[nabs-l] Airlines and Federation History

Mika Pyyhkala pyyhkala at gmail.com
Sun Jun 27 16:56:18 UTC 2010


Yes, we also need to do something on a more macro level.
>From time to time when communicating with the airlines, I have
provided them with a link to Dr. Maurer's banquet speech made the last
time we were in Atlanta, when he extensively discussed airline issues
in two parts of the speech.

That said, when individuals experience disservice, they should be
compenwsated.  I hear a lot of stories about blind people
experienceing dis-service where they are not being compensated.
Travel vouchers, upgrades, extra miles, or complimentary changes to
tickets are the primary ways the airlines compensate anybody on an
informal basis regardless of the nature of the disservice.

While its best to speak with a CRO as soon as possible, one can
certainly talk to a CRO once you land at your final destination, or
you can submit a complaint after the trip.

I mostly fly out of large airports, and there are some good CROs at
large and small airports.

Even when I was an undergraduate, I had a relationship with the CRO's
at Continental at Boston which is the carrier I flew on the most.  I
remember I had an issue where a commuter pilot told me I had to sit in
the front seat.  After talking to a CRO, I asked if it would be
possible for me to come back in on another day and view the carriers
disability training video, and also receive a tour of their facilities
so I would be more familiar with gate locations, and other ameneties.

On at leatt 4 occasions I recall, I have been given a tour by a CRO.
This is a good nonconfrontational way to talk  to them, and it really
helps you if you know where all items are, etc so you don't have to
ask for special assistance or not really know the layout of the place.

One could argue they are obligated to do this bbased on DOT
regulations requiring parity of information for people who are blind,
but frankly, whenever I have asked they have been glad to do it.

I have actually had pretty good luck in the last year dealing with the
Southwest customer relations department and others at that carrier.
When I have had a complaint, they have usually readily admitted that
their actions violated federal regulations rather than being evasive
or beating around the bush.

I have recently been in communication with Southwest in regards to an
issue where customer service agents were entering an SSR in my record
requesting assistance even though I had not requested that they do so.
 Southwest tells me that they have issued a directive to their
stations not to do this, and they have advised me in writing that this
is counter to their practices, procedures, and applicable DOT
regulations.  They have also issued compensation based on a series of
incidents where an SSR was entered against my will and without my
consent.

On another occasion in the last year, after I told a Southwest flight
attendant I was fine, etc., she proceeded to randomly go up to the
passenger sitting next to me, and told him to put my oxygen mask on
for me in the event of an emergency.  I spoke to a CRO upon landing,
and the results were mixed.  While the CRO did conduct a relatively
thorough investigation and interviews with the crew, and completed a
report, she initially only offered me $25 in compensation which I did
not think was adequate.  Then she upped it to $50, but she also tried
to keep pulling out the safety card and said that surely they were
doing this out of a concern for safety.

I wasn't really feeling good that the whole issue had gotten resolved,
so when Jonathan Mosen mentioned Southwest Airlines in one of his
tweets, on Twitter, I replied describing the incident in the 140
characters.

With in an hour the Southwest Twitter representative reached out to
me, and appologized, and gave me her email address.

Many of the airlines, and most all travel writers are active on
Twitter.  There is no reason why Twitter can't be used to promote
accessibility and civil rights in an airline context.

With in a couple of weeks, I received a more formal written response
acknowledging that the behavior was a violation of Part 382
regulations, and an additional $100 in travel credit.

I also requested that they give me a direct contact in the applicable
department so I don't have to just "call the 800 number" if I have an
issue.  I had a little pull with them also because I am flying 2 or 3
times a month with them, and several times at Boston they told me I
was one of their top frequent flyers. :)

I also have worked with their IT department to correct an issue where
boarding passes did not have alt-text that shoed the passengers
boarding letter and boarding position number.  They corrected this
with in about one month of being made aware of the issue.

I have also made them aware that their  upcoming WiFi service should
be tested to ensure accessibility, eg captcha issues.  They inform me
that this has been put on the radar screen of the Southwest project
manager handling the WiFi roll out, and that they don't expect captcha
to be an issue when they launc their service with Row 44 which is an
airline WiFi provider.

Finally I was recently in touch with them, because, a recent version
of their iPhone app broke accessibility, and namely there are now a
lot of unlabeled buttons.  I have not gotten a definitive answer yet
as to the iPhone app.  I'm sure it would help the cause if more of you
who either have iPhones or who are thinking of ever buying an iPhone,
submitted feedback on their web page to customer relations.  On their
form where you submit issues, there are disability specific categories
you can pick that will direct your comments to the team that handles
disability issues.

If you can't write a full letter, etc. at least send them a tweet
about the iPhone app
@southwestair

There is nothing magical about this "work," it just takes persistance,
and I know it would be better if more got involved.

Similar story with the mentioned in flighe entertainment systems.
Virgin America has a totally inaccdessible touch screen based system
which you use to order food, drinks, and entertain yourself.  However,
again, I don't think that carrier has been delluged with letters or
emails about that, and I don't know that people have filed DOT
complaints in the event that either Delta or Virgin America have not
appeared to make a good faith effort to correct their IFE issues.

Best,
Mika



On 6/26/10, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Thanks for that advice. I think I will try that in the Little Rock airport
> but I don't think this would be possible in bigger airports such as New
> York's JFK or London's Heathro. However, as I said in my previous email can
> be done about Delta's airlines in flight intertainment system not be
> excessable for the blind? When a blind person takes a international flight
> with Delta Airlines they can not even call the flight attendent with out
> sighted assistant because the whole system is touch screen.
> cheers,
> Anmol
> I seldom think about my limitations, and they never make me sad. Perhaps
> there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is vague, like a breeze
> among flowers.
> Hellen Keller
>
>
> --- On Sat, 6/26/10, Mika Pyyhkala <pyyhkala at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> From: Mika Pyyhkala <pyyhkala at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Airlines and Federation History
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Date: Saturday, June 26, 2010, 12:21 PM
>> The DOT has issued specific
>> directives to the airlines that they
>> cannot require a passenger, such as a blind person, to
>> accept a
>> wheelchair.
>>
>> If people are being told they are required to sit in a
>> wheelchair,
>> this is certainly something you should escallate to a CRO
>> and
>> depending on the circumstances be compensated for.
>>
>> Don't fall in to the trap of worrying too much if you miss
>> your
>> connection.  If you miss your connecting flight
>> because of say having
>> to work out an issue with a CRO the airline will
>> accommodate you on
>> their next scheduled flight.  In certain
>> circumstances, they also
>> might accommodate you on another airline, etc.
>>
>> If I missed my flight because of a situation with a CRO,
>> I'd certainly
>> ask them to upgrade me to first class on the reaccommodated
>> flight.
>>
>> I think members of the public, blind or not, don't really
>> "get" that
>> these airport supervisors and agents to a large extent can
>> waive any
>> rule, or do anything with your ticket.  They can
>> change your flight,
>> upgrade you, put you on another airline, waive change fees,
>> waive fare
>> differences, put you up in a hotel, etc.  They usually
>> arent' required
>> to do these things, but they can and do them under certain
>> circumstances.
>>
>> Lets just say hypothetically someone traveling to our
>> convention in
>> Dallas encounters the"you must sit in a wheelchair,"
>> issue.  I would
>> say fair compensation might be they upgrade you for the
>> rest of your
>> trip.  Or maybe you booked the 6AM flight for your
>> return because it
>> was cheap, it would also be fair for a CRO to say put you
>> on a 2:00PM
>> flight with no charge due to your issue with the
>> wheelchair
>> contractor, and waive the change fees and fare
>> differences.
>>
>> Otherwise a $100 travel voucher is pretty "standard"
>> compensation, of
>> course sometimes less and sometimes more.
>>
>> Your mileage will vary, and remember work with your
>> CRO.  If you "work
>> with them" and they "work with you" you should be able to
>> get the
>> situation resolved.
>>
>> I would also recommend that you not even request
>> assistance.  A lot of
>> trouble comes up because you guys request the
>> assistance.  If you can
>> corss a street or take a subway, I am sure you can navigate
>> an
>> airport.  Once in security, airports are not that hard
>> to get around.
>> Much easier than say shopping malls or other places you may
>> visit.
>>
>> The lingo you want to tell them when you check in is that
>> you don't
>> want any SSR (special service request) in your PNR
>> (passenger name
>> record.)
>>
>> Eg "I don't want any SSR entered in my PNR."
>>
>> They will be surprised you know this lingo, and again, lots
>> iof issud
>> come up because the SSR is in there.
>>
>> Best
>> Mika
>>
>> On 6/25/10, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>> > One time when changing planes at Saint Louis airport,
>> the person who was
>> > suppose to assist me came with a wheelchair and I like
>> you and like I always
>> > do said that I do need a wheelchair. I to got the
>> responce that he can not
>> > take me unless I take a wheelchair. The plane was
>> de-boarding us and picking
>> > up other passengers for the next distanation. The gate
>> agent was busy
>> > boarding the next flight and said to me "will you just
>> sit in the
>> > wheelchair"? Since I did not want to make a seen and
>> since he was busy I
>> > went ahead and did just that. But a vary interesting
>> thing happened! As soon
>> > as we left the gate, the person pushing the wheelchair
>> said "you did not
>> > want to sit in the wheelchair and they forced you to"?
>> I said yes. He said
>> > "we depend on tips and I know you will not tip me
>> since you did not ask for
>> > it". He turned around and took me back to the gate and
>> told the same agent
>> > that I did not want to sit in a wheelchair and they
>> rely on tips and I was
>> > not
>> >  going to give him a tip. The agent had to call a
>> airline employee and ask
>> > them to walk me to the gate where my next flight was.
>> This was great because
>> > the wheelchair person was the person who came to my
>> rescue and I did not
>> > even have to give a tip since it was a airline
>> employee assisting me and
>> > they are not allowed to except tips.
>> > Just out of wonder, can the airline make you sit in a
>> wheelchair if you do
>> > not want to? Perhaps this is another issue the NFB can
>> work on. The airports
>> > use the same staff the department who is assisting
>> people with special needs
>> > which is usually wheelchair people and thats why they
>> always have a
>> > wheelchair. Perhaps when the passengers let it be
>> known that they are blind,
>> > they should just have someone to basically walk us to
>> our next gate.
>> > Was is your thoughts?
>> > Anmol
>> > I seldom think about my limitations, and they never
>> make me sad. Perhaps
>> > there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is
>> vague, like a breeze
>> > among flowers.
>> > Hellen Keller
>> >
>> >
>> > --- On Fri, 6/25/10, Ignasi Cambra <ignasicambra at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> From: Ignasi Cambra <ignasicambra at gmail.com>
>> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Airlines and Federation
>> History
>> >> To: "National Association of Blind Students
>> mailing list"
>> >> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> >> Date: Friday, June 25, 2010, 9:51 AM
>> >> One time I got to the Atlanta
>> >> airport, and had 45 minutes to make it to my next
>> flight.
>> >> The person that was supposed to assist me came
>> relatively on
>> >> time, with a wheelchair. I told him I didn't need
>> or want a
>> >> wheelchair, and he literally told me that if I
>> didn't get on
>> >> the chair, he wasn't taking me anywhere. Besides
>> that, the
>> >> guy seemed terribly scared of my guide dog. A
>> passenger on
>> >> my flight just told me that he was going just a
>> couple of
>> >> gates away from mine, so I just left with him and
>> let the
>> >> airport employee leave with his wheelchair to do
>> whatever he
>> >> had to do. I never took any action about this,
>> just because
>> >> I didn't have any time.
>> >> On Jun 23, 2010, at 11:47 AM, Mika Pyyhkala
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > (story below of being asked to leave a plane
>> due to a
>> >> safety breifing issue)
>> >> >
>> >> > I don't think the blind should be
>> categorically denied
>> >> access to the
>> >> > exit rows, and I agree with Steve Jacobson's
>> >> comments.  It would be
>> >> > interesting to talk with Steve about his
>> experiences
>> >> in the 80's and
>> >> > 90's.
>> >> >
>> >> > The airline and exit row issue was one of the
>> main
>> >> things that got me
>> >> > interested in the NFB.
>> >> >
>> >> > There is another less known about rule that
>> was
>> >> adopted by the FAA
>> >> > initially at the same time that the initial
>> ACAA Part
>> >> 382 regulations
>> >> > were adopted by DOT.  This little known
>> about
>> >> rule concerns certain
>> >> > requirements that could imply that a blind
>> person must
>> >> receive an
>> >> > individual safety briefing, on top of the
>> general
>> >> safety briefing that
>> >> > is issued to all passengers.
>> >> >
>> >> > We in the federation object to any sort of
>> requirement
>> >> that the blind
>> >> > be subjected to some sort of additional
>> compulsory
>> >> safety briefing on
>> >> > the basis of blindness.  If a blind person
>> >> believes some kind of extra
>> >> > breifing would be helpful to them, they can
>> request
>> >> it.  However, the
>> >> > blind should not be required to receive an
>> extra
>> >> briefing soley based
>> >> > on blindness.
>> >> >
>> >> > Imagine if you will, if a blind person flew 3
>> times
>> >> per week.  Believe
>> >> > it or not, there are people that fly 3 times
>> per
>> >> week.  If you look at
>> >> > this safety briefing notion, imagine then
>> that in
>> >> theory the blind
>> >> > person that flys three times per week would
>> have to
>> >> receive some kind
>> >> > of "extra" "special" briefing that nobody
>> else is
>> >> required to receive.
>> >> > In fact,  the blind person that flys three
>> times
>> >> per week most likely
>> >> > knows the particulars of the aircraft more
>> than 95% of
>> >> travelers.  It
>> >> > is completely arbitrary and capricious to
>> require
>> >> blind people to
>> >> > receive these special briefings soley based
>> on ones
>> >> blindness.
>> >> >
>> >> > This discussion is also not just an academic
>> one, or
>> >> one just about
>> >> > theories and philosophy, or some kind of
>> table top
>> >> exercise.
>> >> >
>> >> > I fly on average about 2 to 4 times a month.
>> >> Fortunately, usually,
>> >> > there is not a major issue with the safety
>> briefings.
>> >> >
>> >> > However, I took a flight on Monday June 21st
>> where
>> >> initially
>> >> > immediately when I boarded, the flight
>> attendant
>> >> indicated that I
>> >> > would have to receive a special briefing.
>> Where
>> >> as with other
>> >> > passengers, the flight attendants greeted
>> them as they
>> >> boarded, I was
>> >> > initially "greeted," with the noted
>> statement.
>> >> >
>> >> > I told the flight attendant repeatedly that I
>> did not
>> >> want or need a
>> >> > "special briefing," and he kept insisting
>> that his
>> >> manual said that he
>> >> > was required by the FAA to provide such a
>> breifing.
>> >> >
>> >> > I asked for a CRO, Complaint Resolution
>> Official, and
>> >> then at least 1
>> >> > agent and 2 supervisors became involved.
>> >> >
>> >> > The agents and supervisors told the flight
>> attendant
>> >> that I was a
>> >> > frequent flyer, and didn't needd a "special
>> >> breifing."
>> >> >
>> >> > Then one of the agents said that they would
>> volunteer
>> >> to fly on the
>> >> > flight with me if this would make the flight
>> attendant
>> >> feel more
>> >> > comfortable.  I told them that while this
>> may
>> >> have been well intended,
>> >> > that it was not a good or solid solution to
>> the
>> >> problem.  I told them
>> >> > I still wanted to speak to a CRO myself.
>> >> >
>> >> > Now mind you all this was going on in the
>> middle of a
>> >> moderately full
>> >> > flight, and again, at this point I was in my
>> seat.
>> >> >
>> >> > Then a CRO came to my seat, and said that I
>> was to
>> >> take my things and
>> >> > come with her off the plane, and that they
>> were going
>> >> to rebook me on
>> >> > another flight.  I asked her if they were
>> going
>> >> to compensate me, and
>> >> > she said absolutely they would compensate
>> me.
>> >> She did actually do
>> >> > this in pretty much as quiet and as
>> discretely a way
>> >> as she could
>> >> > have.
>> >> >
>> >> > I don't know exactly what they would have
>> done if I
>> >> were to have told
>> >> > them I was not going to get off the plane.
>> >> However, several of our
>> >> > brothers and sisters in the NFB do have
>> stories of
>> >> telling "them" that
>> >> > they would not get off the plane.
>> >> >
>> >> > I chose to get off the plane because the
>> flight
>> >> attendant made me feel
>> >> > uncomfortable and unwelcome, because I was
>> confident
>> >> these gate agents
>> >> > were in fact going to do whatever they could
>> do to
>> >> help me, and
>> >> > because in some wayys I did not want to find
>> out what
>> >> would happen if
>> >> > I told them I would not get off.  But in
>> other
>> >> ways, I was curious
>> >> > about it.
>> >> >
>> >> > You have to remember also that, the way these
>> FAA and
>> >> DOT regulations
>> >> > are written, because NFB did not get what we
>> wanted,
>> >> there may be
>> >> > something the airline and flight attendant
>> could use
>> >> to try to say
>> >> > that we qre required to receive the special
>> >> briefing.  I am
>> >> > researching the particulars of the
>> applicable
>> >> regulations.
>> >> >
>> >> > Once we got off the plane, I told the gate
>> agents I
>> >> wanted them to
>> >> > rebook me on another airline to a city closer
>> to where
>> >> I was going,
>> >> > and they obliged without any objections or
>> fuss or
>> >> trouble.
>> >> >
>> >> > Also for my compensation they issued a
>> roundtrip
>> >> flight voucher which
>> >> > is this carriers usual compensation for a
>> denied
>> >> boarding situation.
>> >> > Again they issued the compensation without
>> any fuss or
>> >> difficulty.
>> >> >
>> >> > The next day, on my return flight, I ran in
>> to the
>> >> supervisor who had
>> >> > asked me to leave the plane.  She said that
>> they
>> >> were going to have a
>> >> > conference call with the station managers,
>> the flight
>> >> attendants duty
>> >> > manager, and others and that likely "some
>> action will
>> >> be taken against
>> >> > the flight attendant."
>> >> >
>> >> > The CRO supervisor had the wherewithall to
>> say that
>> >> while the "manual"
>> >> > might say that you always brief a blind
>> passenger
>> >> separately, that no
>> >> > manual can account for every individual
>> situation.
>> >> >
>> >> > In conclusion it also really occurs to me
>> that most
>> >> blind people need
>> >> > to learn more about the nuts and bolts of how
>> airlines
>> >> work, how to
>> >> > deal with CRO's, etc.  The stories I hear
>> are
>> >> just crazy, eg, blind
>> >> > people saying they were required to use a
>> wheelchair
>> >> or other odd
>> >> > things.
>> >> >
>> >> > If you  learn how the airlines work, learn
>> how to
>> >> work with your CRO,
>> >> > if they get to know you at the airport, you
>> really
>> >> often can have a
>> >> > good experience.
>> >> >
>> >> > Working with a CRO, as I described it in an
>> email
>> >> yesterday to my
>> >> > sister, is sort of a dance of carrots and
>> sticks and
>> >> give and take.
>> >> >
>> >> > In general, the law does not require the
>> airline or
>> >> the CRO to make
>> >> > your travel more comfortable, pleasant or for
>> them to
>> >> compensate you
>> >> > or really work with you.  The regulations
>> have a
>> >> lot of requirements,
>> >> > but a lot of them are administrative.  And
>> if any
>> >> dollars are to be
>> >> > paid out, its usually fines a carrier would
>> pay to the
>> >> government.
>> >> > That said, if the CRO wants to help you, they
>> really
>> >> can do a lot for
>> >> > you, but again typically they aren't
>> required
>> >> too.  If they wanted to
>> >> > make your life miserable, they could do that
>> >> too...this would be
>> >> > especially rellevant if you are a very
>> frequent
>> >> flyer.
>> >> >
>> >> > There is also nothing to say you as the
>> passenger have
>> >> to make life
>> >> > easy for the airline.  Your free to file a
>> DOT
>> >> complaint whenever they
>> >> > screw up.  Almost always if a situation
>> >> escallates to the point of
>> >> > needing a CRO, they will screw up on some
>> technicality
>> >> of the
>> >> > regulation and usually more than one.  When
>> you
>> >> file a compalint with
>> >> > DOT it gets tagged against the carrier, and
>> DOT
>> >> completes an
>> >> > investigation similar to that of when a
>> member of
>> >> congress makes an
>> >> > inquiry to the agency.  Its a lot of
>> paperwork
>> >> for the airline and for
>> >> > DOT, and there are very specific ways they
>> have to
>> >> handle the
>> >> > complaint.  That said, if your satisfied
>> that the
>> >> CRO resolved an
>> >> > issue for you, you don't have to file a DOT
>> >> complaint.
>> >> >
>> >> > Hopefully this gives people a few things to
>> think
>> >> about.  And we
>> >> > really should do a seminar on how to deal
>> with the
>> >> airlines on a
>> >> > really practical in the field sense and not
>> just in
>> >> theory.  We should
>> >> > have some very frequent flyers and maybe a
>> real CRO
>> >> put the seminar
>> >> > on.
>> >> >
>> >> > Best,
>> >> > Mika
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On 5/27/10, Briley Pollard <brileyp at gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> >> It is also important to note that
>> everyone else
>> >> who sits in those seats is
>> >> >> only instructed to give it up if they
>> "feel they
>> >> are not willing or able to
>> >> >> complete these tasks." Why should we not
>> be
>> >> permitted to use our own
>> >> >> judgment on this matter? We should have
>> to prove
>> >> it to someone else? I
>> >> >> should think not.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Briley
>> >> >> On May 27, 2010, at 4:58 AM, Jedi wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>> Antonio,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> It's kind of ridiculous that I should
>> have to
>> >> prove my capacity to open
>> >> >>> the door to anyone much less you when
>> sighted
>> >> people don't have to. That's
>> >> >>> the issue, isn't it? As you have
>> already
>> >> stated, there's no guarantee that
>> >> >>> all sighted people are truly capable
>> of
>> >> opening the door, but it's enough
>> >> >>> to know that they believe they can by
>> virtue
>> >> of the intelligence to figure
>> >> >>> it out. Lest anyone think that a
>> sighted
>> >> person would be able to figure
>> >> >>> out how to open the door by means of
>> reading
>> >> visual instructions, I should
>> >> >>> point out that not all sighted people
>> can
>> >> understand diagrams of that sort
>> >> >>> much less utilize them. Just a
>> thought. If the
>> >> cabin is dark or smoky,
>> >> >>> visual instructions won't help
>> anyone.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Respectfully,
>> >> >>> Jedi
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Original message:
>> >> >>>> Hi,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> Jedi, I wonder how you find
>> yourself more
>> >> capable to open the door, and
>> >> >>>> the
>> >> >>>> slide ramp better than many
>> people you
>> >> know if you haven't actually had
>> >> >>>> the
>> >> >>>> experience of, thus the ability
>> to learn
>> >> to deal with the equipment
>> >> >>>> before.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> Just as there are capable, and
>> not so
>> >> capable sighted people, many of
>> >> >>>> whom
>> >> >>>> can not open the door and the
>> slide, there
>> >> are many blind people who are
>> >> >>>> not
>> >> >>>> capable of performing the
>> duties.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> I for one don't mind, and don't
>> care to
>> >> sit in exit sitting, as long as I
>> >> >>>> can sit in a place more or less
>> determined
>> >> by me. That would mean I would
>> >> >>>> not choose to sit in a bulk head
>> seat.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> If the airline can pre-screen for
>> likely
>> >> liabilities, IE. blind passenger
>> >> >>>> who can't see the handle for the
>> ramp,
>> >> they will. And if I can be seated
>> >> >>>> in
>> >> >>>> a reasonable fashion, and get to
>> my
>> >> destination without snag, I am fine,
>> >> >>>> and
>> >> >>>> feel treated fairly for the
>> services the
>> >> airline offers.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> Antonio M. Guimaraes Jr.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> Student, Western Governors
>> University
>> >> >>>> (617) 744-9716
>> >> >>>> Eastern time zone
>> >> >>>> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> >>>> From: "Steve Jacobson" <steve.jacobson at visi.com>
>> >> >>>> To: "National Association of
>> Blind
>> >> Students mailing list"
>> >> >>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> >> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2010 12:18
>> PM
>> >> >>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Airlines
>> and
>> >> Federation History
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>> You make some very good
>> points
>> >> here.  I don't think that some are
>> >> >>>>> realizing how little is
>> really
>> >> expected of most people who choose to sit
>> >> >>>>> in an exit row.  One thing
>> I
>> >> >>>>> forgot to mention when I was
>> writing
>> >> about why we were as upset as we
>> >> >>>>> were
>> >> >>>>> about exit rows in the 80's
>> is that
>> >> there was a policy considered that
>> >> >>>>> would have not
>> >> >>>>> only prohibited us from
>> sitting in
>> >> exit rows, we would also have been
>> >> >>>>> prohibited from the row in
>> front of or
>> >> behind an exit row.  That would
>> >> >>>>> have excluded us from
>> >> >>>>> quite a number of seats on
>> some
>> >> planes.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>> Best regards,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>> Steve Jacobson
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>> On Tue, 18 May 2010 01:24:46
>> -0400,
>> >> Jedi wrote:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read
>> Walking
>> >> Alone and Marching Together! Peter
>> >> >>>>>> can't have given a
>> better
>> >> suggestion!
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>> Unfortunately folks, this
>> is
>> >> exactly the press that makes airlines
>> >> >>>>>> think we can't do for
>> ourselves
>> >> thus asking us not to sit in emergency
>> >> >>>>>> exits, asking us to
>> preboard,
>> >> asking us to deplane after everyone else,
>> >> >>>>>> and altogether treating
>> us as
>> >> though we can't handle ourselves. For
>> >> >>>>>> those who think the
>> emergency exit
>> >> row thing is not such a big deal and
>> >> >>>>>> worth fighting over, let
>> me remind
>> >> you that a person as young as
>> >> >>>>>> fifteen can sit there, a
>> person
>> >> served alcohol (either before boarding
>> >> >>>>>> or on the plane) can sit
>> there,
>> >> and anyone who judges themselves (with
>> >> >>>>>> the exceptions of the
>> deaf, the
>> >> blind, the non-English speaking, and
>> >> >>>>>> the otherwise visibly
>> disabled)
>> >> can sit there. So basically, we're less
>> >> >>>>>> competent, in the opinion
>> of FFA,
>> >> than a fifteen-year-old or a drunk.
>> >> >>>>>> Others are allowed to
>> judge their
>> >> fitness for sitting there, but we
>> >> >>>>>> cannot. Is that worth
>> fighting
>> >> about? Absolutely! Unfortunately, how
>> >> >>>>>> society thinks of us in
>> this
>> >> context is very indicative of how society
>> >> >>>>>> thinks of us in others.
>> This might
>> >> sound harsh, but it's unfortunately
>> >> >>>>>> quite true. The bottom
>> line here
>> >> is that blind people are treated
>> >> >>>>>> arbitrarily based on
>> someone
>> >> else's opinion of what we can do versus
>> >> >>>>>> our own. Arbitrary
>> treatment of
>> >> this kind is not limited to disability
>> >> >>>>>> in our past, but has also
>> been
>> >> used to separate People of Color from
>> >> >>>>>> White folks back in the
>> day and
>> >> even now to an often invisible extent.
>> >> >>>>>> That's why Federationists
>> fought.
>> >> Unfortunately, we did lose that
>> >> >>>>>> battle, but that doesn't
>> mean that
>> >> we won't reserect it someday. I hope
>> >> >>>>>> we do as I consider
>> myself more
>> >> capable of opening that exit than many
>> >> >>>>>> sighted persons I know.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>> Respectfully,
>> >> >>>>>> Jedi
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>> Original message:
>> >> >>>>>>> Hello Peter,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>> I must say that NFB's
>> issues
>> >> with the airlines are an excellent
>> >> >>>>>>> example
>> >> >>>>>>> of the need to pick
>> battles
>> >> one can actually win.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>> It is my thought that
>> the
>> >> fight over the exit row was ridiculous.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>> There's only one case
>> where it
>> >> might be a legitimate issue. That would
>> >> >>>>>>> be if it resulted in
>> a blind
>> >> person actually being denied the trip.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>> If the blind person
>> can be
>> >> reseated or a sighted one is voluntarily
>> >> >>>>>>> bumped in order to
>> secure the
>> >> blind person's equal rights in the case
>> >> >>>>>>> of
>> >> >>>>>>> a packed flight, then
>> the
>> >> matter is resolved IMHO.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>> On 5/16/2010 11:50
>> AM, Peter
>> >> Donahue wrote:
>> >> >>>>>>>> Hello Briley and
>> >> everyone,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>    If people
>> >> would take the time to read Walking Alone and
>> Marching
>> >> >>>>>>>> Together they
>> would learn
>> >> of the federation's long struggle to secure
>> >> >>>>>>>> equal
>> >> >>>>>>>> access for the
>> blind in
>> >> air travel. It is a history filled with the
>> >> >>>>>>>> kind of
>> >> >>>>>>>> publicity and
>> dribble that
>> >> can result from incidents like this one,
>> >> >>>>>>>> and
>> >> >>>>>>>> much
>> >> >>>>>>>> much more. Blind
>> people
>> >> had their canes taken away from them by
>> >> >>>>>>>> airline
>> >> >>>>>>>> personnel, were
>> told they
>> >> couldn't sit in seat rows other than the
>> >> >>>>>>>> bulkhead
>> >> >>>>>>>> if they used a
>> guide dog,
>> >> were told they needed to preboard and
>> >> >>>>>>>> post-board,
>> >> >>>>>>>> the list goes on.
>> Read
>> >> past issues of The Braille Monitor from the
>> >> >>>>>>>> late
>> >> >>>>>>>> 1980s and the
>> early 1990s
>> >> to get an idea of the kind of
>> >> >>>>>>>> discrimination
>> >> >>>>>>>> heaped on blind
>> air
>> >> passengers and why today we must still be on our
>> >> >>>>>>>> guard
>> >> >>>>>>>> when stories of
>> this kind
>> >> hit the media. Blind people were arrested
>> >> >>>>>>>> and
>> >> >>>>>>>> physically
>> removed from
>> >> planes and went to jail for doing nothing
>> >> >>>>>>>> more
>> >> >>>>>>>> than
>> >> >>>>>>>> demanding to be
>> treated
>> >> like other passengers.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>    We
>> >> successfully closed down a US Airways ticket
>> counter for
>> >> >>>>>>>> several
>> >> >>>>>>>> hours due to
>> their
>> >> demanding a blind person move from an emergency
>> >> >>>>>>>> exit
>> >> >>>>>>>> row;
>> >> >>>>>>>> a seat he was
>> assigned in
>> >> the first place. The NFB held several
>> >> >>>>>>>> protest
>> >> >>>>>>>> against the FAA
>> and the
>> >> DOT due to their unwillingness to take a hand
>> >> >>>>>>>> in
>> >> >>>>>>>> remedying the
>> >> discriminatory treatment we experienced at the
>> hands of
>> >> >>>>>>>> the
>> >> >>>>>>>> airlines and
>> still do. I
>> >> know because I took part in several of these
>> >> >>>>>>>> activities.
>> >> >>>>>>>> Other types of
>> air
>> >> passengers now experience similar treatment.
>> Large
>> >> >>>>>>>> passengers are an
>> example.
>> >> The NFB can teach the flying public a
>> >> >>>>>>>> thing
>> >> >>>>>>>> or
>> >> >>>>>>>> two about
>> fighting the
>> >> horrible treatment now experienced all too
>> >> >>>>>>>> often.
>> >> >>>>>>>> They just need to
>> learn to
>> >> stop, as Dr. Maurer put it in 1986,
>> >> >>>>>>>> "Sitting
>> >> >>>>>>>> down
>> >> >>>>>>>> and shutting
>> up!"We as
>> >> federationists need to remember these
>> >> >>>>>>>> struggles
>> >> >>>>>>>> and
>> >> >>>>>>>> not take the
>> freedom of
>> >> travel we now have for granted. These
>> >> >>>>>>>> nabsters
>> >> >>>>>>>> aren't just
>> squealing over
>> >> nothing but are remembering our past and
>> >> >>>>>>>> upholding our
>> legacy of
>> >> collective action by reacting the way they
>> >> >>>>>>>> are.
>> >> >>>>>>>> All
>> >> >>>>>>>> the best.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Peter Donahue
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> ----- Original
>> Message
>> >> -----
>> >> >>>>>>>> From: "Briley
>> >> Pollard"<brileyp at gmail.com>
>> >> >>>>>>>> To: "National
>> Association
>> >> of Blind Students mailing list"
>> >> >>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, May
>> 16, 2010
>> >> 9:39 AM
>> >> >>>>>>>> Subject: Re:
>> [nabs-l] Fwd:
>> >> [Members] Airline apologizes for
>> >> >>>>>>>> forgetting
>> >> >>>>>>>> blindteen
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Valory,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Again, the reason
>> this is
>> >> upsetting is A, this girl, (from the way it
>> >> >>>>>>>> was
>> >> >>>>>>>> portrayed),
>> isn't
>> >> comfortable enough with herself to stand up for
>> her
>> >> >>>>>>>> rights, and B,
>> (the
>> >> biggest issue), how we're portrayed in the media.
>> >> >>>>>>>> What
>> >> >>>>>>>> is said about one
>> of us is
>> >> perceived to be a definition of all of us.
>> >> >>>>>>>> Media
>> >> >>>>>>>> coverage of us is
>> so often
>> >> negative and condescending, and yes, it
>> >> >>>>>>>> does
>> >> >>>>>>>> upset me, and yes
>> it does
>> >> push me to speak up about how this is not
>> >> >>>>>>>> acceptable.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Briley
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> On May 15, 2010,
>> at 10:15
>> >> PM, Valerie Gibson wrote:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> I agree.
>> Seems
>> >> to quick to point out someone else's fault and
>> >> >>>>>>>>> become
>> >> >>>>>>>>> indignant for
>> all over
>> >> one person's actions.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> There's just
>> not
>> >> enough imformation in the article to make such
>> >> >>>>>>>>> judgement
>> >> >>>>>>>>> calls.  We
>> can
>> >> only say what we would do in that situation, and
>> >> >>>>>>>>> while
>> >> >>>>>>>>> we
>> >> >>>>>>>>> don't know
>> this girl's
>> >> background or mental capabilities it seems
>> >> >>>>>>>>> unfair
>> >> >>>>>>>>> to point
>> fingers.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> Perhaps she
>> did not
>> >> know that there are organisations like the NFB
>> >> >>>>>>>>> who
>> >> >>>>>>>>> could help
>> her.
>> >> Perhaps she has been told all of her life that
>> she
>> >> >>>>>>>>> needs
>> >> >>>>>>>>> sighted help
>> in
>> >> everything.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> We've all
>> been in a
>> >> position where we did not know how to do things,
>> >> >>>>>>>>> and
>> >> >>>>>>>>> judging that
>> you have
>> >> found this mailing list, you've found the NFB
>> >> >>>>>>>>> as
>> >> >>>>>>>>> well as a
>> sense of
>> >> endependance.   Not everyone has done so.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> Does it look
>> bad for
>> >> the blind community? Yes.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> But how's
>> this for a
>> >> solution: try and find this girl and tell her
>> >> >>>>>>>>> that
>> >> >>>>>>>>> there are
>> places where
>> >> she can learn a bit of independance.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>> On May 15,
>> 2010, at
>> >> 8:33 PM, Darrell Shandrow wrote:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Hello
>> Sarah and
>> >> all,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> I think
>> we may
>> >> want to exercise care before judging this
>> situation
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> too
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> quickly.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> Many
>> times while
>> >> traveling by air, flight attendants have asked
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> that
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> I
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> wait
>> until the
>> >> plane has emptied before leaving. Sometimes I do
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> this
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> and
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> sometimes
>> I
>> >> don't.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> If
>> Jessica were
>> >> asked to wait, then she were forgotten, then she
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> certainly
>> does
>> >> have a very legitimate complaint here.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> We also
>> need to
>> >> keep in mind that members of the blind community
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> have
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> wide
>> ranging
>> >> capabilities and other disabilities with which
>> they
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> must
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> cope.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> As
>> always, this
>> >> just comes down to the fact we all must exercise
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> our
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> due
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> diligence
>> while
>> >> performing our jobs to avoid problems of this
>> sort.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> On
>> 5/15/2010 4:19
>> >> PM, Sarah Alawami wrote:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> I
>> think she
>> >> should have gotten off the plain by her self. How
>> hard
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> can
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> that
>> be?
>> >> just  get off and turn right and go up the ramp
>> thing
>> >> and
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> turn
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> left
>> and get
>> >> out and then wait for your escort. but here's the
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> story.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> Airline
>> >> apologizes for forgetting blind teen
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> Edmonton
>> >> Journal , May 15, 2010
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> United
>> >> Airlines has apologized to a blind woman from
>> Vancouver
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> Island
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> who
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> was
>> abandoned
>> >> on an empty plane in Chicago.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> Jessica Cabot
>> >> of Courtenay, B.C., made headlines this week
>> after
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> she
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> went
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> public about
>> >> being forgotten in an empty United Airlines plane
>> on
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> an
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> April
>> 7
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> stopover in
>> >> Chicago.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> The
>> >> 18-year-old was waiting for flight attendants to
>> escort her
>> >> to
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> a
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> connecting
>> >> flight to Florida when she heard the plane door
>> seal
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> shut.
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Ten
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> minutes later
>> >> two maintenance staff happened to find her on an
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> unscheduled
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> check
>> of the
>> >> plane.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> She
>> panicked
>> >> in the plane, calling for help.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> After
>> a series
>> >> of complaints, Cabot received a $250 airline
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> voucher
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> and
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> the
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> promise of an
>> >> apology. Five weeks after her flight and a series
>> of
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> news
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> stories later,
>> >> she finally got one.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> "They
>> just
>> >> called," said Cabot, on the phone from
>> Jacksonville,
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> Fla.,
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> where
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> she
>> is
>> >> visiting her fiance. "I can't even count how many
>> times
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> they
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>> said
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> sorry."
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> nabs-l mailing
>> >> list
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>> >> info
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>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >>>>>>>>>> nabs-l
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>> >> >>>
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>> >> _______________________________________________
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