[nabs-l] the test accomodations

Chris Nusbaum dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com
Tue Apr 30 22:09:34 UTC 2013 

Ashley,

A serial port should work for this.

Chris

Chris Nusbaum, Co-Chair
Public Relations Committee
Maryland Association of Blind Students
Phone: (443) 547-2409


-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley Bramlett
Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:16 AM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations

Lilly,
I like that idea. I have an m'power. What cable do you use to hook a monitor
to the notetaker?

-----Original Message-----
From: Lillie Pennington
Sent: Monday, April 29, 2013 9:35 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations

Out of curiosity. Did the issue of having a  monitor hooked up to your
Braille note ever come up so the professor or  whoever could see what you
were doing and not cheating. I like that system as well. It can get dicey
with graphics in the file or massive word banks.

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 29, 2013, at 9:11 PM, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:

> I was a teaching assistant for a large introductory psychology course 
> a few years ago, and was on the other side of the accommodations issue 
> getting disability letters from students who needed extended time or a 
> distraction-free environment for testing. I would send these letters 
> to the instructor who supervised me and he always said he hated 
> working with disability services and much preferred to work out the 
> testing "in-house" between him/me and the student. So I would have 
> students take exams in my office instead of using the testing center 
> because it was less hassle for the instructor that way. If instructors 
> have to go through disability services, they have to prepare their 
> tests early and they also have to often grade the test after everyone 
> else's because they don't get it from disability services until later.
> I agree that a Braille Note could be a really good compromise between 
> using a Braille test and using a reader. The prof could give you a 
> text file, you could fill it out on your Braille Note and then turn it 
> back in at the same time as all other students. As others have stated, 
> professors may or may not allow this but the only way to find out is 
> to ask. I used my Braille Note for testing for four semesters and I 
> think in that time only one professor insisted I use DSS instead of 
> using my Braille Note.
>
> Arielle
>
> On 4/29/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> Kirt,
>> okay; then how do you take the exam? with your own laptop? If not, 
>> how do you read the exam?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Kirt
>> Sent: Monday, April 29, 2013 6:22 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>
>> Ashley,
>> It might be worth checking if your professor will let you take the 
>> test outside of the testing center. If your relationship with her is 
>> as good as you say it is, what would be the harm in asking, at the 
>> very least?
>> Incidentally, many of my professors have recommended that I take 
>> their test
>>
>> outside of the testing center, even if that's where the rest of the 
>> class takes it.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Apr 29, 2013, at 3:57 PM, "Lillie Pennington" 
>> <lilliepennington at fuse.net>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Ashley,
>>> Are you going to be taking classes after this semester? You may want 
>>> to be thinking in the long term of how your going to be fixing these 
>>> types of problems. For example, if your taking another class like 
>>> this where you may want a Braille copy, how do you plan to get it? 
>>> Would you be willing to pay with your own money for a Braille test? 
>>> You could look into getting your tests transcribed somehow. You 
>>> could talk to your future professors about this (you'd probably have 
>>> to make arrangements for them to somehow send the test off to make 
>>> sure that you couldn't possibly cheat.) I recall you mentioning in 
>>> another email that you had a Braille note. How comfortable are you 
>>> with electronic files? The professor may have  an electronic copy of 
>>> the test and you could load it on your Braille note and read from 
>>> there on your display so you are indeed getting a copy in Braille 
>>> (sort of.) For these tests with the foreign language words, and 
>>> other tests in general, this could also iliminate the reader 
>>> problems your having. I don't know if any
>>>
>>> of
>>> this would work, I'm just trying to throw out a few solutions that I 
>>> was thinking of.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Ashley 
>>> Bramlett
>>> Sent: Monday, April 29, 2013 3:57 PM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>
>>> Hi Justin and everyone,
>>> Oh how I'd love a braille copy. that would eliminate this problem of 
>>> hearing a reader state these words.
>>> No, they will not provide braille. They have no one to run the 
>>> braille production anymore; I don't know what the assistive technology
guy left.
>>> They would have to outsource the brailling and there is no time for 
>>> this.
>>> Additionally, I asked my disability counselor to get another exam 
>>> brailled last semester. She refused! As I said, she is difficult to 
>>> work with.
>>> She will do what is minimally required. Her response and argument 
>>> against braille was the following:
>>> 1. The college is only required to provide access and you can read 
>>> the exam with jaws.
>>> 2. You are not entitled to your prefered format of an exam.
>>> 3. No one is available to braille your exam in-house and it is not 
>>> necessary to braille this exam. We won't pay for the outsourcing to 
>>> translate into braille because you have a means to access the exam 
>>> now.
>>>
>>> It was a pr exam btw.
>>> So, I'm sure I cannot get a brailled exam, even if there was enough 
>>> time.
>>> She would make the same arguments I believe.
>>>
>>> Ashley
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: justin williams
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 9:10 PM
>>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>
>>> At this point, why not.  Not a bad idea.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Suzanne 
>>> Germano
>>> Sent: Sunday, April 28, 2013 11:51 AM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>
>>> Can they provide you a Braille copy of the test so you can follow 
>>> along with the reader?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 9:34 PM, Arielle Silverman < 
>>> Arielle.Silverman at asu.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I really think you will be less stressed and happier if you cut out 
>>>> the DSS middleman, and just work with your professor. As a backup, 
>>>> if the prof is totally unwilling, you can go back to DSS and follow 
>>>> their rules. But you said the prof is helpful, so it's likely he'll 
>>>> be willing to work something out with you that's fair.
>>>> Arielle
>>>>
>>>> On 4/27/13, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> What they mean is "if you take the test in our building you have 
>>>>> to use our readers". The DSS policies don't apply to you once you 
>>>>> step out of their office.
>>>>> I  don't know where other blind students have taken tests with 
>>>>> their private readers, but I'd think you could do it in a 
>>>>> designated testing room in the building where the class is, or you 
>>>>> could go to the professor's office hours and do it there while the 
>>>>> professor is around to ensure you don't cheat.
>>>>> If you ask the professor, they might be able to offer a reader who 
>>>>> works for the department, like a student worker or an assistant. I 
>>>>> don't know how it works in community colleges, but I know at my 
>>>>> university, the psych department has a huge support staff. This 
>>>>> will help you avoid having to pay out of pocket, though even then 
>>>>> you might end up sacrificing a little bit on reader quality.
>>>>>
>>>>> Remember: the DSS policies are binding on the DSS staff, but 
>>>>> they're not binding on you as the student. The only one who really 
>>>>> has control over how you take tests is the professor. Some 
>>>>> professors give their entire classes online exams. That's their 
>>>>> right as professors
>>> to do.
>>>>> If the professor trusts you enough to let you use your own reader, 
>>>>> or to use your laptop in class, or any of a number of other 
>>>>> accommodations, that's their decision to make.
>>>>>
>>>>> Arielle
>>>>>
>>>>> On 4/27/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>>> Arielle,
>>>>>> So you're suggesting that the professor and student which is me 
>>>>>> arrange for
>>>>>>
>>>>>> a private reader I hire to take the exam.
>>>>>> Where would I take the exam then? I'll have to check if this 
>>>>>> violates school
>>>>>>
>>>>>> policy.
>>>>>> Are you saying that you know blind students using their own 
>>>>>> readers for exams with no objection from the professor? Where 
>>>>>> would they take the exam and how does the professor ensure that 
>>>>>> you did not cheat then?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ashley
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: Arielle Silverman
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 11:03 PM
>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, a DSS office cannot legislate what you do outside of their 
>>>>>> office.
>>>>>> If you and the professor agree that you will use a reader you 
>>>>>> hired yourself, the DSS office cannot step in and veto that 
>>>>>> arrangement you worked out with your professor. The DSS office 
>>>>>> only has authority if you give it to them by asking to take the 
>>>>>> test in their
>>> office.
>>>>>> Hiring your own readers for testing is only a problem if the 
>>>>>> professor has an objection to it. Many professors are quite 
>>>>>> laid-back about things like that, even if they are technically 
>>>>>> not quite in line with school policy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Arielle
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 4/26/13, justin williams <justin.williams2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Sounds like a possible ADA case if it gets to far.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
>>>>>>> Ashley Bramlett
>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 10:21 PM
>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Arielle,
>>>>>>> oOh, um, this is a community college. I'm finished my BA degree 
>>>>>>> but taking classes to further my studies and get a writing 
>>>>>>> certificate. The class
>>>> I
>>>>>>> need a competent reader for is religion.
>>>>>>> No a TA won't work. Also, Its community college.
>>>>>>> you make it sound easy. Gee, I do wish I could get my own readers.
>>>> Gosh.
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> can think of like 20 people who would be competent readers and 
>>>>>>> have a clue how to read such a test. But no, they don't allow me 
>>>>>>> to do this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I do indeed have my own readers for studying and reading texts 
>>>>>>> and looking up material and research, but no I cannot bring a 
>>>>>>> reader to the exam. Personally, I think this is a legal
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> matter and they need to change the policy so you can have the 
>>>>>>> option
>>> to
>>>>>>> bring your own competent reader as an accomodation under the ADA.
>>>>>>> Its not fair, not equal access, and can cause one to get a lower 
>>>>>>> grade using bad readers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ashley
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Arielle Silverman
>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 7:45 PM
>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] the test accomodations
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You can also ask the professor if the teaching assistant can 
>>>>>>> read/scribe your exam, if there is one for the class. Most 
>>>>>>> teaching assistants are graduate students or advanced 
>>>>>>> undergraduates in the department and should know the material 
>>>>>>> well, and since they're trusted employees of the professor, they 
>>>>>>> are trusted not to help you cheat. Plus, many TA's have nothing 
>>>>>>> else to do during an exam and would otherwise just be sitting 
>>>>>>> around. If the class has no teaching assistant, as in a 
>>>>>>> community college, maybe the professor could read it for you and 
>>>>>>> scribe your answers during office hours the day before the test or
some such?
>>>>>>> I know that blind students have hired their own readers for 
>>>>>>> testing, which allows them to pick people who are competent. 
>>>>>>> Some disability services offices frown on this practice because 
>>>>>>> they prefer to hire and manage readers themselves, but it's an 
>>>>>>> option that's at least worth discussing with your professor, who 
>>>>>>> might not
>>> care much.
>>>>>>> Arielle
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 4/27/13, Suzanne Germano <sgermano at asu.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>>> I haven't used readers since I am a partial and use cctv but 
>>>>>>>> when I
>>>> had
>>>>>>>> disabled students pay for a chemistry lab aid I insisted the 
>>>>>>>> person
>>>> was
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> chem major and an A student.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So maybe you could find your readers through the department. 
>>>>>>>> And then you interview them by having them read to you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 3:30 PM, Kirt 
>>>>>>>> <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm in the middle of the nightmare that is transferring 
>>>>>>>>> between colleges, but the college I am leaving almost always 
>>>>>>>>> provided me with
>>> competent
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> capable readers. Sure, they might pronounce a few words 
>>>>>>>>> incorrectly But they knew how to read out loud.  I hope I 
>>>>>>>>> don't run into the same problem you are dealing with right now 
>>>>>>>>> and my next college.
>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 27, 2013, at 11:21 AM, "Ashley Bramlett"
>>>>>>>>> <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> As finals approach, I wanted to know what test accomodations 
>>>>>>>>>> you get.
>>>>>>>>>> Do
>>>>>>>>> you feel they are adaquate and meet your needs?
>>>>>>>>>> If you need a reader and person to scribe your answers on a 
>>>>>>>>>> scantron,
>>>>>>>>> how are they? Are they competent readers?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm going through a discriminatory situation now. Most my 
>>>>>>>>>> readers were
>>>>>>>>> incompetent but I got around that by asking them to speak 
>>>>>>>>> slower and repeat things; I mean they could not speak all that 
>>>>>>>>> clearly and read fast
>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> spoke to the paper not articulately to me. Many exams I took 
>>>>>>>>> with
>>>> jaws
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> avoid this; I feel this way is slower for me and a reader can
>>>> directly
>>>>>>>>> mark
>>>>>>>>> my answers on a scantron as well as go back to questions I missed.
>>> If
>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>> need a reader scribe I should be given a competent reader.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'll tell more about this specific test issue in another message.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Look forward to seeing your responses.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ashley
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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