[nabs-l] Social Etiquette

Wed Nov 5 01:06:51 UTC 2008

I've been able to get new batteries put into my braille watch at Wal-Mart.

Dezman
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Beth" <thebluesisloose at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette

> That's funny.  I was in band for four years or more of my life.  I am
> a big fan of Braille watches, but you won't be able to get Wal-mart to
> fix the things because the stores don't want something that isn't
> theirs.  But it fits right in and it isn't loud and obnoxious like
> Joseph said.
> Beth
>
> On 11/3/08, Yolanda Garcia <yvgarcia at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hope,
>> Loved the suggestion that you referenced here. I've worked as a summer
>> counselor in our NFB training centers for 5 years and this was a 
>> technique
>> that we often utilized when we noticed that a child was displaying an
>> unacceptable social behavior. We tried to make sure that the word wasn't 
>> too
>> obscure as to draw attention to the strangeness of it's relation to the
>> context but something that was distinct in a more covert manner. This
>> technique is also good with sighted children when you are trying to
>> extinguish an unacceptable behavior instead of harping on the phrase or 
>> word
>> "No" and "Stop That".
>>
>> Warmest Regards,
>> Yolanda
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Hope Paulos" <hope.paulos at maine.edu>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 5:51 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette
>>
>>
>>> Also, the person helping and the person exhibiting blindisms can have a
>>> code between them (that is not known to the public) and when the person
>>> exhibits those behaviors the person can say the "Code word." This is 
>>> what
>>> the nfb centers do.
>>>
>>> Hope and Beignet
>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: Beth <thebluesisloose at gmail.com
>>>>To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>Date sent: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 22:25:31 -0500
>>>>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette
>>>
>>>>That would be the same as picking one's nose or biting one's
>>> nails.  I
>>>>admit I rocked my head like Stevie Wonder does sometimes or did.
>>> God
>>>>knows when I saw him last!  Anyway, to answer Sarah's question, a
>>>>gentle but discrete and firm "This kind of thing i.e.  pking of
>>> eyes,
>>>>moving head, rocking is not appropriate in public" is fine with
>>> me.
>>>>Beth
>>>
>>>>On 11/2/08, David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com> wrote:
>>>>> Many of us have or had them because they are forms of self
>>>>> stimulation ...  self soothing.  They feel good so we do them
>>>>> naturally.  We do them when we are anxious, bored and the like.
>>>
>>>>> Dave
>>>
>>>>> At 04:25 PM 11/2/2008, you wrote:
>>>>>>This is such a great topic.  I admit that I had blindisms and
>>> still struggle
>>>>>>to extinguish them totally.  I have eye-poking issues and rock
>>> occasionally.
>>>>>>What's interesting is that these seem to be common for all blind
>>> people.
>>>>>> Why
>>>>>>is it that we all seem to have these blindisms from the start and
>>> have to
>>>>>>extinguish them as we grow?
>>>>>>I worked at a camp for the blind in the summer and I noticed a
>>> bunch of
>>>>>>these blindisms but I found it hard to point them out to campers
>>> out of
>>>>>>shyness and because they were in the company of their parents, my
>>> age, or
>>>>>>much older.  It was weird.  If I work there again though I think
>>> much of my
>>>>>>shyness will be gone though.  But how do you tell people their
>>> behavior is
>>>>>>inappropriate without embarrassing them? Any thoughts?
>>>
>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>>Of Hope Paulos
>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 2:27 PM
>>>>>>To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette
>>>
>>>>>>Arielle points out several good examples here and I believe this
>>>>>>to be a wonderful post.  I just wanted to add an experience of my
>>>>>>own and of others with whom I work.  When I was very young, I had
>>>>>>several "Blindisms"- I would rock when not in a rocking chair,
>>>>>>and I would poke my eye.  My parents would not allow me to do
>>>>>>this.  When I got older, my grandmother was talking about how
>>>>>>much I'd matured.  She said she was so proud that I didn't
>>>>>>exhibit those blindisms.  I asked my mother why she insisted that
>>>>>>I stop rocking and she explained that it was socially
>>>>>>inappropriate.  There are times, especially being totally blind,
>>>>>>when  people do things that are socially inappropriate, but they
>>>>>>don't even know this fact.  My mother said that she knew that I
>>>>>>couldn't see the people around me and the fact they were not
>>>>>>rocking or poking  their eyes.  She needed to put a stop to these
>>>>>>behaviors.  She wanted me to not be laughed at and to be socially
>>>>>>appropriate.  Arielle, I'm not sure if this was what you were
>>>>>>talking about, but I figured I'd add it in.  It is in no way my
>>>>>>intention to offend people.  If I have i apologize.     When I
>>>>>>worked at Perkins, I worked with people that would make certain
>>>>>>sounds or flap their hands.  These students ranged in age from 9
>>>>>>to 14.  It was extremely difficult to extinguish these behaviors
>>>>>>at those  ages.  The students  progressed when it came time for
>>>>>>me to leave, but I am uncertain as to whether the behaviors have
>>>>>>been extinguished fully.
>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>From: "Arielle Silverman" <arielle71 at gmail.com
>>>>>>>To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>Date sent: Mon, 3 Nov 2008 05:43:21 +1100
>>>>>>>Subject: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette
>>>
>>>>>>>Hi all,
>>>
>>>>>>>I certainly think that social skills/etiquette is important for
>>>>>>high
>>>>>>>school students to understand when transitioning to college and
>>>>>>>beyond.  One of the difficulties with detailing it on the fact
>>>>>>sheet is
>>>>>>>that many rules of etiquette and social grace vary depending on
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>situation and the expectations of the people around.  Just as
>>>>>>there is
>>>>>>>more than one way to look fashionable, there is more than one way
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>be "well-mannered" and what is considered appropriate for one
>>>>>>setting
>>>>>>>may be considered wildly inappropriate in a different one.
>>>>>>Really what
>>>>>>>I think we want to capture is the ability to adapt to situations
>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>"blend in" by following the social/etiquette norms called for in
>>>>>>those
>>>>>>>situations.
>>>
>>>>>>>I would also point out that I think most adolescents (blind and
>>>>>>>sighted) who didn't grow up under a rock have a pretty good
>>>>>>>intellectual knowledge of what is and isn't appropriate public
>>>>>>>behavior.  However, there is a big difference between simply
>>>>>>knowing
>>>>>>>what's appropriate and actually complying with social norms.  In
>>>>>>order
>>>>>>>to comply with social norms one must know what they are, and also
>>>>>>be
>>>>>>>motivated to comply with them, and be in full  control of their
>>>>>>>behavior.  Returning to the hypothetical ten-year-old kid who
>>>>>>picks
>>>>>>>his nose in public, it's possible that he honestly doesn't know
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>it's inappropriate.  More likely, though, is that he's  been told
>>>>>>it's
>>>>>>>inappropriate before (or laughed at for doing it), but he simply
>>>>>>>doesn't care-either because his parents didn't scold or punish
>>>>>>him for
>>>>>>>doing it, or because they did but they're simply not around in
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>situation and the kid doesn't think he's likely to get in trouble
>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>picking his nose.  A third possibility is that he is motivated to
>>>>>>not
>>>>>>>pick his nose, but he's just spaced out and doesn't realize he's
>>>>>>doing
>>>>>>>it, or he has a bad nasal itch and feels compelled to scratch
>>>>>>inside
>>>>>>>his nose to relieve it, etc.  The point is that mere knowledge of
>>>>>>>etiquette isn't enough-people have to be motivated (ideally,
>>>>>>>self-motivated) to do what's appropriate.  There are some
>>>>>>behaviors
>>>>>>>commonly seen in blind people-known as "blindisms"-that can
>>>>>>become so
>>>>>>>habitually ingrained that even when people become motivated to
>>>>>>stop
>>>>>>>they still  have difficulty doing it.  Eye-poking is an example
>>>>>>of a
>>>>>>>behavior that most people engaging in it know full well that it's
>>>>>>>unattractive (and bad for their eyes), and often people are
>>>>>>motivated
>>>>>>>to stop, but some have a very hard time completely eliminating
>>>>>>it.
>>>>>>>(Speaking from  personal experience here, but also from
>>>>>>conversations
>>>>>>>with teenagers and adults who have genuinely struggled to stop
>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>still find themselves occasionally poking their eyes).  To give a
>>>>>>>different example, I think the vast majority of adults know about
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>negative consequences of being chronically late for things, but
>>>>>>there
>>>>>>>are just some people who are always late-maybe they just don't
>>>>>>care,
>>>>>>>or maybe they do but just haven't figured out how to organize
>>>>>>their
>>>>>>>time so they're not late, etc.
>>>
>>>>>>>That said, I do think parents and teachers can help kids improve
>>>>>>their
>>>>>>>social etiquette-not only by teaching what's appropriate
>>>>>>(knowledge),
>>>>>>>but by instilling motivation.  Blind kids may be less motivated
>>>>>>than
>>>>>>>sighted kids to comply with social expectations either because
>>>>>>they've
>>>>>>>been held to lower standards by adults or because they don't see
>>>>>>other
>>>>>>>people's negative reactions to their behavior.  So I think the
>>>>>>emphasis
>>>>>>>should be on teaching blind kids and teens to truly care about
>>>>>>>conducting themselves well in public, adapting to different
>>>>>>social
>>>>>>>situations and building connections with others-rather than just
>>>>>>>telling them to do or not do certain things.  Giving rewards for
>>>>>>good
>>>>>>>behavior and punishments for bad is motivating to an extent, but
>>>>>>>eventually kids need to be motivated regardless of who's around
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>observe their actions.  Ideally they will learn through
>>>>>>experience that
>>>>>>>following social norms and initiating connections with others
>>>>>>makes
>>>>>>>them happier and helps them to reach their goals.
>>>
>>>>>>>So how do we do this? Any ideas?
>>>
>>>>>>>Arielle
>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>for nabs-l:
>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paul
>>>>>>os%40maine..edu
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for
>>>>>>nabs-l:
>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/sarah.jev
>>> nikar%40uto
>>>>>>ronto.ca
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>nabs-l mailing list
>>>>>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for
>>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dandrews%
>>> 40visi.com
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>>>>>>Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1762 - Release Date:
>>>>>>11/2/2008 9:51 AM
>>>
>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>> info for
>>>>> nabs-l:
>>>>>
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesi
>>> sloose%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>nabs-l mailing list
>>>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for nabs-l:
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hope.paul
>>> os%40maine.edu
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nabs-l mailing list
>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nabs-l:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/yvgarcia%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nabs-l mailing list
>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/thebluesisloose%40gmail.com
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jackson.dezman%40gmail.com 