[nabs-l] the test accomodations

Sun Apr 28 20:18:38 UTC 2013

Hi Tyler,
I've worked with incompetent readers. I've tried to accommodate their poor 
reading level. Some of them have mumbled to the page or speak fast so I 
cannot differientiate between choice A and B. I ask them to slow down and I 
lean in toward them to hear better.
Actually, its my experience that good readers do not look down at the page
but rather they sit up straight and their voice projects out and they sort 
of look toward me. Its hard to describe. But their face is not in the page, 
but yeah of course they are looking at it to read.
I think your suggestion of changing seats to sit
across from them is a good one.

Finally, I think you misunderstand my comments. I never said things will be 
perfect and yes I have in fact made my own accomodations. A few examples.
For instance, I learn better in braille or large print if its something with 
symbols.
So, I use my perkins to braille out key items to study or use my braille 
note or my very old embosser on occasion.
Sometimes I don't know how to spell proper places and other nouns so i
go to that word with jaws and read it character by character.
I've often not had my accomodations met that state I get handouts in 
electronic format. So I take them in paper form and scan them.

Sometimes I have articles to read that are not electronic; no online version 
is available. if it is, and the professor is helpful, they send me the 
links.
So in those instances, I have used readers I hired.

So, of course I do more work and work around studying and living in a 
sighted world.
But when a school is  a huge community college and should make the 
accomodations to test you fairly, I do have a problem. They could also have 
a braille display or heaven forbid they actually do in-house brailling. What 
a concept!
Having a braille display and reading it on the pc would solve this problem 
since I'd be reading the words like everyone else.
Note that I've suggested getting a braille display; even a small one, a long 
time ago.

They also lost their Assistive tech guy who could have done the brailling.
They are supposedly looking for a AT assistant.

Anyway, the best I can do is advocate to the dss office and speak to the 
professor and hopefully work something out.

Ashley
-----Original Message----- 
From: Littlefield, Tyler
Sent: Sunday, April 28, 2013 3:56 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations

Ashley:
I'm not sure what you mean by compitant. I've had people read from all
ranges. There are people that read slower, but your two concerns ("They
talk to the paper" and "'tThey don't know arabic words") are pretty far
out there.

First, they're going to be looking at the paper that they're reading.
its physically impossible, unless they were to turn to face you for them
to be looking straight at you. I'm not sure if this is a problem, but
try sitting across from them at a table if you must be facing them.
Second, if they mumble or have issues this is problematic and I suggest
finding someone else. If you are unable to find a reader from department
x, know that said reader probably won't know all the words, and it will
be up to you guys to work things out to try to figure out what they
mean. If they're reading from the book, flip to the back where there's
generally a glossary.

What it comes down to is you are blind, and as a result you have to make
your own accomidations. You can scream and hollar about ADA as much as
you want, but it doesn't matter. When they outright violate your rights,
that's when you need to scream about ADA. When your reader isn't
perfect, it needs to be accepted as one of the points to doing business,
and you as the student needs to work it out. I'm not saying you need to
lay down and take everything--I fully agree that you should complain
about the math issue you mentioned. What I am saying though is you'll
get a lot farther if you are willing to be flexable and acknowledge and
accept that this won't be a perfect shot. It's something you have to
deal with unless you want to find alternative means to getting the books
that you need.

I just want to throw one more thing out there at you. Being in college,
as lame as it may sound really does get you ready for later work life.
I've seen numerous complaints about professor x y and z for the last few
semesters; if you're in a job, you already have to overcome the "wow
she's blind" factor most of the time. Refusing to be flexable or work
with people won't do you any good. You might call up the ADA, but when
it really comes down to it, people can find a good reason to drop you
eventually if they want to, and they don't even have to tell you it's
because you're blind and unflexable. People don't have to hire you if
they don't want to, and they don't have to tell you it's because you're
blind; they can tell you someone else got the job and hand it to the
loser who got half your GPA if they really want to. Again, it doesn't
mean you should take everything, but I feel like you could problem solve
some of these issues a lot more if you were willing to accept people's
ideas and get outside the box, and starting now can only help you in the
future.

Good luck,
On 4/27/2013 10:18 PM, Ashley Bramlett wrote:
> Arielle,
> I was told I have to use their readers by the dss office. I will check the 
> student handbook and the disability website to check on policies. But I 
> believe that I cannot use my own reader. Believe me, I'd love to have 
> another staff member or another student assist me who can read.
>
> My accomodations are between me and the professor to some extent. but when 
> I take a test in the testing center, it is my understand I have to follow 
> their rules. One rule might be I have to use their readers from the dss 
> office. But I will see if such a policy is written down. I'll ask my 
> counselor who tells me this to get me that policy. Ashley
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Arielle Silverman
> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 10:28 PM
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>
> Again, who is "they"? Brining your own reader is a valid testing
> accommodation that blind students have used. I haven't because I
> prefer to use JAWS, but several of my blind friends have done this.
> A disabilities office can choose what accommodations to provide
> students, but they cannot tell you which available accommodations you
> can use and which you can't. That decision is between you and the
> professor to make.
> Arielle
>
> On 4/27/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> Arielle,
>> oOh, um, this is a community college. I'm finished my BA degree but 
>> taking
>> classes to further my studies and get a writing certificate. The class I
>> need a competent reader for is religion.
>> No a TA won't work. Also, Its community college.
>> you make it sound easy. Gee, I do wish I could get my own readers. Gosh. 
>> I
>> can think of like 20 people who would be competent readers and have a 
>> clue
>> how to read such a test. But no, they don't allow me to do this.
>>
>> I do indeed have my own readers for studying and reading texts and 
>> looking
>> up material and research, but
>> no I cannot bring a reader to the exam. Personally, I think this is a 
>> legal
>>
>> matter and they need to change the policy so you can have the option to
>> bring your own competent reader as an accomodation under the ADA. Its not
>> fair, not equal access, and can cause one to get a lower
>> grade using bad readers.
>>
>> Ashley
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Arielle Silverman
>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 7:45 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>
>> You can also ask the professor if the teaching assistant can
>> read/scribe your exam, if there is one for the class. Most teaching
>> assistants are graduate students or advanced undergraduates in the
>> department and should know the material well, and since they're
>> trusted employees of the professor, they are trusted not to help you
>> cheat. Plus, many TA's have nothing else to do during an exam and
>> would otherwise just be sitting around. If the class has no teaching
>> assistant, as in a community college, maybe the professor could read
>> it for you and scribe your answers during office hours the day before
>> the test or some such?
>> I know that blind students have hired their own readers for testing,
>> which allows them to pick people who are competent. Some disability
>> services offices frown on this practice because they prefer to hire
>> and manage readers themselves, but it's an option that's at least
>> worth discussing with your professor, who might not care much.
>> Arielle
>>
>> On 4/27/13, Suzanne Germano <sgermano at asu.edu> wrote:
>>> I haven't used readers since I am a partial and use cctv but when I had
>>> disabled students pay for a chemistry lab aid I insisted the person was 
>>> a
>>> chem major and an A student.
>>>
>>> So maybe you could find your readers through the department. And then 
>>> you
>>> interview them by having them read to you.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 3:30 PM, Kirt <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm in the middle of the nightmare that is transferring between
>>>> colleges,
>>>> but the college I am leaving almost always provided me with competent
>>>> and
>>>> capable readers. Sure, they might pronounce a few words incorrectly But
>>>> they knew how to read out loud.  I hope I don't run into the same
>>>> problem
>>>> you are dealing with right now and my next college.
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 27, 2013, at 11:21 AM, "Ashley Bramlett"
>>>> <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Hi all,
>>>> >
>>>> > As finals approach, I wanted to know what test accomodations you
>>>> get.
>>>> > Do
>>>> you feel they are adaquate and meet your needs?
>>>> > If you need a reader and person to scribe your answers on a
>>>> scantron,
>>>> how are they? Are they competent readers?
>>>> >
>>>> > I’m going through a discriminatory situation now. Most my readers
>>>> were
>>>> incompetent but I got around that by asking them to speak slower and
>>>> repeat
>>>> things; I mean they could not speak all that clearly and read fast and
>>>> spoke to the paper not articulately to me. Many exams I took with jaws
>>>> to
>>>> avoid this; I feel this way is slower for me and a reader can directly
>>>> mark
>>>> my answers on a scantron as well as go back to questions I missed. If I
>>>> need a reader scribe I should be given a competent reader.
>>>> >
>>>> > I’ll tell more about this specific test issue in another message.
>>>> >
>>>> > Look forward to seeing your responses.
>>>> >
>>>> > Ashley
>>>> > _______________________________________________
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-- 
Take care,
Ty
http://tds-solutions.net
He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a fool; he that 
dares not reason is a slave.
Sent from my Toaster (tm).

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