[nabs-l] Extended Time

Thu Feb 7 21:36:01 UTC 2013

Good morning, Ari,

         Personally, I reject all that On-line 
test taking, preferring instead human inner 
action. I don't feel it saying anything less of 
me to call on my fellllow humans to, in the 
absence of my own visual capabilities, to do the visual stuff, for me.
I mean, aren't people upon this earth to help each other, no mater how?
This, is to say that personally, I don't mind 
calling on my fellow humans to do the ocular 
seeing for me, just as I would be totall obliged 
if another  person needed me to fulfill some 
sensual imput that was within my capacity, and not ther's.6/2013, you wrote:
>I am curious to know about this online testing thing, because it seems
>as if you guys are mostly all doing it? What I mean is, what is the
>software you are doing the test on? We use moodle here and once they
>had an online test for something or other but the unit said the online
>testing at my uni isn't accessible. It is also very interesting to see
>how you guys do online tests in class, I suppose its all in the
>digital revolution. Unfortunately here I suppose many students can't
>afford the technology or the professors don't trust online tests, in
>any case, everyone still uses the old pen and paper, even for multiple
>choice quizzes, so we then have to do it orally with a tutor.
>Ari
>Ari
>
>On 2/6/13, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
> > Kirt,
> > I'm glad that works for you. Yes I've heard of the quic hot key R for radio
> > buttons.
> > Yes, it takes you to the first radio button. But what I'm saying is there
> > are four buttons for four choices per answer.
> > I hear all of the choices and then go up line 
> by line to select my choice. I
> > don't thinking pressing shift R will work because it will just take me to
> > the last radio button, but I need to see the whole line. Its hard to
> > explain, what I mean is I need to see what radio button goes with each
> > answer.
> > I wish jaws said something like B radio button checked and then read the
> > answer but its not like that.
> > Maybe our blackboard is different. I think finding the start of the quiz
> > with H for heading is my best bet and once I figure out what heading level
> > it is, I can use the number heading for the next ones; for instance, 3 for
> > heading 3.
> >
> > I feel a reader could give me the info I need by scrolling up to say
> > question 4 and reading me what I selected rather than me going line by line
> > through the questions. Maybe I should do that.
> >
> >
> > I haven't had online quizzes before so I'm 
> hoping to get used to it and find
> > short cut keys that work. Still IMO, extended time should be granted if I
> > feel its needed. My professor will have to give me extra time in class
> > quizzes though.
> >
> > Perhaps my disability counselor will talk to the professor.
> > Ashley
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Kirt
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 1:50 PM
> > To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
> > Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Extended Time
> >
> > Ashley,
> > I don't mean to be contrary, but I have found quite the opposite to be the
> > case in my personal experiences with jaws.  You can press are, from the
> > start of the page, to go directly to the first radio button on the first
> > question
 It will save you a whole bunch of arrowing down.  And, at least
> > for me, once I figured out how Jaws 
> Associates radio buttons with particular
> > question answers, on whatever quiz I'm 
> taking, it's been really easy to just
> > apply that pattern to the rest of the quiz
 Hopefully, I am making sense.
> > For me, personally, the only online assignments that warrant extra time are
> > the ones with lots of images that need to be described by somebody else. If
> > an online quiz, or test, or assignment is all text, which many of them are,
> > I usually finish well within the allotted time. In fact, I have noticed, my
> > screen reader reads things to me faster than 
> many sided people read. While I
> > don't comprehend as much as I do with braille, this is definitely an
> > advantage for me sometimes which, I daresay, most people don't have.
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > On Feb 6, 2013, at 10:34 AM, "Ashley Bramlett" <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Arielle,
> >> Well I see your points. Extended time while we use braille could send a
> >> bad message I suppose that we're inherently slow.
> >> I cannot remember whether I used  extended time all the time in high
> >> school or not. I had a study hall period with my vision teacher, or TVI as
> >>
> >> they're called. Here I finished any tests or in class assignments I needed
> >>
> >> to for the day or worked on homework. This was very valuable time for me
> >> since I struggled with some spatial concepts too and my TVI sort of acted
> >> as a tutor for math as well and explained diagrams.
> >>
> >> I think ideally that  extended time and accomodations should be given on a
> >>
> >> case by case basis. You may need some accomodations in one class and not
> >> others.
> >> But that isn't how college works; they have to make accomodations across
> >> the board so you have one accomodation sheet for all professors.
> >>
> >> I feel that yes extended time is needed in college because of
> >> the medium its taken in. I consider equal access to be braille since
> >> sighted students read it; they do not have to hear it.
> >> As you know, braille is not given to us in college except for maybe math
> >> if you beg for it.
> >>
> >> So, I think using jaws is slower than reading it in print. If its multiple
> >>
> >> choice, I find I need to hear it twice because as with any test taker, I
> >> read it once and eliminate two answers and read it again to pic the  best
> >> answer.
> >> A sighted user clicks the correct button where as we have to go line by
> >> line and listen to the line and arrow up til finding the right answer.
> >> If using a reader, I need them to repeat my answers sometimes to ensure
> >> they circled the right one.
> >>
> >> I am trying to get extended time for practice online quizzes because I
> >> need to scroll back up to check my answers.
> >> I'm confused as to what radio button goes
> >> with what answer. I wish the Letter options of A, b, c, d were on the same
> >>
> >> line but jaws isn't reading like that.
> >> Not to mention that I use a minute or two to find where the darn quiz
> >> begins! Yes, I do use the quick navigation keys such as H for heading to
> >> help but when there are lots of headings this doesn't help too much.
> >>
> >> I find that other forms of tests such as short answer and essay formats
> >> take me less time. I don't always use extended time. But its there in the
> >> many cases I do need it.
> >>
> >> Now, I  just hope I can get
> >> extended time for the blackboard quiz. It has to be manually changed for
> >> me to get extended time.
> >>
> >> Ashley
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message----- From: Arielle Silverman
> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2013 9:57 PM
> >> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> >> Subject: [nabs-l] Extended Time
> >>
> >> Hi all,
> >> The last post about using extra time on quizzes got me thinking about
> >> why we automatically get extra time to take tests and whether or not
> >> this is a good idea. I think the extra time is intended to correct for
> >> any issues with our accommodations or technology that make test-taking
> >> slower; for example, it might make sense to use extra time if we have
> >> to have a scribe write an essay for us or if we are using a reader and
> >> asking them to repeat things or read answer choices a few times. Extra
> >> time also seems appropriate if we have a problem with technology
> >> breaking, files not downloading correctly, etc. But I question whether
> >> extra time is really appropriate for online quizzes, for example, or
> >> for Braille or large print tests.
> >> As a Braille reader I used extended time only on a few occasions and I
> >> found that I only "needed" it when, deep down, I didn't fully
> >> understand the material I was being tested on. This happened a lot
> >> when I had tactile diagrams to interpret since I have always been bad
> >> with spatial mapping and understanding tactile images. So I would use
> >> the extra time to agonize over test questions I didn't understand and
> >> then eventually guess an answer. I really don't think the extra time
> >> was helpful for either my test performance or my learning and I feel
> >> it only acted as a Band-Aid covering up the real issue which was that
> >> I didn't know how to interpret tactile images. Had I not been granted
> >> extended time this might have become a more pressing issue for me to
> >> deal with back in high school. Similarly, I worry that when Braille
> >> readers are automatically granted double time across the board, it
> >> allows teachers to grow complacent with slower Braille-reading speeds
> >> than is desirable and almost sets up the expectation that Braille
> >> reading is inherently slow. It might be appropriate to *temporarily*
> >> grant an individual student extended time while they are still in the
> >> process of building Braille fluency, but granting it to everybody who
> >> reads Braille is something that bothers me. I also question the
> >> implication that blind students just do things slower and that nothing
> >> can or should be done about it so just let them take extra time. I
> >> don't need to tell you that extended time is not granted in the job
> >> world and this is becoming more real for me as I approach graduation
> >> and employment myself.
> >> I'm not trying to belittle anybody who uses extended time. I am just
> >> proposing that we reflect a little on what the extra time is
> >> specifically meant to accomplish, why we use it and whether or not it
> >> is actually helpful. I would propose that we make mindful decisions
> >> about when to accept extended time and that we aim to use it only when
> >> it is truly necessary and beneficial. In order to grow as students
> >> progressing toward employment, I think we should also be aware of why
> >> we are finding ourselves needing extra time and see if there are skill
> >> issues we might be able to address so that we need it less in the
> >> future. In my own case my weakness with tactile diagrams probably
> >> won't impact me much on the job, but a weakness in Braille reading
> >> speed or Web navigation is something that can be addressed with
> >> training and practice and addressing it can make a person much more
> >> competitive on the job, and able to get the job done as efficiently as
> >> sightedd colleagues.
> >> Best,
> >> Arielle
> >>
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