[nabs-l] If the World Went Sighted..

Tue May 3 04:17:50 UTC 2011

Mike,
  Very, very well said.  Except for the bit about no ultimate meaning
except for what we make of life (which, really, is kind of beyond the
scope of this meaningless conversation), I totally agree with you.
Blindness is sometimes a pain in the ass, sometimes it really makes no
difference to life one way or another.  I guess the only benefit
blindness has ever given me is the opportunity to meet some friends
who I would otherwise never have known.  Other than that, if I'm
weighing pros and cons in my own life, blindness isn't really much of
a good thing or a bad thing...it's just kind of there.  It's certainly
not a good thing, I don't think-but it's not really that bad either.
At any rate, there's plenty more important things to worry
about...like the NBA playoffs!  :)  Go Grizleys!  (I kind of adopted
them as my team after they upset the spurs-can you say bandwagon fan?)
  Warmest regards,
Kirt

On 5/2/11, Mike Freeman <k7uij at panix.com> wrote:
> Chris:
>
> I agree with you.  I did not, in fact, say that diversity could be negative
> although I dare say that quite a number of high school kids trying to "fit
> in" might think so.  In fact, to my way of thinking, physical diversity is
> neutral.  Intellectual diversity is certainly an advantage.  As for negative
> diversity -- let's see -- how about the presence of diseases such as
> sickle-cell anemia?  After all, the genes that code for this disease also
> confer some immunity to malaria.  Yet few would disagree with those who seek
> to cure or eliminate this disease.
>
> Now I'm not saying blindness is a disease.  It is a physical condition
> resulting from the lack of one sense -- vision.  That's far from being a
> disease in my book.  But I don't believe blindness confers any advantages,
> either.
>
> Perhaps a sentence or two about my view of life might help you to understand
> where I'm coming from -- it's a view that Jedi does not subscribe to.  Long
> live diversity, eh?  Anyway, I am agnostic.  Therefore, I do not believe
> there is any meaning in life apart from the meaning we give it by our own
> actions.  Nor do I believe there is an ultimate purpose to existence except
> insofar as we overlay it with a gloss of meaning of our own making.
> Therefore, questions such as "why am I here?  Why was I blind?  What purpose
> does my blindness serve in the larger scheme of things?" have no answers
> and, in fact, make no sense to even ask.  It's sort of like in quantum
> mechanics where it makes no sense to ask whether an electron is a wave or a
> particle.
>
> Anyway, with that world view in mind and bearing in mind that I subscribe to
> the NFB notion that with training and opportunity, blindness can be reduced
> to the level of a physical inconvenience and that we, the blind, are simply
> normal people who cannot see, I do not see that having blind people around
> confers some special blessing on society.  Blindness is just that -- the
> lack of sight.  I do not believe that it renders us privy to special
> insights, miraculous talents or capacities or special cultural
> predilections.  I am therefore not committed to its preservation.  Neither,
> on the other hand, am I committed to its eradication.  If it happens, so be
> it.  If it does not, so be it.  I'm not going to worry overly-much about it
> since it won't happen in my lifetime and there will be innumerable
> circumstances I cannot foresee so cannot make a binding judgment upon.
>
> Bottom line: I don't see how we can say that blindness is just the lack of
> eyesight while at the same time believing it confers special virtues or
> valuable traits for society.  I truly do not believe blindness to be all
> that much of a muchness.  Sometimes it's a pain; sometimes it's just there.
> In my experience, it's never the catalyst for wisdom or enlightenment.
>
> Now that I've written this to death, on to the next issue! (smile)
>
> Mike
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Chris Nusbaum
> Sent: Monday, May 02, 2011 12:55 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] If the World Went Sighted..
>
> Being Devil's advocate, what negativity does diversity have?
> Diversity, by definition, isn't good nor bad, but just different.
> So, what is the negative impact of diversity on...  who, society?
>
> Chris Nusbaum
>
> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com
> To: "'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'"
> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Date sent: Sun, 1 May 2011 21:25:10 -0700
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] If the World Went Sighted..
>
> That presumes that diversity always equals benefit.  You and I are going to
> have to differ on this one.
>
> Mike
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org
> [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jedi
> Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 6:45 PM
> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] If the World Went Sighted..
>
> I say that disability is a form of diversity, so I wouldn't want to erase
> it.
>
> Respectfully,
> Jedi
>
> Original message:
>  Hello all,
>
>  This is an interesting discussion, so I thought I'd pop in for a minute.
>
>  This question goes, at the root of it, to how you view disability.  If  you
> view it as an aspect that creates diversity, then erasing it would  be like
> erasing races or different languages.  If you view disability  as a disease,
> then logically the first response would be to want to cure it.
>
>  What do you guys think?
>
>  Briley
>  On Apr 27, 2011, at 7:55 AM, Jorge Paez wrote:
>
>  Arielle:
>  I think blindness does play a roll--in that it is just one of many  things
> that make up an individual, and in a world where genetics  would be
> preprogramed, it just be too perfect.
>  It'd just bee too flawless--too artificial.
>  I'm sure some people would want it--but a world in which blindness  and
> other disabilities are completely eradicated would just be too  artificial,
> almost like we literally managed to create our own world in a way.
>
>  Worse, it would make it a whole lot worse for any blind who were born
> cause then everyone would consider them a scientific failure so to speak.
>  Of course,
>  I'm hypothetically talking about a very cold  world in which science  would
> create people which I hope would never happen but its a good  talking  point
> anyway.
>
>  Jorge
>
>
>  On Apr 27, 2011, at 12:08 AM, Arielle Silverman wrote:
>
>  Hi all,
>
>  We recently had a discussion about how we would react if some of our  blind
> friends could become sighted, and we asked whether it would be  reasonable
> for a sighted person to want to go blind.  This made me  think of an
> interesting, although a bit painful, question:
>  Would the world be better off, worse off, or about the same if  blindness
> were completely eradicated, through genetic engineering  and/or mandatory
> treatment of all causes of blindness?
>  The question may sound silly, but for many vision researchers,  eradication
> of blindness is a real goal.  But does the presence of  blind people in our
> society have any benefit to the society or the  world as a whole?
>
>  Certainly there are costs of having a small group of people in  society who
> read and travel using different techniques than the  rest.  These
> specialized techniques have to be taught, technology has  to be adapted to
> their use and negative public attitudes prevent  this minority of people who
> do things differently from having full  access to societal goods and
> opportunities.  So would it be cheaper  and less resource-demanding if
> everybody could use the same visual  techniques to accomplish life tasks?
>  On the other hand, you could perhaps argue that having people who  use
> different senses to do things in society is advantageous.
>  Technology is forced to innovate to become usable by those who don't  have
> vision as well as those who do.  And conceivably, if a darkness  plague
> struck the planet, it would be better for the species if some  of its
> members could fully function without light.
>
>  What do you think? Should we as a society make an effort to get rid  of
> blindness? Or does blindness serve any kind of social function?
>  There obviously isn't a right answer here, but it's something that,  for
> better or for worse, could become relevant to us someday.
>
>  Arielle
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  nabs-l mailing list
>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/computert
> ech
>  jorgepaez%40gmail.com
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  nabs-l mailing list
>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/brileyp%4
> 0gma
>  il.com
>
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  nabs-l mailing list
>  nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>  http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>  To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/loneblind
> jedi%
>  40samobile.net
>
> --
> Email services provided by the System Access Mobile Network.
> Visit
> www.serotek.com to learn more about accessibility anywhere.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40p
> anix.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nu
> sbaum%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/kirt.crazydude%40gmail.com
>