[nabs-l] problem with college cafe

Wasif, Zunaira Zunaira.Wasif at dbs.fldoe.org
Fri Sep 20 16:45:34 UTC 2013 

Just wondering how you have handled this type of situation in the past, in high school for example? 

-----Original Message-----
From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nathan Clark
Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 12:40 PM
To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] problem with college cafe

Dear Jamie,
I really like your idea Jamie about reorganizing the tables to make a more clear path and I will suggest this to my school when I meet with them on Tuesday.
Sincerely,
Nathan

On 9/20/13, Kirt <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
> Karlee,
> I think having a friend help is fine. hell, I do the very same thing 
> you are suggesting every now and again. Still, and I say this from 
> personal experience, I found the putting myself in situations where 
> I'm forced to rely on other people, and keep in mind that I making the 
> distinction between being forced and choosing to do it of your own 
> free will every now and again, is inconvenient, inefficient and 
> counterproductive. I used to always get around the way you are 
> suggesting. And it worked probably about 80% of the time just fine. 
> However, those times my friends were sick, or busy with other things, 
> or went somewhere else for the day, or those times when I just wanted 
> privacy and my own personal space and couldn't have it because I needed to rely on other people were absolutely unbearable for me.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 20, 2013, at 6:34 AM, Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>> Good morning, Nathan,
>>
>>        Find yourself a hot chick, maybe and grab her arm or shoulder. 
>> Get help! No man is an island...
>> for today, CarAt 11:39 PM 9/19/2013, Kaiti Shelton wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I don't know your entire situation, but here are a few suggestions.
>>> I agree with the views expressed by Kirt, Arielle, Justin, and others.
>>> I also like the idea of making the cafeteria more accessible to all, 
>>> but realistically if the school has too many tables in a room that 
>>> is really not big enough for them and extra space, it might not be 
>>> possible.
>>> Getting your food in a bag or to-go box does wonders.  I do this all 
>>> the time and it makes everything a lot easier for me.  Or, since you 
>>> bring your lunch to school, you can skip the cafe if you really 
>>> don't like dealing with it that day.  If you usually get a drink 
>>> from the cafe before sitting down to eat, try bringing something 
>>> from home along with your food.  Or, there is nothing wrong with 
>>> eating outside in a courtyard or at a table in an academic building; 
>>> other students do it all the time.
>>> If you really want to eat in the cafe though, I would suggest a few 
>>> things if you have not done so already.  Check that you're confident 
>>> in using your cane skills, as that can be a huge factor in this.  If 
>>> you can find an aisle that is more open than others to get from 
>>> point A to point B, figure out a route that works for you.  This 
>>> might require practice on your own time, but can be worth it.  I 
>>> would also try asking cafe staff if they could recommend a way for 
>>> you to go that might get you through the cafeteria a little more 
>>> efficiently than the way you're using now.  .
>>> As was said, I don't think that this is going to change.  I don't 
>>> really see what security can do, and also think that web 
>>> accessibility and other matters that can't easily be remedied by 
>>> individual students are of more importance to faculty.  Yes, left 
>>> out chairs is a hassle and it is a tripping hazard, but it is that 
>>> way for all students, not just those who are blind.  They have to 
>>> push in the chairs to clear a path too, so the best thing you can do 
>>> is figure out a way to work through it to show that you are just as 
>>> capable a navigator as a sighted student.
>>>
>>> On 9/19/13, Arielle Silverman <arielle71 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > Hi Nathan and all,
>>> >
>>> > I think there's something to say for only getting your disability 
>>> > office involved in matters that are serious and those that 
>>> > directly involve blindness. We all agree that chairs being left 
>>> > out are a nuisance, and they make orientation a little tougher, 
>>> > but they don't pose a safety hazard to blind folks who are using 
>>> > canes or dogs. I don't think the problem is serious enough to involve campus security.
>>> > Jamie's redesign idea does sound nice for people with all kinds of 
>>> > disabilities, but I don't think the issue is as important as those 
>>> > involving campus website accessibility, for example.
>>> > Nathan, I think you are a cane user, but if you're not I would 
>>> > encourage you to use a cane at least while you are in the café. It 
>>> > might help to get a little orientation through the café and, in 
>>> > particular, pay attention to sound cues that will help you find 
>>> > your way to the room you're trying to find even if the messy 
>>> > chairs cause you to lose your bearings.
>>> >
>>> > Best,
>>> > Arielle
>>> >
>>> > On 9/19/13, minh ha <minh.ha927 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >> Nathan,
>>> >>
>>> >> There's a big difference between educating the sighted public 
>>> >> about what we need as blind individuals and changing bad habits. 
>>> >> Yes, you can talk to your DS office and security and have them 
>>> >> post reminders, but I would be willing to bet that the issue of 
>>> >> chairs sticking out in your way is not going to be resolved any 
>>> >> time soon. I have a guide dog now so she just takes me around the 
>>> >> chairs or stop so I can nudge the chair out of our path, but when 
>>> >> I was using a cane, all I had to do was nudge the chair in a 
>>> >> little bit and I would have room to go on my merry way. You could 
>>> >> try this simple solution to see if it fixes your problem before 
>>> >> tackling other people's lack of courtesy. I also want to remind 
>>> >> you that you're not going to have a DS office or a chief of 
>>> >> security that you could run to in the real world when people don't have chairs pushed in.
>>> >>
>>> >> Cheers,
>>> >> Minh
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> On 9/19/13, Nathan Clark <troubleclark at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >>> Dear Tyler,
>>> >>> As blind people don't we want to educate others around us about 
>>> >>> what we need and makes us the most successful and independent? I 
>>> >>> don't want to rely on a sighted person who walks with me and 
>>> >>> pushes chairs for me for obvious reasons that we all know about. 
>>> >>> I understand where you are coming from and I respect your 
>>> >>> opinion.
>>> >>> Sincerely,
>>> >>> Nathan Clark
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 9/19/13, Nathan Clark <troubleclark at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >>>> Dear Tyler,
>>> >>>> My school's café is not exactly layid out in a way where you 
>>> >>>> can travel around the outside by the walls and find the opening 
>>> >>>> to the door. Our café has tables that are both pushed up 
>>> >>>> against the wall and in the middle of the café so it isn't 
>>> >>>> exactly a easy navigation like you thought it was.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Sincerely,
>>> >>>> Nathan
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> On 9/19/13, Littlefield, Tyler <tyler at tysdomain.com> wrote:
>>> >>>>> first, I'm not really sure what chairs being stuck out has to 
>>> >>>>> do with security.
>>> >>>>> Second, I really do think there are much bigger battles to 
>>> >>>>> deal with.
>>> >>>>> You could get some person that has to push in chairs after 
>>> >>>>> everyone so you have clear paths, but I've never seen clear 
>>> >>>>> paths through any cafe regardless where the chairs are. My 
>>> >>>>> suggestion is to use your cane, find each individual chair and 
>>> >>>>> push it toward the table with your foot.
>>> >>>>> I
>>> >>>>> just balance my tray on one arm and use my cane with the other 
>>> >>>>> hand and it works out pretty well.
>>> >>>>> You may also be able to walk around the walls of the cafe 
>>> >>>>> (depending on the layout) to get to the room you want to go 
>>> >>>>> to.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> On 9/19/2013 1:16 PM, Nathan Clark wrote:
>>> >>>>>> Dear Nabs,
>>> >>>>>> My name is Nathan Clark and I am one of the quieter people on 
>>> >>>>>> this list but I have a situation that I have at my community 
>>> >>>>>> college where I would like to have some opinions fro you all. 
>>> >>>>>> about.
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> Today as I was walking into my school's café I discovered 
>>> >>>>>> that almost every table that I came upon had chairs that were 
>>> >>>>>> sticking ot where people had been sitting in and forgot to 
>>> >>>>>> push their chairs in. My school had a room off the café where 
>>> >>>>>> students can eat their lunch in a more quieter environment 
>>> >>>>>> which is where I usually eat my lunch and that is where I 
>>> >>>>>> wanted to eat today. However, after struggling with 
>>> >>>>>> navigating through the chairs that were not pushed in I just 
>>> >>>>>> gave up and sat a different bale and had my lunch. After 
>>> >>>>>> eating, I went to my school's Secutrity department and 
>>> >>>>>> expressed my concerns with them.
>>> >>>>>> The
>>> >>>>>> lady who I talked to is named Sharon and she is not a 
>>> >>>>>> security guard but the secretary for the department. She 
>>> >>>>>> knows me very well and she knows from previous semesters that 
>>> >>>>>> I have encountered this problem before with the café. She 
>>> >>>>>> helped me schedule an appointment with the Assistant Chieef 
>>> >>>>>> of Security on Tuesday.
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> My question for you all is should I have scheduled the 
>>> >>>>>> meeting or just dropped the problem. What could be some 
>>> >>>>>> solutions that I could bring up to my meeting with the 
>>> >>>>>> Assistant Chief for Tuesday? If you were wondering I forgot 
>>> >>>>>> to say that I talked to my DSS office and they said that they 
>>> >>>>>> would work with the Secutiry department to solve this 
>>> >>>>>> problem.
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> I would like to hear what people have to say and wondering if 
>>> >>>>>> this has happened to other people on the list?
>>> >>>>>> Sincerely,
>>> >>>>>> Nathan Clark
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> --
>>> >>>>> Take care,
>>> >>>>> Ty
>>> >>>>> http://tds-solutions.net
>>> >>>>> He that will not reason is a bigot; he that cannot reason is a 
>>> >>>>> fool; he that dares not reason is a slave.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>
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>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> --
>>> >> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the 
>>> >> dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
>>> >> but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act 
>>> >> on their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. 
>>> >> Lawrence
>>> >>
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>>> >
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>>>
>>> --
>>> Kaiti
>>>
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