[nabs-l] New Technology and Blindness

Fri May 6 17:41:36 UTC 2011

Jedi:

That's a great insight. What's worse is that the reasoning you outline below is self-reinforcing. If we are helpless and witless, why should we be listened to -- or so the sighted may reason.

Mike Freeman
sent from my iPhone

On May 6, 2011, at 10:14, Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net> wrote:

> You bring up an interesting point, Chris.
> 
> I think the reason why the sighted tend to choose unwisely about the technologies they create for our benefit is because they've got us as a population all wrong. Most of the technologies the sighted invent tend to substitute for something we lack: eyesight. Or, they try to help us with some task they think would be difficult for them if they were blind such as matching our clothes or finding a room in a complex. The funny part is, for the stuff we really need help with like accessing touch screens or web sites, I think the sighted assumption is that we have someone conveniently available to help us do these things. It is true that many of us use readers, and there's nothing wrong with that at all as it is a legitimate, and often useful/necessary, alternative technique. However, I think reader usage patterns are changing because of technologies that allow us to get a lot more done more quickly on our own. I've noticed that my reader usage patterns have change dramatically over the past five to ten years.
> 
> But maybe in some ironic kind of way, the thinking behind the technologies the sighted choose or don't choose to make accessible kind of make sense. They figure we're so helpless that we need all kinds of weird gadgets, but of course we aren't out there in the world to use the normal gadgets they're using. *shrug*
> 
> Respectfully,
> Jedi
> Original message:
>> I agree! I was just thinking, maybe you could check in online for
>> airlines...  if their site is accessible.  But if not, most blind
>> people have a reader, right? Maybe you can ask your reader (if
>> you trust them) to read you the site (if it's not accessible) and
>> you can tell the reader what you want to click on.
> 
>> Chris Nusbaum
> 
>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
> 
>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Jedi <loneblindjedi at samobile.net
>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> Date sent: Wed, 04 May 2011 12:26:42 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] New Technology and Blindness
> 
>> Kirt,
> 
>> I think the bottom line for me is this: can I do what I need to
>> do in a
>> manner that's convenient for me and everyone else around me? Goes
>> back
>> to that "Nature of Independence," doesn't it? You're right that
>> not
>> every technology is going to be accessible to us and that we will
>> have
>> to make work-arounds.  No problem.  We could say, going back to
>> our "If
>> the world went sighted" discussion, that if nothing else,
>> blindness
>> does encourage the development of problem-solving skills.  Most
>> of the
>> time, getting help, if that's what's needed, is perfectly
>> acceptable
>> and sometimes easier or more convenient.  For example, I
>> personally find
>> that I'd rather be checked in by a human than the touchscreens
>> because
>> it seems to me that touchscreen kiosks are kind of complicated
>> (not the
>> technology, but the systems they run on) when it may be just as
>> easy to
>> have an agent (or easier) check me in.  And for now, that's fine
>> given
>> that many airlines still have agents that can do that for anyone.
>> But
>> for those airlines that don't even have agents, that's a problem.
>> Sure,
>> you could work around it by checking in online (and that's
>> probably not
>> a bad idea), but you may have instances where that is not
>> possible for
>> whatever reason.  So it really is inconvenient to the self and
>> others to
>> track down the help you need and then find a way to get rid of
>> them
>> politely so you can go about your business and let them get back
>> to
>> theirs.  the same issue goes for grocery lines.
> 
>> Here's where I draw the line though.  I, generally speaking,
>> refuse to
>> allow anyone to help me at an ATM unless I absolutely know they
>> can be
>> trusted.  There are few people I would entrust with this task,
>> and none
>> of them are members of my family.  I have had a bad experience
>> with
>> someone who helped me: my sister stole money from my bank account
>> when
>> she helped me with an aTM.  Long story short, i became very wary
>> of
>> assistance in this matter.  So for things like that, I believe
>> it's a
>> right of privacy that's at stake here, and everyone ought to have
>> to
>> have that right whether they belong to the majority or not.  Same
>> with
>> voting.  I personally prefer the privacy that comes with an
>> accessible
>> vote than entrusting my vote to someone who may or may not agree
>> with
>> me acting as a reader.  If everyone else in the country has the
>> right to
>> a private vote, so do I.  Now, if I choose to have someone read
>> my
>> ballot to me anyway, that's my choice, but I still have that
>> right to
>> privacy thanks to the HAVA.
> 
>> Does any of this make sense?
> 
>> Respectfully,
>> Jedi
> 
>> Original message:
>> To all,
>>   Here's my take...and, because I enjoy being an argumentative
>> pain in
>> the neck, I'm going to enjoy this.  :)  But before I start, I
>> want to
>> make it perfectly clear that I'm absolutely for the Technology
>> Bill of
>> Rights, making new technology accessible ought to be a legal
>> right,
>> and we are at a disadvantage when technology, like the touch
>> screens
>> Ashley mentioned are being put in store checkout lines, is used.
>>   But we need to remember we are a minority and the majority of
>> the
>> population shouldn't bend over backwards to accomodate us.
>> While
>> having all new technology come to us perfectly accessible is a
>> laudable goal, it's probably never going to totally be realized.
>> Should we have the right?  Absolutely.  Will we ever have it
>> totally?
>> Probably not...even with the Technology bill of rights, this
>> dream of
>> Universal Design will probably never be totally realized.  That
>> doesn't mean we don't work towards it-it just means we need to
>> learn
>> how to live in a world where there are inconveniences we have to
>> deal
>> with.  We may have to stand in lines instead of using the
>> independent
>> self checkout-deal with it.  We may need to get a reader if our
>> textbooks aren't accessible-too bad.  We may need to get
>> assistance
>> using keosks in the airport-I'm terribly sorry, that's life.  e
>> maybe
>> might even have to go with a trusted family member or friend
>> when
>> using an ATM...what a terrible tragedy!  I can't believe we're
>> so
>> mistreated, abused, ignored, neglected, forgotten, and treated
>> like
>> crap by the rest of the evil sighted world that doesn't even
>> give a
>> damn about us!  Life is aweful!  This new technology isn't
>> accessible-woe is me, we're
>> dooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooomed!  Noone
>> even
>> cares about us!  This is a terrible, terrible, no-good world we
>> live
>> in, because we need to get people to help us use touch
>> screens...whatever are we going to do?
>>   Now of course that was an exhageration, and I certainly want
>> technology to be accessible.  But rather than spend so much time
>> complaining about it, let's do our best to get around the
>> inaccessibility and live our lives!  I'm all for pushing to make
>> this
>> new technology independently usable...but it's probably never
>> going to
>> totally happen, deal with it.  There will always be
>> inconveniences and
>> annoyences associated with being blind-get used to it.  The
>> world will
>> never perfectly cater to our every whim, get over it.
>>   Warmest regards,
>> Kirt
> 
>> On 5/2/11, humberto <humbertoa5369 at netzero.net> wrote:
>> Sorry, but your message came out blank: Subject: Re: [Nabs-l]
>> New
>> Technology And blindness, sent on Sonday may 1, 2011 at 9:33 AM
> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Chris Nusbaum <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing
>> list<nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> Date sent: Sun, 01 May 2011 09:33:12 -0400
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] New Technology and Blindness
> 
> 
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