[nabs-l] Ebook Accessibility/The Future of NLS And Bookshare

Wed May 25 04:20:15 UTC 2011

I love my braille folks.  I first learned it when I was 10 and I'm
hooked on it.  Before I learned braille I couldn't spell worth a piece
of crap.  I felt like a retard asking teachers in school to spell
certain words.  I could spell simple words but those big ones (those
you find in SAT books) were my toughest.  I read braille everyday now.
 Since I'm using braille more over audio, my spelling and grammar has
gotten better.

On 5/24/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
> Julie,
>   More and more sighted people are reading ebooks instead of going to
> libraries or buying them hardcopy.  The ability to read mainstream
> ebooks in braille, not just on apple devices but on computers and
> probably notetakers before too long, is expanding at a tremendous
> rate!  If we want to borrow a hardcopy book, we should use a library
> like everyone else does.  If we want to buy a hard copy braille book
> we should use a book store (ala NBP), just like sighted people have to
> buy hardcopy books if they want to keep them.  Maybe it's a worthwhile
> idea to see if government can subsidize NBP and similar bookstores so
> we have to pay the same price as everyone else.  But if we want to get
> an ebook to keep, we should have to buy it.  Just like everyone else.
> And the technology to read ebooks in braille (not just on apple
> devices, but with a braille display and a computer) is already here
> and expanding fast!  Can somebody tell me why, if we want to be
> treated equally, we're clinging to free ebooks when we have options
> (again, not just apple!), to buy our ebooks just like everyone else
> and read them with braille displays?  If that's not hippocricy, I
> honestly don't know what is.
>   I don't mean to insult anyone, offend anyone, or hurt anyone's
> feelings.  But I obviously feel pretty strongly about this-please
> don't take my passion as a personal attack.
>   With respect,
> Kirt
>
> On 5/24/11, Julie McGinnity <kaybaycar at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Well said.  I agree with those statements.
>>
>> I was thinking about it that way as well.  What do sighted people do
>> when they want a new book?  They go to the public library, or they go
>> to Borders or some other book store.  Sometimes they go on Amazon and
>> order hard copy books.
>>
>> We, however, do not get hard copy braille books very easily.  No, not
>> many books are "made" (I mean specifically made, not just embossed by
>> the common people) for distribution.  But we need equal access to
>> books, so we get all these different formats in which we can get them.
>>
>> I think he is confused about the term equal access.  It doesn't mean
>> that *everyone* needs to buy an iPad or whatever and download books
>> just like the sighted people do.  It means that we can have the same
>> choices as the sighted people.  Equal access, equal choices.  If we
>> don't want to read our books on an Apple device, we shouldn't be
>> forced to, and if we want to read all our books on iPhones, then that
>> is our choice as well, but we shouldn't have choices taken away from
>> us in the guise of equal access.  Are all sighted people going to
>> switch over to reading their books on their Apple divices?  No.  Just
>> us.  That just doesn't seem right to me.
>>
>> I'm sure I'm completely crazy in saying all these random things, but I
>> find this is my opinion.  Sorry for subjecting you to my rambles.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 5/24/11, Brice Smith <brice.smith319 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Besides the undercurrent of Apple snobbery here ("It seems to me, and
>>> many others who have embraced the integrated access of Apple products,
>>> that some quarters of the visually impaired community desire equal
>>> access without equal responsibility,) I have one MAJOR, fundamental
>>> problem with this article:
>>>
>>> ":
>>> For those who may argue that, given the high percentage of visually
>>> impaired individuals with low or limited incomes, they simply cannot
>>> afford to purchase books, I have two questions. First, what of all of
>>> the sighted individuals who are in similar circumstances? The
>>> unemployment rate continues at high levels, and I'm sure many of those
>>> who are currently facing hard times would love a treasure trove of
>>> free books at their fingertips. Why don't we open BookShare.org or NLS
>>> up to these unfortunates?"
>>>
>>> Sighted individuals do have a treasure trove of free books at their
>>> disposal. It's called the public library, Josh.
>>>
>>> Of course, I treat BookShare like a library, in that I immediately
>>> delete what I download when I'm finished reading. I'm sure that many
>>> users of BookShare  and NLS keep everything they download, and I would
>>> not mind at all if Bookshare or NLS encouraged and moved towards a
>>> model of renting and borrowing as opposed to downloading and keeping.
>>> Still, BookShare is my treasure trove and rental service for books as
>>> the public library is the treasure trove and rental service for
>>> sighted individuals.
>>>
>>> Brice
>>>
>>> On 5/24/11, Kerri Kosten <kerrik2006 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hey Guys:
>>>>
>>>> I came across an interesting editorial/article written by Josh
>>>> DeLioncourt from lioncourt.com/the Maccessibility Network and I wanted
>>>> to get your thoughts.
>>>>
>>>> The article discusses the future of NLS and Bookshare and the rise of
>>>> ebooks. It suggests that as visually impaired/blind people we should
>>>> try to move towards a future of reading/purchasing Ebooks from
>>>> mainstream sources such as the Amazon Kindle, Audible.com, and Apple's
>>>> Ibooks and that blindness-specific sources such as Bookshare.org and
>>>> the NLS library service should go away.
>>>>
>>>> Just for discussion sake what are your thoughts?
>>>>
>>>> Do you see NLS and Bookshare completely going away in the future?
>>>>
>>>> Just for what it's worth, here are my thoughts.
>>>>
>>>> While mainstream sources are great, what about braille and braille
>>>> literacy? You can't use a braille display to read Kindle books.
>>>> Audible books are audio so no braille there. As far as I know (someone
>>>> correct me if I'm wrong) you can't read Ibooks with a braille display
>>>> either. I for one love Bookshare because you can download the books in
>>>> BRF files and read them in braille on either a braille display or a
>>>> notetaker. You can also get hardcopy braille books from NLS.
>>>>
>>>> What about those who do not like the voice used by the Amazon Kindle
>>>> and the Samantha voice on the Iphone? I for one hate those voices for
>>>> reading book purposes...I've tried and just can't get into them for
>>>> reading.
>>>>
>>>> What about seniors just losing their vision? Though I hope as many
>>>> people get into technology as possible you have to be somewhat
>>>> computer savvy to work the kindle PC software and the Ibooks app for
>>>> the Iphone/Ipod touch/Ipad is all touchscreen.
>>>>
>>>> Just my thoughts...I would be very very sad if NLS and Bookshare went
>>>> away completely.
>>>>
>>>> hHere is the article...just thought I'd bring this up for discussion
>>>> purposes.
>>>>
>>>> Kerri
>>>>
>>>> Crossroads: Rekindling the Accessible Ebook Discussion
>>>> by Josh de Lioncourt
>>>> A few weeks ago, I read a question posed by someone on Twitter that
>>>> rekindled a line of thought I have had on and off for a couple of
>>>> years. In essence, the question was this: "We have BookShare.org, the
>>>> National Library Service, and other similar resources. Why should we
>>>> care about the accessibility of eBook platforms like iBooks, Kindle,
>>>> Adobe Digital Editions, etc?"
>>>>
>>>> On the surface, this question, which has been posed by several people
>>>> with whom I’ve been acquainted, appears to be a pragmatic one. If one
>>>> digs a little deeper, however, it becomes an illustration of an
>>>> alarming attitude, often an unconscious one, throughout the visually
>>>> impaired community.
>>>>
>>>> Before exploring that aspect, though, let’s take a quick look at just
>>>> a few of the strictly practical answers that can be given to this
>>>> question.
>>>>
>>>> •In general, books released in printed form are now simultaneously
>>>> available in digital formats. This provides readers and students with
>>>> access to material, be it for pleasure, education, or work, at the
>>>> same time as their sighted counterparts. This is rarely the case with
>>>> publications offered through many of the resources aimed at providing
>>>> materials in accessible formats.
>>>> •Many of the resources which provide accessible materials are
>>>> understandably required to obtain medical proof of disability from
>>>> their users before they are able to gain access to the content
>>>> provided. Some users may be unwilling or unable to jump through these
>>>> hoops, or find it a violation of privacy.
>>>> •Some services require expensive, unwieldy, or otherwise undesirable
>>>> or inefficient equipment to access their content. By contrast,
>>>> commercial solutions like Apple’s iBooks and Amazon’s Kindle provide
>>>> access to their content across a variety of mainstream devices,
>>>> including mobile phones.
>>>> •Some resources of accessible content, (i.e. BookShare.org), charge a
>>>> recurring fee for the service. For avid readers who consume large
>>>> number of books each year, this is undoubtedly a cost-efficient
>>>> solution. For those who read only occasionally, however, it can prove
>>>> far more costly than purchasing books from a digital retailer.
>>>> •Many books are never made available in accessible formats through these
>>>> bodies.
>>>> This is by no means an exhaustive list of practical reasons why a
>>>> visually impaired user may prefer access to a digital e-book platform,
>>>> but it does provide a sample of the variety of such reasons. No one
>>>> solution will ever work for all users, and that must be always kept in
>>>> mind when topics such as this are discussed or debated.
>>>>
>>>> There is a far more important issue that this subject raises, however.
>>>> It is best expressed in the form of a question: "As visually impaired
>>>> people, what is it we desire most: equal access, or preferential
>>>> treatment?"
>>>>
>>>> Several years ago, this was not nearly as legitimate of a question.
>>>> Services like NLS and BookShare provided materials that were otherwise
>>>> inaccessible to those with visual impairments or other disabilities in
>>>> a manner that was equivalent to public libraries.
>>>>
>>>> With the ever increasing ubiquity of the Internet, the availability
>>>> and usage of public libraries around the globe has fallen sharply.
>>>> Research can be done far more efficiently online, where the wealth of
>>>> information is virtually limitless and growing all the time. A
>>>> WikiPedia article outlines the basic statistics of the decline of
>>>> library use over the last twenty years. As far back as 2001, 93% of
>>>> college students felt it made more sense to obtain the information
>>>> they needed online than by visiting a physical library.
>>>>
>>>> The majority of information online is, of course, far more accessible
>>>> than the visually impaired have ever had access to in the past. Few
>>>> technological advances, if any, have had such a profound impact on the
>>>> quality of life for visually impaired individuals, and you will find
>>>> none who would argue that point.
>>>>
>>>> With the decline of libraries as a research tool has come the decline
>>>> of their usage as a source of books consumed for pleasure as well. Ask
>>>> yourself this: how many sighted readers do you know who regularly, or
>>>> exclusively, obtain books for a local public library to read. The
>>>> answer will be very few, if any. These days, most avid readers
>>>> purchase books to read, just like any other form of entertainment
>>>> media such as music or movies.
>>>>
>>>> While the usefulness of services like NLS or BookShare.org in years
>>>> passed is undeniable, their necessity is waning in the wake of
>>>> accessible mainstream sources of materials such as iBooks, Inkling,
>>>> and Audible.com. Though services providing accessible content to those
>>>> with disabilities may still be the best, or in some cases the only,
>>>> solution for some users today, we should be actively moving toward a
>>>> future of equal access with our sighted peers.
>>>>
>>>> It seems to me, and many others who have embraced the integrated
>>>> access of Apple products, that some quarters of the visually impaired
>>>> community desire equal access without equal responsibility, especially
>>>> when regards written material. Do we, the visually impaired community,
>>>> purchase music like everyone else? Do we buy DVD’s like everyone else?
>>>> Do we pay for Coca-Colas at the corner store or our lattes at
>>>> StarBucks? Why not our books as well? Is the entertainment or
>>>> educational value of a novel by Stephen King or a instructional text
>>>> on programming C++so low that we feel it isn’t worth as much as we pay
>>>> for the latest album by Lady Gaga or a course at the local community
>>>> college?
>>>>
>>>> For those who may argue that, given the high percentage of visually
>>>> impaired individuals with low or limited incomes, they simply cannot
>>>> afford to purchase books, I have two questions.
>>>>
>>>> First, what of all of the sighted individuals who are in similar
>>>> circumstances? The unemployment rate continues at high levels, and I’m
>>>> sure many of those who are currently facing hard times would love a
>>>> treasure trove of free books at their fingertips. Why don’t we open
>>>> BookShare.org or NLS up to these unfortunates?
>>>>
>>>> Second, what about all the funds wasted, be it by individuals or
>>>> government agencies, on access technology which is less capable than
>>>> mainstream solutions? For example, the GW Micro BookSense is available
>>>> in $349 USD and $499 USD varieties. It allows visually impaired users
>>>> to read books in electronic format and listen to audio books or music.
>>>> How is this a better value than, for example, an iPod touch, which
>>>> provides the same functionality, plus Internet access, email, and tens
>>>> of thousands of applications to extend its capabilities starting at
>>>> just $229 USD? This isn’t even to mention the fact that the iPod touch
>>>> can be connected to a Braille display, has significantly more storage,
>>>> and a battery warranty that is twice the length of what users get from
>>>> the BookSense. Wouldn’t money saved by integrated solutions ultimately
>>>> be better spent compensating the authors of useful or entertaining
>>>> books for their hard work?
>>>>
>>>> Is it not the height of hypocrisy that the visually impaired community
>>>> wastes not a moment in lambasting, (even suing), companies like Amazon
>>>> for a lack of accessibility in its Kindle products, and yet balks at
>>>> the notion that we begin moving away from having the majority of our
>>>> printed materials handed over for free?
>>>>
>>>> We, the visually impaired community, are rapidly approaching a
>>>> crossroads. It is time to prove that we have the courage of our
>>>> convictions. Will we be worthy of equal access, and by extension equal
>>>> opportunities? Or will we squander the chance to put ourselves on
>>>> equal footing with the sighted world by an unwillingness to move
>>>> forward with society, and a misplaced sense of entitlement?
>>>>
>>>> I know which outcome I’m hoping for.
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Brice Smith
>>> North Carolina State University, Communication - Public Relations
>>> Brice.Smith319 at gmail.com
>>>
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>>
>>
>> --
>> Julie McG
>>  Lindbergh High School class of 2009, participating member in Opera
>> Theater's Artist in Training Program, and proud graduate of Guiding
>> Eyes for the Blind
>>
>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that
>> everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal
>> life."
>> John 3:16
>>
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>
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