[nabs-l] Of Things that Matter
Jorge Paez
jorgeapaez at mac.com
Fri Feb 4 02:35:01 UTC 2011
Fair point Arielle.
I agree--though I'm a bit more skeptical, if only because these sorts of studies tend to have prejudgements.
Hope you're right though.
Jorge
On Feb 3, 2011, at 9:13 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> As a student of experimental psychology and as someone who aspires to
> do research on issues affecting blind people, I have definitely seen
> my share of blindness research that is demeaning and needlessly grim
> and pessimistic. This comes from many problems including problems with
> the initial research questions being asked, interpretations of data
> that paint an overly grim picture of blindness, and studies that are
> poorly designed. My gut reaction to this study was similar to many of
> yours in that I am also not sure why the sex knowledge of blind people
> should differ in meaningful ways from the sex knowledge of the general
> population. However, I strongly believe that if we want to effect any
> change, we should not only take the survey if we meet the criteria,
> but whether or not we meet the criteria we should take the researchers
> up on their request for feedback and, after reviewing the survey
> items, share our concerns and suggestions with them. Like Jamie said,
> science is self-correcting. Those of us who had positive and equal
> experiences with sexuality should share our data with the researchers
> so the data they gather is accurate and representative. Boycotting the
> study is not going to improve the accuracy of the data collected or
> the conclusions drawn from them. Furthermore, I believe one of the
> main reasons why blindness research continues to be so demeaning is
> because there is little real dialogue between the sighted researchers
> and actual blind people. I believe that any researcher worth anything
> would be glad to hear from potential subjects and gain a deeper
> insight into the issues being studied by talking with them directly.
> If you think the hypotheses are completely off-track or the research
> questions being asked might have bad implications for the blind
> community, share your thoughts with the researchers and perhaps offer
> suggestions for different kinds of research questions that might be
> more productive for them to study. They may or may not accept the
> feedback, but a good researcher will listen to a clear message that
> his/her hypothesis is problematic, and will not want to waste time and
> money chasing a hypothesis that is unlikely to be supported. Your
> dialogue might inform the researchers about angles of the issue they
> haven't even thought about before. If nothing else, it would be
> worthwhile to find out what their predictions are and what they hope
> to do with this information before jumping to conclusions.
>
> Arielle
>
> On 2/3/11, Jorge Paez <jorgeapaez at mac.com> wrote:
>> Jamie:
>> Please tone down a bit.
>>
>> This isn't a question that goes against inqury--it just asks weather this
>> inquiry is needed and weather it is, indeed, to the public's benefit.
>>
>>
>> And, to talk in your own lango, Science's aim is only and exclusively for
>> the benefit of the public.
>>
>> Isn't it?
>>
>> Therefore, does this breach what brings benefit to the public?
>>
>> How would this benefit anyone?
>>
>> Defend your case well and I'd be willing to listen,
>> but seriously, back yourself with some data or reason, please.
>>
>>
>> On Feb 3, 2011, at 8:27 PM, Jamie Principato wrote:
>>
>>> Or we can completely miss the point...
>>>
>>> On Thu, Feb 3, 2011 at 8:20 PM, humberto <humbertoa5369 at netzero.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> everyone is right. Why are they doing this? Blind people can learn just
>>>> like the sighted, just a little differently, and, whoever started up the
>>>> survey, doesn't know anything about blindness and about that we are just
>>>> normal people who can't see. I was actually thrilled when I first that
>>>> message arrived, and my index fingers touches the letters s, e, and x in
>>>> braille as I read from a braille note. These stupid people are wasting
>>>> time
>>>> trying to figure out how "these weird strange extra-terrestrial
>>>> own-little-world-holder blind people work." (This is what I think of them
>>>> saying about us.)
>>>> Now I just hope that this internet mailing list can go public enough so
>>>> that these people can read all our posts regarding the matter, and that
>>>> these people are automatedly being invited to one of our National
>>>> Conventions of the NFB, and so that they can listen to Dr. Maurer's
>>>> banquet
>>>> speeches about blindness. He is really good at speaking and educating
>>>> people
>>>> about blindness.
>>>> Although I didn't think of posting anything about this thread, but
>>>> inspiration made me, and here are my sixteen cents, for what it's worth.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: Jorge Paez <jorgeapaez at mac.com
>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>
>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>
>>>>> Date sent: Thu, 03 Feb 2011 15:11:50 -0500
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Of Things that Matter
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Completely agree.
>>>>> Why in the world would the general public care about that kind of
>>>>>
>>>> private stuff?
>>>>
>>>> 1 the general public doesn't care,
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> and
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2. the survey--if its done on that principle is therefore
>>>>>
>>>> baseless.
>>>>
>>>> The only person we'd ever have to educate about such things are
>>>>>
>>>> the person we would be doing it with--if that makes sense.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jorge
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 3, 2011, at 2:40 PM, Beth wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Joe,
>>>>>> I agree with all the stuff you are saying. I think the
>>>>>>
>>>>> survey is irreleevant now that I think about it and is a useless waste
>>>> paper baket of .. well, wastepaper. Crumpled up receipts can go on top
>>>> of
>>>> the survey if possible. *crumples up the survey sheets and throws them
>>>> into
>>>> wastepaper basket). IF only I could do what I think I just did
>>>> virtually.
>>>>
>>>>> Beth
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Joe Orozco" <jsorozco at gmail.com
>>>>>> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
>>>>>>
>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>
>>>>> Date sent: Thu, 3 Feb 2011 13:47:20 -0500
>>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Of Things that Matter
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> For me, the sex study is irrelevant and insignificant. The age
>>>>>>
>>>>> range is
>>>>
>>>>> limited, making me wonder about a sufficient sample, and we
>>>>>>
>>>>> really don't
>>>>
>>>>> have a clue as to what exactly it is that the research hopes to
>>>>>>
>>>>> accomplish.
>>>>
>>>>> And this survey is merely preparatory for a future survey? What
>>>>>>
>>>>> does
>>>>
>>>>> trouble me is the validity people have given the project. From
>>>>>>
>>>>> what little
>>>>
>>>>> we know of the project, it would appear the professor believes
>>>>>>
>>>>> there is
>>>>
>>>>> something inherently different in blind people that would make
>>>>>>
>>>>> sex education
>>>>
>>>>> a special circumstance for this population.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Maybe I'm missing something. Is your perception of sex
>>>>>>
>>>>> different because
>>>>
>>>>> you're blind? Was your inability to see a significant challenge
>>>>>>
>>>>> to figuring
>>>>
>>>>> out how it works? Was your childhood so isolated that your
>>>>>>
>>>>> friends did not
>>>>
>>>>> fill in the gaps?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Okay, let's say we agree the study is a joke. You say it's
>>>>>>
>>>>> important to
>>>>
>>>>> educate the public that blind people are every bit as capable of
>>>>>>
>>>>> intercourse
>>>>
>>>>> as anyone else. The million-dollar question is quite simply:
>>>>>>
>>>>> Why?
>>>>
>>>>> Seriously, why is it necessary to tell scholars that blind
>>>>>>
>>>>> people learn
>>>>
>>>>> about sex the same as any other adolescent. You could claim
>>>>>>
>>>>> it's everyday
>>>>
>>>>> advocacy, but advocacy is only necessary if you are being barred
>>>>>>
>>>>> from
>>>>
>>>>> equally participating in certain activities.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> This specific study is intellectual waste because it makes blind
>>>>>>
>>>>> people feed
>>>>
>>>>> into public misconceptions. It makes blind people feel they
>>>>>>
>>>>> need to defend
>>>>
>>>>> themselves against something for which no defense is necessary.
>>>>>>
>>>>> The
>>>>
>>>>> research presumes blind individuals are subjects worthy of
>>>>>>
>>>>> unique
>>>>
>>>>> examination, and we allow ourselves to be reduced to odd samples
>>>>>>
>>>>> the second
>>>>
>>>>> we begin to engage the researcher in his own experiment. You're
>>>>>>
>>>>> not going
>>>>
>>>>> to educate him, because it's not just about disproving a
>>>>>>
>>>>> hypothesis. It's
>>>>
>>>>> about disproving the preconceived prejudice that triggered the
>>>>>>
>>>>> research in
>>>>
>>>>> the first place.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Ultimately, people will wonder but will probably not publicly
>>>>>>
>>>>> ask: Why are
>>>>
>>>>> sighted people generally put off by the idea of intercourse with
>>>>>>
>>>>> a blind
>>>>
>>>>> person? My educated guess is fear of the unknown. We have all
>>>>>>
>>>>> been in
>>>>
>>>>> situations where we feared too many questions would be just
>>>>>>
>>>>> plain rude.
>>>>
>>>>> Well, you think, how is it that we're supposed to change minds
>>>>>>
>>>>> if we're not
>>>>
>>>>> supposed to advocate? Remember, you're not trying to have sex
>>>>>>
>>>>> with the
>>>>
>>>>> general public. There are things for which you do not need to
>>>>>>
>>>>> make a
>>>>
>>>>> statement to make happen with the one person that is the target
>>>>>>
>>>>> of your
>>>>
>>>>> natural instincts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Is there a place for an examination of sex and blindness in the
>>>>>>
>>>>> same
>>>>
>>>>> context? Certainly. We should examine the depravity of certain
>>>>>>
>>>>> humans who
>>>>
>>>>> force themselves on blind people simply because they perceive
>>>>>>
>>>>> the victims as
>>>>
>>>>> easy prey. This is an idea worth investigating and finding
>>>>>>
>>>>> solutions.
>>>>
>>>> But, there is a difference between a victim of violence and a
>>>>>>
>>>>> victim of
>>>>
>>>>> society. In the case of the former, one may not always have the
>>>>>>
>>>>> resources
>>>>
>>>>> to protect oneself against the circumstances. In the case of
>>>>>>
>>>>> the latter,
>>>>
>>>>> however, you do have a choice, and you do not need to feel
>>>>>>
>>>>> pressured to send
>>>>
>>>>> a signal over something so insubstantial as to almost be
>>>>>>
>>>>> laughable.
>>>>
>>>>> Hard-core disability activists who feel moved to write books
>>>>>>
>>>>> about sexual
>>>>
>>>>> equality irritate me because all that time that was spent
>>>>>>
>>>>> preaching could
>>>>
>>>>> have been spent...But, I digress.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> We need to keep things in perspective. We need to not be lured
>>>>>>
>>>>> into
>>>>
>>>>> dialogues that do nothing to advance our equality. There are
>>>>>>
>>>>> plenty of
>>>>
>>>>> fields where we need to educate the public of our abilities, and
>>>>>>
>>>>> as far as
>>>>
>>>>> I'm concerned, the three main people in that big diverse public
>>>>>>
>>>>> for whom the
>>>>
>>>>> extra mile is required are the people you call family, the
>>>>>>
>>>>> people who cut
>>>>
>>>>> your check, and the people you take home to meet mama. How I
>>>>>>
>>>>> learned about
>>>>
>>>>> and fulfilled my private tasks is not a matter of academic
>>>>>>
>>>>> speculation,
>>>>
>>>>> because my disability does not make me any different from anyone
>>>>>>
>>>>> else.
>>>>
>>>> Alright, now I'm going to smack myself around for succumbing to
>>>>>>
>>>>> the urge to
>>>>
>>>>> fall victim to this irrelevant distraction. I am copying the
>>>>>>
>>>>> professor here
>>>>
>>>>> in hopes he might enlighten me as to his motives. Maybe there's
>>>>>>
>>>>> something
>>>>
>>>>> there I'm just too dense to see? Criticisms aside, I'm open to
>>>>>>
>>>>> being
>>>>
>>>>> educated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Joe
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> "Hard work spotlights the character of people: some turn up
>>>>>>
>>>>> their sleeves,
>>>>
>>>>> some turn up their noses, and some don't turn up at all."--Sam
>>>>>>
>>>>> Ewing
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>>
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>
>
> --
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone: 602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
>
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