[nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes interview, Ride into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT
Carly Mihalakis
carlymih at earthlink.net
Mon Jun 27 04:39:37 UTC 2011
Hi, Josh,
Again I am not uppset! There are people dying all over this here
world. How could I take a deep offense, or even a shallow one, at that? :
>Carly, I again apologize for upsetting you. But, I'm not
>characterizing your relationship with your councilor in that way, I
>am just giving an opinion.
>Best,
>Josh
>
>sent from my Apex
>Email: joshkart12 at gmail.com
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at earthlink.net
>To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>Date sent: Sun, 26 Jun 2011 21:00:42 -0700
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes
>interview,Ride into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT
>
>
>
>Hi, Josh,
>
> I am proud to say that, never do I use the system, for I
>understand that it isn't a matter of rehab "getting" stuff for you.
>I do not "rely" on the government to help me procure things, and
>people who have such a gross sense of entitlement, give folks in need
>a bad name. I don't need to sit here and explain the ways in which I
>work diligently to work for what I am able to procure from my rehab
>counselor. In fact, I think I take profound offense to your
>charactrizing my realationship with rehab, as such. ---
>From: "Carly Mihalakis Esq." <carlymih at earthlink.net
>To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
><nabs-l at nfbnet.org>,National Association of Blind Students mailing
>list<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>Date sent: Sun, 26 Jun 2011 20:27:17 -0700
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes
>interview,Ride into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT
>
>
>
>
>Hi, Chris,
>
>No need to moralize like that. With blindness comes an innate
>understanding of how to conduct oneself.
>
>Remember too, people are trying the best they can at all times, and I
>resent your assumption that people are always seeking always to
>procure something for free.
>I am biting my tongue as this is, in no way a personal issue but stop
>with the flagrant moralizing and lecturing about things which are
>obvious to blind people. What 15 PM 6/26/2011, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>I agree! We need to accept the fact that it's not a right for us to
>get whatever luxury we want just because we're blind! With rights
>come responsibilities.
>
>Chris
>
>"A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>To learn more about Camp Abilities and find a local camp near you,
>just click on this link to their national Web site: www.campabilities.org.
>
>The I C.A.N. Foundation helps visually impaired youth in Maryland
>have the ability to confidently say "I can!" How? Click on this link
>to learn more and to contribute: www.icanfoundation.info or like us
>on Facebook at I C.A.N.
>Foundation.
>
>Join me on Facebook: Search for Christopher Nusbaum!
>
>Sent from my BrailleNote
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
>To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>Date sent: Sun, 26 Jun 2011 09:55:17 -0600
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes
>interview,Ride into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT
>
>Chris,
> I know it's going to happen. I wish it wasn't, but it will and I'm
>optomistic it will be something beneficial. I'm just concerned about
>the mentality this fosters-lots of us already think we're entitled to
>get everything in the whole dang world without working for it, what's
>next? Don't get me wrong, we need things accessible, money, as I
>think has been demonstrated over and over again, is already accessible
>to us if we know how to handle it. We don't even need technology like
>an iBill or LookTell app, and 99 times out of 100, I might even say
>999 times out of 1000, we'll be fine. Sighted people are playing by
>pretty much the same odds-what with fraud and ponzie schemes and so
>forth. Don't get me wrong, I'll take advantage of the usability of
>the new money as much as anyone else. But I'm getting a little
>frustrated with blind people demanding things we don't really need and
>acting like it's an unalienable right to get whatever we want.
> Best,
>Kirt
>
>On 6/26/11, Chris Nusbaum <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com> wrote:
>Kirt,
>
>I say "take it when you can get it!" We're debating something
>that's going to happen anyway, which is fine, but the accessible
>currency is still going to be made no matter what we say. ACB
>won the case. Even if it is a luxury, let's take that luxury
>when we can get it!
>
> Chris
>
>"A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>To learn more about Camp Abilities and find a local camp near
>you, just click on this link to their national Web site:
>www.campabilities.org.
>
>The I C.A.N. Foundation helps visually impaired youth in
>Maryland have the ability to confidently say "I can!" How? Click
>on this link to learn more and to contribute:
>www.icanfoundation.info or like us on Facebook at I C.A.N.
>Foundation.
>
>Join me on Facebook: Search for Christopher Nusbaum!
>
> Sent from my BrailleNote
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
>To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
><nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>Date sent: Sat, 25 Jun 2011 08:52:02 -0600
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes
>interview,Ride into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June
>22, 8:00 pm EDT
>
>Car,
> That was two words. ;) I know I'm a jerk.
> I still think the cost is too high. If the government is going
>to
>spend millions of dollars that don't need to be spent (nothing
>new
>there), I can honestly think of more ways they could do it. How
>a
>bout just cut every blind person in America a check for a
>thousand
>dollars? That would be cheaper than replacing all the cash out
>there
>with newer bills of different size, or with tactile marks, or
>whatever. And, honestly, I'd probably get more use out of it.
> Best,
>Kirt
>
>On 6/24/11, Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
> Hi, Arielle,
>
> In a word it is absolutely, worth it!
> Yet, if people in power are reluctant to change existiing
> infrastructure then divices needed to discern, individual
>currency,
> ought to be FREE in the name of total equality.
> for today,
> Car
> :25 PM 6/24/2011, Arielle Silverman wrote:
>Hi all,
>I think there is a difference between having currency designed a
>certain way from the get-go, and having to change what has
>already
>been designed. So comparing India which has had identifiable
>currency
>since it became independent with the situation in the U.S.
>which
>would
>have to redesign the money from scratch is not really
>appropriate. I
>agree that having bills be identifiable by touch is useful for
>many
>reasons, both for the blind and the sighted. But is it worth the
>cost
>of having to redesign what has already been created?
>Arielle
>
>On 6/24/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Kirt,
> I am not sure, but I would guess that the current system of
>Indian
> currency
> has been in place since independence in 1947 before any vending
>machines
> or
> ATM were invented. True it is not fair for millions of sighted
> individuals
> to have to pay and adjust to accessible currency: redesigning
>ATM and
> vending machines, replacing the cash they already have which
>individuals
> have to do every 7 years I believe or whenever a new note comes
>out; but
> if
> we allow the fairness arguement for the sighted keep us from
>advancing
> our
> goals to create opportunities and bring greater independence for
>the
> blind
> we would never achieve anything. If we used the fairness
>arguement as
> you
> described, it is not fair for millions of businesses to be
> mandated to build
> ramps or have elevaters so that hand full of persons
> in wheelchair can have
> equal access, but do we live and do we want to live in a society
>where
> only
> majority have access and opportunity to life because making
> adjustments or baring cost associated to bringing the necessary
>changes
> to
> make certain aspects of life accessible is unfair to the
> majority, or do we
> want a society where people are willing to adjust and bare cost
>so that
> their fellow citizens who happen to be blind or disabled can
>have equal
> opportunities and rights as them? If we take the fairness
>arguement,
> then
> the Americans with Disabilities ACT (ADA) is unconstitutional
>and
> it was the
> main reason why many businesses were opposed to it.
>Redesigning
> the currency
> may cause inconvenience at first, but like Europe it will soon
>be a part
> of
> life and an adjustment that many do not have any problems.
>Many
>sighted
> people have asked me why is the currency not accessible? Many
> sighted people
> who I talk to about this do not seem to mind baring the cost and
>the
> little
> inconvenience associated with doing this in order to bring
>greater
> opportunity and equality to the million or so blind individuals.
>
> best
> Anmol
>
> I seldom think about my limitations, and they never make me sad.
>Perhaps
> there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is vague,
>like a
> breeze
> among flowers.
> Hellen Keller
>
>
> --- On Fri, 6/24/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
>wrote:
>
> From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw Our Eyes
>interview,
> Ride
> into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22, 8:00 pm EDT
> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Friday, June 24, 2011, 8:48 PM
> Anmol,
> I didn't say India doesn't have a lot of
> infrastructure. I just
> think the US, all told, has more that would need to be
> replaced. I'd
> be interested to know if India's currency has been of
> different sizes
> ever since India became in independent country in 1948.
> Just think of it this way. How many times do
> you see an ATM in a
> convenience store, bank, hotel, hospital, airport or
> supermarket? If
> we made our currency different sizes, or added tactile
> marks, all
> those hundreds of thousands of ATMS would have to be
> replaced. I'm
> sure Europe had that problem adopting the euro, but it was
> worth the
> cost for most people involved. It's not fair to the
> however many
> million sighted Americans out there to make them replace
> all their
> ATMS, vending machines, cash they already have, etc.
> But, like I
> said, since it's going to happen anyway, I hope they pull
> off
> something that will work.
> Best,
> Kirt
>
> On 6/24/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com
> wrote:
> Kirt,
> Actually there is a large infrastructure in India. The
> thing is that
> identifiable currency has just become a part of life
> and I don't think it
> was ever intended to be accessable for the blind when
> it was designed. So
> why was the Indian currency designed in different
> sizes? I am not sure, but
> the sighted and blind have benefited from it alike and
> cost to do this can
> not be that high since there are not many resources
> and frankly it is hard
> to get Indian politicians to do anything good for
> people with disabilities
> is rare. Perfect example of what can be possible in
> the US.
> Anmol
>
> I seldom think about my limitations, and they never
> make me sad. Perhaps
> there is just a touch of yearning at times; but it is
> vague, like a breeze
> among flowers.
> Hellen Keller
>
>
> --- On Fri, 6/24/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
> wrote:
>
> From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw
> Our Eyes interview, Ride
> into History, Race for Independence, Wed. June 22,
> 8:00 pm EDT
> To: "National Association of Blind Students
> mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Friday, June 24, 2011, 7:14 PM
> Anmol,
> I should never say I'm leaving-people always
> say
> stuff and I can't
> stay away. Here's the thing about India. As
> large as the population
> is (massive!), there's not near the infrastructure
> to
> replace. I hope
> that will change as India's economy becomes more
> and more
> developed
> and the middle class gets larger but, as it stands
> now, I
> think doing
> this in the US would be a lot harder than in India
> because
> of all the
> machinery that would need to be redone.
> Best,
> Kirt
>
> On 6/24/11, Anmol Bhatia <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com
> wrote:
> Kirt,
> The population of UK may be five times less
> then US,
> but the population of
> my country of India is 1 billion almost
> three
> times more then the US and
> still we have currency wich can be
> identifiable by the
> blind. So if India
> can make the transition without a problem,
> then it
> should not be that
> difficult for the US.
>
> Anmol
>
> I seldom think about my limitations, and they
> never
> make me sad. Perhaps
> there is just a touch of yearning at times;
> but it is
> vague, like a breeze
> among flowers.
> Hellen Keller
>
>
> --- On Thu, 6/23/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
> wrote:
>
> From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l]
> [Nfbnet-members-list] Threw
> Our Eyes interview, Ride
> into History, Race for Independence, Wed.
> June 22,
> 8:00 pm EDT
> To: "National Association of Blind
> Students
> mailing list"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date: Thursday, June 23, 2011, 10:49 PM
> Carley,
> Cool! I've never been a science
> guy. I'm
> going to straite my brain
> and leave the list for a couple days.
> Enjoy,
> everyone.
>
> On 6/23/11, Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at earthlink.net
> wrote:
>
>
> Hi, Kurt,
>
> As I understand it, a muscle
> striates when it
> is
> active. If
> therefore, a law, procedure or
> cultural norm
> striates,
> it flexes its
> muscle, thus changing states.
> Have fun, Kurt!
> Car23/2011, you wrote:
>Carly,
> I'm not exactly sure what
> a
> striation is. The NFBwas opposed to
>such a measure, and I think they
> were
> right to be
> against it for
>reasons I've already mentioned.
> But,
> after
> the federal court judge
>decided to side with the ACB, the
> NFB
> decided,
> rightly, that it may as
>well be a part of the process
> since it was
> going to
> happen anyway. I
>don't really see the harm in
> this, do
> you?
> Best,
>Kirt
>
>On 6/23/11, Carly Mihalakis
> <carlymih at earthlink.net
> wrote:
>
>
> Good morning, Kirt,
>
> 'Seems to
> me though, that one ought to be able to
> determine
> shades of their own
> reality, which
> is how I
> understand the Federation
> wants its members, to
> conduct
> themselves, in
> the world. Yet, beyond
> the elaborate striations
> the
> existing system
> will need to experience,
> if such a change were to be
> made,
> how come
> the Federation
> didn't speak up when it
> was asked,
> by
> the Mint last time that entity
> produced curency?
> :
>Carly,
> We all make
> mistakes. No worries.
> Now, just for the
> heck
> of it, I'd like to address a point I
> think
>you made earlier. (I'm
> only
> guessing, because my gmail wouldn't read
>the whole message to
> me) But I
> think
> you said something like this.
>"The federation is kind
> of
> hypocritical
> because they rap ad noseum
>about independence but
> are stuck
> relying
> on sighted people to help
>them-depending on
> another person
> isn't
> independence at all!" If I'm
>off the mark, I'm sorry,
> but I
> can see you
> saying something like that
>so it's just my guess of
> what you
> said
> from the little bit gmail was
>able to read me.
> Here's the thing
> about
> that. Independence does not mean do
>everything by yourself
> all the
> time.
> It simply means you can do what
>you want to, when you
> want to do
> it, in a
> way that's efficient and
>works for you. It
> means,
> basically,
> that you aren't subject to
>another person's vision
> of your
> life, you
> do things the way you wish
>to do them. It also
> means you
> do
> this without really making anyone
>else go much out of
> their way to
> help
> you.
> So think of it
> this
> way. Every store already has a sighted
> worker,
>most of those will be
> honest,
> almost all
> will be honest with other
>people watching. If
> you ask
> that
> person "hey, what's this bill you're
>handing me?" that's in
> no way
> compromising
> your independence. Using
>technology is better
> because it
> takes away
> the outside chance that
>someone's trying to pull
> off some
> funny
> business but, without the
>technology, you're still
> probably
> safe
> most of the time. As we've
>seen already from other
> posts,
> nothing is
> fool proof.
> But back to
> independence
> and philosophy and stuff. Have you
> ever
>used a reader? If you
> have,
> you're
> using another person, who's
>chosing to do something
> they
> don't have to
> do; either they get money
>or they don't, but it
> works
> because you
> get the job done and you
>aren't forcing them to
> do it for
> you. They chose to provide their
>time to read you
> something-you
> aren't
> making them do anything. Have
>you ever used a sighted
> guide?
> I do,
> all the time. (I'm starting to
>less and less just to
> keep my
> cane skills
> up but sometimes it's just
>the most efficient way
> to get
> stuff
> done.) You can get somewhere
>independently and use a
> sighted
> guide, as
> long as you're getting there
>on your terms and you
> could do it
> without
> a guide there.
> See what I'm
> saying? Independent and interdependent
> aren't
> mutually
>exclusive.
> Best,
>Kirt
>
>On 6/23/11, Carly
> Mihalakis
> <carlymih at earthlink.net
> wrote:
>
>
>
> 'Morning, Kurt,
>
>
> 'Guess I really blew it for myuy self
> with all
> those I'd
> say
> off the wall
> comments,
> about the
> Ibill.
>
> Now a truth
> immerges which
> I failed
> to state clearly, before.
>
> 'was confused with
> the
> NoteTeller 2
> which, experience has shown me is
> unreliable, at
> best.
> Carly even the
> person
> showing
> them
> couild not
> make them work.
> It's
> interesting
> however
> that folks on this List have found good
> luck
> with
> them.
>
> Carwrote:
>That
> is your
> experience
> -- mine is that the iBill works quite
> well
>-- and
> I think
> others
> have found this to be true too.
>
>Dave
>
>At
> 05:08 PM
> 6/22/2011,
> you wrote:
>
>
>
>
>Hi,
> Hamberto and all
> interested folks,
>
>
>Truth be
> known, my
> common law husband and I had the I bill,
>
>courtesy of
> rehab
> but, after repeated attempts to make the
> thing
>
>identify
> paper
> currency, we ascertained it a genuine
> piece of
>
> shit
>
>and is not
> worth
> anything, so I submit that the
> manufacturers
>
> must
>be
> well
> aware of
> their having themselves a niche market,
> in blind
>
>people and
> the deep
> pocketed agencies who tend to support
> them,
>
> so
>
>are
> totally
> exploiting it in the manner of any
> Capitalist
> aware
>
> of
>
>the
> exisstance of a
> small and needy marketplace.
>
>So, in
> essence,
> don't waste your's or rehab's time with
> the I
>
>bill! 02:11
> PM
> 6/22/2011, you wrote:
>
>Hello,
> but what
> happens if I have a bill in my hand and I
> want
>
> to
>
> know
>
> what
>
>it is,
> but there
> is not a single sighted soul to tell me
> what it
>
> is? I
>
> know
>
>is a
> free
> alternative but, is it truly worth it?
> And, what
> if
>
> that
>
>
> sighted
>
>person
> lies
> about the amount of money that is on the
> bill?
>
>I would
> probably
> support ideas like the KNFB reader and
> the
>
> iBill
>
>
> identifier
>
>if they
> were
> even cheaper. If they were so, I would
> buy one or
>
> the
>
>
> other,
>
>but so
> far, I
> can not afford either one.
>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
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>--
>Arielle Silverman
>President, National Association of Blind Students
>Phone: 602-502-2255
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>Website:
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