[nabs-l] more transportation, and travel questions
Anjelina
anjelinac26 at gmail.com
Wed Oct 13 12:09:24 UTC 2010
Anita:
Great advice. I've also found it helpful to ask bus drivers or other
passengers about the cross streets and surrounding businesses. It's
interesting what you can learn on a bus trip. :)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anita Adkins" <aadkins7 at verizon.net>
To: "Ashley Bramlett" <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>; "National Association of
Blind Students mailing list" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:03 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] more transportation, and travel questions
> First, get to it by typing in www.google.com if it is not your homepage.
> You might be able to add a forward slash followed by the word maps, but
> haven't tried this yet because Google happens to be my prefered home page.
> On this page, there is a link that says maps, which you will press enter
> on. When the page loads, it will have an edit box, and you will type your
> start destination followed by your end destination like this: Valley View
> Apartments, Frostburg, MD to Country Club Mall, Lavale, MD
> Use the commas as I have them, but of course, use your own locations. You
> could also type a street number such as 93 West Boxing Lane, (I made that
> up). You would put a comma after the street name also. It is very
> usable. In fact, I used to learn how to navigate the town I am in
> independently without the assistance of an O&M instructor. I also used
> other tools to help me with this. For example, I babysat 40 hours per
> week in Cumberland, and so I had to take the bus to and from that job and
> also a cab from the college over there to here late at night because my
> area is not big and buses do not run late at night. While in whichever
> type of transportation, I asked the driver to tell me the cross streets as
> we came to them, and I wrote them down. I moved here because I was
> transfering to the college here in town, and I also used Google to help me
> learn how to get to the campus of this school, and I also asked people
> that I knew about the area and the bus and cab drivers. But, back to
> Google Maps. You can have it provide walking direcetions, bicycling
> directions, driving directions and probably more. I believe it is
> automatically set for driving directions. To test it, you can do like I
> did and ask it how to go somewhere you already know how to get to because
> you will be able to determine its accuracy. Also, I will ask it for
> driving and then for walking sometimes if I am learning a new place
> because if walking has you head and driving has you head east, I can learn
> the cross streets on either side of me like that. Gotta run for school,
> and so sorry can't go into this further now. But, anyone can feel free to
> ask more questions, and please ignore my mistakes throughout this email.
> Thanks. Sorry, just looked, it gives miles. This is why I build on my
> knowledge by first determining at least the name of one place on each
> block because then I could learn the connecting streets. I wish it did
> tell you blocks and the names in between. It is in beta, and so maybe
> this could be suggested by someone. However, I have learned that a block
> in my type of a city is about 1/10 of a mile, and so you may be able to
> figure it out for your city. In small cities, blocks are shorter than in
> big cities, or so it seems to me. Gotta rush out of here. Have a great
> day. Anita
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ashley Bramlett" <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 10:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] more transportation, and travel questions
>
>
>> Hi Anita,
>> Good suggestions. A few questions.
>> I haven't used Google Maps. By its nature it has a map with it; so how
>> do you get to the site and does it give user friendly pedestrian
>> directions?
>> Will it give directions in terms of blocks or for cars, the miles?
>>
>> Yes arriving ten minutes early is a good idea.
>> I'd say call them over sending a facebook message; you'll get more out of
>> a conversation. Its a shame you don't have a good mobility instructor
>> Kerri. I learned about the bus system, how to call them, what questions
>> to ask, addresses, and landmarks from the O&M instructor I had.
>>
>> You need to give the bus rep some info. An address is fine I believe but
>> they don't need to know its the apartment.
>> Another idea is to get the street your complex is on and ask this way.
>> "Sally, what bus runs on Elm street?"
>> While on the bus its true they have radios but I thought they're off
>> while talking to customers.
>> Whether its an address or something else you need to give them the stop
>> you want to get off. This is probably done by intersections. But each
>> bus system is different.
>> So say "Driver, I need to get off at 4th and Clark street." Some stops
>> are at landmarks or right at malls. In that case state that. "Driver I
>> need to depart at the Crabtree mall."
>> Often buses run in thirty minute intervals or on the hour. If you'll use
>> a bus frequently get to know its schedule.
>> If you live in a city you might be lucky and buses may run more like
>> every 20 minutes!
>>
>> Kerri some systems such as the DC metro system have an automated phone
>> system. You might check if yours has this; probably not but its worth
>> asking.
>> This phone system allows you to state your bus number. Then the computer
>> system checks and says when the next bus is coming. It also says if
>> there's any bus disruptions on a different menu.
>>
>> I also thought of something; if you have lots of questions including
>> basic info, it may be worth setting up an appointment with a bus company
>> representative to ask these questions. You don't want to tie up the
>> phone line a long time on their end but you also want to get this
>> information. If you show interest in their system, they may be happy to
>> be accomodating. Accomodations are making the website accessible,
>> announcing stops, providing basic info in accessible formats and
>> providing accessible fair machines.
>> The metro system here has information in braille and large print plus
>> many phone features anyone can use including those with disabilities as
>> long as you can speak clearly.
>> Some companies just are not aware of blind customers and their needs.
>>
>> Ashley
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Anita Adkins" <aadkins7 at verizon.net>
>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:10 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] more transportation, and travel questions
>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> First, I mean once you are used to the bus route and going all over the
>>> place, you will then have the information of where you are waiting and
>>> can communicate this to the driver whereas you do not know now simply
>>> because you are not familiar with the routes. Remember, you may not
>>> always be leaving from home, and so your waiting area could be downtown
>>> somewhere. In a big city, you may even be able to wait at a bus stop and
>>> not need to worry with even calling, but in my area, there are not many
>>> bus stops; people just flag the bus down in most spots. And, the nice
>>> thing about the mall in my area is that the bus arrives at a certain
>>> time, and it is easy to get to, and so I know at 30 after the hour I
>>> need to be there waiting. Just FYI, you always want to be there about
>>> ten minutes before the scheduled arrival time of the bus so you do not
>>> miss it by accident. Here's a question for you: is your goal to ride the
>>> bus, or is your goal specificly to travel on the bus from your home?
>>> Another option might be for you to cab (if available) to the mall and
>>> then take the bus home or, if possible, to another location that is easy
>>> to arrive to. I don't mean to do this on a regular basis; I just mean
>>> for a first try. Maybe, someone sighted could meet you, such as your
>>> mother, when you get off the bus, but you could insist that you walk
>>> home without holding her arm so you can learn the route, or you could
>>> just have someone walk with you to and from the bus pickup/drop off spot
>>> near your home to familiarize you with it before you take the bus at
>>> all. Again, I would explore on my own, but if you are not an
>>> experienced traveler, it is okay to bring along company. Just make sure
>>> the company is someone who will let you walk on your own and that the
>>> person is not too overhelpful or too afraid you will hurt yourself.
>>> Just another thought. I agree with Ashley that is none of their business
>>> where you live; perhaps, it would be a better idea for you to ask
>>> someone or for you to use Google maps to learn the names of the street
>>> in your area. For example, google directions from your house to a place
>>> you know is close by. You will hear google say something like head west
>>> toward Bell Street or whatever, and then you would know the name of the
>>> cross street. Or, if you already know the name of the highway with the
>>> red light, you could reference that with the bus. The bus people speak
>>> over radios that can be heard by many people, and it is probably not a
>>> good idea to have your address broadcast over the system just for safety
>>> reasons even though you do live in a gated apartment. I am not trying to
>>> scare you; I am just pointing out that you might want to avoid using
>>> your address. In fact, my bus system does not want your address, and I
>>> think there is a law or maybe company policy that you cannot give them
>>> specific directions like that. Also, do you use the bus for people with
>>> disabilities in your area? You do have to schedule this, but if you are
>>> not used to taking buses, this might be a first good step as it will
>>> take you from door to door and you can familiarize yourself with the
>>> environments, such as the layout of the mall, before you figure out how
>>> to city bus to it. Just an idea. I am certainly not trying to tell you
>>> not to take the bus. But again, asking a buddy to come along for your
>>> first time is okay to do. BTW, transfering is not a big deal. You just
>>> ask for a transfer slip when you get on the bus and give it to the next
>>> bus driver. If you transfer at a central location where all buses come
>>> together, you can ask the driver if the bus you are looking for, such as
>>> the green line, is in front of you or even if it has arrived yet. Also,
>>> you can ask the driver to radio the driver for the bus to which you are
>>> transfering to tell them you are there, but still be certain to ask
>>> nearby people which color line of the bus is coming up as I do this all
>>> of the time, and it is beneficial. I would call the bus company instead
>>> of facebooking them alone. It is okay to facebook or send them a
>>> message, but you will still probably need to call to clarify information
>>> with them. Of course, you will know this for certain when you do the
>>> calling. I am thinking if you call, that this is really your first big
>>> step because you have made human contact with them. You may have done
>>> this in the past, but now you are nervous, and calling them now will
>>> mean you can succeed at one step--finding out the bus route. If you
>>> have a scanner, you can probably scan this bus route in, and if you are
>>> a student at the college you mention, it probably has a scanner in its
>>> disability office that you may be able to use. To hire a reader, put up
>>> an ad at the college. This is if you need a reader for a steady amount
>>> of time each month, such as ten hours. You wouldn't want to do that for
>>> just a one-time occurrence. Just some tips. Sorry if I am so talkative.
>>> I'm in school, and I'm too tired to do much editing and deleting extra
>>> information at this point. Smile. Again, good luck and have fun. Anita
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Kerri Kosten" <kerrik2006 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "Ashley Bramlett" <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>; "National Association
>>> of Blind Students mailing list" <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 8:26 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] more transportation, and travel questions
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi Ashley, Anita, and All:
>>>>
>>>> First, Anita, I can't just call them and say "I'm waiting at this
>>>> stop" as I don't know where the stop is from my apartment complex. I
>>>> want to say it's at the light but not for certain. The website is
>>>> inaccessible so I can't check there. So, I kind of have to call them
>>>> and explain the situation and where I live.
>>>>
>>>> Also Anita, Morgantown is a college town and since the majority of the
>>>> students can drive the bus caters to the freshman students. I do not
>>>> live in the student area so I'm pretty sure I'm going to have to
>>>> transfer or take two buses to get anywhere. I don't think I can just
>>>> take just one bus to one location as it's weird here and you have to
>>>> connect.
>>>>
>>>> I think I'd like to go to the Morgantown Mall in Westover for my first
>>>> trip. I am on the same side of town as the mall so maybe just maybe I
>>>> may be able to go on one bus but I'll have to check.
>>>>
>>>> Ashley, I live in a gated apartment complex...Don't I need to let them
>>>> know what complex it is and where it is so they can tell me where the
>>>> stop is?
>>>>
>>>> Also, our buses do not have directions like westbound...they are
>>>> colored lines...the orange line, the blue and gold connector, the
>>>> purple line, the brown line...they have no directional names what so
>>>> ever.
>>>>
>>>> Since they are on Facebook...would it be okay if I messaged them since
>>>> I'm better at writing than talking and can think out my questions
>>>> better when writing? Or do I have to call? If I message them then I
>>>> can copy/make notes on the time, any transfers, and location of stops
>>>> as needed.
>>>>
>>>> Also, I'll ask if my friend could come down but you have to
>>>> understand...it's my state president and her significant other and
>>>> they are middle-aged so...I'll ask them but I don't know?
>>>>
>>>> I tried to talk to my mother to see if she could help me look at the
>>>> schedule and map but she said I could just call...I don't know where
>>>> else to get help from. Many of the sighted people I know have the
>>>> typical feel sorry for the blind girl attitude so I don't know if
>>>> asking a sighted friend to help me would be effective but I will try.
>>>>
>>>> Also since I shouldn't need to use the deviated route service to go to
>>>> the mall I guess to keep things simple I'll leave the deviated route
>>>> out for now.
>>>>
>>>> I don't currently have a reader nor know how to hire one though I've
>>>> read about it.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> Kerri
>>>>
>>>> On 10/12/10, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>> Kerri,
>>>>> Sometimes I believe as blind people we need to do what is realistic
>>>>> and
>>>>> safe. If this venue is not pedestrian friendly with few or no
>>>>> sidewalks and
>>>>> built for cars, then I'd really advise not going there especially
>>>>> since you
>>>>> say you're a beginning traveler. My views of independence may be a
>>>>> little
>>>>> different here. But I say independence means going where you want to
>>>>> go and
>>>>> when but not inconveiencing yourself too much and it means asking for
>>>>> assistant when needed.
>>>>> Why not make some friends and go with them who have cars if you really
>>>>> want
>>>>> to go to this town center?
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't answer your depot question as I have not done that. Generally
>>>>> though with buses, yes ask the driver to announce your stop. Sit near
>>>>> the
>>>>> driver and you might have to remind him/her. If you need to transfer
>>>>> most
>>>>> bus companies have a bus
>>>>> transfer pass. So get one before leaving your first bus. Be sure to
>>>>> ask
>>>>> what bus it is and where its going
>>>>> when you board your second bus. You don't want to board the wrong
>>>>> bus!
>>>>>
>>>>> As to the bus company and questions, its up to you. But no I would
>>>>> not
>>>>> recommend stating where you live. Just explain you want to get from
>>>>> point A
>>>>> to B and give the addresses. Then yes you could explain you're blind
>>>>> and
>>>>> ask about the deviated route if you wanted.
>>>>> Its not necessary for the representative to know where you live
>>>>> although if
>>>>> they see the address is an apartment complex they'll probably
>>>>> figure its your home. But its not the company's business to know
>>>>> where you
>>>>> live.
>>>>> I have hardly traveled either because my mother is protective like
>>>>> yours is.
>>>>> But when I ask about public transit, I take down the information and
>>>>> repeat
>>>>> it back to the customer service representative to ensure I understood
>>>>> it.
>>>>> Another option is to record the information while on the phone. I get
>>>>> this
>>>>> info:
>>>>> 1. the time the bus leaves my stop and the full name of it like the
>>>>> 38B
>>>>> westbound.
>>>>> Each bus has two directions so the direction is important.
>>>>> 2. The arrival time of the bus to the next destination.
>>>>> 3. At my destination any landmarks or where the stop is if they'll
>>>>> tell me.
>>>>> Does it let me off mid block? Near a 711? Is there a bus shelter at my
>>>>> end
>>>>> stop?
>>>>> 4. If I need a transfer ticket how long is the transfer pass valid
>>>>> for?
>>>>>
>>>>> Finally, if you use readers I'd say they could look at the map for you
>>>>> and
>>>>> describe major landmarks.
>>>>> Sometimes you need sighted assistance and independence is knowing when
>>>>> to
>>>>> get it. Independence is being in control of your choices.
>>>>> So print out the map and go over it with someone.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ashley
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Kerri Kosten" <kerrik2006 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 4:54 PM
>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] more transportation, and travel questions
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi All:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have a few more travel and transportation questions. Again, I hope
>>>>>> these don't jump around too much but I figured I'd make them all one
>>>>>> post.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First, I think I would like to try sometime in the future taking the
>>>>>> bus to somewhere simple such as maybe the mall. The problem Iam
>>>>>> having
>>>>>> is that this being a college town the bus caters to the nondriving
>>>>>> students, who are the freshman. The freshman for the most part live
>>>>>> downtown on the downtown campus (the college has two campuses.) I do
>>>>>> not live in the downtown area so to go anywhere from my house on the
>>>>>> bus I'd have to make a transfer at most likely one of the two bus
>>>>>> depots.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When I've tried to contact the bus in the past, they tell me that the
>>>>>> bus comes to the light at the six-lane highway that is the first
>>>>>> street you come to after you exit the gate of my apartment complex.
>>>>>> My
>>>>>> apartment complex isn't very accessible...when I moved here I didn't
>>>>>> know about the NFB so accessability wasnt one of the priorities. On
>>>>>> top of that my mother who is very overprotective really liked this
>>>>>> complex because it is gated and has security after 6 o'clock.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, from what a friend in the NFB who doesn't live here but lives
>>>>>> in another town about half an hour away who has taken our bus before
>>>>>> tells me, the bus supposedly has a deviated route system where they
>>>>>> will go out of the way of the route one-fourth of a mile and pick you
>>>>>> up, almost like paratransit. I'd like to try to take the bus
>>>>>> somewhere
>>>>>> simple.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I feel a little overwhelmed. Do I call and begin by telling
>>>>>> them I am blind, and would like to try taking their bus for the first
>>>>>> time and ask them what accomodations they have for people with
>>>>>> disabilities and ask them about the deviated route system?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Then from there, do I explain where I live which is at the Suncrest
>>>>>> Village
>>>>>> Apartment Complex on Maple Drive and that I would like to go to the
>>>>>> Morgantown Mall in Westover and ask them which lines I would need to
>>>>>> take, and what times the lines run?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I understand that in order to use the deviated route service I need
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> apply and fill out paperwork...but I figured I'd start by just asking
>>>>>> general questions and see where I get from there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since I'll most likely have a transfer at one of the depots, is there
>>>>>> anything I should know about bus depots? From what my friend who has
>>>>>> taken the bus before says all the buses line up along the curb...but
>>>>>> I've also been told bus depots are where a lot of homeless hang out
>>>>>> so
>>>>>> is there anything I should know about them? Should I not carry
>>>>>> certain
>>>>>> items? From what my friend said, he and his wife took three buses
>>>>>> here
>>>>>> and everyone was very friendly and nice and the bus drivers even get
>>>>>> out of the bus and announce what line the bus is when they approach.
>>>>>> HHowever, he says they do not announce stops as they come to them or
>>>>>> announce intersections as they come to them which they are supposed
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> do. I figure when I get on the bus I will ask the driver to please
>>>>>> let
>>>>>> me know when we get to the line I need to get off at.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, the bus company does have a website but their routes are laid
>>>>>> out
>>>>>> in a map which is inaccessible to screenreaders...you can get a
>>>>>> description of which line goes where but you can't access the times
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> location of each stop.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Our bus which is called Mountain Line is also on both Twitter and
>>>>>> Facebook and they update frequently with updates if a route has to
>>>>>> deviate for construction or something like that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My next questions bring up an issue that I just found out about, that
>>>>>> I wanted to get your opinions on.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We have an area with
>>>>>> sevral stores, restaurants, and a movie theater called University
>>>>>> Town
>>>>>> Center. I initially was under
>>>>>> the assumption it was a strip mall and everything could be walked to.
>>>>>> So, I thought I could just simply take the bus there and make that my
>>>>>> first bus trip.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, it turns out it is very inaccessible and not pedestrian
>>>>>> friendly at all. The buildings are very spread out along a mile-long
>>>>>> hill
>>>>>> and to get from one to the other you have to go across a four-lane
>>>>>> highway-like street and through the store's parking lots. I did some
>>>>>> research and apparently these are popping up in several areas and
>>>>>> they
>>>>>> are called "metroplex shopping centers." I asked whether maybe I
>>>>>> could
>>>>>> have someone from Customer Service walk me from one place to another
>>>>>> such as from one of the restaurants to the movie theater but I've
>>>>>> been
>>>>>> told it's not possible as the area wasn't built for pedestrians. This
>>>>>> shopping center contains stores such as Starbucks, Target, Sams Club,
>>>>>> Macys, Walmart, T.J. Macs, Barnes and Noble, Giant Eagle, a shoe
>>>>>> store, a dress store, and Bestbuy. Some of the restaurants are Cicis
>>>>>> Pizza, Olive Garden, Red Lobster, Cheddars, Cracker Barrel, Golden
>>>>>> Karrowe, Longhorn Steakhouse, and Chillis just to name a few.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Obviously, it would be very very convient to be able to be dropped
>>>>>> off
>>>>>> at this University Town Center, and get everything done in one
>>>>>> place...maybe get a coffee from Starbucks, go to Walmart to get
>>>>>> groceries, then maybe go to one of the restaurants or to catch a
>>>>>> movie
>>>>>> at the movie theater.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are other places I could go in town and get the same things
>>>>>> done
>>>>>> but they wouldn't be as efficient.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Obviously, the people who built this town center did not consider
>>>>>> pedestrians at all and just assumed everyone would be able to drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does anyone else have these types of shopping centers in their area
>>>>>> and can anything be done to make it more pedestrian friendly or maybe
>>>>>> have a shuttle that would go from store to store? Considering this
>>>>>> area has already been completed and built, I've been told there is no
>>>>>> point in battling it because it would cost too much to fix it and
>>>>>> it'd
>>>>>> be too much work/reconstruction.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do I just find other ways to get the same things done and quit my
>>>>>> griping or does action need to be taken?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Like I said, I could go to the mall to get something to eat and see a
>>>>>> movie, then maybe drive through Starbucks afterwords on my way home.
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> could do my grocery shopping at Kroger which is right near me...but
>>>>>> for a beginning traveler I thought it'd be neat to go to this one
>>>>>> area
>>>>>> and get evrything done in one convient location and not only that but
>>>>>> get to practice cane travel as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And, yes from what I've read on their website, the bus does go to
>>>>>> this
>>>>>> University Towncenter several times a day. But, since it isn't
>>>>>> pedestrian friendly, I don't know if it would drop me off at one
>>>>>> store, then pick me up and take me to another store, one of the
>>>>>> restaurants, or the movie theater? As I said, I am very upset about
>>>>>> this because that'd be a simple place to start out with and practice
>>>>>> travel/get some things done all at the same time in one location.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thoughts? Are these "metroplex shopping centers" common where you
>>>>>> live
>>>>>> and if so can most of you who are better travelers than I navigate
>>>>>> them with ease?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks so much and I know my posts jump around a lot but I really
>>>>>> want
>>>>>> to try taking the bus somewhere simple, and I thought this University
>>>>>> town center would be simple...but I guess I could just take the bus
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> the mall instead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kerri
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
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