Cucco via humanser <humanser at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Failing you for the semester is a bit harsh, even though the
>> university felt your performance was worse than the other students.
>> At Rutgers, where I got my MSW, practicum is pass/fail and there
>> something called a marginal pass for practicum only. A margianal
>> pass means that the student's performance was below that of the other
>> students, but the internship instructor and, more important, the
>> university, realized the student still tried his/her best. This
>> would allow you to still pass the course, while letting the
>> university believe your performance was below other students'. I
>> would hate for you to have to retake the practicum! Also, this would
>> give the university an out, making it not as necessary for you to
>> feel like you want to sue them!(maybe slightly exaggerating your
>> feelings, but I'm sure you see my point.) Of course, the university
>> didn't do right by you by not talking to the blind music therapist
>> and not giving you the confidentiality form until it was too late.
>> J.D. makes a good point about talking to the disability services office
about the situation.
>>
>> Serena
>>
>> On 5/14/14, JD Townsend <43210 at bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Sandy makes an excellent suggestion. In family therapy I often
>>> change chairs to sit next to one family member or another to lend
>>> support or relate
>>>
>>> especially to one or another. Of course I do need to know well the
>>> chair arrangement and where each is sitting!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Sandy
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 11:08 PM
>>> To: Human Services Mailing List
>>> Subject: Re: [humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
>>>
>>> Kaiti,
>>>
>>> Sorry you have had a hard practicum. This reminds me of way back when I
>>> was
>>> studying elementary education, and my advisor (also head of the
>>> department)
>>> kept sending me to yet another practicum, stating I needed to do more
>>> than
>>> my peers, especially since I was working toward elementary education
>>> (able
>>> to teach k-6th grade). He didn't want to know of any other blind
>>> teachers
>>> cause they either lost sight later in life, had more sight than me,
>>> didn't
>>> know Braille, whatever. Please don't let your situation get to this
>>> point!
>>> I think you would do well to speak to the blind music therapist for
>>> specific
>>> techniques, and do this whether the college person decides to speak to
>>> her
>>> or not. Also, could you take turns during a session sitting by each
>>> resident to better monitor movement?
>>>
>>>
>>> Best and keep at it,
>>>
>>>
>>> Sandy
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>> From: "JD Townsend" <43210 at Bellsouth.net>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 10:35 PM
>>> To: "Human Services Mailing List" <humanser at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hello Kaiti,
>>>>
>>>> Do not let this experience faze you. I would suggest that you consult
>>>> with the Dean of the program - it is under her direction that the
>>>> professers work. At your university there is, most usually, an office
>>>> of
>>>>
>>>> disability services, perhaps someone from that office might help in
>>>> this
>>>> regard. Some folks have invited a representative from the NFB to such
>>>> a
>>>> meeting as well. The more folks you can pull into the discussion,
>>>> including the Dean of Students, the better.
>>>>
>>>> This is not about your skills and abilities, but about how best to
>>>> identify the participation of your clients during sessions. I know of
>>>> one
>>>>
>>>> blind music therapist who handed out different types of bells as wrist
>>>> or
>>>>
>>>> ancle bracelets so each client made a different sound. It will be your
>>>> challenge to determine what answers your unique needs, try out a few
>>>> solutions with friends or family, determine what works for you and next
>>>> semester you will fly through the internship.
>>>>
>>>> JD
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Kaiti Shelton
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 12:57 PM
>>>> To: humanser at nfbnet.org
>>>> Subject: [humanser] Questions about practicum and documentation
>>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> I saw Renee's thread, which coincidentally raised some similar
>>>> questions to those I have been forgetting to ask on this list.
>>>>
>>>> I am a music therapy student who has just completed my sophomore year,
>>>> however this year I have ran into some pretty major issues with my
>>>> degree program professors. Most of the issues seem to be related to
>>>> my blindness.
>>>>
>>>> First, let me preface this by saying I have excellent self-advocacy
>>>> skills, and have never really had a problem with professors until now.
>>>> All my gen eds thus far have worked out well, and even the more
>>>> strict or less open-minded of those professors I have for only a
>>>> semester have come around and been willing to cooperate with me to
>>>> make things work. However, I have taken most of those classes before,
>>>> or classes very similar to them, so it is easy for me to say, "I'll
>>>> need all printed materials converted into an electronic format or
>>>> braille," because I know that is the drill and what works. I have
>>>> never taken anything with experiential learning like a practicum
>>>> before, so this is new territory for me. I feel like I don't really
>>>> know what I don't know in terms of accommodating in this type of
>>>> situation, and my professors have obviously never had to work with a
>>>> blind student either.
>>>>
>>>> I was hoping that my professors and I would be able to work as a team,
>>>> and collaborate to find reasonable acomodations for course
>>>> requirements. Additionally, I know a blind music therapist from my
>>>> hometown, and she agreed to consult with my professors by telephone so
>>>> that we might be able to have the best of all three worlds working for
>>>> a solution---the student who knows their personal vision issues, the
>>>> professors who know which standards need to be met and where I'm
>>>> lacking, and a blind professional who has been successfully practicing
>>>> for years. At first, my supervising professor seemed very eager to
>>>> call the music therapist to seek her advice, and she even said she
>>>> knew of another MT-BC who was blind as well who could be of
>>>> assistance. I went into the semester and the first weeks of my
>>>> practicum thinking everything would be great, and as I started to get
>>>> more confident in sessions I thought I was doing a really good job.
>>>> The feedback about my interaction with the nursing home residents in
>>>> our session s was getting better, and I was getting stronger musically
>>>> as well.
>>>>
>>>> However, an area where I had issues was in the documentation. I was
>>>> really unsure of how to do it, because a lot of our residents did not
>>>> really talk or make much noise. Obviously I thought to use auditory
>>>> cues for evidence, but there were still some issues in specificity. I
>>>> might say, "The residents participated in the receptive experience,"
>>>> and struggle to say much more because I didn't know what they were
>>>> doing visually. My observations were significantly limited during
>>>> this particular experience, because they were just moving to
>>>> pre-recorded music, and the movement is what is important to document
>>>> in order to judge whether or not range of motion has improved.
>>>>
>>>> What was frustrating was that I had to walk a fine line between
>>>> advocating for my needs and being annoying to my professors. I backed
>>>> off in my advocacy efforts because they seemed annoyed that I was
>>>> pestering them to call the music therapist I knew to get her input so
>>>> much. I trusted that if they were that annoyed with my reminders that
>>>> they would do it. I was wrong, and only received the family education
>>>> rights and privacy act (FERPA) form to sign on the last day of the
>>>> semester. By that point, there was nothing that could really be done.
>>>> I The forms which would have allowed me to give my professors
>>>> permission to speak to this other woman were not served to me until it
>>>> was too late, and I still wonder why they were given to me at all
>>>> since the professors could have talked to her in general terms without
>>>> breaking confidentiality laws. I would have much rather have had that
>>>> happen and been a little fuzzy on what was said, and had professors
>>>> that had an idea of what to do or some way to help me, than to not
>>>> have anything happen at all. The worst was that as a result, I was
>>>> given a failing grade on the practicum for the issues I had in my
>>>> documentation, and I was told "The difficulty for us lies in
>>>> reconciling your accomodations with professional standards," by one of
>>>> my professors.
>>>>
>>>> I really am unsure of what to do next. Having to take practicum again
>>>> will keep me in school for an additional year, which I have no clue
>>>> how I am going to pay for, and I am now scared that the same thing
>>>> might happen again. They don't want me to remind them, yet they don't
>>>> follow through with their end of helping to come up with
>>>> accomodations. When I do come up with my own accomodations, there is
>>>> always something clinically wrong with them. For example, to allow me
>>>> to see what the residents were doing one day late in the semester, I
>>>> decided to lead movement while walking around the group. My
>>>> documentation was a lot better that week, however I was told that by
>>>> standing up I was no longer on eye level with the residents, and I
>>>> failed to encorperate foot movement, because I needed to use my feet
>>>> to stand and walk around. I don't want to annoy my professors,
>>>> because I need them to be in my corner and willing to help, but I
>>>> obviously can't leave them to their own devices and expect they'll do
>>>> as they say they will as evidenced by this past semester.
>>>> Furthermore, I feel like I'm being held back because my musical skills
>>>> and interpersonal skills have grown significantly, and I think in
>>>> those areas I am more than ready to go on to subsequent practicum
>>>> courses.
>>>>
>>>> Has anyone had experience in practicums? How did you accommodate for
>>>> visual information in documentation, and what accomodations were
>>>> helpful for you and your supervisor to use? Any suggestions at all
>>>> would be appreciated.
>>>> --
>>>> Kaiti
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> humanser mailing list
>>>> humanser at nfbnet.org
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>>>> humanser:
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>> JD Townsend LCSW
>>>> Helping the light dependent to see.
>>>> Daytona Beach, Earth, Sol System
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> JD Townsend LCSW
>>> Helping the light dependent to see.
>>> Daytona Beach, Earth, Sol System
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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>
>
> --
> Kaiti
>
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