[nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes interview, Ride into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT

bookwormahb at earthlink.net bookwormahb at earthlink.net
Thu Jun 23 21:07:33 UTC 2011


Well, in other countries they use different sizes.  Anyone seen the Euro 
bills for the UK?
I heard they are different sizes with some bills having round edges.
Ashley

-----Original Message----- 
From: Kirt Manwaring
Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 11:11 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes interview, Ride 
into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT

Joshua,
  Different textures, different sizes, I honestly don't know either.
That's why this is such a problem.  If we were a smaller country, or
if we'd thought about this 25 years ago, I bet it would be a lot
easier..

On 6/22/11, Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu> wrote:
> What else can we do, to make it identifiable?
> We've discussed this to death, on the other list.
> Making the paper currency have different textures may be okay.
> The Braille, though isn't the answer.
> I don't know what else to do.
> Blessings, Joshua
>
> On 6/22/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Kirt,
>> You and Josh have valid points, but I have even a better solution! Lets
>> make
>> the currency identifable so that a blind person would not have to find a
>> friend or rely on technology to identify their money. Don't we stress
>> independence? Well having to ask someone how much money you have or
>> dependenting on technology to identify your money is not independence. 
>> The
>> folding method is fine if you know how much money you have.
>> Anmol
>> I seldom think about my limitations, and they never make me sad. Perhaps
>> there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is vague, like a 
>> breeze
>> among flowers.
>> Hellen Keller
>>
>>
>> --- On Wed, 6/22/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes interview,
>>> Ride
>>> into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT
>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 4:00 PM
>>> Joshua,
>>>   Valid points.  I've got a solution for you that
>>> doesn't cost a
>>> thing.  Get a sighted person you trust to tell you
>>> what your bills are
>>> when you get them, and fold them so you can identify them
>>> in the
>>> future.  Inconvenient, maybe...but hey, if we're going
>>> to fit in to
>>> the world we've got to put up with some annoyances.
>>>   BTW, what's wrong with a 20 cell display?  Not
>>> ideal maybe but, hey,
>>> maybe a rehab counselor would be more willing to get
>>> something with
>>> that much of a price reduction as compared to a 40
>>> cell.  I used a
>>> 20-cell PAC mate all through High School, an 18-cell Apex
>>> for my first
>>> year of college, and the shorter displays work fine.
>>>   Best,
>>> Kirt
>>>
>>> On 6/22/11, Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>
>>> wrote:
>>> > This is what Allan Ramos told me.
>>> > He was a trainee at LWSB, when I was there.
>>> > He's a member of the CCB, (California Council of the
>>> Blind,) (not to
>>> > be confused with Colorado Center for the Blind.)
>>> > I'm going on what he said.
>>> > Paper currency in the US, started with Andrew
>>> Jackson.
>>> > Glenn Beck talks about this in great deal, in his
>>> book, "Growth."
>>> > I've heard, that the debit cards are an alternative,
>>> but we don't have
>>> > such a system, that is accessible to us, in my small
>>> town.
>>> > It's either what I suggested, or we should ask the NFB
>>> to push the
>>> > companies that make accessible technologies, to make
>>> their technology
>>> > affordable for all blind citizens, that need it.
>>> > That's my problem with the Blind Driver Challenge,
>>> (for example.)
>>> > They will make this car, but they have to charge an
>>> obseen amount of
>>> > money, for it.
>>> > I'm not going to be able to afford it.
>>> > I can't afford a Pac Mate, with a 32 cell Braille
>>> display, and my
>>> > state won't purchase it, for my schooling.
>>> > I'm bringing this up, because, (back to the currency,)
>>> the IBill costs $100.
>>> > The IBill, (I felt of one at convention last year,) is
>>> as small as a
>>> > giga-pet.
>>> > I got one of those, for $5, when I was a child!
>>> > Why would I pay $100 for something that small?
>>> > Make it affordable!
>>> > Blessings, Joshua
>>> >
>>> > On 6/22/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> >> Josh,
>>> >> Your idea to have only coins is a good idea, but
>>> not realistic. Can you
>>> >> see
>>> >> a 50 dollar coin or even 20 dollar coin? Paper
>>> currency has been and will
>>> >> always be a fabric of this country as it is in
>>> every country. Which
>>> >> country
>>> >> has only coins and know paper currency?
>>> >> I do not believe, but I could be wrong and please
>>> correct me, but I do not
>>> >> think that ACB is advocating only braille notes.
>>> From my understanding
>>> >> they
>>> >> have been advocating a form of paper currency
>>> which is accessible  and
>>> >> afordable. Ovisily braille is not the most
>>> afordable means to make paper
>>> >> currency accessible.
>>> >>
>>> >> Anmol
>>> >> I seldom think about my limitations, and they
>>> never make me sad. Perhaps
>>> >> there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it
>>> is vague, like a breeze
>>> >> among flowers.
>>> >> Hellen Keller
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> --- On Wed, 6/22/11, Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>> From: Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>
>>> >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list]
>>> Threw Our Eyes interview,
>>> >>> Ride
>>> >>> into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June
>>> 22, 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> To: "National Association of Blind Students
>>> mailing list"
>>> >>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> >>> Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 1:51 PM
>>> >>> Anmol, it's amazing that you bring up
>>> >>> accessible currency.
>>> >>> What the ACB wants, is Brailled currency.
>>> >>> That isn't going to work.
>>> >>> I have the answer to the problem.
>>> >>> First of all, it's political.
>>> >>> I'm tired of people saying that the
>>> conservatives aren't on
>>> >>> the side
>>> >>> of the blind.
>>> >>> When it comes to currency, they are.
>>> >>> Remember, when Reagan mentioned a return to
>>> the gold
>>> >>> standard?
>>> >>> Coins are the answer to the problem.
>>> >>> We can identify the coins, by their texture.
>>> >>> We can't do this with paper currency.
>>> >>> That solves the problems with our currency.
>>> >>> This would help everyone, including us.
>>> >>> #1. You can't inflate, or deflate coins.
>>> >>> #2. You can't counterfeit coins.
>>> >>> #3, (Here's the thing that will help blind
>>> people,) We can
>>> >>> identify
>>> >>> coins by their texture.
>>> >>> Would there have to be alot of changes made?
>>> >>> Yes, but is it worth it?
>>> >>> Yes!
>>> >>> Blessings, Joshua
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 6/22/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>
>>> >>> wrote:
>>> >>> > Jessica,
>>> >>> > Good point. In addition, I would much
>>> rather a blind
>>> >>> person to feel mobil
>>> >>> > even if they don't have good mobility
>>> skills and
>>> >>> frankly I would rather have
>>> >>> > audible street lights then to see a blind
>>> person get
>>> >>> killed because they
>>> >>> > could not figure out how the traffic
>>> goes.
>>> >>> > Anmol
>>> >>> > I seldom think about my limitations, and
>>> they never
>>> >>> make me sad. Perhaps
>>> >>> > there is just a touch of yearning at
>>> times; but it is
>>> >>> vague, like a breeze
>>> >>> > among flowers.
>>> >>> > Hellen Keller
>>> >>> >
>>> >>> >
>>> >>> > --- On Wed, 6/22/11, Jessica <jessmonsilva2003 at sbcglobal.net>
>>> >>> wrote:
>>> >>> >
>>> >>> >> From: Jessica <jessmonsilva2003 at sbcglobal.net>
>>> >>> >> Subject: Re: [nabs-l]
>>> [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw
>>> >>> Our Eyes interview, Ride
>>> >>> >> into History, Race for Independence,
>>> Wed. June 22,
>>> >>> 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> >> To: "National Association of Blind
>>> Students
>>> >>> mailing list"
>>> >>> >> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> >>> >> Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 1:01
>>> PM
>>> >>> >> There are certain types of
>>> >>> >> intersections where no matter how
>>> long you stand
>>> >>> there and
>>> >>> >> listen to traffic you will never hear
>>> a good cycle
>>> >>> so in
>>> >>> >> those cases I actually support aps.
>>> Just keep that
>>> >>> in mind
>>> >>> >> when someone talks about every
>>> intersection being
>>> >>> crossable
>>> >>> >> by listening to traffic.
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>> >> Sent from my iPhone
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>> >> On Jun 22, 2011, at 9:57 AM, Kirt
>>> Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> wrote:
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>> >> > Anmol,
>>> >>> >> >  It's a nice thought.
>>> Maybe it'll
>>> >>> be
>>> >>> >> possible, some day.  Never say
>>> >>> >> > never, ri9ght?
>>> >>> >> >  But here's the
>>> thing.  The two
>>> >>> >> organizations have evolved two
>>> >>> >> > separate philosophies and
>>> mindsets.  I'm
>>> >>> doing
>>> >>> >> something really bad
>>> >>> >> > and generalizing.  If
>>> anyone who knows
>>> >>> more than
>>> >>> >> I do wants to correct
>>> >>> >> > me here, feel free.
>>> >>> >> >  The stance the ACB seems
>>> to take more
>>> >>> often than
>>> >>> >> not is to make the
>>> >>> >> > environment more accessible for
>>> us.
>>> >>> This is
>>> >>> >> evidenced by their
>>> >>> >> > support for audible street
>>> signals (which
>>> >>> make a lot
>>> >>> >> of sense to me,
>>> >>> >> > I'm not really convinced one way
>>> or the other
>>> >>> on that
>>> >>> >> one yet),
>>> >>> >> > tactile currency, descriptive
>>> movies, the
>>> >>> provisions
>>> >>> >> in the ADA to
>>> >>> >> > make ATMs accessible, the 21st
>>> century
>>> >>> communications
>>> >>> >> act, their
>>> >>> >> > support for Randolph-Shepherd,
>>> universal
>>> >>> design in
>>> >>> >> technology, etc.
>>> >>> >> > They also use lots of their
>>> resources to
>>> >>> fight
>>> >>> >> descrimination, at
>>> >>> >> > least it seems that way to me.
>>> >>> >> >  The NFB, on the other
>>> hand, seems to
>>> >>> more often
>>> >>> >> than not advocate us
>>> >>> >> > adapting to the
>>> environment.  This is
>>> >>> evidenced
>>> >>> >> by the strict
>>> >>> >> > standards of training centers,
>>> pushing
>>> >>> braille,
>>> >>> >> opposition to the
>>> >>> >> > tactile currency idea, advocacy
>>> of relying on
>>> >>> traffic
>>> >>> >> rather than
>>> >>> >> > audible signals (which makes a
>>> lot of sense
>>> >>> to me),
>>> >>> >> our philosophy
>>> >>> >> > that with the right training and
>>> opportunity
>>> >>> we can
>>> >>> >> compete on an
>>> >>> >> > equal footing, the idea of the
>>> blind driver
>>> >>> challenge,
>>> >>> >> etc.  Of course
>>> >>> >> > the NFB sometimes pushes making
>>> changes in
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> environment (technology
>>> >>> >> > bill of rights, Help America
>>> Vote Act, and
>>> >>> the ADA
>>> >>> >> which we also
>>> >>> >> > supported), and the ACB does
>>> advocate for
>>> >>> quality
>>> >>> >> independence
>>> >>> >> > training/O&M.  But,
>>> those are the
>>> >>> rough
>>> >>> >> philosophies of the two
>>> >>> >> > organizations, if we're going by
>>> their
>>> >>> records.
>>> >>> >> Is the ACB wrong?
>>> >>> >> > No, I don't think so, but the
>>> NFB is more of
>>> >>> a fit
>>> >>> >> with my vision of
>>> >>> >> > blindness.  I just think
>>> thee two
>>> >>> separate
>>> >>> >> methodoligies willkeep us
>>> >>> >> > from ever uniting as one
>>> group...and that's
>>> >>> ok.
>>> >>> >> We all have the
>>> >>> >> > right, even the obligation to
>>> advocate for
>>> >>> ourselves
>>> >>> >> and those we
>>> >>> >> > represent.  The ACB does it
>>> their way,
>>> >>> we do it
>>> >>> >> ours.  Sometimes there
>>> >>> >> > is overlap, lots of times our
>>> philosophies
>>> >>> take us in
>>> >>> >> different
>>> >>> >> > directions and put us on
>>> opposite sides of
>>> >>> important
>>> >>> >> issues.  When our
>>> >>> >> > aims are the same (or similar),
>>> we need to
>>> >>> work
>>> >>> >> together and present a
>>> >>> >> > united front.  When we are
>>> at odds
>>> >>> (which we
>>> >>> >> often are, the two
>>> >>> >> > organizations really are very
>>> different), we
>>> >>> both have
>>> >>> >> the right to
>>> >>> >> > push our separate agendas and
>>> attempt to get
>>> >>> our
>>> >>> >> policies implimented.
>>> >>> >> > Sometimes they win, sometimes we
>>> win, that's
>>> >>> >> politics.  We don't have
>>> >>> >> > to be bitter about it and, on
>>> the personal
>>> >>> level, we
>>> >>> >> can still be good
>>> >>> >> > friends even when our politics
>>> are at odds.
>>> >>> >> >  Just my thoughts,
>>> >>> >> > Kirt
>>> >>> >> >
>>> >>> >> > On 6/22/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>
>>> >>> >> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >> Kirt,
>>> >>> >> >> You bring some vary valid
>>> points, and yes
>>> >>> we have
>>> >>> >> beaten the
>>> >>> >> >> democrats/republicans
>>> analogy  to
>>> >>> death but
>>> >>> >> it keeps coming up as a
>>> >>> >> >> comparison, so I will just
>>> say one thing
>>> >>> about
>>> >>> >> this. I may have already said
>>> >>> >> >> this before on the list, but
>>> please
>>> >>> furgive me if
>>> >>> >> I have. The blind
>>> >>> >> >> community is a to small of a
>>> community to
>>> >>> be
>>> >>> >> divided on partizen lines like
>>> >>> >> >> democrats and republicans,
>>> and our
>>> >>> challenges are
>>> >>> >> to great to be divided
>>> >>> >> >> like democrats and
>>> republicans. Sure
>>> >>> there will be
>>> >>> >> differences between
>>> >>> >> >> members of the ACB and
>>> members of the NFB
>>> >>> on how
>>> >>> >> business should be
>>> >>> >> >> conducted, but honestly
>>> there differences
>>> >>> between
>>> >>> >> members of each
>>> >>> >> >> organization on how their
>>> organization
>>> >>> should do
>>> >>> >> business.
>>> >>> >> >> True there were disagreement
>>> on how
>>> >>> business
>>> >>> >> should and leadership issues
>>> >>> >> >> causing the split between
>>> the NFB and
>>> >>> ACB, I
>>> >>> >> consider the leadership issues
>>> >>> >> >> to be pitty differences.
>>> Often when one
>>> >>> candidate
>>> >>> >> loses, they and their
>>> >>> >> >> supporters go and form their
>>> on
>>> >>> organization or
>>> >>> >> chapter. This happened at my
>>> >>> >> >> local NFB chapter and as a
>>> result we have
>>> >>> two NFB
>>> >>> >> chapters in a small town.
>>> >>> >> >> Now some may consider this
>>> to be a good
>>> >>> thing, but
>>> >>> >> think about how much more
>>> >>> >> >> we can achieve if we were
>>> one NFB chapter
>>> >>> in
>>> >>> >> Fayetteville in recruiting,
>>> >>> >> >> fund raising and my
>>> volunteers for
>>> >>> events. In
>>> >>> >> addition, these types of
>>> >>> >> >> childish arguements causes
>>> many blind
>>> >>> people who
>>> >>> >> otherwise may be involved
>>> >>> >> >> in a blind organization to
>>> be a "fense
>>> >>> sitters".
>>> >>> >> Now using this analogy  to
>>> >>> >> >> NFB ACB, ACB does not have
>>> near the funds
>>> >>> that NFB
>>> >>> >> has, but they are not
>>> >>> >> >> poor eather. Their
>>> attendence is not as
>>> >>> large at
>>> >>> >> the conventions, but it is
>>> >>> >> >> not small eather. Think if
>>> both of these
>>> >>> >> organizations were together how
>>> >>> >> >> much more money we would
>>> have to do
>>> >>> policy that
>>> >>> >> each organization does or
>>> >>> >> >> the advocacy work that each
>>> >>> organization
>>> >>> >> does, and think about how much
>>> >>> >> >> larger the convention would
>>> be. We would
>>> >>> pack two
>>> >>> >> hotels full or near full.
>>> >>> >> >> In addition, think about how
>>> much venders
>>> >>> would be
>>> >>> >> giving out in prizes
>>> >>> >> >> because now insteading
>>> having to spend
>>> >>> money to
>>> >>> >> send their workers to two
>>> >>> >> >> convention, they will only
>>> have to send
>>> >>> their
>>> >>> >> workers to one convention. In
>>> >>> >> >> addition, most venders give
>>> out big
>>> >>> prizes at each
>>> >>> >> convention and if there
>>> >>> >> >> was only one convention,
>>> they can give
>>> >>> two
>>> >>> >> prizes.
>>> >>> >> >> However, you are right in
>>> that
>>> >>> realistically the
>>> >>> >> two organizations will not
>>> >>> >> >> merge any time soon.
>>> >>> >> >>
>>> >>> >> >> best wishes,
>>> >>> >> >> Anmol
>>> >>> >> >> I seldom think about my
>>> limitations, and
>>> >>> they
>>> >>> >> never make me sad. Perhaps
>>> >>> >> >> there is just a touch of
>>> yearning at
>>> >>> times; but it
>>> >>> >> is vague, like a breeze
>>> >>> >> >> among flowers.
>>> >>> >> >> Hellen Keller
>>> >>> >> >>
>>> >>> >> >>
>>> >>> >> >> --- On Tue, 6/21/11, Kirt
>>> Manwaring
>>> >>> <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>
>>> >>> >> >>> From: Kirt Manwaring
>>> <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> >>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l]
>>> >>> [Nfbnet-members-list]
>>> >>> >> Threw Our Eyes interview, Ride
>>> >>> >> >>> into History, Race for
>>> Independence,
>>> >>> Wed. June
>>> >>> >> 22, 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> >> >>> To: "National
>>> Association of Blind
>>> >>> Students
>>> >>> >> mailing list"
>>> >>> >> >>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> >>> >> >>> Date: Tuesday, June 21,
>>> 2011, 2:51
>>> >>> PM
>>> >>> >> >>> Anmol,
>>> >>> >> >>>   I don't
>>> really see a
>>> >>> merger
>>> >>> >> happening any time soon,
>>> >>> >> >>> nor would I
>>> >>> >> >>> want it to.  We've
>>> all beaten
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> democrat/republican
>>> >>> >> >>> analogy to
>>> >>> >> >>> death...but imagine
>>> Barack Obama and
>>> >>> Mitt
>>> >>> >> Romney in the
>>> >>> >> >>> same political
>>> >>> >> >>> party.  It just
>>> wouldn't work.
>>> >>> >> There are huge
>>> >>> >> >>> differences.  It
>>> >>> >> >>> doesn't make the NFB
>>> better for
>>> >>> everyone, but
>>> >>> >> it makes the
>>> >>> >> >>> NFB better
>>> >>> >> >>> for me.  I have
>>> lots of respect
>>> >>> for my
>>> >>> >> friends in the
>>> >>> >> >>> ACB who stand up
>>> >>> >> >>> and fight for their
>>> agenda.
>>> >>> Lots of the
>>> >>> >> times, it's
>>> >>> >> >>> the same as mine.
>>> >>> >> >>> When it's not, we can
>>> talk without
>>> >>> being
>>> >>> >> jackasses to each
>>> >>> >> >>> other and,
>>> >>> >> >>> in a lot of cases, the
>>> disagreement
>>> >>> actually
>>> >>> >> strengthens
>>> >>> >> >>> our
>>> >>> >> >>> friendship.
>>> >>> >> >>>   I say
>>> diversity is
>>> >>> good,
>>> >>> >> competition is good, we
>>> >>> >> >>> need a free market
>>> >>> >> >>> of ideas.  I
>>> respect ACB and the
>>> >>> sincere
>>> >>> >> people there
>>> >>> >> >>> trying to make
>>> >>> >> >>> the lives of blind
>>> people
>>> >>> better.  I
>>> >>> >> happen to find
>>> >>> >> >>> the Federation
>>> >>> >> >>> philosophy and method
>>> more meaningful
>>> >>> for
>>> >>> >> me.  I want
>>> >>> >> >>> to understand
>>> >>> >> >>> the split.  From
>>> the little bit
>>> >>> of
>>> >>> >> studying I've done,
>>> >>> >> >>> I don't really
>>> >>> >> >>> think it was petty
>>> personal
>>> >>> differences but
>>> >>> >> rather
>>> >>> >> >>> differing
>>> >>> >> >>> philosophies about
>>> methodology and
>>> >>> leadership
>>> >>> >> that drove
>>> >>> >> >>> the two
>>> >>> >> >>> groups to
>>> separate.  We can be
>>> >>> different
>>> >>> >> without being
>>> >>> >> >>> petty.  We can
>>> >>> >> >>> disagree without being
>>> bigots.
>>> >>> When our
>>> >>> >> two
>>> >>> >> >>> organizations come down
>>> >>> >> >>> on opposite sides of
>>> important
>>> >>> issues, as we
>>> >>> >> often do, we
>>> >>> >> >>> need not be
>>> >>> >> >>> arrogant or
>>> self-rightious because we
>>> >>> think
>>> >>> >> we're
>>> >>> >> >>> right.  The fact
>>> is,
>>> >>> >> >>> we disagree.  And I
>>> think the
>>> >>> >> disagreements are too
>>> >>> >> >>> central to our
>>> >>> >> >>> respective organizations
>>> for us to
>>> >>> ever become
>>> >>> >> one.
>>> >>> >> >>> But that doesn't
>>> >>> >> >>> mean we can't be
>>> friends, especially
>>> >>> on a
>>> >>> >> personal level.
>>> >>> >> >>>   Best,
>>> >>> >> >>> Kirt
>>> >>> >> >>>
>>> >>> >> >>> On 6/21/11, Anmol Bhatia
>>> <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>
>>> >>> >> >>> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>> Kirt,
>>> >>> >> >>>> You are bringing up
>>> some vary
>>> >>> good
>>> >>> >> points...
>>> >>> >> >>> Understanding the
>>> history of
>>> >>> >> >>>> the NFB and ACB is
>>> an import part
>>> >>> in the
>>> >>> >> history in
>>> >>> >> >>> the blind movement and
>>> >>> >> >>>> an important part in
>>> the history
>>> >>> of two
>>> >>> >> organizations.
>>> >>> >> >>> Frankly in it is just
>>> >>> >> >>>> my oppinion both
>>> organizations
>>> >>> bring value
>>> >>> >> and have
>>> >>> >> >>> and continue to make a
>>> >>> >> >>>> difference for blind
>>> people
>>> >>> across America
>>> >>> >> on a daily
>>> >>> >> >>> bases. It is a shame
>>> >>> >> >>>> that this split
>>> happened and just
>>> >>> maybe
>>> >>> >> the next
>>> >>> >> >>> generation of blind
>>> >>> >> >>>> individuals our
>>> generation or
>>> >>> those who
>>> >>> >> are younger
>>> >>> >> >>> then can bring the two
>>> >>> >> >>>> organizations
>>> together once
>>> >>> again. Now
>>> >>> >> this is just my
>>> >>> >> >>> translation and my
>>> >>> >> >>>> oppinion, but
>>> it seems to
>>> >>> me that
>>> >>> >> the NFB ACB
>>> >>> >> >>> split happened over
>>> pitty
>>> >>> >> >>>> differences and two
>>> individuals
>>> >>> with
>>> >>> >> different ideas
>>> >>> >> >>> fighting for power. It
>>> >>> >> >>>> seems to me that the
>>> hate the
>>> >>> two
>>> >>> >> organizations have
>>> >>> >> >>> towards each other is
>>> >>> >> >>>> not as strong
>>> amongest this
>>> >>> generation.
>>> >>> >> Infact many
>>> >>> >> >>> members of NABS of ACB
>>> >>> >> >>>> and NABS of NFB are
>>> friends in
>>> >>> life and
>>> >>> >> attack on the
>>> >>> >> >>> other organization is
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>   usually not
>>> >>> allow on each
>>> >>> >> organization's mailing
>>> >>> >> >>> list.
>>> >>> >> >>>> Dave, you are right
>>> that ACB does
>>> >>> not have
>>> >>> >> the same
>>> >>> >> >>> amount of people
>>> >>> >> >>>> attending its'
>>> convention, but
>>> >>> their
>>> >>> >> attendence is not
>>> >>> >> >>> small eather. I would
>>> >>> >> >>>> guess 1500 attend
>>> the ACB
>>> >>> convention and
>>> >>> >> all the major
>>> >>> >> >>> venders who attend
>>> >>> >> >>>> the NFB convention
>>> attend the
>>> >>> ACB
>>> >>> >> convention. There
>>> >>> >> >>> are also quite a few
>>> >>> >> >>>> young people who
>>> attend the ACB
>>> >>> >> convention.
>>> >>> >> >>>> Yes ACB does its'
>>> business
>>> >>> different then
>>> >>> >> NFB, but
>>> >>> >> >>> thats why they are a
>>> >>> >> >>>> different
>>> organization. However,
>>> >>> this does
>>> >>> >> not make
>>> >>> >> >>> them any worse or
>>> better
>>> >>> >> >>>> then the NFB.
>>> >>> >> >>>> Just my thoughts and
>>> it would be
>>> >>> great if
>>> >>> >> we keep the
>>> >>> >> >>> attacks on each
>>> >>> >> >>>> organization to as
>>> less as
>>> >>> possible.
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>> Anmol
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>> I seldom think about
>>> my
>>> >>> limitations, and
>>> >>> >> they never
>>> >>> >> >>> make me sad. Perhaps
>>> >>> >> >>>> there is just a
>>> touch of yearning
>>> >>> at
>>> >>> >> times; but it is
>>> >>> >> >>> vague, like a breeze
>>> >>> >> >>>> among flowers.
>>> >>> >> >>>> Hellen Keller
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/21/11,
>>> Kirt
>>> >>> Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> >>> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> From: Kirt
>>> Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Subject: Re:
>>> [nabs-l]
>>> >>> >> [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw
>>> >>> >> >>> Our Eyes interview,
>>> Ride
>>> >>> >> >>>>> into History,
>>> Race for
>>> >>> Independence,
>>> >>> >> Wed. June 22,
>>> >>> >> >>> 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> >> >>>>> To: "National
>>> Association of
>>> >>> Blind
>>> >>> >> Students
>>> >>> >> >>> mailing list"
>>> >>> >> >>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Date: Tuesday,
>>> June 21, 2011,
>>> >>> 12:25
>>> >>> >> PM
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Dave,
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>   How long ago
>>> >>> was
>>> >>> >> this?  Things could've
>>> >>> >> >>> changed
>>> >>> >> >>>>> since you last
>>> went
>>> >>> >> >>>>> if it's been a
>>> while, maybe?
>>> >>> >> And, with respect,
>>> >>> >> >>> this
>>> >>> >> >>>>> is a big deal
>>> to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> a lot of
>>> us.  I know for
>>> >>> me it's
>>> >>> >> a lot more than
>>> >>> >> >>> a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> "small
>>> >>> >> >>>>> consideration",
>>> I like to
>>> >>> know the
>>> >>> >> past as much as
>>> >>> >> >>> I can
>>> >>> >> >>>>> because it
>>> >>> >> >>>>> shaped the here
>>> and
>>> >>> now.  I can
>>> >>> >> read the books
>>> >>> >> >>> put out
>>> >>> >> >>>>> by each
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> organization-they probably
>>> >>> both have
>>> >>> >> lots of the
>>> >>> >> >>> truth
>>> >>> >> >>>>> intermingled
>>> >>> >> >>>>> with their
>>> respective
>>> >>> agendas.
>>> >>> >> But nothing
>>> >>> >> >>> beats
>>> >>> >> >>>>> talking to
>>> people
>>> >>> >> >>>>> who have studied
>>> the issues
>>> >>> or,
>>> >>> >> preferably, people
>>> >>> >> >>> who were
>>> >>> >> >>>>> actually
>>> >>> >> >>>>> there.
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>   All the
>>> >>> best,
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Kirt
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> On 6/21/11,
>>> David Andrews
>>> >>> <dandrews at visi.com>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> The two
>>> biggest things I
>>> >>> noticed
>>> >>> >> at an ACB
>>> >>> >> >>> national
>>> >>> >> >>>>> convention were
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> that the
>>> crowd was
>>> >>> considerably
>>> >>> >> smaller than
>>> >>> >> >>> that at a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> NFB convention
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> -- less
>>> exhibits etc.
>>> >>> too.
>>> >>> >> The second
>>> >>> >> >>> things was
>>> >>> >> >>>>> that there were
>>> few
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> young
>>> persons -- some
>>> >>> but
>>> >>> >> noticeably not
>>> >>> >> >>> very
>>> >>> >> >>>>> many.  One
>>> of the major
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> things that
>>> the ACB has
>>> >>> pushed in
>>> >>> >> the past is
>>> >>> >> >>> that it
>>> >>> >> >>>>> is different
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> from the
>>> NFB, it does
>>> >>> things
>>> >>> >> differently
>>> >>> >> >>> etc.
>>> >>> >> >>>>> This doesn't
>>> really
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> matter to
>>> younger people
>>> >>> though,
>>> >>> >> so they have
>>> >>> >> >>> little
>>> >>> >> >>>>> reason to join,
>>> so
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> don't.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> You guys can
>>> spend lots
>>> >>> of time on
>>> >>> >> the
>>> >>> >> >>> history, and
>>> >>> >> >>>>> differences if
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> you want --
>>> but what is
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> point.  It
>>> >>> >> >>> happened,
>>> >>> >> >>>>> it is over with
>>> and
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> done.
>>> Yes we can
>>> >>> and should
>>> >>> >> learn from our
>>> >>> >> >>>>> history, but it
>>> is just
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> one small
>>> consideration.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> Dave
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> At 11:32 AM
>>> 6/20/2011,
>>> >>> you wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>> Dave,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>
>>>   I do see
>>> >>> your
>>> >>> >> point.  Those
>>> >>> >> >>>>> alive at the
>>> time are not,
>>> >>> and will
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>
>>> probabluy never be
>>> >>> >> friends.  Heck,
>>> >>> >> >>> getting
>>> >>> >> >>>>> them to actually
>>> talk in
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>> peace
>>> would be the
>>> >>> achievement
>>> >>> >> of the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> century!   if
>>> >>> such a
>>> >>> >> call were
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>> to
>>> hypothetically
>>> >>> happen, how
>>> >>> >> could we
>>> >>> >> >>> keep it from
>>> >>> >> >>>>> opening old
>>> wounds
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>> and
>>> stoking old
>>> >>> fires?
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>
>>>   Best,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>> Kirt
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>> On
>>> 6/20/11, Chris
>>> >>> Nusbaum
>>> >>> >> <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Dave,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> Our
>>> joint
>>> >>> conference call
>>> >>> >> isn't
>>> >>> >> >>> associated
>>> >>> >> >>>>> whatsoever with
>>> the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> proposition of a
>>> >>> change in
>>> >>> >> the NFB
>>> >>> >> >>>>> bylaw.  If
>>> I'm setting
>>> >>> this
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> up,
>>> which it
>>> >>> appears I am,
>>> >>> >> I didn't
>>> >>> >> >>> even have
>>> >>> >> >>>>> the intention
>>> of
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> mentioning that
>>> >>> >> proposition on the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> call.  The
>>> call's
>>> >>> purpose is
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> to
>>> learn the
>>> >>> history of
>>> >>> >> the NFB/ACB,
>>> >>> >> >>> with a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> little emphasis
>>> on
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> the
>>> "civil war"
>>> >>> period,
>>> >>> >> from both
>>> >>> >> >>> sides so we
>>> >>> >> >>>>> are
>>> informed.  I
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> also
>>> want this
>>> >>> call to
>>> >>> >> start a
>>> >>> >> >>> discussion on
>>> >>> >> >>>>> the history of
>>> our
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> movement and what
>>> >>> we can
>>> >>> >> learn from
>>> >>> >> >>> it, not
>>> >>> >> >>>>> only as
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Federationists,
>>> >>> but as
>>> >>> >> blind
>>> >>> >> >>> students.
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Jorge and I have
>>> found
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> some
>>> ways that we
>>> >>> can hold
>>> >>> >> the call
>>> >>> >> >>> without
>>> >>> >> >>>>> making it a
>>> NABS
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> membership call,
>>> >>> if it is
>>> >>> >> entirely
>>> >>> >> >>>>> necessary.
>>> And as to
>>> >>> your
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> comments about
>>> >>> them not
>>> >>> >> being our
>>> >>> >> >>> friends,
>>> >>> >> >>>>> then using your
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> argument, the
>>> >>> Republicans
>>> >>> >> should not
>>> >>> >> >>> hear the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Democrats point
>>> of
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> view
>>> in meetings
>>> >>> of
>>> >>> >> Congress, but
>>> >>> >> >>> the two
>>> >>> >> >>>>> parties should
>>> be
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> separated from
>>> >>> each other
>>> >>> >> for fear
>>> >>> >> >>> of their
>>> >>> >> >>>>> own side being
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> attacked.
>>> >>> We can
>>> >>> >> keep our same
>>> >>> >> >>>>> opinions, and
>>> probably many
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Federationists
>>> >>> and Council
>>> >>> >> members
>>> >>> >> >>> who attend
>>> >>> >> >>>>> this call will.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> This
>>> is just a
>>> >>> way that we
>>> >>> >> can be
>>> >>> >> >>> more
>>> >>> >> >>>>> informed when
>>> forming
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> these opinions.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>>>>>>   Chris
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> "A
>>> loss of sight,
>>> >>> never a
>>> >>> >> loss of
>>> >>> >> >>> vision!"
>>> >>> >> >>>>> (Camp Abilities
>>> motto)
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> To
>>> learn more
>>> >>> about Camp
>>> >>> >> Abilities
>>> >>> >> >>> and find a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> local camp near
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> you,
>>> just click
>>> >>> on this
>>> >>> >> link to
>>> >>> >> >>> their
>>> >>> >> >>>>> national Web
>>> site:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> www.campabilities.org.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> The
>>> I C.A.N.
>>> >>> >> Foundation helps
>>> >>> >> >>> visually
>>> >>> >> >>>>> impaired youth
>>> in
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Maryland have the
>>> >>> ability
>>> >>> >> to
>>> >>> >> >>> confidently say
>>> >>> >> >>>>> "I can!" How?
>>> Click
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> on
>>> this link to
>>> >>> learn more
>>> >>> >> and to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> contribute:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> www.icanfoundation.info.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>>>>>>   Sent from
>>> >>> >> my BrailleNote
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>>>>>>   -----
>>> >>> >> Original Message -----
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> From: David
>>> >>> Andrews <dandrews at visi.com
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> To:
>>> National
>>> >>> Association
>>> >>> >> of Blind
>>> >>> >> >>> Students
>>> >>> >> >>>>> mailing list
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> Date
>>> sent: Sun,
>>> >>> 19 Jun
>>> >>> >> 2011 20:39:01
>>> >>> >> >>> -0500
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Subject: Re:
>>> >>> [nabs-l]
>>> >>> >> >>> [Nfbnet-members-list]
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Threw Our Eyes
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> interview,Ride
>>> >>> into
>>> >>> >> History, Race
>>> >>> >> >>> for
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Independence,
>>> Wed.
>>> >>> June
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> 22,
>>> 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Chris:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> I
>>> don't want to
>>> >>> friend
>>> >>> >> anyone -- but
>>> >>> >> >>> I think
>>> >>> >> >>>>> this is a
>>> terrible
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> idea!
>>> >>> Remember the
>>> >>> >> ACB split off
>>> >>> >> >>> from
>>> >>> >> >>>>> the NFB because
>>> they
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> thought
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> that
>>> we were all
>>> >>> wrong,
>>> >>> >> did our
>>> >>> >> >>> business in
>>> >>> >> >>>>> the wrong way
>>> etc.  I
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> am
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> not
>>> going to say
>>> >>> that we
>>> >>> >> can't learn
>>> >>> >> >>> anything
>>> >>> >> >>>>> from the ACB,
>>> but
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> not
>>> a
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> history
>>> >>> lesson.  I
>>> >>> >> was at a ACb
>>> >>> >> >>> National
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Convention a few
>>> years
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> ago
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> --
>>> and heard the
>>> >>> NFB
>>> >>> >> attacked openly
>>> >>> >> >>> and
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> indirectly.  These
>>> >>> folks
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> are
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> not
>>> our
>>> >>> friends.  We
>>> >>> >> can work
>>> >>> >> >>> jointly at
>>> >>> >> >>>>> times, and
>>> should, and I
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> don't think we
>>> >>> should be
>>> >>> >> against
>>> >>> >> >>> them, for
>>> >>> >> >>>>> the sake of it,
>>> as
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> some
>>> of
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> my
>>> old-timer
>>> >>> friends are
>>> >>> >> -- but a
>>> >>> >> >>> joint
>>> >>> >> >>>>> conference call
>>> on
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> consideration of
>>> >>> a change
>>> >>> >> to a NFB
>>> >>> >> >>> division
>>> >>> >> >>>>> bylaw is going
>>> to
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> far!
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Dave
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> At
>>> 12:53 PM
>>> >>> 6/19/2011, you
>>> >>> >> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Kirt,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> I
>>> have a friend
>>> >>> in the
>>> >>> >> Council that
>>> >>> >> >>> I will
>>> >>> >> >>>>> see Monday
>>> night, so I
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> plan
>>> to give this
>>> >>> idea to
>>> >>> >> him and
>>> >>> >> >>> ask if he
>>> >>> >> >>>>> knows someone in
>>> the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Council that
>>> >>> would be
>>> >>> >> knowledgeable
>>> >>> >> >>> enough
>>> >>> >> >>>>> and willing to
>>> attend
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> this
>>> call on
>>> >>> behalf of the
>>> >>> >> Council
>>> >>> >> >>> as an
>>> >>> >> >>>>> expert on their
>>> history.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Maybe it would be
>>> >>> better
>>> >>> >> if someone
>>> >>> >> >>> like me
>>> >>> >> >>>>> moderated.
>>> Keep in
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> mind
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> that
>>> I did
>>> >>> volunteer, but
>>> >>> >> I'm not
>>> >>> >> >>> degrading
>>> >>> >> >>>>> anyone else, I'm
>>> just
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> using myself as
>>> >>> an example
>>> >>> >> here.
>>> >>> >> >>> I'm a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> member of the
>>> Federation,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> but
>>> I'm not a
>>> >>> hard-line
>>> >>> >> "NFB is
>>> >>> >> >>> good, ACB
>>> >>> >> >>>>> bad" person, so
>>> I
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> wouldn't
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> show
>>> any bias to
>>> >>> NFB or
>>> >>> >> ACB.  I
>>> >>> >> >>> also am
>>> >>> >> >>>>> not currently a
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> contributing
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> (due-paying)
>>> >>> member of
>>> >>> >> NABS, so I'm
>>> >>> >> >>> not a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> leader in it of
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> course.
>>> >>> That way, we
>>> >>> >> wouldn't have
>>> >>> >> >>> any
>>> >>> >> >>>>> bias.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> I
>>> think it would
>>> >>> be easy
>>> >>> >> to have it
>>> >>> >> >>> jointly
>>> >>> >> >>>>> attended even if
>>> it's
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> an
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> official NABS
>>> >>> call.
>>> >>> >> If we have a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> representative
>>> of ACB on the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> call,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> we
>>> could probably
>>> >>> easily
>>> >>> >> get other
>>> >>> >> >>> members of
>>> >>> >> >>>>> ACB on the call
>>> to
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> kind
>>> of back up
>>> >>> or add to
>>> >>> >> that
>>> >>> >> >>> guest
>>> >>> >> >>>>> speaker's
>>> information.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Chris
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> "A
>>> loss of sight,
>>> >>> never a
>>> >>> >> loss of
>>> >>> >> >>> vision!"
>>> >>> >> >>>>> (Camp Abilities
>>> motto)
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> To
>>> learn more
>>> >>> about Camp
>>> >>> >> Abilities
>>> >>> >> >>> and find a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> local camp near
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> you,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> just
>>> click on
>>> >>> this link to
>>> >>> >> their
>>> >>> >> >>> national Web
>>> >>> >> >>>>> site:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> www.campabilities.org.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> The
>>> I C.A.N.
>>> >>> >> Foundation helps
>>> >>> >> >>> visually
>>> >>> >> >>>>> impaired youth
>>> in
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Maryland
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> have
>>> the ability
>>> >>> to
>>> >>> >> confidently say
>>> >>> >> >>> "I can!"
>>> >>> >> >>>>> How? Click on
>>> this
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> link
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> to
>>> learn more and
>>> >>> to
>>> >>> >> contribute:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> www.icanfoundation.info.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> Sent
>>> from my
>>> >>> BrailleNote
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> ----- Original
>>> >>> Message
>>> >>> >> -----
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> From: Kirt
>>> >>> Manwaring
>>> >>> >> <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> To:
>>> National
>>> >>> Association
>>> >>> >> of Blind
>>> >>> >> >>> Students
>>> >>> >> >>>>> mailing list
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> Date
>>> sent: Sun,
>>> >>> 19 Jun
>>> >>> >> 2011 00:45:08
>>> >>> >> >>> -0600
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Subject: Re:
>>> >>> [nabs-l]
>>> >>> >> >>> [Nfbnet-members-list]
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Threw Our Eyes
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> interview,Ride
>>> >>> into
>>> >>> >> History, Race
>>> >>> >> >>> for
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Independence,
>>> Wed.
>>> >>> June
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> 22,
>>> 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Carley,
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    The
>>> >>> two
>>> >>> >> organizations don't
>>> >>> >> >>>>> really claim to
>>> be "friends"
>>> >>> as
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> such-it
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> seems like now
>>> >>> they just
>>> >>> >> mostly
>>> >>> >> >>> ignore each
>>> >>> >> >>>>> other, work
>>> jointly
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> when
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> their agendas
>>> >>> converge and
>>> >>> >> play
>>> >>> >> >>> politics when
>>> >>> >> >>>>> they
>>> don't.  Maybe
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> they
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> aren't enemies,
>>> >>> but the
>>> >>> >> official
>>> >>> >> >>>>> organizations
>>> don't really
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> advertise
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> themselves as
>>> >>> friends.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> While it
>>> >>> >> would be great to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> have people from
>>> both
>>> >>> organizations
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> participate in a
>>> >>> joint
>>> >>> >> call, I don't
>>> >>> >> >>> see it
>>> >>> >> >>>>> happening.
>>> Here's
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> hoping
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> though, I
>>> >>> guess  It's
>>> >>> >> certainly a
>>> >>> >> >>> nice
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> thought-although, if the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> call
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> were
>>> to have
>>> >>> presentations
>>> >>> >> from
>>> >>> >> >>> members of
>>> >>> >> >>>>> both
>>> organizations, it
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> probably should
>>> >>> be jointly
>>> >>> >> moderated
>>> >>> >> >>> and
>>> >>> >> >>>>> attended.
>>> The NFB (or
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> probably even
>>> >>> NABS) would,
>>> >>> >> I'm
>>> >>> >> >>> betting, not
>>> >>> >> >>>>> be inclined to
>>> go
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> there.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> So
>>> maybe we'll
>>> >>> have better
>>> >>> >> luck
>>> >>> >> >>> going through
>>> >>> >> >>>>> unnoficial
>>> channels
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> and
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> setting this up
>>> >>> on our
>>> >>> >> own?  No
>>> >>> >> >>> need to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> make it an
>>> official event
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> for
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> either the
>>> >>> Federation or
>>> >>> >> the
>>> >>> >> >>> Council-I think
>>> >>> >> >>>>> it's safe to
>>> say
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> that
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> idea
>>> was doomed
>>> >>> to fail
>>> >>> >> before it
>>> >>> >> >>> was brought
>>> >>> >> >>>>> up.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Best,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Kirt
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> On
>>> 6/18/11, Chris
>>> >>> Nusbaum
>>> >>> >> <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> And,
>>> as I said
>>> >>> before, I
>>> >>> >> would be
>>> >>> >> >>> very
>>> >>> >> >>>>> willing to
>>> moderate this
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> call.
>>> >>> Please keep me
>>> >>> >> posted!
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Chris
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> "A
>>> loss of sight,
>>> >>> never a
>>> >>> >> loss of
>>> >>> >> >>> vision!"
>>> >>> >> >>>>> (Camp Abilities
>>> motto)
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> To
>>> learn more
>>> >>> about Camp
>>> >>> >> Abilities
>>> >>> >> >>> and find a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> local camp near
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> you,
>>> just click
>>> >>> on this
>>> >>> >> link to
>>> >>> >> >>> their
>>> >>> >> >>>>> national Web
>>> site:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> www.campabilities.org.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> The
>>> I C.A.N.
>>> >>> >> Foundation helps
>>> >>> >> >>> visually
>>> >>> >> >>>>> impaired youth
>>> in
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Maryland have the
>>> >>> ability
>>> >>> >> to
>>> >>> >> >>> confidently say
>>> >>> >> >>>>> "I can!" How?
>>> Click
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> on
>>> this link to
>>> >>> learn more
>>> >>> >> and to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> contribute:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> www.icanfoundation.info.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    Sent
>>> >>> from my
>>> >>> >> BrailleNote
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> -----
>>> >>> >> Original Message
>>> >>> >> >>>>> -----
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> From: Ignasi
>>> >>> Cambra <ignasicambra at gmail.com
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> To:
>>> National
>>> >>> Association
>>> >>> >> of Blind
>>> >>> >> >>> Students
>>> >>> >> >>>>> mailing list
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> Date
>>> sent: Sat,
>>> >>> 18 Jun
>>> >>> >> 2011 18:51:04
>>> >>> >> >>> -0400
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Subject: Re:
>>> >>> [nabs-l]
>>> >>> >> >>> [Nfbnet-members-list]
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Threw Our Eyes
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> interview,Ride
>>> >>> into
>>> >>> >> History, Race
>>> >>> >> >>> for
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Independence,
>>> Wed.
>>> >>> June
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> 22,
>>> 8:00 pm EDT
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> This
>>> call would
>>> >>> be very
>>> >>> >> interesting
>>> >>> >> >>>>> indeed.
>>> If
>>> >>> representatives
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> from
>>> both
>>> >>> organizations
>>> >>> >> are willing
>>> >>> >> >>> to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> participate, it
>>> can really
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> be
>>> productive in
>>> >>> many
>>> >>> >> ways.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> On
>>> Jun 18, 2011,
>>> >>> at 1:46
>>> >>> >> PM, Carly
>>> >>> >> >>> Mihalakis
>>> >>> >> >>>>> wrote:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    Good
>>> >>> morning,
>>> >>> >> list,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    A
>>> >>> few days
>>> >>> >> ago, someone on
>>> >>> >> >>>>> the NABS
>>> list  suggested
>>> >>> a
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> conference
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> call
>>> bringing
>>> >>> clarity to a
>>> >>> >> younger
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> generation.  What,
>>> >>> exactly, is
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> the
>>> history of
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> ideological
>>> >>> >> >>> parting of
>>> >>> >> >>>>> ways, between
>>> the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Federation and
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> Council? Does
>>> >>> >> >>> anybody know
>>> >>> >> >>>>> today, the
>>> history
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> of
>>> this division
>>> >>> or is it
>>> >>> >> a product
>>> >>> >> >>> of sheer
>>> >>> >> >>>>> habit as is the
>>> case
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> with
>>> Republicans
>>> >>> and
>>> >>> >> Democrats? If
>>> >>> >> >>> such a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> meeting of both
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> entities were to
>>> >>> take
>>> >>> >> place, There
>>> >>> >> >>> ought to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> be
>>> representation of
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> both
>>> >>> organizations
>>> >>> >> so that a
>>> >>> >> >>> wholistic
>>> >>> >> >>>>> portrait of this
>>> issue
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> can
>>> be
>>> >>> exercised.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    and
>>> >>> its split
>>> >>> >> from the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> ACB.  This
>>> seems like a
>>> >>> >> productive and
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> enlightening
>>> >>> discussion
>>> >>> >> but I
>>> >>> >> >>> wonder, if the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Federation and
>>> the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> council claim to
>>> >>> be
>>> >>> >> friends, should
>>> >>> >> >>> there not
>>> >>> >> >>>>> be
>>> representation
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> from
>>> >>> >> both   sides,
>>> identifying
>>> >>> >> >>>>> their position
>>> and
>>> >>> whereabouts
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> they
>>> stand, in
>>> >>> this? At
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    ----
>>> >>> Original
>>> >>> >> Message
>>> >>> >> >>>>> ------
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> From: "Joe
>>> >>> >> Ruffalo" <nfbnj at yahoo.com>
>>> >>> >> >>>>> (by way of
>>> David
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Andrews<dandrews at visi.com>)
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Subject:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> [Nfbnet-members-list] Thru
>>> >>> Our Eyes
>>> >>> >> interview,
>>> >>> >> >>> Ride
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> into
>>> History,Race
>>> >>> for
>>> >>> >> >>> Independence,
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Wed.  June
>>> 22, 8:00 pm
>>> >>> EDT
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    Date
>>> >>> sent:
>>> >>> >> Fri, 17 Jun 2011
>>> >>> >> >>>>> 19:26:45 -0500
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    Save
>>> >>> The
>>> >>> >> Date:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    On
>>> >>> Wednesday,
>>> >>> >> June 22,at
>>> >>> >> >>>>> 8:00 pm eastern,
>>> Thru Our
>>> >>> Eyes host,
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> Joe
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Ruffalo will
>>> >>> >> interview
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Parnell Diggs,
>>> chair of the
>>> >>> >> Imagination
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> Fund,
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    Race
>>> >>> for
>>> >>> >> Independence.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    The
>>> >>> interview
>>> >>> >> will highlight
>>> >>> >> >>>>> current and past
>>> grants
>>> >>> awarded to
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> state
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> affiliates
>>> >>> >> and chapters.
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    In
>>> >>> addition,
>>> >>> >> featured will
>>> >>> >> >>>>> be Imaginators
>>> who will share
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> methods
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    to
>>> >>> make the
>>> >>> >> ask to make a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> difference in
>>> changing what
>>> >>> it means
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> to
>>> be blind.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Special
>>> >>> >> highlight of the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> interview will
>>> be the
>>> >>> announcement of
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>> the
>>> 30
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> winners who
>>> >>> >> will have the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> opportunity to
>>> be driven by a
>>> >>> blind
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> driver
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> while
>>> >>> >> attending
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    the
>>> >>> national
>>> >>> >> convention in
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Orlando.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Witness the
>>> >>> >> opportunity to
>>> >>> >> >>>>> ride into
>>> history!
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    To
>>> >>> watch and
>>> >>> >> listen to the
>>> >>> >> >>>>> interview,
>>> please visit the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> following:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> <http://www.thruoureyes.org>www.thruoureyes.org
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    For
>>> >>> JAWS
>>> >>> >> users and mobile
>>> >>> >> >>>>> phone users,
>>> please visit
>>> >>> the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> following:
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> m.thruoureyes.org
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> Other options
>>> >>> >> to watch or
>>> >>> >> >>>>> listen can be
>>> found on the
>>> >>> sites
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> listed above.
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    To
>>> >>> call in
>>> >>> >> with comments or
>>> >>> >> >>>>> questions,
>>> please dial the
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> following:
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    1
>>> >>> 888 572
>>> >>> >> 0141
>>> >>> >>
>>> >>>>>>>>    Join
>>> >>> us to
>>> >>> >> Make a
>>> >>> >> >>>>> Difference!
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> nabs-l
>>> mailing list
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>> >>> >> >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
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>>> >>> >> >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com
>>> >>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> >>> >> >>>>> nabs-l mailing
>>> list
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>>> >>> >> >>>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >> >>>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> >>> >> >>>
>>> >>> >> >>>
>>> >>> >>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> >>> >> >>
>>> >>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> >>> >> >>
>>> >>> >> >
>>> >>> >> >
>>> >>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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>
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